FOTM and easymode in this game

[matslarson]

the current trend is to play a spec that does about 80 to 90% of the dmg a DD class would while having a lot of either CC or dmg mit (or both in one case haha). This makes for what is imo (and many people I talk to) both simple and boring pvp.

 

Basically what you're arguing is that classes with flexibility and utility have become the flavour of the month...and this is somehow more boring than everyone playing a "HULK SMASH" straight dps char?

 

And for bonus points you claim anyone who disagrees with you is an uneducated simpleton without the college degrees you posses...

 

That's quite a compelling argument you've constructed there chief...

 

I play a full corruption sorc btw, which has never and will never be the fotm, and I heal the pants off of Op healers, which are the current fotm healers. I see a pretty nice balance in most of my lvl 50 WZs. Lowbie PvP has far too many Marauders, but you refused to include them in your list of fotm chars and you have tons of college degrees, so they must not be as overwhelmingly popular with rerollers as they seem to be.

Edited June 20, 2012 by matslarson

[Xerain]

Im shocked you would say this as a past Rift player. FOTM when there are only 4 classes... It was so much worse how could just spec to fotm at will. It would be like SWTOR letting us swap advanced classes.

 

I cant really follow your argument anyway.. Im not seeing any evidence of extreme FOTM like Ive seen in other games. No where close actually. Even more bizarre is that lately Im seeing an *** ton of mercs in my wzs, supposedly one of the worst classes.

 

Be awesome if SWTOR offered classes like RIFT.

[Cooperal]

Strange analysis by the OP. Especially when defining 4 of only 8 advanced classes (and presumably their mirrors) as FOTM early on.

 

That and operatives are unmentioned in thier "invincible unless stupid" state.

[FodderofCannon]

NOOOOOO it's finally happened. Someoned called snipers FOTM.....my beloved sniper...my very first 50...the class I've been playing since beta....now I'll just look like one of the FOTM's in wz's. Why are they FOTM? They've had no real major changes since launch, a few quality of life adjustments, but thats about it. I heard some people say it's because they can counter all maras/sents out there though.

 

I know of no other class that can lock someone down and burst their face off better than a sniper. They are weak to multiple enemies, but otherwise they do insane burst damage compared to all other classes. Also I have noticed some of them are more tanky than tanks.

 

1v1 this class is only class I consider OP.

[sauerkraut]

Strange analysis by the OP. Especially when defining 4 of only 8 advanced classes (and presumably their mirrors) as FOTM early on.

 

That and operatives are unmentioned in thier "invincible unless stupid" state.

 

Somehow I have the feeling, that the OP is not aware he mirror class situation in TOR, he probably rolls one of those OP classes his complaining about.

[alcek]

Now lets define fotm for SWTOR. Right now it is War (Mar or jug), tankasin, ptech, and sniper.

Juggernaught/guardian? Really?

I agree on the rest, though.

[Orangerascal]

Now lets define fotm for SWTOR. Right now it is War (Mar or jug), tankasin, ptech, and sniper.

 

When 5 out of 8 classes are FOTM, I call that a pretty balanced game. Now bring the other 3 up to par.

 

And personally I think the sorc and scoundel are just fine.

Edited June 20, 2012 by Orangerascal

[Helig]

Juggernaught/guardian? Really?

I agree on the rest, though.

He's probably referring to Rage - which doesn't fit into "do much-mitigate much" description, since this spec is rather squishy.

[Jetflair]

The FOTM mentality isn't larger in this game unlike OP says.

 

Most of players I meet and play in WZ are sages or inquisitors simply because so many rolled them early on. I'd like to see example of game where there would be neither at all.

 

I remember WoW having real FOTM problem. People really rolled warlocks when they fine. When rogues were better they were everywhere. When paladins became OP they were everywhere. Then Deathknights etc.

[Lovia]

Fotm will be the dominant play style in swtor for as long as it will exist. It takes 50-100hrs to get a fresh 50, buy recruit and then in another 50-100 you are done with battlemaster and you are well on your way to some warhero pieces. A casual player can achieve this within 2 or 3 months.

 

The development cycle for balance changes is 3 to 4 months, thus making it possible for every1 to reroll and regear fotm.

