Lost Island observation

[NoxiousAlby]

Well, let's drop HM EC then, because the majority of players can't complete that. If hardcore players are such a pointless minority it would seem better to give them a few challenging flashpoints than entire raids, but I digress.

As I stated before players who want to raid will find a way, its the majority of players in any RPGMMO that either no longer want to raid or never have, and they couldnt care less about HM EC. HM EC is brilliant for the target audience it is aimed at.

 

I'd like you to point me to where I said the loot drops in HM LI were appropriately tuned. I'm advocating preserving the flashpoint's degree of challenge, nothing more. Please don't put words in my mouth.

I never quoted you as saying the above, that is a statement I made. I'm running guildies one at a time through HM LI because they want the speeder.

 

I just believe that given the majority of players will want to do HM LI and only a minority of players will ever successfully achieve it. For a flashpoint that isnt what I would call a success

[erei]

Last time I checked the enrage timers on bosses dont allow players to be carried and you certainly make it sound easier than most players have encountered.

You can do a lot (all ?) HM with 2 players. Some need some columi+ gear (D7), but some don't need any (Kaon).

I've done them with a lot of player. And honestly, some of them were completely carried by the team.

Enrage timer are a complete joke for people who know how to play their class. For noobs with ****** DPS, yeah, they can be tricky.

 

Link to the topic for 2 man HM :

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=463772

 

HMs in this game are far from challenging. Except LI. Once I'm 50, with 45+ stuff, I do them, with my friends. No problems, it's incredibly easy. And they are nerfed with each patch.

Also, the NM instance are so incredibly easy, maybe you can solo them with enough gear. I did battle of ilum yesterday, we were all 50, with random blue gear, and a lvl 49. I was the healer. I spent my time DPSing. Except the boss who stun and pop adds, it was incredibly easy. And yet, that's because 2 of our melee kept hitting the boss when he had his shield up. We didn't wiped once, and nobody died.

 

The only concern I have with LI is the ratio difficulty/reward. You drop columi for every boss until the end, but you are probably already columi geared. And a rakata in the end, while you could have had the same in a raid, and 1.2 HM raid are easy. EC story mode is a bit harder, granted.

 

I wish they add more difficult instance, some real HM, call them nightmare if you want to. Add some extra reward so people want to run them, but it's not necessary. I want some difficulty, I want to wipe and use my brain.

Keep most instance for casual, the same way we have now.

 

Wouldn't it make sense than if Bioware modified the leg queue finder a bit to make it that people can not queue for these higher Tiers until they meet gear requirements instead of putting LI on the same level as other non HMs?

We asked for it on testlive forum. As with all our suggestions, BW didn't even answered, and they didn't care at all. Do you expect they'll care about it now ? You better know a metrics, because they only listen to them.

[Hxxr]

Yes HM LI is a bit silly, considering that flashpoints are the bread and butter for casual players making it inaccessible to many causuals (due to skill[{b] & gear requirements) sort of defeats the purpose.

 

Highlighted the interesting part. Casual or not, baddies is a whole different discussion.

If your bad at something in genereal or mess up you don't deserve to be rewarded.

 

Dont consider HM LI as a flashpoint, it's basicly a mini raid for all the players who QQ'd in the first 3 months about how easy the game was.

 

Whining about content being to easy is a new one. Anyway it seems like there are enough players who feel like they need more challange than faceroll their way through the game.

 

HM LI is a gear & skill check, both which will improve over time if you have the patience and desire to complete it.

 

It's not a gear check. Can be done in Tionese gear without any problem (excluding the bonus boss that actually is a gear check) - skill check ... well casual players don't have to be bad, right?

 

To many bad people hide behind the 'casual' label. This is bad for pretty much all players and the community itself.

 

Your entitled attitude and greedy demeanor is quite unattractive.

 

You're talking to a mirror now, right?

[NoxiousAlby]

You can do a lot (all ?) HM with 2 players. Some need some columi+ gear (D7), but some don't need any (Kaon).

I've done them with a lot of player. And honestly, some of them were completely carried by the team.

Enrage timer are a complete joke for people who know how to play their class. For noobs with ****** DPS, yeah, they can be tricky.

I dont believe a healer could be carried through Sav-Rak or a tank caried through the first and last boss and 1 dps certainly couldnt be carried through any fight due to the enrage timers.

 

HMs in this game are far from challenging. Except LI. Once I'm 50, with 45+ stuff, I do them, with my friends. No problems, it's incredibly easy. And they are nerfed with each patch.

