FREE Character Transfers are Coming!

[JeramieCrowe]

No need to be rude. I was curious and your post was pretty darn detailed with numbers and dates.

 

Didn't mean to sound rude. Just was perplexed that you considered facts to be creepy, that's all.

 

Care to address what I said that wasn't a side note? I noticed you skipped right past that part.

 

Sure, why not?

 

SWTOR has the Star Wars IP and hundreds of millions in startup capital.

 

Once you remove the capital used for the VAs and the cinematics, you're left with pretty much the same budget as Rift, or any MMO for that matter, to actually make the game. Maybe even less.

 

Billions in merchandise.

6 movies.

Cartoon series.

Prime Time Holiday Specials.

Books.

Millions of Fans across the entire planet for over 30 years.

 

Largely irrelevant. My brother is a Star Wars fan, but has never set foot in an MMO in his life. Doesn't even play games.

 

Rift started out with.....

 

The same sword and sorcery type of fantasy that's been done to death. Once you've seen one, you've seen them all.

 

Besides, it's not like Rift's lore is really all that great...

 

But all of that has absolutely nothing to do with the typical MMO timeline of feature implementation. Average times are being met by every MMO in existence, including TOR. And the timing of implementation has much less to do with cost and capital than you think.

Edited May 30, 2012 by JeramieCrowe

[kriegheld]

Didn't mean to sound rude. Just was perplexed that you considered facts to be creepy, that's all.

 

 

 

Sure, why not?

 

 

 

Once you remove the capital used for the VAs and the cinematics, you're left with pretty much the same budget as Rift, or any MMO for that matter, to actually make the game. Maybe even less.

 

 

 

Largely irrelevant. My brother is a Star Wars fan, but has never set foot in an MMO in his life. Doesn't even play games.

 

 

 

The same sword and sorcery type of fantasy that's been done to death. Once you've seen one, you've seen them all.

 

Besides, it's not like Rift's lore is really all that great...

 

But all of that has absolutely nothing to do with the typical MMO timeline of feature implementation. Average times are being met by every MMO in existence, including TOR. And the timing of implementation has much less to do with cost and capital than you think.

 

So are people here for the Star Wars IP or Bioware? Maybe both in some cases? Either way, regardless of your opinion or mine, there are a lot of people interested in this game just because it says "Star Wars" on it. I am one of them.

 

Also, we don't know how much was spent and how they spent it. Even though I agree with you, I think it was mostly blown on VO. We know this now. But not in the years leading up to the release.

 

In the years leading up to the release, Bioware boasted for years that it was going to compete with WOW. A MMO with the Star Wars IP, hundreds of millions in startup capital setting its sights on WOW. Sounds like a good game.

 

So wouldn't the average Joe expect that SWTOR to at least have features or improve upon the features of the game they were competing against? Maybe people are a little let down that they are playing a 2012 MMO with 2005 features (or lack there of).

 

A MMO that you're stuck having to compare to Rift now, I might add.

 

Where's the SWTOR with the hype and disingenuous weekly articles from all the Gaming Review Sites before launch? I want to play that SWTOR, not this one.

 

Is it a good idea to release a game, no matter the IP or funding, in this condition when so many others are coming out?

[JeramieCrowe]

So are people here for the Star Wars IP or Bioware? Maybe both in some cases? Either way, regardless of your opinion or mine, there are a lot of people interested in this game just because it says "Star Wars" on it. I am one of them.

 

Also, we don't know how much was spent and how they spent it. Even though I agree with you, I think it was mostly blown on VO. We know this now. But not in the years leading up to the release.

 

In the years leading up to the release, Bioware boasted for years that it was going to compete with WOW. A MMO with the Star Wars IP, hundreds of millions in startup capital setting its sights on WOW. Sounds like a good game.

 

Agree with this except the last part. It was EA and John Riccitiello who kept boasting and poking at WoW. The Docs at BioWare kept trying to downplay that, even going so far as stating they'd be happy with a million and a half subs.

 

So wouldn't the average Joe expect that SWTOR to at least have features or improve upon the features of the game they were competing against? Maybe people are a little let down that they are playing a 2012 MMO with 2005 features (or lack there of).

 

A MMO that you're stuck having to compare to Rift now, I might add.

 

I guess I'm just an experienced MMOer. Been playing MMOs for over a decade now, and feature implementation timing is on purpose. No feature exists in a vacuum. Also, LFG is all but useless for the first few months of a MMO because there are enough people to group because of the typical MMO launch surge, and no one's at endgame.