 

This wont get better in the feature due to level cap increases and resets on any achieved balance.

 

Thus the only path for a player is to reroll fotms and hope that devs change their balancing circle to fix the situation or just have fun with a different character every 3 or so months.

[clearsighted]

Sin has 3 choices, I only listed 1. Marauder I didn't list as fotm so that is not included and I explained why. Merc has 3 choices. Sorc has 3 choices. Scoundrel has 3 choices. So you said 8 choices and you are wrong. I am trying to have a logical discussion about what is making the pvp in this game less fun than it could be. You likely play to make yourself feel better and not to have fun. I already am very happy irl. I play to have fun and this game has great potential.

 

I didn't list any healers because there is nothing wrong with healing. Cross healing is a prob in all mmo's and I have talked about using diminishing returns in all mmo's but no company ever does this. BTW, I mainly pug and I don't heal pugs so you are wrong there. I don't heal on any of my chars. Healing is the only spec/class mix I don't have currently.

 

I am saying that high dmg mit and decently high dmg is FOTM. This is what most people are migrating to but this is also what I hear from people is so boring. This will hurt this game's pvp. Please discuss.

 

I totally get what you're aiming at, and I completely agree. Though, tankassins and pyrotechs will happily troll you. They don't seem to get that there are not at 8 specs, there are actually 24, and about 4-5 are grossly disproportionately powerful to the rest.

[clearsighted]

When 5 out of 8 classes are FOTM, I call that a pretty balanced game. Now bring the other 3 up to par.

 

And personally I think the sorc and scoundel are just fine.

 

You completely missed the point of his post. He's talking about specs, not classes, of which there are 24 (not 8).

 

I.E, nobody, to the best of my knowledge, has a problem with shield techs or AP techs...It's just pyrotechs. And PvP becomes boring when all powertechs roll pyrotech because it's so much better in PvP.

 

Comprendhe, mi amigo?

Edited June 20, 2012 by clearsighted

[Daltonymous]

I know of no other class that can lock someone down and burst their face off better than a sniper. They are weak to multiple enemies, but otherwise they do insane burst damage compared to all other classes. Also I have noticed some of them are more tanky than tanks.

 

1v1 this class is only class I consider OP.

 

alright, you made me lol, good job.

 

now back to serious discussion...

[clearsighted]

alright, you made me lol, good job.

 

now back to serious discussion...

 

He's also never fought a Pyrotech in augmented war hero. Holy crap. GIve me a class I can LOS or cleanse, over one I can't, any day of the week.

Edited June 20, 2012 by clearsighted

[Helig]

alright, you made me lol, good job.

 

now back to serious discussion...

 

My Annihilation Marauder has a better survival rate under heavy fire than my Guardian when he's Defense-specced - if I don't Guardian Leap out of the tight situation, which isn't a "tanky" thing to do, since we're discussing "tankiness".

[Orangerascal]

You completely missed the point of his post. He's talking about specs, not classes, of which there are 24 (not 8).

 

I.E, nobody, to the best of my knowledge, has a problem with shield techs or AP techs...It's just pyrotechs. And PvP becomes boring when all powertechs roll pyrotech because it's so much better in PvP.

 

Comprendhe, mi amigo?

 

The optimal spec for classes will always exist and min/maxers will always use sail optimal specs.

 

Sage - Hybrid healing

Scoundrel - sawbones

Assassins - tankassassins

juggernauts - 18/23

etc.

etc.

 

It's the nature of the min/maxing.

 

If you want all specs to be equality viable all the time .... err ... good luck with that. That will never happen in this game or any game in the future because of the complex variables involved in balancing classes.

Edited June 20, 2012 by Orangerascal

[kjpwv]

Did you really just name 5 of the 8 classes in the game as FOTM? In that case I'd say bio did a decent job.

[cycao]

Is the a serious post? How could it when half of the classes were listed (classes not builds). Every class is more than viable now that most people have there builds spec and rotation down, with the exception of BH/commandos they could use a slight buff.

[alcek]

The FOTM mentality isn't larger in this game unlike OP says.

