1.3 Maras/Sents no nerfs?

[Astarica]

So these *good* players ignore you?

 

I'm not sure whether I want to laugh condescendingly or shake my head sadly...

 

Do you think I play a Sorc or something? I'm not a glutton for punishment.

 

If someone can root you from range (Creeping Terror) they can't really heal nor will they have access to bubble blind/knockback root. This means just make a note never to get caught fighting them in the middle of nowhere 1on1, which pretty much never happens in a WZ anyway (and a Sorc in the middle of nowhere is asking to get killed by a Tankasin). Once in while you'll have a melee that gets rooted one too many times and decide to show the Sorc the power of Grapple, but for the most part a disciplined player should not be wasting his time chasing someone who cannot heal and cannot do a KB root/bubble blind which actually stops multiple melees as opposed to barely slowing down one.

[Dracosz]

Do you think I play a Sorc or something? I'm not a glutton for punishment.

 

If someone can root you from range (Creeping Terror) they can't really heal nor will they have access to bubble blind/knockback root. This means just make a note never to get caught fighting them in the middle of nowhere 1on1, which pretty much never happens in a WZ anyway (and a Sorc in the middle of nowhere is asking to get killed by a Tankasin). Once in while you'll have a melee that gets rooted one too many times and decide to show the Sorc the power of Grapple, but for the most part a disciplined player should not be wasting his time chasing someone who cannot heal and cannot do a KB root/bubble blind which actually stops multiple melees as opposed to barely slowing down one.

 

So if you don't play a sorc why are you commenting on the playstyle?

 

Do you understand how kiting and LoS works in the slightest? You stun/root a person and dot them up, then dip behind a pillar if they try to get near you. Of course good players will try to *avoid* a person that's doing that , but when it comes down to it you cannot simply ignore the threat they present if they know what they're doing. The damage isn't all tickles and giggles. A good Sorc can shut down a player AND continue to deal high amount sof damage whilst keeping themselves alive (if they use their bubbles properly).

 

Pulls/Charges, though useful to counter this type of play, are moot in this discussion as a good player can react to them accordingly (either by sprinting away or by avoiding them entirely).

[Grisher]

Hmm....i think this is an isue i should get involved in as i am playing a sentinel.

 

I see there is many who believe that sentinel/marauders are OP. That is not excactly how it is!

I do not claim to be a very good sentinel but i have more than myself to back my words up.

I play on ahto city which is a PvP server. There are some really good players there including a few sentinels.

When ti comes to sentinels there are just a few that does 300k+ damage, other sentinels does from 100k-close to 300 k and does not stand out in any way compared to other players/classes. So when you get facerolled by a sentinel....you get facerolled by a GOOD sentinel!

When i look at the board after a warzone, sentinels/marauders does not "stand out".

So in general it is my opinion that all who think sentinel/marauders are op, should play one or shut up!

[Astarica]

So if you don't play a sorc why are you commenting on the playstyle?

 

Do you understand how kiting and LoS works in the slightest? You stun/root a person and dot them up, then dip behind a pillar if they try to get near you. Of course good players will try to *avoid* a person that's doing that , but when it comes down to it you cannot simply ignore the threat they present if they know what they're doing. The damage isn't all tickles and giggles. A good Sorc can shut down a player AND continue to deal high amount sof damage whilst keeping themselves alive (if they use their bubbles properly).

 

Pulls/Charges, though useful to counter this type of play, are moot in this discussion as a good player can react to them accordingly (either by sprinting away or by avoiding them entirely).

 

In any fight that's bigger than a 2on2 there is almost always someone else you can attack even while rooted beacuse it's impossible to space people out so evenly.

 

So your range root rarely prevents any damage being done to your side. It prevents damage done to you but it's not like anybody is really concerned about a Madness Sorc's DPS. It's certainly not capable of beating a direct damage single target class (otherwise they'd be way overpowered). While you dot someone up that guy is killing your Sniper or PT who does more far better focused damgae than you.

 

Once a while I get tired of watching Sorcs who think they're all smug hiding back there and never die and I Force Pull them to their doom, and usually immediately regret doing that since I wasted my Force Pull on someone that wasn't a healer. If all you're doing is dotting, and that's all you'll be doing if you got the ranged root, then I don't really care about the dots you pile up because anyone not piling up dots still do more focused damage than you can. You cannot heal and you don't have two of the AE CCs that actually can impact a WZ, so there's no reason for me to want to kill you unless you're the last guy left because you're harmless.

[Boarg]

also, you people need to differentiate between front loaded and back loaded burst.

 

front loaded) stealthers, snipers, pts, maybe carnage.

backloaded) annamaries (anni maras), rage, mercs

 

Of Stealth specs, there are only two with decent burst. Scrapper/Concealment is front loaded, but Infiltration/Deception is backloaded.

[Grodr]

As a merc healer, they have become my bane and frustration...taking what little enjoyment I take out of solo queue pvp. I still enjoy my merc even though it has been nerfed, but I just cant escape one or survive one atm. I just log off and watch some tv

[UGLYMRJ]

Really now,

 

BTW, you do realize that 3 stack of Deadly Saber and a Rupture w/ a Berserk thrown in will crit 6k~ in decent gear, right? And that you're doing damage WHILE this is happening?

