When is bioware going to fix tank assassins in dps gear?

[stephenalandavie]

Actually according to Bioware we were tanking better than either of those two classes which is why we were nerfed on armor. It's more of a PvE nerf than anything else. At least that's the rationale behind the nerfs.

 

Tank speced+geared Jugg/PT will likely live longer too because they don't do meaningful DPS so nobody good will waste time attacking one of those guys. I guess you can be tanked speced+DPS gear but you'd just be a bad DPS for Jugg/PT so probably you won't see anyone doing that.

 

Thats what i mean in a way we may of been tanking to well which is why they lowered the survivability. we are meant to put out the DPS that we do.

 

There will always be alot of haters. I myself find operatives annoying but it doesnt mean i think they need a NERF.

 

Those that moan are usually the ones who always change classes rerolling the new flavour of the month.

 

All i see are PTs these days

[DarthMaulUK]

They are the most overpowered class in the game and take zero skill. Why haven't they been nerfed yet? this isn't something new either, this has been going on for a long time. Something needs to be done.

 

You speak like someone who hasnt got a clue. There IS a skill playing Assassin. Just because you cant deal with them, dont blame the class

[Kawiki]

Actually according to Bioware we were tanking better than either of those two classes which is why we were nerfed on armor. It's more of a PvE nerf than anything else. At least that's the rationale behind the nerfs.

 

Tank speced+geared Jugg/PT will likely live longer too because they don't do meaningful DPS so nobody good will waste time attacking one of those guys. I guess you can be tanked speced+DPS gear but you'd just be a bad DPS for Jugg/PT so probably you won't see anyone doing that.

 

Agree. According to BW Assasins were performing about 10% better then other tanks in PvE. This nerf has nothing to do with PvP.

 

However, Jugg/PT are clearly the best tank for PvP now. If anyone actually plays one. Assassins have the absolute worst mitigation in PvP of the tank classes now. Hell Maras make better tanks then they do now.

 

The assasin role will be a moderate damage/high utilty pest.

[JMCH]

Assassin tanks is dps gear are totally not a problem. According to bioware, the only issue with them is that tank specced/geared assassins are overperforming slightly in pve.

After some thinking, they effectively have an edge over the other tanks in PvE, but mostly in some insanely elite PvE context.

 

When you stack shield and defense index, wear a full (armorings) PvE set and a shield amplification relic (perhaps even PvP shield relics as of 1.3), with the proper build, you have by far the best damage mitigation of all 3 tanks.

 

Overall, that's quite a difficult combo and doesn't make the sin "invincible" at all, just a little tougher than its comrades, on encounters not ignoring its defenses (remains to be seen on these, with what seems to be the highest elemental/internal damage mitigation). 65% (permanent!) chance to reduce the hit to 50~60% of its nominal value remains relatively standard for a tank, the issue is the others are lower than that (45% chance with similar gear) and have a lesser parry rate too (5% to be exact, 23 vs 28% in the case I simulated).

 

 

Just to be clear : I'm not defending this stupid nerf, but there's definately something wrong PvE-wise, and what has been done will have horrible effects.

Edited June 26, 2012 by JMCH

[Kawiki]

After some thinking, they effectively have an edge over the other tanks in PvE, but mostly in some insanely elite PvE context.

 

When you stack shield and defense index, wear a full (armorings) PvE set and a shield amplification relic (perhaps even PvP shield relics as of 1.3), with the proper build, you have by far the best damage mitigation of all 3 tanks.

 

Overall, that's quite a difficult combo and doesn't make the sin "invincible" at all, just a little tougher than its comrades, on encounters not ignoring its defenses (remains to be seen on these, with what seems to be the highest elemental/internal damage mitigation). 65% (permanent!) chance to reduce the hit to 50~60% of its nominal value remains relatively standard for a tank, the issue is the others are lower than that (45% chance with similar gear) and have a lesser parry rate too (5% to be exact, 23 vs 28% in the case I simulated).

