This game badly needs mods and macros.

[DeviuosOne]

I really don't enjoy healing in this game at all right now. I set my tank as focus but any conversations or entering a different area removes your focus. trying to scramble before attacks to get your focus target is a pain as well as I find that a lot of times it doesn't work. There are times i have to focus something else and then my tank again. I cast dark infusion and i have to watch the cast bar and make sure it is at the very end of the cast bar because i will cancel the cast if i try casting anything else, and even sometimes it seems to cancel the cast even after the cast bar is done. Ah I'm rambling on but is short I'm not happy with healing right now and decided to play a BH dps class and hopefully they fix healing in upcoming patch and i will go back to my inquisitor which I would rather play.

[Ratall]

As a Sith warrior I have talents that have the possibility to proc various things like force scream being free to cast or a reduced rage cost on some abilities.

 

I have no idea how I am supposed to know when these have procced. It makes taking those talents seem pointless since I have no real way to take advantage of them.

 

I also find that I spend most of my time staring at the ui at the bottom. I want mods that let me put the information I need around my character so that I can watch the action and be aware of my surrounding which is especially important for a tank.

[Matte_Black]

I sorely underestimated just how poor the UI would turn out. It is so uncustomizable it isn't funny. Health bars, buffs, debuffs, and the power bar are all WAY too small. You can't move or resize anything, I HATE having the chat box up the top.

 

Not having a damage meter or even a freaking combat log is ridiculous. Why shouldn't we even know how much damage we're doing? I want to know what the best rotation is for my character and I have absolutely no way of working that out.

 

Macros are a staple in every MMO, how can you just not have them? There's a nice focus target but it's practically useless without focus macros.

 

These should be top priority for the next patch.

 

Simply put, BioWare wants us to have characters that adventure through their story more than just a digital tool to negotiate an MMO with. I am not saying it is wrong or right but, it does seem to be an ongoing thread running through their decisions.

[Kurnea]

'Badly needs' is quite severe. Thus far I've played without macros and mods and got by fine. However, some ui adjustments and perhaps mouseover macros would make playing a more pleasant experience.

[ltankhsd]

No problems here.

 

ITT people who need to be told what buttons to press and when.

[Ratall]

Currently there is a level playing field. Everyone has the same UI. Everyone has the same information shown to them.

 

As soon as mods and add-ons and to a lesser extent UI customisation is allowed EVEYTHING changes:

 

• Joe Casual, who has no want or desire to change things, finds himself at a disadvantage in PvP over Peter Pr0, as he doesn't want or feel he needs the crazy mod/ui/add-ons to play his game
   
  
• Peter Pr0, who has a combat log parser, notices that Andy Average is doing 10% less damage than he is, and so boots him from the Operation group on the grounds that "He is the same class as I am, he should be able to put the same damage output out there as I can". Andy Average has some UI customisation, but CAB with the complexity of mods and add-ons
   
  
• Zoe Zealot has an add-on which evaluates potential guild/groupmates based on a combination of their item level and stat scores. She will not allow anyone with less than score X join her guild or group, telling Andy Average that he's not good enough and laughing at Joe Casual.
  

 

See where I'm going with this? For a MMO to remain playable and fair the game has to remain as it is, so we're all on a level playing field. Sure, it's not as slick as "the other games out there" but this is SWTOR. It should stand on it's own and the devs need to be brave enough to stand fast to their vision, IMHO.

 

 

There's no such thing as a level playing field. The people that strive to find ways to optimize their play will always dominate Joe Average mods or not.

 

That's like saying it isn't fair for Peter Pro Grand Master Starcraft player to practice and study the game of Starcraft because that isn't fair to Joe Average Bronze player who puts in zero effort.

 

 

There is needed information that is not being presented as far as I can tell such as abilities from talents proccing and such. As well as my desire to actually watch the game and not the icons and rage bar at the bottom of my screen.

Edited December 19, 2011 by Ratall

[Rannasha]

Simply put, BioWare wants us to have characters that adventure through their story more than just a digital tool to negotiate an MMO with. I am not saying it is wrong or right but, it does seem to be an ongoing thread running through their decisions.

 

And eventually we've adventured through the story, reached level 50 and then what? People will start running hardcore modes of lower-level flashpoints, will start doing operations (raids), etc... And it would be damn handy not to be encumbered by a clunky UI that presents you with very little useful info while taking up a fair amount of space.

 

The game should derive its difficulty from gameplay-challenges, not from making the players fight against the UI.

[Jedi_Wannabe]

I want to know what the best rotation is for my character and I have absolutely no way of working that out.