Also, the NM instance are so incredibly easy, maybe you can solo them with enough gear. I did battle of ilum yesterday, we were all 50, with random blue gear, and a lvl 49. I was the healer. I spent my time DPSing. Except the boss who stun and pop adds, it was incredibly easy. And yet, that's because 2 of our melee kept hitting the boss when he had his shield up. We didn't wiped once, and nobody died.[/quoe]

You do realise that NM Battle of Illum is a lvl 48 min entry flashpoint? If you went in with levels 50's I imagine it would be easy. But yes Battle of Illum is not diffiicult the only encounter that provided any challege prior to HM LI was Mentor on D7 and he was merely challenging the first time.

 

The only concern I have with LI is the ratio difficulty/reward. You drop columi for every boss until the end, but you are probably already columi geared. And a rakata in the end, while you could have had the same in a raid, and 1.2 HM raid are easy. EC story mode is a bit harder, granted.

You get no arguement from me here, the only players who really have anything to gain from the boss drops (last boss) are the exact same players struggling to complete it.

 

I wish they add more difficult instance, some real HM, call them nightmare if you want to. Add some extra reward so people want to run them, but it's not necessary. I want some difficulty, I want to wipe and use my brain.

Keep most instance for casual, the same way we have now.

But wouldnt we have the same problem with players who only ever run 4 man content becoming dissillusioned at the difficulty of nightmare mode? I see the same scenerio repeating itself, but it's a good suggestion nonetheless

 

We asked for it on testlive forum. As with all our suggestions, BW didn't even answered, and they didn't care at all. Do you expect they'll care about it now ? You better know a metrics, because they only listen to them.

BW will make all their decisions based on subscription rates and profit forecasts........most MMO's do, some just take a little longer to act.

Edited July 2, 2012 by NoxiousAlby

[NoxiousAlby]

Highlighted the interesting part. Casual or not, baddies is a whole different discussion.

If your bad at something in genereal or mess up you don't deserve to be rewarded.

Look, I honestly dont like the term "bads" or putting players down. Many players on the forums have been playing MMO's for a decade or more and I dont judge anyone new to a game. Yes it can be frustrating pugging a dps on your raids who spams force lightning (actually happened) but thats the dice you roll. I'm happy to make suggestions but in the scheme of things let people play how they want, it is after all a game. Not every player is equal in terms of ability but insulting players because they can't achieve what we can is wrong. By your definition the OP is bad because they are unable to clear HM LI, and if thats the case I would say that well and truly 70% of players are bad given the number that have acquired the Aratech ice as we dont see many (even less of the Aratech Fire & Nightscythe).

 

As for players deserving rewards because they lack skills, I honestly couldnt care less. I've seen this arguement so many times on the Wow forums and it never ceases to amaze me. I have always taken pleasure out of having fun raiding with a tight group of friends, I enjoy the accomplishments we have achieved and seeing improvements where needed. I also enjoy gearing my characters, but most of all I dont care what the player next to me has or how they achieved it and will never understand why so many on the forums do. It's usually the have nots in life that worry so much about what other people have, if you are satisfied and content with what you have you wont care what other people have.

 

Whining about content being to easy is a new one. Anyway it seems like there are enough players who feel like they need more challange than faceroll their way through the game.

Not really, by December the forums were ablaze with QQ about how easy the content was and what we recieved from BW was a knee jerk reaction with LI & EC. Dont get me wrong i enjoy the challenge but I have always been of the opinion that flashpoints should be achievable by 95% of players. In both HM LI & SM EC the drops are obselete in most cases for raiders, given the increased difficulty level and the entry level gear requirements I really question what the devs were thinking.

You claim that more players want difficult challenge over easy content? Based on what ........the forums? You do realise it's the squeeky wheel that most vocal on the forums and would account for a single digit percentage of the total player base. In fact most players making up of those with average skills just want to have fun, and an even greater number of older players play this game and they have jobs and families to provide them with all the challenge they need in life.

 

It's not a gear check. Can be done in Tionese gear without any problem (excluding the bonus boss that actually is a gear check) - skill check ... well casual players don't have to be bad, right?

Right, i'm familiar with quite a few casual players who are ex raiders that raided BWL, MC, SSC, & BT who still have the skills and would make many raiders today look plain simple. As for HM LI not being a gear check you are joking? Full Tionese including weapon wouldnt give you the necessary dps to avoid enrage timers. If it could be done in Tionese we wouldnt see so many complaints about HM LI on the forums.

