Do you support an in game version of Recount. Please give reasons for your answer.

[Chosenxeno]

Go back to wow then.

 

SWTOR has no add on's, accept it.

 

 

It will have them or it won't succeed. The only people that don't realize this or people who played WOW but, were bad at it and thus they had a bad experience and WOW haters that have never played the game. WOW players are the MMO Population. Sorry to break it to you. It can make things a bit more familiar to us (I mean as far as streamlining. I do not want Elves!! lol) or it can become Rift. Rift was a bit slow on Addons and Macros. Ask Trion how that went for them.

 

They need to be catering to WOW raiders that will happily spend money to raid End Game in a game that's not WOW but has it's streamlining. Catering to the "MMO of the Month" Crowd will lead to it's downfall.

 

The "MMO of the Month" Crowd are those people whining about not wanting things from WOW in the game and as soon as they look up and realized the population has dropped this will in their eyes, suddenly, become a dead game and they will latch on to the Tera's and GW2's of the world. Their they will repeat the cycle.

 

So yea keep Addons and Macros out.

 

It will start with is "so and so a dead server" because people have taken your advice and gone back to WOW.

[HalusW]

5% is a Ridiculous number. They have a Raid Browser. Because Raiding End Game is the biggest part of an MMO. That's why all of these games that try to have PVP End Games have failed. They have tried to make raiding more inclusive. Not more casual. Less than 1000 guilds cleared WOTLK at the end of WOTLK. Heck on my server alone only 3 guilds(of course mine did /flex) beat the final boss of the so-called EZ Expansion.

 

People are so full of it. Addons will make the game too easy(and yet the numbers suggest not many people clear the expansions legit/prenerf) and yet they don't want people kicking them because their DPS is low(shouldn't it be easy to dps in an easy game?). What? Either WOW is easy or it's hard make up your minds people.

 

I don't consider the LFR tool progression raiding, I consider it catering to the casuals. Making raiding accessible by nerfing content as was done thru the LFR tool and on the Cataclysm raids is not creating more progression raiders, it's keeping the casuals subscribing. Why is everything I've read state that Titan will be casual if casuals don't bring in the money?

[Kunitsukami]

It will have them or it won't succeed. The only people that don't realize this or people who played WOW but, were bad at it and thus they had a bad experience and WOW haters that have never played the game. WOW players are the MMO Population. Sorry to break it to you. It can make things a bit more familiar to us (I mean as far as streamlining. I do not want Elves!! lol) or it can become Rift. Rift was a bit slow on Addons and Macros. Ask Trion how that went for them.

 

They need to be catering to WOW raiders that will happily spend money to raid End Game in a game that's not WOW but has it's streamlining. Catering to the "MMO of the Month" Crowd will lead to it's downfall.

 

The "MMO of the Month" Crowd are those people whining about not wanting things from WOW in the game and as soon as they look up and realized the population has dropped this will in their eyes, suddenly, become a dead game and they will latch on to the Tera's and GW2's of the world. Their they will repeat the cycle.

 

So yea keep Addons and Macros out.

 

It will start with is "so and so a dead server" because people have taken your advice and gone back to WOW.

 

I played wow, was always top DPS in any raid I went into PUG or guild, hitting around 30k sustained, downed raggy as a tank and as DPS when he was in his first two months, was full ruthless PvP and downed Helion back when it was damn damn hard to do so.

 

I don't want Recount you're being subjective and childish.

[Chosenxeno]

Why don't you ask WoW to build you a better WoW? And if WoW is the pinnacle of the MMO experience, why didn't you stay there?

 

Maybe the answer to that question is you feel that there was something that you lost there, that you no longer have. So now you behave like a virtual diaspora demanding homogeneity in gaming experience in line with your own subjective vales, desires and needs. Yes, Wow is an incredibly succesful commercial enterprise, but that does not necessarily entail a higher quality product and experience. For a lot of people, highly succesful cultural products produced for mass consumption are not intrinsically 'better' than others produced. Maconalds sells a lot of food; enough said. A lot of people playing SW:TOR really dont want World of McWarcraft.

 

I standby my statement. We are the MMO Pool. This game will become WOW with Lightsabers. EA likes Profit. You might as well just leave not. You are one of those "MMO of the Month" People that do not understand that even though WOW has dated graphics the way it's streamlined is better than any MMO and that's why it continues to succeed. If they want to try and be too different and not include those little bells and Whistle that WOW has than the game despite it's graphics and companions and spaceships plays as dated by comparison.