 

Is 4 pieces of aug'd gear, all with BM mods, WH implants and earpiece, aug'd sabers and my matrix cube and most of my datacrons just to throw that in... considered "good gear"?

 

Cuz I KNOW how to play my marauder... Top damage damn near all day. I stack my DS, pop my berserk and like I should right before I hit rupture I pop an adrenal/relic and sometimes both depending on the target. (Healers get ALL of it) and I don't think I've ever crit for 6k on a rupture... Mayyyyybe 4 and some change.

 

I could be wrong but I think you're exaggerating a bit to support your cause. I don't pay attention to the numbers as much as maybe I should because I'm focused on his % more than what I'm hitting him for, so mayyyyyyyyybe you're right. But it sounds a little high. I'll be trying this on my PvP training dummy tonight cuz by the time I get in a fight I prolly won't notice the numbers as usual.

 

Just sayin'... sounds a little high.

[UGLYMRJ]

As a merc healer, they have become my bane and frustration...taking what little enjoyment I take out of solo queue pvp. I still enjoy my merc even though it has been nerfed, but I just cant escape one or survive one atm. I just log off and watch some tv

 

A bad marauder should be an easy kill... it is with my BH. A good marauder.... kite him enough and he'll move on unless you're a healer merc. Which as stated... you are. In that case he should be all over you and his job in most cases should be to kill you. So save your stuns for that good marauder that has you marked cuz if it's me... I'm hunting you all game. Kite me properly and I'll start looking for another healer to focus on since me chasing you in circles while you heal isn't doing my team much good.

 

Also on a good team... the team should be protecting their healers. In no case should a healer be getting killed by a marauder 1v1. You should have at least one team mate helping you with more than just a guard.

 

My opinion anyways... from the eyes of the guy trying to stab you in the face.

Edited June 12, 2012 by UGLYMRJ

[Varicite]

Is 4 pieces of aug'd gear, all with BM mods, WH implants and earpiece, aug'd sabers and my matrix cube and most of my datacrons just to throw that in... considered "good gear"?

 

Cuz I KNOW how to play my marauder... Top damage damn near all day. I stack my DS, pop my berserk and like I should right before I hit rupture I pop an adrenal/relic and sometimes both depending on the target. (Healers get ALL of it) and I don't think I've ever crit for 6k on a rupture... Mayyyyybe 4 and some change.

 

I could be wrong but I think you're exaggerating a bit to support your cause. I don't pay attention to the numbers as much as maybe I should because I'm focused on his % more than what I'm hitting him for, so mayyyyyyyyybe you're right. But it sounds a little high. I'll be trying this on my PvP training dummy tonight cuz by the time I get in a fight I prolly won't notice the numbers as usual.

 

Just sayin'... sounds a little high.

 

Um, I wasn't talking about the initial hit.

 

I meant your 3 stacks of Deadly Saber AND Rupture ALL critting for a total of 6k+ over the duration.

 

Try it against a friend in a duel sometime.

 

Pop DS, get all 3 stacks up, use Rupture, pop Berserk and take note of how much hp he loses just from the crit bleeds alone. Should be somewhere close to that mark. : )

 

For added fun, you could also Berserk > Frenzy > Bloodthirst your bleeds too.

Edited June 12, 2012 by Varicite

[Daikeru]

Um, I wasn't talking about the initial hit.

 

I meant your 3 stacks of Deadly Saber AND Rupture ALL critting for a total of 6k+ over the duration.

 

Try it against a friend in a duel sometime.

 

Pop DS, get all 3 stacks up, use Rupture, pop Berserk and take note of how much hp he loses just from the crit bleeds alone. Should be somewhere close to that mark. : )

 

For added fun, you could also Berserk > Frenzy > Bloodthirst your bleeds too.

 

Maybe it's just me, but that doesn't seem like a lot o.O I guess it depends on what you're attacking.

Edited June 12, 2012 by Daikeru

[UGLYMRJ]

Um, I wasn't talking about the initial hit.

 

I meant your 3 stacks of Deadly Saber AND Rupture ALL critting for a total of 6k+ over the duration.

 

Try it against a friend in a duel sometime.

 

Pop DS, get all 3 stacks up, use Rupture, pop Berserk and take note of how much hp he loses just from the crit bleeds alone. Should be somewhere close to that mark. : )

 

For added fun, you could also Berserk > Frenzy > Bloodthirst your bleeds too.

 

Ahhhhh... I thought you guys were talking about burst and when I think burst I factor out bleeds. I'll have to check that out. I really don't pay attention to the numbers, it's all about that pretty red bar dropping. I rarely notice numbers until end game... I normally use it to gauge how drunk I am.

 

-Top damage = sober

-Top 3 damage = buzzed

-Top 5 damage = drunk

-None of the above = bed time

 

And since I switched from carnage I really haven't used my bloodthirst as much as I used to. I normally save my frenzy for predations to cut down teh travel time of the group. I'll run some node protection tonight and check it out.

