1.3: Mercenary DPS PVE specs?

[ushistorycoach]

What pve specs are you using now?

[Aerro]

What pve specs are you using now?

 

Still using Arsenal and have yet to have anyone top me in DPS. I am averaging about 1780 DPS now on HM Firebrand and Stormcaller, where as before I was doing around 1600 DPS.

[acnoj]

1780? You must know something I don't. Short of AoEing the guys under the shields, I can't imagine doing that much.

[Aerro]

1780? You must know something I don't. Short of AoEing the guys under the shields, I can't imagine doing that much.

 

Fully raid buffed, my Tracer Missiles are now critting for 4k.

[Fossman]

Still using arsenal. Putting out more than I was in 1.2 but my tracers are definitely not critting for 4k

 

How are you comparing to marauders aerro?

[acnoj]

Fully raid buffed, my Tracer Missiles are now critting for 4k.

 

Seriously? I'm in fully augmented level 61 gear and I don't get close to that even with a relic and adrenal. Is this with a Marauder popping Bloodthirst?

Even with Bloodthirst, 1780 DPS is more than a quarter over mine. Got any logs or a profile I can have a look at?

Edited June 29, 2012 by acnoj

[Gyronamics]

Sounds about right tbh.

 

I calculated pyro damage to be over 1700 damage in 1.3 but that was without augs.

 

Arsenal is much the same.

Edited June 30, 2012 by Gyronamics

[lawphill]

In response to the original question, I believe this is the top Arsenal PvE build: http://db.darthhater.com/skill_calc/bounty_hunter/mercenary/#::f6df8efef2e13fe2f2e3f10def6

 

The Merc Arsenal Compendium on MMO-mechanics posted some numbers for different builds (based on SimulationCraft) and this has the highest DPS. Not having 3 points in Advanced Targeting seems to be a bad idea, and you get a slight advantage out of splitting the last two points between the two alacrity skills.

[Aerro]

Seriously? I'm in fully augmented level 61 gear and I don't get close to that even with a relic and adrenal. Is this with a Marauder popping Bloodthirst?

Even with Bloodthirst, 1780 DPS is more than a quarter over mine. Got any logs or a profile I can have a look at?

 

Doing dailies with only a Sorc buff I see ~3700+ Tracer Missile crits.

[Aerro]

In response to the original question, I believe this is the top Arsenal PvE build: http://db.darthhater.com/skill_calc/bounty_hunter/mercenary/#::f6df8efef2e13fe2f2e3f10def6

 

The Merc Arsenal Compendium on MMO-mechanics posted some numbers for different builds (based on SimulationCraft) and this has the highest DPS. Not having 3 points in Advanced Targeting seems to be a bad idea, and you get a slight advantage out of splitting the last two points between the two alacrity skills.

 

I honestly stopped reading anything on MMO-Mechanics because its quality has greatly diminished. SIMCraft is nice to use, but at the same time it has major flaws. Right now, Bioware doesn't give us nearly enough information regarding boss mitigation (IE. armor values). As I explained before, the amount of armor the boss has GREATLY affects which talents we should be using. We know around the exact amount a Training Dummy has, but at the same time we know that we get different numbers on a boss fight. If a boss were to have 10k armor, then yes, the 30% additional ArP would be nice. If a boss has 6k armor, then it really doesn't matter.

 

Also one of the main problems at hand is the fact that it seems to be combining mutiplicatively. Either thats a bug or it is actually intended. We do not know right now. All we have are logs from one another.

[deadandburied]

We know the Ops test dummy has 5814 armor. For every point not put into Advanced Targeting you will do approx 4% less damage on Unload and Railshot. It's actually a bit more more than that. But was easier to do the math with a whole number. I then did a comparison of the 7/31/3 alacrity build vs a 5/31/5 build. I ran multiple tests with both builds and wrote down all damages. From there i was able to get a correct average of each abilities normal damage and an average crit damage value. From there i assigned 40% crit for all abilities except i gave Tracer Missle 55% crit. That took care of the damage values.

 

Next i wrote a chart based on rotation and the correct time for each ability used. I did this for both builds and went to 32 seconds. The 7/31/3 build was able to do an extra Tracer Missle after about 30 seconds. I decided to favor the 7/31/3 build and went to just under 35 seconds. This allowed it to finish with an Unload where as the 5/31/5 build could not. Still the 5/31/5 build was higher even when i tried to favor the 7/31/3 build. The 8% less damage on Unload and Railshot was just to much of a disadvantage. I will assume bosses have 5814 armor until we find out otherwise.

 

Now as for raiding i'm trying to remember if there are any fights where we actually stay in one spot and never move to even take advantage of the 7/31/3 build. I can think of only 1 fight. So i see no advantage using the 7/31/3 build even if it was slightly better which it isn't.