 

 

Just to be clear : I'm not defending this stupid nerf, but there's definately something wrong PvE-wise, and what has been done will have horrible effects.

 

The extra shield chance only makes up for the far less armor mitigation. Assassins will have about 10% less armor mitigation then the other tanks after this nerf.

 

Also the extra shield chance is not permanent. It needs to be activated and the charges are subject to running out before the cooldown is over. Though this rarely happens.

 

The problem was/is resilience. Since there is more force/tech damage in end game which bypasses shields and it only subject to armor mitigation, bw felt/their metrics showed that the 5 seconds of immunity every 45 seconds (inaddition to the self healing) that assassins get makes them perform better.

 

Assasins require the most skill to play of the tanks, will be the spikiest in terms of damage recieved and have the least PvP/PvE "natural" mitigation.

 

Therefore, Their increased damage potential over the other tanks is quite justified.

Edited June 26, 2012 by Kawiki

[Astarica]

The only time tanking stats matter in PvP is if you're carrying the Huttball and Jugg were always best due to having two charges.

 

Let's say a tank takes half of the damage after mitigation/shield/passives compared to a healer. Well if the tank is guarding the healer you might as well focus fire the healer because the shared damage is equal to what you'd get if you attack tank first. And of course if the healer isn't guarded you definitely attack the healer first. In a 1onX situation no tank is going to win by outlasting the enemy even if the X is 2, and stuff like stealth, Force Shroud, Force Cloak, or even Force Speed are far better at stalling time than mere defensive CDs because 2 people can power through any flat DPS reducers very fast but if you Force Cloak at the right time and they failed to catch you, that buys you 7 seconds even if you're fighting 8 guys in Alderaan/Voidstar (you interrupt the cap just as they're about to be done).

 

It's even possible that with the armor nerf people might realize Tankasins aren't someone you need 3 guys attacking the whole time and actually focus on DPS classes with much worse survivality which indirectly increases our survivality. Even as the most powerful class in the game in 1.2, it never made sense to attack a Tankasin over say a PT first. We are at least 3 times as hard to kill as a PT but we sure don't do 3 times their DPS. In fact it's not clear we do more DPS (overall) than they do and it should be readily obvious we are way harder to kill. The armor nerf isn't going to make Tankasins have worse survivality with any DPS in the same zip code aside from possibly Marauders. It'd still always be better to kill any non Marauder DPS that dies way faster while doing comparable DPS compared to a Tankasin even if you're limited to just DPS as targets.

[Dejected]

What they should have done is nerf their damage and buff their threat generation with every attack. That way they wont do such damage in WZ's but they'll still be able to tank content in PvE. Then if people want to live, they go Darkness/KC and if they want to kill, they go Deception:Madness/Infiltration:Balance.

 

 

Problem Solved.

[Astarica]

What they should have done is nerf their damage and buff their threat generation with every attack. That way they wont do such damage in WZ's but they'll still be able to tank content in PvE. Then if people want to live, they go Darkness/KC and if they want to kill, they go Deception:Madness/Infiltration:Balance.

 

 

Problem Solved.

 

Problem is Bioware says we are too good at tanking in PvE to begin with. I don't know if that's true or not, but that's what they're saying. If Bioware is right, then nerfing the mitigation is a no brainer if we are indeed that much better at survivality than the other two tank classes while leaving DPS alone.

 

My prediction is that over time you'll see even bigger numbers from Tankasins in WZ leaderboard because the only way a Tankasin fails to get awesome numbers is if 3 guys are on him the whole time, which never made sense to begin with (you just don't focus fire tanks in PvP). People will realize they need to start hitting the PTs/Snipers now that the Tankasin isn't borderline immortal but this would actually pump up Tankasin WZ numbers even more. There will be a brief drop in numbers since people will still send 3 guys after a Tankasin first which we'd definitely be worse off, but eventually people will learn to stop doing that.