 

And damn... if those 6k numbers are without using adrenals and relics.... I feel bad for the healers I hunt cuz they get the whole shebang if I got em up.

[UGLYMRJ]

Maybe it's just me, but that doesn't seem like a lot o.O I guess it depends on what you're attacking.

 

EDIT: I totally misread this... But that's not gonna be 6k on a tank class and whether it is 6k or not, it is a lot of damage considering the duration of time it would take for that rotation. On any armor that's a decent chunk.

 

On top of that... it's a single target DPS class.... it's damage should be higher than other classes that are not single target DPS classes. (I have to throw this in every time I say anything about the positives of being a marauder or someone will think I'm on the OP band wagon)

Edited June 12, 2012 by UGLYMRJ

[Varicite]

Maybe it's just me, but that doesn't seem like a lot o.O I guess it depends on what you're attacking.

 

I didn't want to quote outrageous numbers, lol. We have plenty of people doing that already. These are numbers that most Marauders should be able to pull in average gear. It's actually a bit low for what a good Marauder will pull from their Bleed/Berserk combo.

 

PS) Bleeds are internal damage, they'll hit tanks for just as much generally.

 

6k is not a lot, no. But you aren't factoring in that you're layering 2k Annihilates on top of that. : )

Edited June 12, 2012 by Varicite

[UGLYMRJ]

I didn't want to quote outrageous numbers, lol. We have plenty of people doing that already. These are numbers that most Marauders should be able to pull in average gear.

 

PS) Bleeds are internal damage, they'll hit tanks for just as much generally.

 

6k is not a lot, no. But you aren't factoring in that you're layering 2k Annihilates on top of that. : )

 

I really wanna check this out now... 6k seems like a lot to me. 1/3 of my health on most characters. I'm glad this came up within days of getting that training dummy on my ship.

Edited June 12, 2012 by UGLYMRJ

[Varicite]

I really wanna check this out now... 6k seems like a lot to me. 1/3 of my health on most characters. I'm glad this came up within days of getting that training dummy on my ship.

 

Well, I don't think 6k damage for 4 GCDs is all that much, but it definitely adds up when you start layering other attacks on top. Why do you think Annihilation tears through things so fast, even w/out any real "burst"? Bleeds add up, especially stacked like that, and Annihilate itself is not really a slouch in the damage department.

 

I honestly think the damage Marauders bring is fine, though.

 

I just think that maybe a couple of their 5 defensive cds could use a bit of tweaking to bring them in line w/ the defensive capability of most other DPS ACs.

 

No, I don't want to see them nerfed into the ground. I play a Marauder as well.

[justntrue]

Yar. Mara/jedi next up on chopping block.

 

I hope the nerf isn't too severe. They aren't too far off... just a little tweak and they'll be in line with others.

[Frequencyz]

theres nothing wrong with marauders.....if you cant kill them, or you're being killed by them.....then you're just bad....assassin tanks DID need that nerf though.

[rustypro]

lol dude you obviously don't know how to play your shadow. My main is a shadow infiltration spec. by the way. We have everything a rogue has from wow -the smoke bomb. Its crazy how much control we have over fights, the only issues ive had has been with wh geared guardians thats about it they don't know how to die, but thats not really an issue more than it is op gear, and im too lazy to find a comp to them yet.

[Xinika]

That's great, another 10 w/o even trying .

[Talsyrius]

theres nothing wrong with marauders.....if you cant kill them, or you're being killed by them.....then you're just bad....assassin tanks DID need that nerf though.

Great argument, really changed how I viewed this problem...

[Arkerus]

Because there are class issues greater than a perceived issue with Sentinels/Marauders. They die pretty damn fast when their defensive cooldowns are not up.

[Derian]

The only class that was close to marauders level of overpowered in pvp was the shadow tank and thank god they are being fixed. The question is how did the sent/mara avoid the nerfbat?

 

We all know it is coming, the only people that do not believe that it is coming is the marauder. They believe they are balanced and fine. Hell I even started a marauder and even at lvl 18 I am already abusing people with just cloak of pain having a 50% uptime.

 

No you aren't.

[Varicite]

Because there are class issues greater than a perceived issue with Sentinels/Marauders. They die pretty damn fast when their defensive cooldowns are not up.

 

It's a good thing they have 5 of them compared to everyone else's 2-3 then?

[Ballzz]

theres nothing wrong with marauders.....if you cant kill them, or you're being killed by them.....then you're just bad....assassin tanks DID need that nerf though.

 

I would like to point out that the same argument can be made for Sages pre 1.2 but I'm guessing you were one of the people crying about OP Sages..am I right?

[Macabrae]

NO its not. Cry babies will always cry. They are straight DPS classes. They cant heal themselves unless they are in one spec. Why do so many people cry about a melee dps that can be cc'ed and burnt down?

 

Because that is what teribile players do. They come on the forums and cry for nerfs instead of learning how to beat that class. I play an Assasin not a Marauder and beat them all the time. They don't need anything done to them. They have lots of weaknesses.