 

To many bad people hide behind the 'casual' label. This is bad for pretty much all players and the community itself.

Why do you feel the need to set yourself above others? There are no "bad" people.........only average players. And if flashpoints are tuned above the skills of the average player then thats not good for the game.

 

You're talking to a mirror now, right?

No i'm talking to someone who sets his lifes accomplishments based on a pixelated game, when you have a family, a Benz in your driveway, and can take your family on an overseas holiday every year then you'll be standing tall enough to look me straight in the eyes.

Edited July 2, 2012 by NoxiousAlby

[Utania]

I like the difficulty of LI, though its a big step up from the other flashpoints and another step up if you try with melee.

[StefanInter]

ok folks, i understand that for some of you, lost island is an easy mode fp. this is NOT true of melee dps. my sentinel cannot go into LI at all because it is so anti-melee. this place is ridiculously overtuned to be dropping MAINLY columi gear. and no i'm not a fresh 50, i am 2/5 rakata with everything else besides my MH being columi. i've dont my time in FPs and OPs, and im here to tell you this place makes even denova(2/4 HM) look like a joke. so tell me plz how you justify a FLASHPOINT, t2 or not bein harder than any OP in the game?

 

We run it weekly with 2 sentinels and another group in our guild runs it also with a sentinel. Its all about the tank knowing how to move. If he knows what to do its a breeze for sentinels. If he is incompetent, its a nightmare.

[wetslampigduex]

So tonight i will tank LI HM in only boots belt bracers and head and i will post it up here tonight or tomorrow to show you ppl just how hard this FP is

[Nolenthar]

Dont get me wrong i enjoy the challenge but I have always been of the opinion that flashpoints should be achievable by 95% of players. In both HM LI & SM EC the drops are obselete in most cases for raiders, given the increased difficulty level and the entry level gear requirements I really question what the devs were thinking.

 

I don't think that's quite the problem. You cannot make a content which would be achievable by 95% of the players while being attractive to 95% of the players. If you have too easy content, you'll have "average" players rolling through, being geared in 1 week, and at best, rolling an alt (hense and repeat) or at worst, closing subscription and leaving.

 

The point with LI HM is not that it's only achievable by the cream (which you seem to point), it just requires some coordination, and time investment to complete.

 

I for one really think Bioware should start working on several difficulty level on FP (normal mode, hardmode, nightmare mode, hero mode, what not) while still giving sensibly the same reward (maybe just with a different look) to please all world, but even by doing this, you'll still have people complaining that this FP in Elite Mode is too hard, and that they can't get the same loot than this player.

 

1 flashpoint out of 11 requiring you to learn to do better with your toon won't kill anyone. It's hardly puggable, indeed, still the LFG system and other system will eventually lead to a total disparition of any community if there is no content to create a community (such as raids, harder content, etc).

 

Not 100% of the players consider fun something where they encounter no difficulties what so ever. Still there should be some content where no one should encounter difficulties, but there is a learning curve in MMO, and that's what make your journey enjoyable.

 

As to the loot in LI, I would say it should probably be improved, but it's already very good compared to what other FP drops (aka 1 tier higher).

[NoxiousAlby]

So tonight i will tank LI HM in only boots belt bracers and head and i will post it up here tonight or tomorrow to show you ppl just how hard this FP is

 

look forward to it, make sure your healer and dps are all geared in columi as the average player would be. Dont forget to make a few mistakes like pugs would, like standing in the electrical bubble or not interrupting incinerate.

 

Sorry but your boast will prove nothing, if you run it with guildies. key word is "average" player

[LarryRow]

'bout a month ago I attempted Lost Island HM with some guildies. We were in vent and definitely well-geared, and LR-5 creamed us. Didn't go back until couple days ago...

 

Used the group finder to form a group for normal mode. None of us had any idea about the flashpoint after the first boss. We were totally making it up as we went. Sure there were some wipes, but in the end we four pugs figured it out and cleared it, and it was a lot of fun. Haven't had that sense of accomplishment in a while in this game, since there's almost always someone in your group who knows the mechanics and just explains them to you.

 

Now I feel like I'm ready to queue for hard mode and see how it goes. It will be challenging, but it's supposed to be.

[Bloodcharged]

LR5 is super easy on Story Mode, however on Hard Mode it is a lot more challenging...especially if the group is melee heavy.

[NoxiousAlby]

I don't think that's quite the problem. You cannot make a content which would be achievable by 95% of the players while being attractive to 95% of the players. If you have too easy content, you'll have "average" players rolling through, being geared in 1 week, and at best, rolling an alt (hense and repeat) or at worst, closing subscription and leaving.