 

The 6/31/4 build that is using 3 points in Tracer lock is intriguing. I'll have to math this one out next as it may very well beat the other 2. It may require a higher crit % and this means less power. With that build you'd have to stand still for what 37 seconds to get an extra hit in? Sure by math maybe it'll win. But in an Ops i'm just not seeing it. Can also look at it this way. Let's say after 18 seconds boss tosses some crap on the ground and you have to move. Now let's say with 5/31/5 you were half way thru your cast. You'd interupt it by moving your arse away. But with 6/31/4 you may have just finished the cast. So it can have it's advantages. Maybe the 7/31/3 and 6/31/4 build are good for getting that last hit in on trash mobs as well. I'm already #1 on trash and quite frankly i'd rather be #1 on bosses and i'm nowhere near that currently.

Edited July 1, 2012 by deadandburied

[Gyronamics]

Doing dailies with only a Sorc buff I see ~3700+ Tracer Missile crits.

 

I was going to doubt this but then I looked at the numbers my 1.3 geared Pyro was doing and I was critting for 3700+ on trash mobs without an adrenal. I'm using Powershot however but it's all the same.

 

Actually it's not the same at all because one is 55% armour avoiding and the other is 9% buffed on fire and does more damage before that too.

 

But whatever, in the end, it's much the same.

 

Evidence of brutal murder: http://s11.postimage.org/6l6h386df/tmpmax.jpg

 

Fully raid buffed, my Tracer Missiles are now critting for 4k.

 

On trash I believe that.

 

Dunno about 4k crits on a boss though even with bloodthirst and adrenal.

 

But I didn't know I was hitting so hard so I'll try it out.

Edited July 1, 2012 by Gyronamics

[colin_]

Seriously? I'm in fully augmented level 61 gear and I don't get close to that even with a relic and adrenal. Is this with a Marauder popping Bloodthirst?

Even with Bloodthirst, 1780 DPS is more than a quarter over mine. Got any logs or a profile I can have a look at?

 

I'm sure he is BIS if not close. My gear is about 90% done and I'm seeing 3.5+ tm's fully buffed in raids. Stack power, have enough acc/surge and spam away.

[acnoj]

SIMCraft is nice to use, but at the same time it has major flaws. Right now, Bioware doesn't give us nearly enough information regarding boss mitigation (IE. armor values). As I explained before, the amount of armor the boss has GREATLY affects which talents we should be using. We know around the exact amount a Training Dummy has, but at the same time we know that we get different numbers on a boss fight.

 

That's just not true, I've personally tested both the defense (10%) and armor (35%) of bosses and made sure the Simulation Craft guys have it right, which they do. The numbers have been confirmed by a number of other people.

There will always be issues comparing simulations to real fights, but the damage math is correct (for Arsenal at least).

I use a spreadsheet for tracking my stat balance and theoretical DPS, I use Simulation Craft for rapid prototyping of specs and rotations and for comparison, and I use in-game data to double check both..and both of those tools are within 2% of my actual damage.

 

So when my spreadsheet tells me Advanced Targeting beats the Alacrity talents by 2.6%, and Simulation Craft says AT is better by 2.4%, I'm inclined to believe them. It's hard to measure that difference on a target dummy let alone in raid, so I trust in the tools at hand.

[saatana]

This is the DPS build I have been using in 1.3 and I think it´s OK, for at least pure PvE Ops & random daily runs.

 

http://db.darthhater.com/skill_calc/bounty_hunter/mercenary/#::f15efef2e13fe2f2e3f3df7ef6:

[Aerro]

That's just not true, I've personally tested both the defense (10%) and armor (35%) of bosses and made sure the Simulation Craft guys have it right, which they do. The numbers have been confirmed by a number of other people.

There will always be issues comparing simulations to real fights, but the damage math is correct (for Arsenal at least).

I use a spreadsheet for tracking my stat balance and theoretical DPS, I use Simulation Craft for rapid prototyping of specs and rotations and for comparison, and I use in-game data to double check both..and both of those tools are within 2% of my actual damage.

 

So when my spreadsheet tells me Advanced Targeting beats the Alacrity talents by 2.6%, and Simulation Craft says AT is better by 2.4%, I'm inclined to believe them. It's hard to measure that difference on a target dummy let alone in raid, so I trust in the tools at hand.

 

Well I take back what I said!

[Obmel]

Aerro, what 2 relics are you using? I'm thinking the War Hero +113 Power and the Campaign +kinetic dmg ones are the best right now. (Both augmented of course)

[acnoj]

Well I take back what I said!

 

LOL now confess you're DPS secrets! For all my math you're still kicking my butt on the DPS. And don't tell me how much your Tracer is hitting for, lets talk rotations and boss specific tricks.

[Kulis]

I am a bit torn right now on relics. I am not a fan of the on equip damage proc relics. I am using the War Hero power relic and the matrix cube. I just picked up a second War Hero relic, I am tempted to use it. I am going to run some dps test runs on the dummy and see what happens. I too am seeing some massive increase in Tracer Missile crits, I have seen up to 3700. If I use another of these relics it will push my power up over 900. I am still using the alacrity build, but after reading some of these posts I am tempted to try a new build.

