Which augment are you going to use?

[Boxer]

So, stacking power? Stacking aim? Mixing in some crit or surge? What's your plan?

[pureeffinmetal]

So, stacking power? Stacking aim? Mixing in some crit or surge? What's your plan?

 

Use Aim. Main Stat scales better with the 9% buff from talents and another 5% from the Sage buff. This makes Main Stat better than Power at a 1:1 ratio.

 

Never use Crit or Surge in augments. You can max this stats to their effective DR range with just enhancements so its a bit pointless IMO.

Edited June 23, 2012 by pureeffinmetal

[Boxer]

I actually did the math last night on the power vs aim.

 

1 point of power adds .23 damage.

1 point of aim adds .2 damage.

adding 1 aim to armor with the buffs you mentioned gives you 1.14 aim for the stats.

.2 * 1.14 = 2.28

 

For healing, 1 aim = .14 while 1 power = .17, but 1.14*.14 = .16. So, for healing your losing out on ~ 2 bonus healing..

 

So, as far as raw damage and healing goes, aim = power

However, aim also influences crit, with the 252 aim probably increasing crit by a bit less than 1% (depending on your stats)

 

So you're right that aim is a winner, but not by a huge margin.

Edited June 23, 2012 by Boxer

[Boufsa]

To be clear with few maths:

1 power => 0.23 damage

1 aim => 0.2 damage

1 aim with buff & talents => 0.2*1.14 = 0.228 damage

1 - (0.228/0.23) = 0.0087

 

So in term of damage difference aim is 0.9% less effective than power. That small difference is compensated with the other stats that depend on aim, especially the crit. On the other hand once you have augmented in aim, the crit gained should allow you to replace some crit/surge sophs with power/surge ones

[ArchangelLBC]

Keep in mind that while Aim benefits from talents AND sage buff, Power does benefit from Knight buff, so you have to figure those into your equations too. Specifically 1 power with Knight buff adds .2415 Bonus damage.

 

 

Still probably not enough difference to make up for the very minor crit boost you get from Aim, but there you are.

[Oticus]

so finnally a good theorycraft thread

so my question is what should be our minimum and max goals for each stat:

Power

Accuracy

Crit

Surge

Aim I know is more= better

Alacrity- dont care atm as I am gunnery

thanks very much

[Boufsa]

so finnally a good theorycraft thread

 

You didn't dig too well. Take a look at those:

Which short end is shorter?

Is aim really always the best stat?

[azhrione]

If your Crit is >35% then Power Augment is better since diminishing returns have kicked in for Crit.

 

If your Crit is <35% but >30% and your Bonus Damage is under 400/700 then Power Augment is better since bonus damage means more than Crit rate when you are that low. You should fix your gear before slotting anything though.

 

Any other time Aim > Power in terms of augments.

[Boufsa]

Where do these assertions come from?

 

BTW I don't understand what you mean by "diminishing returns"

[Luceon]

Diminishing returns is when you have a stat that reaches a certain point and whenever you get more of it the benefit is less than what it used to be. It is a fail safe system to keep players from becoming over powered. An example is if you have a crit rate of 30%. If you raise it by 5% then you will likely get crit attack ~35% , however if you raised it by 10% to 40%, you may only hit a crit about lets say ~37% of the time. That 5 extra % didn't quite equal 5% at that high of a crit rate. The same goes for the crit multiplier with usually DR around 70-75%. Edited July 2, 2012 by Luceon

[Boufsa]

Thanks to you I now understand better the following quote:

If your Crit is >35% then Power Augment is better since diminishing returns have kicked in for Crit.

 

But I would have formulated it in anotherway: "Always use aim augments, and if your crit is >35%, switch a endu/crit/surge soph for an endu/power/surge one"

 

BTW I thought that the DR on crit was just about the crit index and that the "due to aim" crit bonus was unaffected ?

[azhrione]

Thanks to you I now understand better the following quote:

 

 

But I would have formulated it in anotherway: "Always use aim augments, and if your crit is >35%, switch a endu/crit/surge soph for an endu/power/surge one"

 

BTW I thought that the DR on crit was just about the crit index and that the "due to aim" crit bonus was unaffected ?