Firstly I just want to say i enjoyed reading your reply

And your correct in saying that content achievable by 95% of players wouldnt be attractive to all of the same 95%. But over the last 6 years flashpoints or instances have become the poor mans version of end game content in rpgmmo's. 95% of players expect to be able to complete HM flashpoints and could up until HM LI, I am more concerned with non raiding players becoming disillusioned with the game because content that they thought could be done will no longer provide them with what they are after.

I saw the casual playerbase diminish in Cata to a point where cities became ghost towns, all because heroic instances were ramped up to a level of difficulty where 95% could no longer complete them. I dont want to see that happen here if HM LI is to be a trend of things to come.

 

The point with LI HM is not that it's only achievable by the cream (which you seem to point), it just requires some coordination, and time investment to complete.

Again I agree with you but it's the mentality associated with flashpoints thats the problem, which is why I prefer to call HM LI a mini raid. Players who raid have patience, understand the need to practice coordination, and time investment on bosses. But for flashpoints it's different, a percentage of the players who exclusively run 4 man as end game content arent accustomed to it. Some will enjoy it but others will recoil from it,

I wouldnt say only the creme will complete it, but at the moment most players I have spoken to who have completed it are either raiders or ex raiders. I truly dont believe the average player will be able to complete HM LI in the same fashion as they have other flashpoints, and that is a problem for them.

 

I for one really think Bioware should start working on several difficulty level on FP (normal mode, hardmode, nightmare mode, hero mode, what not) while still giving sensibly the same reward (maybe just with a different look) to please all world, but even by doing this, you'll still have people complaining that this FP in Elite Mode is too hard, and that they can't get the same loot than this player.

I really like this idea

 

1 flashpoint out of 11 requiring you to learn to do better with your toon won't kill anyone. It's hardly puggable, indeed, still the LFG system and other system will eventually lead to a total disparition of any community if there is no content to create a community (such as raids, harder content, etc).

I've always been of the opinion that anything that creates segregation amongst players is negative for the community. I just wish the Aratech Ice wasnt dependent upon completing HM LI, then I wouldnt have to run so many guildies through it because they wouldnt care whether they did it or not.

 

Not 100% of the players consider fun something where they encounter no difficulties what so ever. Still there should be some content where no one should encounter difficulties, but there is a learning curve in MMO, and that's what make your journey enjoyable.

Again I agree, but I usually raid for the challenge and have been very pleased with EC its definately a step in the right direction after EV & KP. But does flashpoints need to follow the same example as operations? thats the question. Because we then run the risk of locking out a percentage of the playerbase.

 

As to the loot in LI, I would say it should probably be improved, but it's already very good compared to what other FP drops (aka 1 tier higher).

Honestly I thought the loot was terrible, never ran it for any upgrades. Was only ever after the BH badges and Aratech Ice to add to my collection. Maybe if every boss dropped Rakata then sure we could expect the average player to man up and put in the time and effort but in my opinion not as it currently stands.

Edited July 2, 2012 by NoxiousAlby

[DiLune]

Did HM LI for the first time this weekend. PuG group with two experienced players. We had plenty of wipes but eventually got it all down. We all knew what we were getting into when we queued for a Tier 2 HM FP.

 

They all went on my friends list and we should be clearing content together again in the future.

[magicfurhat]

I am a casual player, and I do not think this should be nerfed. There is nothing wrong with giving the experienced players something fun and challenging to play. They may be a minority, but they still exist and pay their 15 bucks. There is plenty of stuff for casuals to do instead, and this gives us something to work towards. I honestly would quit playing if were able to just blow through everything right away, because what is the point of all the gearing and learning then?

 

As for the distinction of this actually being a "mini-raid", who cares? They already invented a new category for it. They just chose to call it "tier-2 flashpoint" instead of "mini-raid". Semantics. It is pretty clear that it is supposed to be harder than the normal flashpoints. If you can't tell that from the group finder, then there is no hope for you anyway.

[Thorvath]

After another 3 hour round of wipes to the first boss I've sworn it off. I would say the main problem is that if you can one shot this boss atm there is no reason to. You most likely already have the rakata chest or have access to EV HM gear. Even when I actually cleared the place with a group of raid geared people the hours we dumped into this did not equal the reward.

