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Gear Question - Orange Belt/Bracer

CharterMonkKent

By CharterMonkKent
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CharterMonkKent

CharterMonkKent

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I've been somewhat absent when it comes to using gear outside of the regular BM stuff. Got my first WH piece last night (was on a low pop server). So my question is, how people are using orange belts/bracers?

 

1. Pulling mods from BM gear and putting them in with a mix of PVE?

 

2. Using PvE mods to increase Surge/power/etc to proper lvls?

 

3. Are they overall worthless and it's better to stick with WH/BM with augment slots?

 

I assume one should do what they need to do to get to prime stat numbers (crit/surge/power/etc). any advice would be great. Thanks community.

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L-RANDLE

L-RANDLE

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I've been somewhat absent when it comes to using gear outside of the regular BM stuff. Got my first WH piece last night (was on a low pop server). So my question is, how people are using orange belts/bracers?

 

1. Pulling mods from BM gear and putting them in with a mix of PVE?

 

2. Using PvE mods to increase Surge/power/etc to proper lvls?

 

3. Are they overall worthless and it's better to stick with WH/BM with augment slots?

 

I assume one should do what they need to do to get to prime stat numbers (crit/surge/power/etc). any advice would be great. Thanks community.

This is what I am rolling..

http://swtor.askmrrobot.com/character/79e226c3-f042-441d-818a-5fb24469272d

PvE armor, PvP mod....

 

Orange Bracer: 76END, 112WP, 30EXP, 39 POW

WH Bracer: 58END, 76WP, 70EXP, 39 POW

 

If you don't have access to a high level PvE(Lvl 58+) armoring mod, just wear the PvP one...

 

[Edit] this also assumes you are sitting at a decent EXP number already.... like 600EXP.....

Edited by L-RANDLE
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CharterMonkKent

CharterMonkKent

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I guess I could do the math. was hoping for the easy way, someone would fill this in for me. The below is without augments, which will be able to be added to any gear in 1.3

 

in full WH gear you get 1332 exp (armor rating 146). if you take away belt/bracer you end with 1192, which should be plenty for pvp if you make up for that last 8 exp (unless you run on the 1250 target bandwagon, then you can only mod out either belt or bracer)

 

WH (DPS) belt is, 87 main stat (AIM example), 65 endurance, 70 exp, 12 either crit/power

 

When building the orange belt... if I get an armor mode with daily coms, Advanced Reflex Armor 23 (could be much higher from boss drops)

126 armor rating, 48 AIM, 31 endurance

+

and Advanced Agile Mod 28B

154 armor rating, 47 AM, 60 Endurance, 37 Power

 

Totals = 95 AIM, 91 Endurance, 37 Power

 

times 2 if you are moding both belt/bracer= 190AIM, 182 Endurance, 74 Power

WH times 2 gives you = 172 AIM, 130 Endurance, 24 Power

 

The difference when using moded orange belt & bracer =

+18 AIM, + 52 endurance, +50 power, -140 exp

 

Does that look correct? And is that worth the trouble?

 

Thanks to anyone giving it a look

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Smashbrother

Smashbrother

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I guess I could do the math. was hoping for the easy way, someone would fill this in for me. The below is without augments, which will be able to be added to any gear in 1.3

 

in full WH gear you get 1332 exp (armor rating 146). if you take away belt/bracer you end with 1192, which should be plenty for pvp if you make up for that last 8 exp (unless you run on the 1250 target bandwagon, then you can only mod out either belt or bracer)

 

WH (DPS) belt is, 87 main stat (AIM example), 65 endurance, 70 exp, 12 either crit/power

 

When building the orange belt... if I get an armor mode with daily coms, Advanced Reflex Armor 23 (could be much higher from boss drops)

126 armor rating, 48 AIM, 31 endurance

+

and Advanced Agile Mod 28B

154 armor rating, 47 AM, 60 Endurance, 37 Power

 

Totals = 95 AIM, 91 Endurance, 37 Power

 

times 2 if you are moding both belt/bracer= 190AIM, 182 Endurance, 74 Power

WH times 2 gives you = 172 AIM, 130 Endurance, 24 Power

 

The difference when using moded orange belt & bracer =

+18 AIM, + 52 endurance, +50 power, -140 exp

 

Does that look correct? And is that worth the trouble?

 

Thanks to anyone giving it a look

 

Point for point, expertise > all stats. So no, it's not worth the trouble.

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CharterMonkKent

CharterMonkKent

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Point for point, expertise > all stats. So no, it's not worth the trouble.

 

Actually I just ran it through the character builder. It is worth it, if one has the time to do all the work (I probably won't ha). If the best pve mod/armor are used the increase in HP is 986.2 and increase in damage (min/max and tech for my example) is above about 2.3%. That takes in account the lose of 1.86% exp loss.