 

try arithmetic.

[Usagizero]

Not having a damage meter

 

is a good thing. There, fixed that for you. That kind of thing ruined WoW, and games don't need them, all you need to know is "Did we kill the boss?", and you are good. What swtor doesn't need is making grouping even more annoying "LFM Black Talon, need 1000 gear score and 6k dps. link achieve."

[Kurnea]

No problems here.

 

ITT people who need to be told what buttons to press and when.

 

Or just want some aesthetic improvements and adjustments, maybe?

[Gravesyuh]

Currently there is a level playing field. Everyone has the same UI. Everyone has the same information shown to them.

 

As soon as mods and add-ons and to a lesser extent UI customisation is allowed EVEYTHING changes:

 

• Joe Casual, who has no want or desire to change things, finds himself at a disadvantage in PvP over Peter Pr0, as he doesn't want or feel he needs the crazy mod/ui/add-ons to play his game
   
  
• Peter Pr0, who has a combat log parser, notices that Andy Average is doing 10% less damage than he is, and so boots him from the Operation group on the grounds that "He is the same class as I am, he should be able to put the same damage output out there as I can". Andy Average has some UI customisation, but CAB with the complexity of mods and add-ons
   
  
• Zoe Zealot has an add-on which evaluates potential guild/groupmates based on a combination of their item level and stat scores. She will not allow anyone with less than score X join her guild or group, telling Andy Average that he's not good enough and laughing at Joe Casual.
  

 

See where I'm going with this? For a MMO to remain playable and fair the game has to remain as it is, so we're all on a level playing field. Sure, it's not as slick as "the other games out there" but this is SWTOR. It should stand on it's own and the devs need to be brave enough to stand fast to their vision, IMHO.

 

Agreed, customization is great -- but it shouldn't offer an advantage or predjudice against others.

[Rannasha]

try arithmetic.

 

The interaction between different procs and talents that make abilities improve other abilities can be strongly non-linear. Simple arithmetic will not get you very far. You're left with either a spreadsheet / simulation program to properly theorycraft your rotation or just a simple damage meter that tells you how much damage you did while bashing a boss for a minute or two.

 

Strangely enough, most people do not prefer the first option.

[Gegner]

Would like to see some customizable UI. I don't like the bar sitting on the top of the screen, it makes me feel boxed in. Would also like to see some add-on and macro support.

[Blarginater]

UI definately needs some work, should be one of their top priorities tbh.

[Bigguyonarock]

is a good thing. There, fixed that for you. That kind of thing ruined WoW, and games don't need them, all you need to know is "Did we kill the boss?", and you are good. What swtor doesn't need is making grouping even more annoying "LFM Black Talon, need 1000 gear score and 6k dps. link achieve."

 

Except damage meters were there since the beginning of WoW.

 

Long before they had their first million subscribers..

 

I don't really see how you can make the claim damage meters ruined WoW.

[Rannasha]

is a good thing. There, fixed that for you. That kind of thing ruined WoW, and games don't need them, all you need to know is "Did we kill the boss?", and you are good. What swtor doesn't need is making grouping even more annoying "LFM Black Talon, need 1000 gear score and 6k dps. link achieve."

 

And when you don't kill the boss? What then? How do you know where to improve? Is the tactic wrong? Is someone significantly underperforming? Without extra information, the best you can do is just keep trying over and over until somehow you succeed. Either that, or all bosses need to be of such a difficulty-level that they don't pose a serious challenge. Neither option sounds like a lot of fun for serious gamers.

 

You mentioned "LFM Black Talon, 1000 gear score, 6k dps, link achieve". None of this will happen with the introduction of a damage meter. Damage meters don't give you a gear-score, they don't give you achievements and the required DPS-level people can (and will!) just lie about to get into the run as there's no way to prove your capability until you're already in.

[killercat]

I don't mind them adding damage meters and customizable UI. I do not wanting them to open up the addon markets. While there are some good ones like the meters, there are others that made the game simple, and allowed poor players the ability to do content that diminished the feel of completing content. Aka raid helpers, decursive, rotation guides, etc.

[Matte_Black]

And eventually we've adventured through the story, reached level 50 and then what? People will start running hardcore modes of lower-level flashpoints, will start doing operations (raids), etc... And it would be damn handy not to be encumbered by a clunky UI that presents you with very little useful info while taking up a fair amount of space.

 

The game should derive its difficulty from gameplay-challenges, not from making the players fight against the UI.