 

So yea. Build me a better WOW. That's why the majority of players are here. I'm bold enough to not pretend that I want WOW with Lightsabers to a certain the degree. Why? Because even if WOW is not superior to all these other MMOs that aren't nearly as successful it still plays better and it doesn't have archaic ideas that get in my way.

[AlpsStranger]

I played wow, was always top DPS in any raid I went into PUG or guild, hitting around 30k sustained, downed raggy as a tank and as DPS when he was in his first two months, was full ruthless PvP and downed Helion back when it was damn damn hard to do so.

 

I don't want Recount you're being subjective and childish.

 

Won't matter what you want.

 

Inb4 swtorrecount.

[Zironic]

I don't consider the LFR tool progression raiding, I consider it catering to the casuals. Making raiding accessible by nerfing content as was done thru the LFR tool and on the Cataclysm raids is not creating more progression raiders, it's keeping the casuals subscribing. Why is everything I've read state that Titan will be casual if casuals don't bring in the money?

 

I don't get all this Casual vs Hardcore stuff. MMO's need both.

 

You need your game to be casual friendly, because that's how you get people to start playing in the first place. People don't start out with huge guilds and countless people on their friendslist, they need to be able to play without a heavy investment.

 

As people play and meet more and more people in the game, they get more invested in the game and crave more and more content and so the casual player BECOMES hardcore eventually.

 

Without the hardcore you have noone to build that very important community that every MMO needs and without the casuals you don't have the people that bring in the money and are on the edge of joining the community.

[Chaffery]

My answer is plain and simple, yes.

I want see how I'm doing compared to others.

I want know, if I'm not good enough, is there improvement room.

I want know how much I'm generating threat buy DPS'ing or healing.

I want know how much I'm generating threat as a tank.

 

Currently this game Reminds me Lotro. Once I was asked join in to fellowship do a instance on Lone Lands.

But because my hunter was in full crafted purples and tank in quest greeens, you can imagine what happen next. After couple shots I pulled agro off from tank. Had stop DPS and avoid boss damage buy running around till tank got agro back.

Just as an example how ridiculous your game play could get if you trying be a best and others have no clue, what or how they doing.

But hey, this game has a similar mechanics. If you do too much DPS you over agro tank, or if you threat generation is not good enough as a tank, healers and DPS get killed first.

So peoples who won't DPS/threat meter fine buy me but many peoples won't wipe in same instance for all day.

[Takhomasak]

I'll add to my 'no' vote that I was a chart topping DPS in WoW until I quit in Firelands...

 

25k+ dps on my boomkin, 25k+ on my mage - in addition I tanked as a bear, and a DK, and had a Disc Priest...

 

I regularly hit top 3 on 25-man BH runs alongside members of the top guild on my server...

 

Just adding what some would consider credibility to my 'NO' vote.

 

 

I view the Recount and LFG requests to be part of a similar issue... additionally...

 

Some people feel that 'dungeons' should be instantly accessible, repeatable... basically 'zergable' - in my opinion, those are special runs. Part of the 'fun' of this game to me is picking out a group (hopefully guildies or friends) and testing our might in a difficult setting. There is something to be said for keeping instances and high end content more difficult... and more rare. This game has been out for ONE MONTH - not everyone is intended to be *finished* as soon as possible... the fun is in the journey.

 

Like I said, my opinion... I was raised in a time before cellphones, on-demand movies, internet... etc. Maybe these debates are just symptoms of a generational conflict...

Edited January 8, 2012 by Takhomasak

[HalusW]

So yea. Build me a better WOW. That's why the majority of players are here. I'm bold enough to not pretend that I want WOW with Lightsabers to a certain the degree. Why? Because even if WOW is not superior to all these other MMOs that aren't nearly as successful it still plays better and it doesn't have archaic ideas that get in my way.

 

I played WOW for three years. I consider a "better WOW" to exclude macros

and add-ons. Bioware has attempted to build a better WOW and apparently felt the same way. Combat Logs are coming for those that need to parse.

[Kunitsukami]

I standby my statement. We are the MMO Pool. This game will become WOW with Lightsabers. EA likes Profit. You might as well just leave not. You are one of those "MMO of the Month" People that do not understand that even though WOW has dated graphics the way it's streamlined is better than any MMO and that's why it continues to succeed. If they want to try and be too different and not include those little bells and Whistle that WOW has than the game despite it's graphics and companions and spaceships plays as dated by comparison.