 

Honestly the biggest indicator that the first boss needs a nerf is how comparatively easy the rest of the instance is. Reduce the droid's health by 10% and reduce the number of lightning balls so that melee dps isn't as much of a handicap and it would be in line with the other bosses.

 

Even if you think it doesn't need a nerf I think you'd agree that lightning ball and incinerate should share a cd. That's just an incredibly cheap combo not an "interesting challenge"

[Aurojiin]

No i'm talking to someone who sets his lifes accomplishments based on a pixelated game, when you have a family, a Benz in your driveway, and can take your family on an overseas holiday every year then you'll be standing tall enough to look me straight in the eyes.

Wow, you're actually resorting to life checks now. You have my pity.

 

I also note a sudden silence on the topic of BiS gear. Interesting, that.

 

Anyway, back ontopic: given that LI wasn't touched in the massive round of flashpoint nerfs in 1.3, I'd say BioWare must presently be happy with the level of challenge. Given all it requires is some basic gear and four players with functioning human brains, so they should be.

 

The loot tables could use some tweaking, however. Even if Lorrick dropped a random slot Rakata token, rather than solely chest; Columi groups should be able to run the instance in <30 minutes, meaning they'd have a reason to keep coming back.

Edited July 2, 2012 by Aurojiin

[DiLune]

Wow, you're actually resorting to life checks now. You have my pity.

 

They are funny. Now I gotta get back to signing bills into law in my cushy chair in the Oval Office.

[Aurojiin]

They are funny. Now I gotta get back to signing bills into law in my cushy chair in the Oval Office.

I should go too. I have to meet with the rest of the Illuminati so I can let you know what bills to pass.

 

Obviously I'll be traveling to the meeting in my solid gold Rolls Royce.

Edited July 2, 2012 by Aurojiin

[DiLune]

I should go too. I have to meet with the rest of the Illuminati so I can let you know what bills to pass.

 

Obviously I'll be traveling to the meeting in my solid gold Rolls Royce.

 

Only for now. We're busy mandating a benz in the driveway and yearly overseas trips for everyone. Don't you have the last meeting's minutes?

[Aurojiin]

Only for now. We're busy mandating a benz in the driveway and yearly overseas trips for everyone. Don't you have the last meeting's minutes?

You know, I didn't even notice that part. I did read section 2 (Proposed Requisite Factors for a Valid Opinion), but I started skimming after the first subsection (Family Unit Size; Minimum Number of Children).

 

I am a casual player, and I do not think this should be nerfed. There is nothing wrong with giving the experienced players something fun and challenging to play. They may be a minority, but they still exist and pay their 15 bucks. There is plenty of stuff for casuals to do instead, and this gives us something to work towards. I honestly would quit playing if were able to just blow through everything right away, because what is the point of all the gearing and learning then?

 

As for the distinction of this actually being a "mini-raid", who cares? They already invented a new category for it. They just chose to call it "tier-2 flashpoint" instead of "mini-raid". Semantics. It is pretty clear that it is supposed to be harder than the normal flashpoints. If you can't tell that from the group finder, then there is no hope for you anyway.

Also, quoted for common sense.

Edited July 2, 2012 by Aurojiin

[NoxiousAlby]

I am a casual player, and I do not think this should be nerfed. There is nothing wrong with giving the experienced players something fun and challenging to play. They may be a minority, but they still exist and pay their 15 bucks. There is plenty of stuff for casuals to do instead, and this gives us something to work towards. I honestly would quit playing if were able to just blow through everything right away, because what is the point of all the gearing and learning then?

 

As for the distinction of this actually being a "mini-raid", who cares? They already invented a new category for it. They just chose to call it "tier-2 flashpoint" instead of "mini-raid". Semantics. It is pretty clear that it is supposed to be harder than the normal flashpoints. If you can't tell that from the group finder, then there is no hope for you anyway.

 

Spoken by someone who sounds as though they are yet to attempt it, if your interested in a flash point that my require you going back week after week to try and clear a flashpoint then kudos to you. Past games would indicate that a percentige of non raiding players dont have this mentality, and we have to remember regardless of it's tier ranking it has been marketed as a flashpoint and not an operation.

As for there being no hope for me, I have already cleared it multiple times. In fact I sub one member out of my 4 man crew each week to take a fellow guildy through so they can obtain the blue speeder.

Pure and simple introducing raid mechanics into flashpoint/instances has shown to be a poor formula over the last 2 years, Cataclysm can verify this.

[NoxiousAlby]

Wow, you're actually resorting to life checks now. You have my pity.

Dont need it, my life is all roses.