 

I don't really see it as fighting the UI. You seem to want a different product presented. If you want movable, scaleable UI, few would disagree. If you want to dredge all the numbers from the behind the curtains and splash them into the foreground, then you are focusing the game more on the numbers and optimization and less on character and story. My sense is that they trying to promote a more seat-of-the-pants connection that let's your eyes and ears follow the "story" as opposed to just responding to numerical feedback.

[Kineticks]

Entirely debate as to whether or not it should be made more customizable is invalid BioWare already stated they are making it more customizable as a top priority.

[Bigguyonarock]

And when you don't kill the boss? What then? How do you know where to improve? Is the tactic wrong? Is someone significantly underperforming? Without extra information, the best you can do is just keep trying over and over until somehow you succeed. Either that, or all bosses need to be of such a difficulty-level that they don't pose a serious challenge. Neither option sounds like a lot of fun for serious gamers.

 

You mentioned "LFM Black Talon, 1000 gear score, 6k dps, link achieve". None of this will happen with the introduction of a damage meter. Damage meters don't give you a gear-score, they don't give you achievements and the required DPS-level people can (and will!) just lie about to get into the run as there's no way to prove your capability until you're already in.

 

Even then, I always break down my info after a fight regardless of it being a success or failure.

 

I like seeing where myself and others succeeded and made mistakes. So I can do the same or avoid repeating them.

 

This debate reeks of too many people afraid of being judged, critiqued, or called-out for *********** up.

 

If you ****-up, you ****-up. You can get better. Stop worrying about it. We all start out ******.

[Jedi_Wannabe]

For a MMO to remain playable and fair the game has to remain as it is, so we're all on a level playing field.

 

To reach a level playing field, the average players need mods to help them compete with the superior players.

 

The superior players will learn to maximize their DPS and not pull aggro without DPS or threat mods. The mods help the inferior players compete.

[Beatmiser]

Mods and Macros are for people who don't have the ability to compete with the tools that the devs provide. They are a crutch for people who need their scripted boss encounters to be easymode so that they can claim they have 'x' boss or instance on farm.

 

If you're a tank who can't hold aggro- let someone else tank until you have the gear and ability to hold aggro.

If you're a healer who cant watch healthbars - learn which players you need to focus on and adjust accordingly.

If you're dps who keeps pissing off the boss - learn to wait for the tank to build up aggro and use less powerful abilities.

 

If you are a raid leader who wants to exclude people based on numbers, you've missed what 'fun' is all about.

Edited December 19, 2011 by Beatmiser

[alerum]

I agree UI is horrendous.

 

Working out a rotation is simple due to fly text and watching health bars

 

I understand your concern with macros. Maybe simple macros but I would not like to see the game turn out like Rift. Bunch of 3 button rotations.

 

I don't mind the UI although I wish I could move my side bars in closer.

 

Mouse-over macros would be good but I doubt we'll see that in the near future.

[Rannasha]

I don't really see it as fighting the UI. You seem to want a different product presented. If you want movable, scaleable UI, few would disagree. If you want to dredge all the numbers from the behind the curtains and splash them into the foreground, then you are focusing the game more on the numbers and optimization and less on character and story. My sense is that they trying to promote a more seat-of-the-pants connection that let's your eyes and ears follow the "story" as opposed to just responding to numerical feedback.

 

The problem is that the model you're describing works great for single player games that have a well defined ending. The SW:TOR story has an end, but the business-model Bioware uses encourages them to keep people hooked to the game after the story ends. And Bioware will never be able to expand the story at the same rate that people consume it.

 

So there has to be something at the end of the story that keeps people hooked. Something that takes a lot of time, but is still fun to do. Stuff like raiding and PvP are the obvious choices here, as evidenced by other MMOs. And for that, the current interface is inadequate and you need the numbers and optimization.

 

I agree that for the current questing phase of the game, it's not necessary. A bit of UI redecoration / customization would still be nice, but generally it's all good. But the questing phase will end for all but the most fanatic alt-addicts.

[Aisar]

I sorely underestimated just how poor the UI would turn out. It is so uncustomizable it isn't funny. Health bars, buffs, debuffs, and the power bar are all WAY too small. You can't move or resize anything, I HATE having the chat box up the top.

 

Not having a damage meter or even a freaking combat log is ridiculous. Why shouldn't we even know how much damage we're doing? I want to know what the best rotation is for my character and I have absolutely no way of working that out.

 

Macros are a staple in every MMO, how can you just not have them? There's a nice focus target but it's practically useless without focus macros.

 

These should be top priority for the next patch.

 

It's ok. I dont think addons are needed and I hope they dont ever exist for this game.

Edited December 19, 2011 by Aisar