 

So yea. Build me a better WOW. That's why the majority of players are here. I'm bold enough to not pretend that I want WOW with Lightsabers to a certain the degree. Why? Because even if WOW is not superior to all these other MMOs that aren't nearly as successful it still plays better and it doesn't have archaic ideas that get in my way.

 

I played Ultima Online for 3 years and WoW since Vanilla.... you, good sir, are possibly one of the most straw manning idiots I have ever posted against.

Edited January 8, 2012 by Kunitsukami

[Gohlar]

I vote no.

 

Peoople can't be trusted with too much information. This has been proven.

 

Mods like that, while useful, in the end make the game easier. I'm not saying everyone who uses is a noob, I used it myself, I'm just saying it does end up making content a lot easier to clear.

 

So no.

Edited January 8, 2012 by Gohlar

[Chosenxeno]

I don't consider the LFR tool progression raiding, I consider it catering to the casuals. Making raiding accessible by nerfing content as was done thru the LFR tool and on the Cataclysm raids is not creating more progression raiders, it's keeping the casuals subscribing. Why is everything I've read state that Titan will be casual if casuals don't bring in the money?

 

 

I never understood that mentality. Who cares if they nerf content to include more people? I just told you that End Game raiding is the heart of any good MMO.

 

I raided for 6 years. Did I care at 1st about welfare epics? HELL YES! I got over that long ago. Server 1sts, certain titles, certain mounts and Ranks on progression sites are much much bigger than gear.

 

It would be foolish of Blizzard not to Nerf content to make it more inclusive. That would be "Hustling Backwards" (lol) if they didn't. That's quite the Elitist "everything should be constantly masochistic and only 10 people should see the end game boss" attitude you've got yourself there. I'm long past that part. There are things beyond gear. Let's face it even though you'll deny it, the core of this statement is that you don't want everyone to have your gear. You instead want them drooling and lapping at your e-peen.

 

Anyone else getting that from his comment?

[Ayami_no_baka]

I standby my statement. We are the MMO Pool. This game will become WOW with Lightsabers. EA likes Profit. You might as well just leave not. You are one of those "MMO of the Month" People that do not understand that even though WOW has dated graphics the way it's streamlined is better than any MMO and that's why it continues to succeed. If they want to try and be too different and not include those little bells and Whistle that WOW has than the game despite it's graphics and companions and spaceships plays as dated by comparison.

 

So yea. Build me a better WOW. That's why the majority of players are here. I'm bold enough to not pretend that I want WOW with Lightsabers to a certain the degree. Why? Because even if WOW is not superior to all these other MMOs that aren't nearly as successful it still plays better and it doesn't have archaic ideas that get in my way.

 

LOL...full of yourself much? So much, that I won't even attempt to convince you otherwise. All I will say is: Wait and see. And then please quit and go back to WoW, we don't need idiots like yourself in SWTOR :3

[HalusW]

I don't get all this Casual vs Hardcore stuff. MMO's need both.

 

You need your game to be casual friendly, because that's how you get people to start playing in the first place. People don't start out with huge guilds and countless people on their friendslist, they need to be able to play without a heavy investment.

 

As people play and meet more and more people in the game, they get more invested in the game and crave more and more content and so the casual player BECOMES hardcore eventually.

 

Without the hardcore you have noone to build that very important community that every MMO needs and without the casuals you don't have the people that bring in the money and are on the edge of joining the community.

 

The group you are missing is the reason behind the issue. Those that went from Casual to Hardcore and then back to Casual. The former Hardcores just want to have fun like they did when they were first playing. Paying to play a game that stresses you out and introduces drama into your life gets old. Flame away, but everyone becomes a former Hardcore at some point. They/we just want to leave that baggage behind and not mess up our new shiny playground.

[Chosenxeno]

I played wow, was always top DPS in any raid I went into PUG or guild, hitting around 30k sustained, downed raggy as a tank and as DPS when he was in his first two months, was full ruthless PvP and downed Helion back when it was damn damn hard to do so.

 

I don't want Recount you're being subjective and childish.

 

Who didn't down Ragnaros. I have magical rainbows that shoot out of my *** when I fart. I am saying it on the internet where I don't have to have proof so it must be true. Also to know that you had "X" amount of DPS sustained is an admission that you had access to a parser. You're a smart guy:)

[Originale]

+1 for in game parser and allowing all addons for that matter.