 

Secondly, I compare to Rift because it's been hailed as the MMO that launched with, and put out content the fastest. So it's a good touchstone.

 

Where's the SWTOR with the hype and disingenuous weekly articles from all the Gaming Review Sites before launch? I want to play that SWTOR, not this one.

 

Is it a good idea to release a game, no matter the IP or funding, in this condition when so many others are coming out?

 

What condition? "This" condition is typical of every MMO. Actually a bit better. The only three things I fault BioWare for is the removal of open-world PvP on Ilum, breaking their server transfer software they had ready since beta (tested great in closed beta), and the fact that the endgame content is too easy. There's more there than any other MMO before it, but people are finishing it faster than the typical MMO because it's too easy.

 

That's it.

 

As I mentioned above, no feature exists in a vacuum. Consideration and prioritizing of feature sets is a game of balance and timing. The inclusion of one invariably means the exclusion of another. Thus the decision comes down to which to exclude to include? And, usually, things like the LFG, which won't even be used by a substantial enough number of players until months after launch, are usually excluded for just that reason, then put in at the time it will actually be used.

Edited May 30, 2012 by JeramieCrowe

[kriegheld]

Agree with this except the last part. It was EA and John Riccitiello who kept boasting and poking at WoW. The Docs at BioWare kept trying to downplay that, even going so far as stating they'd be happy with a million and a half subs.

 

 

 

I guess I'm just an experienced MMOer. Been playing MMOs for over a decade now, and feature implementation timing is on purpose. No feature exists in a vacuum. Also, LFG is all but useless for the first few months of a MMO because there are enough people to group because of the typical MMO launch surge, and no one's at endgame.

 

Secondly, I compare to Rift because it's been hailed as the MMO that launched with, and put out content the fastest. So it's a good touchstone.

 

 

 

What condition? "This" condition is typical of every MMO. Actually a bit better. The only three things I fault BioWare for is the removal of open-world PvP on Ilum, breaking their server transfer software they had ready since beta (tested great in closed beta), and the fact that the endgame content is too easy. There's more there than any other MMO before it, but people are finishing it faster than the typical MMO because it's too easy.

 

That's it.

 

As I mentioned above, no feature exists in a vacuum. Consideration and prioritizing of feature sets is a game of balance and timing. The inclusion of one invariably means the exclusion of another. Thus the decision comes down to which to exclude to include? And, usually, things like the LFG, which won't even be used by a substantial enough number of players until months after launch, are usually excluded for just that reason, then put in at the time it will actually be used.

 

Ok, I see where you stand now. You make good points that I can agree with.

 

But, I will point out two things that I didn't.

 

The first on being that WOW hoop-la was all on the EA CEO. There was a thread here which was deleted but can be easily found across the internet and YouTube about a Dev talking about Alderaan being the size of 7-8 zones in WOW. I think over the years there were a few more statements comparing the game with WOW from the Devs. But I will not refute that this was mainly from EA. Not saying that you are wrong, but Bioware doesn't really have clean hands.

 

"It's condition". I've been playing games a long time too. I understand what you are saying. Nobody can implement every feature from every modern game. And most games that we have played have started out pretty stale in comparison. But at the time, back in 2000, were they stale, or freaking awesome? The MMO genre ten years ago was pretty cool to me. But, it's 2012 now. And there are more than four MMOs on the market.

 

Perfect example, not that you need one, because I think we see each other's POV. But for lurkers, I have a condo that I'm going to sell when I finish my obligations in this State. 6 more condos are currently for sale. They all look the same inside and out. Except, I put in new wood flooring, carpet, tile, windows, sliding backdoor, etc etc. (for real I did this). Guess who's going to sell first? I have incentive. I have features.

 

Anyways, didn't mean to bring personal experiences into this, but I thought it fit. I'm glad you and I got to discuss our opposing views in a civil manner. I only wished that our priorities were your priorities, as a community. Maybe we wouldn't have to worry about transfers and merges, etc etc.

[JeramieCrowe]

The first on being that WOW hoop-la was all on the EA CEO. There was a thread here which was deleted but can be easily found across the internet and YouTube about a Dev talking about Alderaan being the size of 7-8 zones in WOW. I think over the years there were a few more statements comparing the game with WOW from the Devs. But I will not refute that this was mainly from EA. Not saying that you are wrong, but Bioware doesn't really have clean hands.