 

I also note a sudden silence on the topic of BiS gear. Interesting, that.

Not interesting just pointless.

You believe non raiders can be BIS with all their gear and I disagree so we'll just leave it at that.

 

Anyway, back ontopic: given that LI wasn't touched in the massive round of flashpoint nerfs in 1.3, I'd say BioWare must presently be happy with the level of challenge. Given all it requires is some basic gear and four players with functioning human brains, so they should be.

Funny that I never quite understood why FP's that didnt need nerfing were nerfed in 1.3, even with the advent of RDF pug groups shouldnt have any problem clearing pre 1.3 FP's.

Obviously BW intend for HM LI to act as filler content for raiders given that EC only has 4 bosses and will be cleared long before 1.4 is released. Marketing it as a FP however will create dissilllusion amongst players who cant manage to complete it. Regardless of whether it is ear marked as T2 or not player mentality shows that FP/instances should be achievable by 95% of players, and that wont be the case with HM LI.

 

The loot tables could use some tweaking, however. Even if Lorrick dropped a random slot Rakata token, rather than solely chest; Columi groups should be able to run the instance in <30 minutes, meaning they'd have a reason to keep coming back.

This is good

Look I would be amazed at any Columi group completing HM LI in <30 min the first time, and the rewards definatley need tweaking. I'm assuming that like me this FP offered no upgrades for you but only the satisfaction of having done it plus the Aratech Ice.

It's just my opinion but if all the bosses dropped Rakata or Lorrick a token as you suggested I would advocate that non raiders would need to man up for this FP. If the rewards equaled the effort then it most certainly shouldnt be touched, if players want T3 raiding gear then they would need to work for it. But in it's current format I can understand the angst it is causing some players who are being driven to despair for a single chest piece and the Aratech ice.

[Aurojiin]

As for there being no hope for me, I have already cleared it multiple times. In fact I sub one member out of my 4 man crew each week to take a fellow guildy through so they can obtain the blue speeder.

The person you quoted was making the point that the group finder clearly communicates that players should expect a higher challenge from LI (on account of the tier 1 and tier 2 distinctions). Your response to this is to comment on how good you apparently are at clearing the flashpoint.

 

Your statements don't even have basic logical consistency. There was literally no connection between what was quoted and what you asserted. It's bizarre.

 

It's clear no amount of reasonable discussion will convince you to see past this nonsensical raid/non-raid divide you've constructed in your head. Part of the problem is that you simply provide no actual justification for your arguments: you just make arbitrary declarations about "non-raiders" and "raid mechanics" (whatever this means), while occasionally hand-waving Cataclysm references. Can you at least explain to me the following things:

 

1. What exactly are raid mechanics, as separate from - assumably - flashpoint mechanics?

2. Why should "non-raiders" have no options for challenging content?

3. Why should "raiders" have no options for challenging content in less than 8-man groups?

 

Not interesting just pointless.

You believe non raiders can be BIS with all their gear and I disagree so we'll just leave it at that.

You can disagree, but that won't make me any less right. I explained how non-raiders can achieve BiS for about 80-90% of their gear, give or take. I'm yet to see a counterpoint.

 

I'm assuming that like me this FP offered no upgrades for you but only the satisfaction of having done it plus the Aratech Ice.

It's just my opinion but if all the bosses dropped Rakata or Lorrick a token as you suggested I would advocate that non raiders would need to man up for this FP. If the rewards equaled the effort then it most certainly shouldnt be touched, if players want T3 raiding gear then they would need to work for it. But in it's current format I can understand the angst it is causing some players who are being driven to despair for a single chest piece and the Aratech ice.

I more or less agree here. Aside from the weekly BH comms, I suspect the only players who really benefit much from this flashpoints (notwithstanding the simple fun factor) are the more hardcore variety (or "raiders" if you will) who use it to accelerate their alts' gearing curves.

 

For players who are decently geared, the only loot-based reason to return regularly is if you're lucky enough to have a Rakata chest itemisation with a decent mod or enhancement. This is true of all flashpoints, essentially, but since LI stands alone in tier 2 it should really provide a stronger incentive to rerun it.

Edited July 3, 2012 by Aurojiin

[NoxiousAlby]

Only for now. We're busy mandating a benz in the driveway and yearly overseas trips for everyone. Don't you have the last meeting's minutes?

 

Now your stretching the line between fiction and fantasy DiLune, the US government wouldnt be financially capable of mandating a Benz in the driveway and overseas holidays for everyone. Leave that to private citizens who can afford it.