 

One would also lose a little over 1% damage reduction and a little under 1% healing boost. The 1,000 HP increase may cross that out depending on opinion / if one is a healer or not

Edited by CharterMonkKent
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DimeStax

DimeStax

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Actually I just ran it through the character builder. It is worth it, if one has the time to do all the work (I probably won't ha). If the best pve mod/armor are used the increase in HP is 986.2 and increase in damage (min/max and tech for my example) is above about 2.3%. That takes in account the lose of 1.86% exp loss.

 

One would also lose a little over 1% damage reduction and a little under 1% healing boost. The 1,000 HP increase may cross that out depending on opinion / if one is a healer or not

 

The point of 1.2 was to establish obvious advantages for players to use PvP gear in PvP and to use PvE gear in PvE, and that's why expertise no longer has a cap. They wanted to take away the mix and matching of the min/maxers so that it was clear that PvP gear was better for PvP and PvE gear was better for PvE. Unfortunately, Min/Maxers are still looking for a way to include PvE gear into their PvP gear sets in order to give them some kind of mathematical advantage. If you're going to mix and match PvE and PvP gear then you're going to give some main stat and endurance in return for expertise. That's the way it is. I'm going to choose my gear based on the idea that BW did the math right and the expertise you gain from WH gear is equivalent or better for you in PvP than the main stat and endurance you gain from PvE gear, because that was the entire point of patch 1.2.

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L-RANDLE

L-RANDLE

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Actually I just ran it through the character builder. It is worth it, if one has the time to do all the work (I probably won't ha). If the best pve mod/armor are used the increase in HP is 986.2 and increase in damage (min/max and tech for my example) is above about 2.3%. That takes in account the lose of 1.86% exp loss.

 

One would also lose a little over 1% damage reduction and a little under 1% healing boost. The 1,000 HP increase may cross that out depending on opinion / if one is a healer or not

 

:D

Yep, it can actually be slighty better, but just close your eyes and plug your ears when I whisper: "use a WH mod instead" and scream "expertise" three times....:D

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CharterMonkKent

CharterMonkKent

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The point of 1.2 was to establish obvious advantages for players to use PvP gear in PvP and to use PvE gear in PvE, and that's why expertise no longer has a cap. They wanted to take away the mix and matching of the min/maxers so that it was clear that PvP gear was better for PvP and PvE gear was better for PvE. Unfortunately, Min/Maxers are still looking for a way to include PvE gear into their PvP gear sets in order to give them some kind of mathematical advantage. If you're going to mix and match PvE and PvP gear then you're going to give some main stat and endurance in return for expertise. That's the way it is. I'm going to choose my gear based on the idea that BW did the math right and the expertise you gain from WH gear is equivalent or better for you in PvP than the main stat and endurance you gain from PvE gear, because that was the entire point of patch 1.2.

 

I see your point. But the math doesn't lie. And depending on the class (and damage over defense) it could increase damage output by around 5.8% (think sniper, that is before class buffs). I always wondered where those 7k+ crits come from post 1.2 I was just too lazy to do the math (btw my sniper broke 5.8k once since 1.2 in BM gear no mods/augs). Power/surge stacking is the answer. Now I'm just too lazy to do the work.

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CharterMonkKent

CharterMonkKent

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Expertise is the best stat, period.

 

Even at 1200+ expertise you can find situations where you'd rather have the expertise than the hps.

 

I don't think anyone would argue against that expertise is the best stat for pvp. But math proves your 2nd statement incorrect. That's not an argument from me, simply put, the numbers have been crunched.

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CitizenFry

CitizenFry

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When building the orange belt... if I get an armor mode with daily coms, Advanced Reflex Armor 23 (could be much higher from boss drops)

126 armor rating, 48 AIM, 31 endurance

+

and Advanced Agile Mod 28B

154 armor rating, 47 AM, 60 Endurance, 37 Power

 

Where are you getting grade 28 mods, with 154 armor rating? Pretty sure the highest in-game at the moment is grade 26.

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CharterMonkKent

CharterMonkKent

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Where are you getting grade 28 mods, with 154 armor rating? Pretty sure the highest in-game at the moment is grade 26.

 

I'm not personally getting any of this :) It's too time consuming with a few nights a week in game. I've read these are (supposed) nightmare boss drops. Regardless, removed them and plopped the 26s into char builder and stats remain + in the equation.

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DimeStax

DimeStax

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I'm not personally getting any of this :) It's too time consuming with a few nights a week in game. I've read these are (supposed) nightmare boss drops. Regardless, removed them and plopped the 26s into char builder and stats remain + in the equation.

 

From what I've heard; You can't just drop a Black Hole or Rakata Armoring and Mod into the belt or bracer slots. From what I understand, the best armoring you can put into a customizable belt or bracer slot is a rank 22 Armoring that you get from the daily quests. The mod however can be anything. Some PvPers are putting War Hero Mods of their choice in customizable belts and bracers, and putting the PvE 22 Armoring from dailys to ensure they reach maximums of certain stats; but it's definitely not a rank 26 Armoring, no where even close.