 

I would love to see how I'm doing in my progression with better gear, and how my party and operations groups are doing and progressing as we obtain gear. Also, with parsers you can see what went wrong, what secondary stat you should be stacking, and tweak your rotations.

 

If you don't want a parser, you can disable it or what ever. Don't keep it away from people who do. Choices are better than "NO!"

[elenas]

 

So yea. Build me a better WOW.

 

Not an answer to my original question: why dont you ask WoW to build you a better WoW?

 

That's why the majority of players are here. I'm bold enough to not pretend that I want WOW with Lightsabers to a certain the degree.

 

Why dont you ask WoW to give you lightsabers. There are enough ludicrous concoctions and items there that surely wont make them look out of place ;p

 

Why? Because even if WOW is not superior to all these other MMOs that aren't nearly as successful it still plays better and it doesn't have archaic ideas that get in my way.

 

Not all archaic ideas are intrinsially bad.

 

 

 

 

So basically the position on the WoW players here is the 'not very veiled threat' to BW that if they don't implement what they desire, they will leave and kill their game. Because, after all, WoW players are the MMORPG population, and if they left, there would be no player base. That is a very static statement. It doesn't take into consideration a growth in playerbase for SW:TOR as a result of such things as marketing strategies, having a theme which attracts a SW fanbase who would not necessarily be MMO players previously. I'm sure there are contingency plans in place for if and when the WoW players decide to pull the plug.

[Gohlar]

Yes, it's an essential component of modern mmo design.

 

See I disgree with this.

 

I don't think it's essential to go straight to optimal. It should be harder than that. I don't think the UI should make it so easy to be optimal because in games like this that's most of the battle.

 

It make content trivial a lot faster. That's a bad thing.

 

Using recount is like looking up how to win online, I realize that's not only encouraged but expected at this point, but must we be in such a rush to be done with everything?

Edited January 8, 2012 by Gohlar

[HalusW]

I never understood that mentality. Who cares if they nerf content to include more people? I just told you that End Game raiding is the heart of any good MMO.

 

I raided for 6 years. Did I care at 1st about welfare epics? HELL YES! I got over that long ago. Server 1sts, certain titles, certain mounts and Ranks on progression sites are much much bigger than gear.

 

It would be foolish of Blizzard not to Nerf content to make it more inclusive. That would be "Hustling Backwards" (lol) if they didn't. That's quite the Elitist "everything should be constantly masochistic and only 10 people should see the end game boss" attitude you've got yourself there. I'm long past that part. There are things beyond gear. Let's face it even though you'll deny it, the core of this statement is that you don't want everyone to have your gear. You instead want them drooling and lapping at your e-peen.

 

Anyone else getting that from his comment?

 

Umm I don't care if they nerf content. I like having fun and playing casual. That's why I'm against macros and add-ons. My e-peen is so huge and massive that I can play just to have fun and enjoyment.

[Chosenxeno]

The group you are missing is the reason behind the issue. Those that went from Casual to Hardcore and then back to Casual. The former Hardcores just want to have fun like they did when they were first playing. Paying to play a game that stresses you out and introduces drama into your life gets old. Flame away, but everyone becomes a former Hardcore at some point. They/we just want to leave that baggage behind and not mess up our new shiny playground.

 

 

Then don't Raid? Not having Addons and Macros imo creates a sense of Challenge that is false by today's MMOs standard. If you want to play those old Games where everything takes forever than go play them. Today's MMOer has a life bro.

[Chosenxeno]

LOL...full of yourself much? So much, that I won't even attempt to convince you otherwise. All I will say is: Wait and see. And then please quit and go back to WoW, we don't need idiots like yourself in SWTOR :3

 

There is no point in trying to convince me because i'm right. They can cater to today's modern raider or they can die.

[Gohlar]

There is no point in trying to convince me because i'm right. They can cater to today's modern raider or they can die.

 

Raiding is very niche. Always will be.

 

I've raided since EQ.

Edited January 8, 2012 by Gohlar

[Gerandar]

No, if they are going to make addons just let people make them, dont waste dev time with more needless crap.

[Sol_Taril]

yep, there is a need for recount, but without ability to post in chat.

[Gohlar]

yep, there is a need for recount, but without ability to post in chat.

 

Why do you need to be told what is optimal almost right away?

 

It's more fun when people have to figure things out. Trust me.