Does size matter?

[Hediori]

Amidst a sea of dicontent, and various digressions on.. Well, various subjects, I thought it might be refreshing to have a thread who's innogural idea is to provide feedback on the size of the different Warzones.

 

So, specifically, we'll discuss everything that relates to the size, and perhaps shape, of Warzones, and try to gleam what the community at large wants in terms of just that in future installments.

 

To do this, I've complied a neat little list of questions you can answer, with either breviety or elaborately.

1) What size do you typically prefer; Big, medium or small?

2) What is currently your favourite Warzone?

2a) Is it too big, too small, just right, almost right?

3) What is currently your least favourite Warzone?

3a) Is it too big, too small, just right, almost right?

4) Which size would you like to see more of?

5) Which size would you like to see less of?

 

There we have it. Simplistic, just the way I like it. So, for my own answers;

 

1) I typically like bigger maps. I quite like having the freedom of manouverability over larger areas, and it often has a wierd asthetic effect on me.

 

2) Novare coast, hands down. Large, wide-spread and open.

2a) This is the Warzone I feel they got just right, size-wise.

 

3) Voidstar.

3a) It's a little too small for my liking. It feels cramped, to the point where it almost makes me claustrophobic. It is, admittedly, bigger than Huttball,but given how it's long and narrow, and sectioned off, it comes off as more of a series of very small areas rather than one large one.

 

4) A mix of medium and large maps, though I'd be just as happy if they just withheld the medium ones

 

5) The small, Voidstar-esque ones, for the reasons listed above.

[Motav]

Oh baby yes it does. If I can reach the base get that dick out my face!

 

 

But OT: Swtor couldn't handle more players at once very well, large scale pvp would be great but it's not in our grasp

[Hediori]

Oh baby yes it does. If I can reach the base get that dick out my face!

 

 

But OT: Swtor couldn't handle more players at once very well, large scale pvp would be great but it's not in our grasp

 

Oh you!

 

I should perhaps have clarified better; What I'm looking for is input in the physical size of the map, not the amount of players per Warzone!

[hankart]

Only if your small..........................

[Foxrynn]

1) What size do you typically prefer; Big, medium or small?

2) What is currently your favourite Warzone?

2a) Is it too big, too small, just right, almost right?

3) What is currently your least favourite Warzone?

3a) Is it too big, too small, just right, almost right?

4) Which size would you like to see more of?

5) Which size would you like to see less of?

 

1.)Medium to Big

2.)Huttball

2A.)Just right

3.)Voidstar

3A.)Too Small

4.)Medium - Big

5.)Small...

[paul_preib]

It all falls to context. Novare's layout makes it feel about right, any larger would make holding the northern node farthest from your spawn far to impractical, making it boil just that much more of a matter of whoever wins middle taking the match.

 

Alderaan however I think is a little too easy to respond defensively too-- stretching it a bit further I think would add a bit more back and forth to it (assuming they also spaced speeder-return differently to counter the longer return time from an attacker).

 

Voidstar-- Feels like it could best benefit from an expansion not only terms of map size but group size. I realize they aren't going to do anything bigger then eight, but I could see a three-door ten v. ten being of much greater tactical import. Where your capacity to advance is much more strategic. Right now unless you have a tremendous sheer firepower advantage door plants are much more about someone screwing up on the defensive end then anything else.

 

 

Hutball-- the toughest one to consider. Due to the multi-layer design the total foot-area is actual quite sizeable despite the fairly small actual length of the map. I like the idea of a bigger more open-field huttball map, but I do fear that any bigger would make it extremely difficult for the mobility-challenged classes to do anything save hold middle. I'd love to see multiple map varieties in huttball more then any of the others (hell I'm the oddball that wishes matches still popped 50% of the time instead of a fairly even split now-- even when on my non force-user)

 

That all said, at the end of the day the mobility differences between certain classes coupled with 8 per side model really makes it difficult to make maps much bigger then what you see now short of ramping up the number and variety of speed-boost powerupsleft sprinkled across the map.

[Kabaal]

This is why we should all mourn the death of Battlefield 3 and burn Lucasarts.

[Shlamorel]

Sorry OP I found that I couldn't just answer your questions I had a lot more to say, so please forgive me for deviating from the questions you asked

 

I like Huttball's size only due to it's unique objectives. I think a small map fits perfectly for that warzone. Otherwise, the bigger the better

 

I hate to bring up another game for reference, but I can't resist given the question: I'd love to have an outdoor warzone be more like Arathi Basin. It was HUGE, but it worked because the geography was actually relevant.