 

I see where you stand on everything in your post, and I respect it all. Just wanted to touch on this one:

 

It's one thing to seek to establish common ground with your potential playerbase, and it's quite another to target as opposition. I feel BioWare's comparisons were merely to establish common ground, and to use examples that people were most familiar with so that the most people possible have as much of an accurate picture as possible. I've seen JO, DD, GZ, and DE make comparisons to other games besides WoW, too. It doesn't mean they were targeting them to take on head-to-head.

 

EA, on the other hand, was not seeking to establish that common ground. They (he, JR) straight up took on WoW as an opponent, even stating (in contradiction to BioWare) that he was expecting 10 million subscriptions in 10 years. That's completely different than comparing a planet's size to WoW zones.

[Drakkip]

 

I guess I'm just an experienced MMOer. Been playing MMOs for over a decade now, and feature implementation timing is on purpose. No feature exists in a vacuum. Also, LFG is all but useless for the first few months of a MMO because there are enough people to group because of the typical MMO launch surge, and no one's at endgame.

 

<snip>

 

As I mentioned above, no feature exists in a vacuum. Consideration and prioritizing of feature sets is a game of balance and timing. The inclusion of one invariably means the exclusion of another. Thus the decision comes down to which to exclude to include? And, usually, things like the LFG, which won't even be used by a substantial enough number of players until months after launch, are usually excluded for just that reason, then put in at the time it will actually be used.

 

I disagree in that it's not just level 50's that use an LFD tool. I have used the LFD tool in other games at all levels. I didn't start playing until February and on my server I hit it at just the "wrong" time. Most of the population had matured and there were very few people to group with at my level. So as it was I missed most of the FP's since there were so few people to group with at my level. I would have used an LFD tool to hit the lower level FP's as would a lot of other people.

 

I think the issue is compounded by what I consider to be low server population caps. Whether it was the perfect storm or the planets aligned or whatever, the bottom has now completely fallen out on my server and from what I have read here many other servers as well. I currently log in spend about 30-40 minutes online doing a few dailies log out as all the people I knew and hung out with have left and honestly when there are usually only 10-20 level 50's online it's nigh impossible to get a group together. My server along with others are losing so much pop I wonder if there is even the critical mass left to justify having the server there at all some nights.

 

I think the senior project manager is completely out of touch with the gaming industry. It makes me wonder on what basis they hire these guys...

Edited May 30, 2012 by Drakkip

[kriegheld]

I see where you stand on everything in your post, and I respect it all. Just wanted to touch on this one:

 

It's one thing to seek to establish common ground with your potential playerbase, and it's quite another to target as opposition. I feel BioWare's comparisons were merely to establish common ground, and to use examples that people were most familiar with so that the most people possible have as much of an accurate picture as possible. I've seen JO, DD, GZ, and DE make comparisons to other games besides WoW, too. It doesn't mean they were targeting them to take on head-to-head.

 

EA, on the other hand, was not seeking to establish that common ground. They (he, JR) straight up took on WoW as an opponent, even stating (in contradiction to BioWare) that he was expecting 10 million subscriptions in 10 years. That's completely different than comparing a planet's size to WoW zones.

 

Another good point.

[JeramieCrowe]

I disagree in that it's not just level 50's that use an LFD tool. I have used the LFD tool in other games at all levels. I didn't start playing until February and on my server I hit it at just the "wrong" time. Most of the population had matured and there were very few people to group with at my level. So as it was I missed most of the FP's since there were so few people to group with at my level.

 

I think the issue is compounded by what I consider to be low server population caps. Whether it was the perfect storm or the planets aligned or whatever, the bottom has now completely fallen out on my server and from what I have read here many other servers as well. I currently log in spend about 30-40 minutes online doing a few dailies log out as all the people I knew and hung out with have left and honestly when there are usually only 10-20 level 50's online it's nigh impossible to get a group together. My server along with others are losing so much pop I wonder if there is even the critical mass left to justify having the server there at all some nights.

 

I think the senior project manager is completely out of touch with the gaming industry. It makes me wonder on what basis they hire these guys...

 

I agree. That's why, if you reread what I said, it's not usually used by a substantial number of people because there are so many people playing because of the launch surge in the first couple of months, there is no issue getting groups.

 

The second reason was that no one was at endgame to do the hard stuff.

 

As far as the speed, in this game, in which the launch surge dropoff occurred, I agree it's because of the low server cap at launch. Reportedly, they've more than doubled that cap, now, so we'll see.

[kriegheld]

@JC

 

Hey, I forgot to ask you something.