 

Currently no matter what Power Augments are already about .002% better than Aim Augments even taking Crit into account. This is due to various talents and abilities increasing damage or doing other things on Crits.

 

Aim adds to the "Critical Rating" we have, it does not directly add to Crit %. This means once diminishing returns are hit we gain little or nothing from Aim in terms of improved Critical %. At this point Power Augments become a lot better than Aim Augments.

 

You are right in that if you are hitting diminishing returns with Aim Augments, then you should be moving stuff around. From my experience this is really hard to do overall since the best gear is a little short on Crit.

[Soltrooper]

Currently no matter what Power Augments are already about .002% better than Aim Augments even taking Crit into account. This is due to various talents and abilities increasing damage or doing other things on Crits.

 

Aim adds to the "Critical Rating" we have, it does not directly add to Crit %. This means once diminishing returns are hit we gain little or nothing from Aim in terms of improved Critical %. At this point Power Augments become a lot better than Aim Augments.

 

You are right in that if you are hitting diminishing returns with Aim Augments, then you should be moving stuff around. From my experience this is really hard to do overall since the best gear is a little short on Crit.

 

Sorry but that's wrong on a lot of counts. Look at your tooltip... it tells you what Aim does - it is giving you critical chances not critical rating. A look at crit rating will show you how much crit you get from Aim, how much from Cunning and how much from Crit Rating and how much from talents/buffs/companion bonus, etc. This is important because diminishing returns is on each category - that is there is a separate formula for Crit rating with it's own level of diminishing returns, another for Aim and another for Cunning. There is no diminishing returns for talent/buff bonuses. And the crit levels from each source do not contribute to the diminishing returns from other sources.

 

There is no diminishing returns on the tech/ranged damage bonus from Aim, it is a flat 0.2 (0.14 for heals). Check this with your tooltip if you don't believe me, with no buffs, your tech/damage bonus will be Aim/5. Power gives a flat 0.23 (0.17 for heals). But Aim in raid and group situations should have a 14% buff, so that 1 point of Aim is actually 1.14 points of Aim giving 0.228 (0.16) damage/heals bonus. Factor in the crit bonus, and as someone said in another thread Aim is always better than power for DPS until you have 8000 Aim (a bit less for healing but still an unattainable Aim number). Commando's should never be using Power augments where Aim is available. The reason some of the lower Aim/higher power mods win out is because the Aim + Power total on the low Aim/high Power mod is better.

[Freeborne]

Here is by far the best explanation I have seen on the Aim vs Power debate:

 

 

And as someone else said in this thread: ALWAYS go Aim.

[Boufsa]

Thanks for the very interesting link

[ArchangelLBC]

Got it so Aim augments all around then, but can someone tell me off the top of their head what the DR on Critical Chance from Aim is?

[Freeborne]

It's a very lazy curve. From the post I linked:

 

At exactly 1 primary stat point you gain +0.00813527 % crit chance per point.

 

At exactly 2000 primary stat points you gain +0.004730614986327% crit chance per point.

 

[AshlaBoga]

If your Crit is >35% then Power Augment is better since diminishing returns have kicked in for Crit.

 

If your Crit is <35% but >30% and your Bonus Damage is under 400/700 then Power Augment is better since bonus damage means more than Crit rate when you are that low. You should fix your gear before slotting anything though.

 

Any other time Aim > Power in terms of augments.

 

When you say "Crit is 35%" do you mean buffed or unbuffed?

[ArchangelLBC]

Since my understanding is that buffs don't affect the DR of crit from aim or crit rating, I would guess that that's unbuffed.

[jedip_enguin]

Was going to go for power, but changed to Aim at the last minute.

[AshlaBoga]

Since my understanding is that buffs don't affect the DR of crit from aim or crit rating, I would guess that that's unbuffed.

 

Except Lucky Shots and Coordination add 5%. So if you have 31% unbuffed, you'd have 36% buffed.

[ArchangelLBC]

Except Lucky Shots and Coordination add 5%. So if you have 31% unbuffed, you'd have 36% buffed.

 

Yes, but again that shouldn't affect the DR for Crit from aim (or from crit rating for that matter). That's why I personally am shooting for 35% unbuffed and stacking power everywhere else.