 

For example, one node was high on a cliff - this could be used to strategically get to the node below it quickly... or to knock people off o f the cliff altogether.

 

On the other hand, a different node was deep in a valley. This often made it harder to hold sometimes because people could drop in from every direction.

 

So anyway, I'd love to see an outdoorsy warzone like Denovaa with bolder geography. The geography needs to serve a purpose though - not just have mountains, rivers, and cliffs to make it pretty. Make it actually affect how hard/easy it is to defend a node.

[Avildar]

1) What size do you typically prefer; Big, medium or small?

2) What is currently your favourite Warzone?

2a) Is it too big, too small, just right, almost right?

3) What is currently your least favourite Warzone?

3a) Is it too big, too small, just right, almost right?

4) Which size would you like to see more of?

5) Which size would you like to see less of?

1. Big Map

2. Voidstar

2a. almost right

3. Hutball

3a. almost right

4. Big Maps

5. Small Maps

 

Honestly, Big maps for me is much more fun. Although, I also like large scale PvP. This 8 man PvP, the maps are probably fine or almost right. But, like I said I like Large maps with large scale PvP I would like to see 20v20 or even 40v40 but who knows they may never add that to this game even though it would be fun from time to time to get to play in a Large scale battle.

[TheLordMagnus]

i hate void star to small

i like hut ball multi lvl provide many angles of atack

i like large maps denova is nice has blind spots ect and has good scale for distance to each node

what do i want

20v20 large scale combat

proper incentive for world pvp

thats it

[syntxerr]

1) What size do you typically prefer; Big, medium or small?

2) What is currently your favourite Warzone?

2a) Is it too big, too small, just right, almost right?

3) What is currently your least favourite Warzone?

3a) Is it too big, too small, just right, almost right?

4) Which size would you like to see more of?

5) Which size would you like to see less of?

 

1) I usually prefer medium to big maps.

2) Difficult to say, I like both Alderaan and Novare the most.

2a) About right for the teamsizes there are, I'd say. Doesn't mean I wouldn't mind seeing bigger maps with bigger teams.

3) Absolutely Voidstar.

3a) I don't really care about it's size, I dislike the gameplay. It is a stuffed zerg/gibfest where two good teams just end up mindlessly smashing each other in a stalemate. It's also the ugliest of them.

4) I'd like to see more of Alderaan/Novare Coast type maps. Size and gameplay wise.

5) I'd like to see less of small maps, this also applies to maps like Voidstar where the map itself might not be as small, but the design forces you to battle in one small area without having much room for tactical approaches and going to some other node.

[DarthKhaos]

No matter what she said the answer is yes. ~comfort~

 

Ohhh WARZONES... Nevermind then. MOAR HUTTBALL!!!

Edited May 17, 2012 by DarthKhaos

[cycao]

Well I am a huge fan of the BF series so I am in favor of much larger scale objective type maps. NC is right up their with huttball as my favorite maps to play because of the size and openness that it brings. VS is just not fun its just to close together until you get into the final stage. CW is so-so but teams tend to give up more easily on this due to the mentality that when you get down 2-1 off the bat its over.

[Dajag]

Alderaan is decided normally in the first 3 to five minutes (when two competent teams are facing one another), the first team to get two points wins, because you can recover from death too fast and get right back to defending. I would like to see the side speeders removed and more obstacles and elevations between the spawn points and the side objectives.

 

Voidstar is a bit better though I would do it where both teams are equal distance from the doors and both teams are trying to reach the goal at the same time. Make more routes with more choke points and some rooms with catwalks and defensive/ hiding points. Give some doors timers, or place keys in hard to reach places and even use crafting like slicing would be fun. Have multiple capturable spawn points away from doors and objectives for tactical advantages, Make rezzing your team mates important.

 

I like Huttball and Novare Coast, good design, good size for how quick people die in this game.

[LarryRow]

I would take a different approach and say that the size of the zone should depend on its style. Huttball is small for a reason; Novare/Alderaan are larger for a reason.

 

Another really important key for a warzone: the better and more evenly matched the two teams are, the more fun the match should be. This is not always the case presently, as we have seen.

 

Here's what I think of each zone:

 

Huttball. As many have said, the best and most innovative zone we have. Good size too. Hazards are really fun. Hopefully we will see more like it in the future, with different layout geometry/topography and new hazards. Evenly matched good teams make for a fun game. No ties. One con: zone is arguably balanced against classes without lots of utility/mobility

 

Voidstar: First area is way too small. Evenly matched good teams stalemate ending in a tie. Too easy to defend with free/basic attacks and AoE. I've heard some good ideas for this: 3 doors instead of 2 for each section, spicier mechanics, using crafting, getting a bomb from somewhere and bringing it to the door, having the door bomb save your progress, etc.