 

I said that I'm here for the Star Wars.

 

Why are you here? SW fan? Bioware fan? Both? MMOs in general?

 

I'm asking because I just want to know what's keeping you here or maybe better put, brought you here. It is hard for me to walk away because I'm a Star Wars fan. I really wanted it to do better.

 

But, with news like EA CEO saying that this game isn't that important, layoffs, huge loss in subs, game reviews have all but stopped, customer service; don't you see the writing on the wall? As a veteran, you have witnessed these things before (Vanguard, STO, AOC, WAR). You don't think SWTOR is heading the same direction? That being maintenance mode or worse. Not to mention talk about F2P from some around here and other sites.

 

This doesn't seem familiar to you?

Edited May 30, 2012 by kriegheld

[InnerPieces]

That being maintenance mode or worse. Not to mention talk about F2P from some around here and other sites.

 

This doesn't seem familiar to you?

 

I'm sorry... but who exactly from BioWare or EA have "talked" about SWTOR going F2P and where? At least in regards to something they're thinking about doing. As a veteran, you should know if it does not come in an official statement from either the developer or the publisher it means absolutely nothing. Even interviews and 3rd party articles mean nothing. Anything can be skewed, twisted, and taken out of context or shown in an altered context. Just like the regular news media, articles and interviews are shown in a light designed to attract attention and bring "ratings."

[Nyteblades]

I'm sorry... but who exactly from BioWare or EA have "talked" about SWTOR going F2P and where? At least in regards to something they're thinking about doing. As a veteran, you should know if it does not come in an official statement from either the developer or the publisher it means absolutely nothing. Even interviews and 3rd party articles mean nothing. Anything can be skewed, twisted, and taken out of context or shown in an altered context. Just like the regular news media, articles and interviews are shown in a light designed to attract attention and bring "ratings."

 

What about when you cancel sub the servey they send you is eat up with f2p questions . Dosnt that fall into the offical catagory as it is coming from E.A.Ware?

[KinCharBamin]

So what do these last posts have to do with Character Transfers?

 

In the words of Gold Five "Stay on Target...."

[Kaisernick]

a question for bioware as i cant find an answer at the moment (or im looking in the wrong place)

Will character transfers be limited? as i have 8 characters on my main server and i would like to move them all to the same (albeiat higher populated) server.

[Rafaman]

So what do these last posts have to do with Character Transfers?

 

In the words of Gold Five "Stay on Target...."

 

lol! There's too many of them! I'm going to have to break off!

[Nyteblades]

a question for bioware as i cant find an answer at the moment (or im looking in the wrong place)

Will character transfers be limited? as i have 8 characters on my main server and i would like to move them all to the same (albeiat higher populated) server.

 

You cant find the answer anywhere because they refuse to give one. Or any information on transfers. I'm not sure what thier train of thought is with the info blackout . But then again their policy is to not tell the customers anything and hope it turns out alright .

 

Its easier to hide behind half truths and soon's.

[Infirmary]

The thing that really bothers me is that...if there was no such thing as Legacy, I would have already skipped servers and started on a new one..no questions asked. But since I have a couple of 50s and 30s...I feel like i'm screwing myself over by abandoning my Legacy. This is frustrating.

[Monoth]

The thing that really bothers me is that...if there was no such thing as Legacy, I would have already skipped servers and started on a new one..no questions asked. But since I have a couple of 50s and 30s...I feel like i'm screwing myself over by abandoning my Legacy. This is frustrating.

 

They should make Legacy attached to your account instead of being tied to the server your on.

 

Would remove any problems of switching servers.... But I guess with 1.3 the transfer system should also fix this issue....

[JeramieCrowe]

@JC

 

Hey, I forgot to ask you something.

 

I said that I'm here for the Star Wars.

 

Why are you here? SW fan? Bioware fan? Both? MMOs in general?

 

I'm asking because I just want to know what's keeping you here or maybe better put, brought you here. It is hard for me to walk away because I'm a Star Wars fan. I really wanted it to do better.

 

But, with news like EA CEO saying that this game isn't that important, layoffs, huge loss in subs, game reviews have all but stopped, customer service; don't you see the writing on the wall? As a veteran, you have witnessed these things before (Vanguard, STO, AOC, WAR). You don't think SWTOR is heading the same direction? That being maintenance mode or worse. Not to mention talk about F2P from some around here and other sites.

 

This doesn't seem familiar to you?