[Raekor]

Still using Arsenal and have yet to have anyone top me in DPS. I am averaging about 1780 DPS now on HM Firebrand and Stormcaller, where as before I was doing around 1600 DPS.

 

My DPS is never high in that fight, but total damage done is usually up there at 2nd or 3rd. When using swtorlogs, dps was under 1K last night (story mode so wasn't trying that hard, first time on the time taking double instead of dancing, and multiple incredibly unlucky crit streaks). How are maintaining such high dps when there is so much down time in that fight?

 

Should I try finding and uploading my logs to a different website instead of using the swtorlogs parser?

[Gyronamics]

LOL now confess you're DPS secrets! For all my math you're still kicking my butt on the DPS. And don't tell me how much your Tracer is hitting for, lets talk rotations and boss specific tricks.

 

1) Don't let the group put you on the ground dodging missiles and lightning rods

2) Get on Firebrand not Stormcaller

3) Stay fighting on the tank during a shield phase and position so its knockback tosses you into the shield so no damage is wasted running about.

 

The rest is your rotation and gear.

 

Keeping up DPS in that fight is exceptionally easy if you're doing that, I have merc pyro parses that prove over 1700 dps is totally doable in 1.3 gearing for mercs. I didn't even cherry pick the parse, had 15 mins to do one and it's the first and only one I did.

 

You use FB/SC for big dps numbers because the others... are a bit crap for big dps numbers

 

Toth/Zorn = phases where you can't dps and relies on tanks keeping them where you can hit

Vorgath = Sometimes there's just nothing to hit

Kephess = lots of movement chasing targets

 

But 4k tracer on a boss (without freaky damage multipliers like fabricator/lorrick) isn't happening. Trash maybe, if you blow adrenal and bloodthirst on trash that is.

 

I've got 1049 power and 2298 aim and (if I was arsenal spec, which I'm not) my tracer would be 2100 average damage before reductions so somehow you need to more than double that damage with crit and buffs since the boss will still have about 20% damage reduction after all armour debuffs.

Edited July 3, 2012 by Gyronamics

[Raekor]

1) Don't let the group put you on the ground dodging missiles and lightning rods

2) Get on Firebrand not Stormcaller

3) Stay fighting on the tank during a shield phase and position so its knockback tosses you into the shield so no damage is wasted running about.

 

The rest is your rotation and gear.

 

Keeping up DPS in that fight is exceptionally easy if you're doing that, I have merc pyro parses that prove over 1700 dps is totally doable in 1.3 gearing for mercs. I didn't even cherry pick the parse, had 15 mins to do one and it's the first and only one I did.

 

You use FB/SC for big dps numbers because the others... are a bit crap for big dps numbers

 

Toth/Zorn = phases where you can't dps and relies on tanks keeping them where you can hit

Vorgath = Sometimes there's just nothing to hit

Kephess = lots of movement chasing targets

 

But 4k tracer on a boss (without freaky damage multipliers like fabricator/lorrick) isn't happening. Trash maybe, if you blow adrenal and bloodthirst on trash that is.

 

I've got 1049 power and 2298 aim and (if I was arsenal spec, which I'm not) my tracer would be 2100 average damage before reductions so somehow you need to more than double that damage with crit and buffs since the boss will still have about 20% damage reduction after all armour debuffs.

 

Ah, so that's where the big dps is coming from on F & S . Then I don't really care if I am low, as we down them anyway when I'm dancing.

 

Regarding the last paragraph, I and other have commented that tracers appear to be doing nearly 100% more damage on crits lately. Something that I have noticed, but haven't pulled out any parses to double check though. Could just be lucky timing when I notice it and am not looking at cool downs or positioning.

[acnoj]

1) Don't let the group put you on the ground dodging missiles and lightning rods

2) Get on Firebrand not Stormcaller

3) Stay fighting on the tank during a shield phase and position so its knockback tosses you into the shield so no damage is wasted running about.

 

The rest is your rotation and gear.

 

I haven't done it yet with full Augs, will be trying that tonight. I already do all those things you suggested, I think my main DPS losses would be running in at the start, and running back onto Firebrand after the shield phases. I'm getting rapid shots in but nothing substantial, so maybe I need to pause for a second to fire some Tracers. I'll see how I go.

[Raekor]

If getting knocked into the shield, a good use for (forgotten it's damn name) power surge?is to use it to fire a tracer on the run back. Also if you don't use rail shot under the shield and use that on the run back, that should be 2-3 GCD's to run back in and get on the tank before having to stop for tracer. If you kill your adds fast enough, you can turn and get a full set of armour debuffs on him before running back in, giving you a heat seeker as well.

 

Is that viable, or not advisable?

[HeVans_]

Fully buffed I have around 1080 tech bonus damage (2201 Aim and 1165 Power) my tracers crit on bosses (without bloodthirst) for about 3.6k, 4k is possible on trash.