 

Alderaan: I actually like this warzone. I think the size and layout are about right. I agree it should be a little harder to defend. Maybe stretch it out slightly. Have those two center speeders in the spawn actually take you to different spots. One biases left slightly, the other right.

Three things I hate about this warzone:

- Evenly matched good teams can stalemate in the middle, making the game last FOR.EV.ER. (ala Sandlot). Sometimes the team that is ticking slower will realize and break some people away to the enemy's capped turret, usually resulting in loss of mid. Essentially this means the match is decided in the first 20 seconds: all about who caps left/right first.

- Almost impossible to win once the score is 2:1 against you

- The ceiling in the center confines my camera zoom to be much tighter than I want. I really hate this, and WTB Dragon Age: Origins style camera that faded the ceiling whenever you zoomed out.

 

Novare: Fixed the Alderaan 2:1 issue - yay! Nice to have a bigger zone to run around in. Doesn't seem to impact performance and may even make it better because the other battles are out of range. Having one cap point far away from your spawn is a nice change of pace from Alderaan, but can lead to a zerg at mid. Still, 2 evenly matched good teams will generally try to outplay each other and go for different cap points. So this is a plus.

 

The one thing I hate about Novare are the frigging huts. You can exploit by standing in the corner. You can be a jerk and stand in front of the console so no one can cap while you are alive. And it royally sucks if you're melee. It's camera issue from Alderaan mid x1000.

 

Edit: What I'd like to see.

Arena style deathmatches. So easy to implement. Just a room with some pillars/objects and let us go at it.

More Huttball style matches.

More environmental hazards in warzones

More interesting objectives than "stand and channel for 8 seconds." Maybe objectives that require more than 1 person. Or several distinct steps. 1. Loot computer processor from lab. 2. deliver to broken droid. 3. repair broken droid. 4. Defend broken droid while it slices and overrides tractor beam.

Edited May 17, 2012 by LarryRow

[KhalDrogoe]

It's not the size that matters, only on how you use it. Like Huttball is perfect

[paul_preib]

 

To do this, I've complied a neat little list of questions you can answer, with either breviety or elaborately.

1) What size do you typically prefer; Big, medium or small?

2) What is currently your favourite Warzone?

2a) Is it too big, too small, just right, almost right?

3) What is currently your least favourite Warzone?

3a) Is it too big, too small, just right, almost right?

4) Which size would you like to see more of?

5) Which size would you like to see less of?

Realized I only bothered with the size question so I'll dig into the rest (forewarning I tend to tldr things... just cannae help it)

 

2.Huttball-- This is the most dynamic to me, and if things are going poorly I still feel like one person by himself can make a sizeable difference (may not be able to score but you can do a lot as one person alone to make scoring a pain in the ___ for the other team). Likewise I think this is the warzone that best underlies the ability for a well-played group to win in the face of gear or class-comp inequities from the other team.

 

2a.Sizewise I think it's right-- Any smaller would be a joke and any bigger puts the less mobile classes at too much of a disadvantage

 

3.Depends, Alderaan to me suffers as the one that you can do the least with a group that's clearly outclassed, and spending the final half of the match diving into an outnumbered fracass because half your team rolled up and decided to farm Defender medals is easily my most hated component to a warzone. Assuming fairly balanced sides though I think Voidstar is my least favorite because progress there relies far more upon someone on the defensive side screwing up rather then actual strategy on the attackers side.

 

3a.I think expanding both of these could help alleviate the issues at hand. Defenders can respond in alderaan far to quickly from the side speeders to just flat-out running from one node to another. Spread out to reduce response times and I think there might be more back and forth, right now first to 2-cap has a higher-then-should-be chance of the victory. Voidstar as stated is just to clustered up which makes bomb plants rely too much on either sheer overpowering of the enemy (which means they'd likely win any warzone) or someone on defense screwing up. Spread the field a bit and you might see actual strategy factoring in much more then "everyone go X side stealthers try the other"

 

 

4.Size I'd like to see more of-- To context based, the size is really dictated by the type of warzone it is. I would like to see a larger more expansive map of some kind, but you'd have to tune it such that it doesn't turn into a mobility vs. slower class debate.

 

5.Less of-- Funnel maps. Voidstar is technically the largest warzone in terms of the entire map, but the first room especially utilizes far too little of the space, funneling everyone into an AOE fustercluck. It is fun on occasion to hop in and go hog wild seeing what big numbers you can rack up for the end scorecard, but the increased frequency you see of it with the same-faction changes just kind of highlights its issues.