 

Most of players I meet and play in WZ are sages or inquisitors simply because so many rolled them early on. I'd like to see example of game where there would be neither at all.

 

I remember WoW having real FOTM problem. People really rolled warlocks when they fine. When rogues were better they were everywhere. When paladins became OP they were everywhere. Then Deathknights etc.

Not my experience in swtor. When i enter wzs, they are full of fotms - marauders, powertechs, shadow tanks. Often hard to beat purely to class balance, not that they are something special as players. And when you encounter players that combine fotm+skills (yes, few of these exist) it becomes hilariously unbalanced.

[Hethroin]

Be awesome if SWTOR offered classes like RIFT.

 

For those no familiar with Rift:

 

Immagine if you will that you take a CW pop on your Sith Warrior start the game as Annihilation Marauder. Midway through you realize that your healers are getting eaten alive and swap to Tank Spec Jug. Or your healing scoundrel finds himself in the middle of a 6 healer group and decides that now would be a good time to change to Dirty Gunslinger.

 

You picked one of 4 classes, and those 4 had 12 trees each. You could use 3 trees at the same time. You were able to predefine 5 combinations.

[LarryRow]

The optimal spec for classes will always exist and min/maxers will always use sail optimal specs.

 

Sage - Hybrid healing

Scoundrel - sawbones

Assassins - tankassassins

juggernauts - 18/23

etc.

etc.

 

It's the nature of the min/maxing.

 

If you want all specs to be equality viable all the time .... err ... good luck with that. That will never happen in this game or any game in the future because of the complex variables involved in balancing classes.

 

You're both right. They should try to make all 24 specs viable, but it's tricky.

 

I think the Knight/Warrior class is the best for this right now. Besides the 18/23 Guard/Jugg, Rage/Focus is pretty popular, and the two Mar/Sent specific trees are both viable. Sniper is pretty good too; aren't their trees all pretty decent?

[kitsinni]

I think the real FOTM is any class commplaining about classes that beat them on the forums.

[SinnedWill]

I think the real FOTM is any class commplaining about classes that beat them on the forums.

 

What happens if I say my Powertech (normally pyro, but AP spec is pretty solid, too), my Tankassin, and my MM Sniper were all FoTM (which, they are, judging by their sudden increase in popularity, despite the fact I've had mine since early launch)? They have no issues killing ANY class/spec - they only die to focus fire. Does this mean that I need to be nerfed, as in me, specifically? Can't really consider my carnage marauder FoTM due to how unpopular it is, how easily it is countered, etc. And I certainly can't say my madness sorcerer is FoTM, though it only has a few classes that can consistantly trounce it with significance.

Edited June 20, 2012 by SinnedWill

[SinnedWill]

Is the a serious post? How could it when half of the classes were listed (classes not builds). Every class is more than viable now that most people have there builds spec and rotation down, with the exception of BH/commandos they could use a slight buff.

 

Madness sorc! <--- Could use a damage increase to DoT's and/or a defensive cooldown (people have yelled at me for mentioning bubble as a defensive, but explained that it doesn't mitigate damage values, it only act as pro-active healing).

[SinnedWill]

Not my experience in swtor. When i enter wzs, they are full of fotms - marauders, powertechs, shadow tanks. Often hard to beat purely to class balance, not that they are something special as players. And when you encounter players that combine fotm+skills (yes, few of these exist) it becomes hilariously unbalanced.

 

Yep, been doing a 3-man premade of pyro P-techs with my guildies (we'll grab a healer if one's on, but we can manage without one) - all of us are good players, all of us know our best rotations - combined with our memble-driven (a VoIP program) coordinated edge (for focus fire, targeted taunts/staggering, aoe taunt staggering, and stun/cc staggering), we are nigh impregnable as a pack. And to make matters worse, each of us can EASILY hold our own against 2 enemies solo (unless they continuously zerg back in before we can rest up).

Normally, this WOULD get boring (winning by 3-caps every match, 6-0 hutt-balls, etc.) but p-tech's grapple ability permits a LARGE amount of diverse methods to have fun (at least on 2 of the warzone maps) to keep it interesting.

Now we just need to figure out a way for the enemy teams to stop leaving warzones when they realise we're together...