 

I'm a fan of all three. I love a good story. The 8 storylines are enough to keep me for a while, as well as my guildies. We've been playing through the storylines so much that we just did our first HM the night before last. And as long as my guildies and I are having fun, we have a game to play.

 

I take layoffs, loss in subs, negative game reviews, and the like with a grain of salt. After all, even WoW has been through these things. And, like I said, as long as my guild and I are having fun, it doesn't matter. The guild I'm in, we've been together for a decade through many, many MMOs. And I've always had nothing but good experiences with the CS in this game.

 

I seriously doubt TOR will ever go F2P. At worst, I think it might do like EQ2 is doing and stay sub-based, but offer some F2P/RMT servers, if anything.

 

In short, I go more by my own experiences over what other people try to tell me I should feel about the game.

Edited May 30, 2012 by JeramieCrowe

[JeramieCrowe]

You cant find the answer anywhere because they refuse to give one. Or any information on transfers. I'm not sure what thier train of thought is with the info blackout . But then again their policy is to not tell the customers anything and hope it turns out alright .

 

Its easier to hide behind half truths and soon's.

 

They're working on an entire developer blog about it. It doesn't just take a few days to do that.

[JeramieCrowe]

The thing that really bothers me is that...if there was no such thing as Legacy, I would have already skipped servers and started on a new one..no questions asked. But since I have a couple of 50s and 30s...I feel like i'm screwing myself over by abandoning my Legacy. This is frustrating.

 

I wouldn't abandon them at this point. 1.3 is coming to PTS within a couple of weeks, which puts release of 1.3 around a month or so, and SR stated that transfers are coming before 1.3.

[Infirmary]

I wouldn't abandon them at this point. 1.3 is coming to PTS within a couple of weeks, which puts release of 1.3 around a month or so, and SR stated that transfers are coming before 1.3.

 

- I don't want to but since there's literally 5 people on my fleet right now, there's nothing for me to do. Sorry to vent, again it's rather frustrating.

[silviothinks]

This is simply too little too late. I am quite new to the game, and I levelled to 30 before realising that at peak times the Fleet had about 4 players online, and this would never change.

 

I trawled the forums for a long time, thinking that surely this can't be an MMO - I'm playing one player. Sure, I'm enjoying questing, but I can't take part in battlegrounds or flashpoints.

 

So, I took the plunge and re-rolled to a server with instant battleground queues, and there are constantly 200+ in the Fleet, and normally around 100 players wherever I am levelling.

 

The game is alive now I have re-rolled. The problem is, for people like my brother who have played since release, they don't want to have invested /played 30 days to then have to move.

 

'FREE Transfers' is nothing short of an insult. It's not even being hidden that it will probably cost money to move where you want to. The 'free' transfers restrict your movement to one server - one that is probably currently dead in an attempt to fill it up.

 

I was in a position to move server and start to enjoy the game, others are definitely not, and I have to say that the customer service is coming across as pretty disgusting across the board on this move. This is based on the approach of not facing the community straight up.

 

Problems are ignored for too long, not addressed properly, and the players and customers are not respected.

[InnerPieces]

What about when you cancel sub the servey they send you is eat up with f2p questions . Dosnt that fall into the offical catagory as it is coming from E.A.Ware?

 

Well, considering I haven't canceled my account I wouldn't know anything about that.

 

Attitude aside, thanks for answering the question.

[PalihoJ]

So what do these last posts have to do with Character Transfers?

 

In the words of Gold Five "Stay on Target...."

 

Absolute quality!!!!

[Mrcha]

My server count on Republic side 26 people. Queues are last for 40+ minutes. It is now peek time at Saturday evening. I don't want to have free-transfers to another death server. I doubt we will get free-transfers to highly populated servers.

 

Do you, guys from Bioware, think I would be interested to move from one death server to another death server. You don't have any given statistic for server publicly available, to help me with decision, for me it will bejust blind shot when I try to move to better server.

 

According to my home server where I do have 6 toons on Republic side and one Imperial. I would be happy for short time now when I will do play Imperial, but how long? How ling would be people happy to do PvP against same faction (Imperials particullary on my server?)

 

Free transfers aren't solution for SWTOR cancer (low pop), but only and only cross server queues and LFG tools. That would be priority. Ranked warzones just on one server would be epic fail. Imagine how big gap will be between Imperials and Republic on our server. I doubt we will have any premade on Republic side, but Imperials will run own couple of premade groups to fight agains each other. So Republic will get zilch and Imperials will get all, nice try, but epic fail.

Edited June 2, 2012 by Mrcha