Edited by DimeStax
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BlastingGravy

BlastingGravy

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From what I've heard; You can't just drop a Black Hole or Rakata Armoring and Mod into the belt or bracer slots. From what I understand, the best armoring you can put into a customizable belt or bracer slot is a rank 22 Armoring that you get from the daily quests. The mod however can be anything. Some PvPers are putting War Hero Mods of their choice in customizable belts and bracers, and putting the PvE 22 Armoring from dailys to ensure they reach maximums of certain stats; but it's definitely not a rank 26 Armoring, no where even close.

 

Actually, HM Kephess drops Black hole equivalent armoring that is not bound to a specific gear piece. My guild has already been putting them in their orange belts and bracers. However, I doubt many people would want to regularly run HM EC for such a small boost in their PvP gear.

 

Here's a screencap for evidence: http://i.imgur.com/Tgpf1.jpg

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Koenig-O-Riain

Koenig-O-Riain

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Lvl 50 Commando (heal spec). I have Legacy Bracers and Orange belt, both have 58 rated pve armoring and BM rated 58 mods, soon to be 61 rated armoring and wh mods. I have 19.5k HP and as a healer, the extra hp is more helpful than the expertise at the moment.

 

I have a longer window of survivability, more time to hold an objective, more time to healtank, a "heavier" distraction role.... In 1.3, they are reducing the Commando's Heavy Trooper ability which will result in a decrease of 4% for heals on self. I may switch and put on my WH belt and bracers when 1.3 hits and see the difference.

 

One thing to consider is that in 1.3 everything is Augmentable.

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MaverickXIV

MaverickXIV

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When I upgraded a Battlemaster piece to War Hero, I ripped the BM mods out and put one into an orange belt, replacing my Recruit's belt. I plan on just saving the comms and just buying War Hero belt. I'm not really concerned with the +/- differences because they're pretty small.
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Lymain

Lymain

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The point of 1.2 was to establish obvious advantages for players to use PvP gear in PvP and to use PvE gear in PvE, and that's why expertise no longer has a cap. They wanted to take away the mix and matching of the min/maxers so that it was clear that PvP gear was better for PvP and PvE gear was better for PvE. Unfortunately, Min/Maxers are still looking for a way to include PvE gear into their PvP gear sets in order to give them some kind of mathematical advantage. If you're going to mix and match PvE and PvP gear then you're going to give some main stat and endurance in return for expertise. That's the way it is. I'm going to choose my gear based on the idea that BW did the math right and the expertise you gain from WH gear is equivalent or better for you in PvP than the main stat and endurance you gain from PvE gear, because that was the entire point of patch 1.2.

 

Do you also assume Bioware did the math on your gear, so you don't need to optimize the mods at all because they're already as good as they can be? :p

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-HP-

-HP-

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The expertise breakpoint in 1.2 is around 1150 for most classes. Past that you get more DPS and effective HP from same-rating PvE armorings. The breakpoint might slide closer to 1200 in 1.3 due to increased amounts of mainstat/power being available through augs (which increases bonus damage, which in turn increases the efficacy of the additional expertise damage multiplier). Of course this ignores the additional ~1% of PvP bonus healing received you'd get from the expertise, but that can be offset through some class skills (for example Surprise Comeback granting additional HP per tick as a result of the increased Endurance on the PvE armorings) and healing received shouldn't be a priority for some classes (burst DPS classes, stealth classes).

 

But shhhh let the straight expertise gearers keep on their merry way and we'll keep our straight advantage over them.

Edited by -HP-
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Ahhmyface

Ahhmyface

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I don't think anyone would argue against that expertise is the best stat for pvp. But math proves your 2nd statement incorrect. That's not an argument from me, simply put, the numbers have been crunched.

 

Those numbers are wrong.

 

Look for Astarica's post on the subject, numbers prove that expertise is always better.

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DimeStax

DimeStax

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The expertise breakpoint in 1.2 is around 1150 for most classes. Past that you get more DPS and effective HP from same-rating PvE armorings. The breakpoint might slide closer to 1200 in 1.3 due to increased amounts of mainstat/power being available through augs (which increases bonus damage, which in turn increases the efficacy of the additional expertise damage multiplier). Of course this ignores the additional ~1% of PvP bonus healing received you'd get from the expertise, but that can be offset through some class skills (for example Surprise Comeback granting additional HP per tick as a result of the increased Endurance on the PvE armorings) and healing received shouldn't be a priority for some classes (burst DPS classes, stealth classes).

 

But shhhh let the straight expertise gearers keep on their merry way and we'll keep our straight advantage over them.

 

Why is there a break point on expertise?

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