Combat Medic PVP Builds after 1.2

[Trexcapades]

I mainly play in pre-mades with my guild and have been a dedicated healer for a long time. With the new 1.2 changes what do you think the best overall strategy + rotation + skill build will be?

 

Right now I typically get my Super charge to 30, heal with adv probe, med probe and bact infusion while throwing in kolto bombs and field aid here and there on myself and friendlies. When things are intense i'll pop my super charge, throw a kolt bomb, pop shield, use relics + adrenals etc and go into adv med probe, med probe, bacta infusion rotation on focused targets.

 

Of course there is more too it generally but I think overall I have done very well. Rank 72 valor in full BM.

 

Any thoughts on how to proceed after 1.2 would be awesome.

 

Thanks!

[Trexcapades]

Ok I will try to foster some discussion about skills.

 

Kolto Residue -- I always liked hitting friendlies with a Kolto before going into my normal healing rotation. If there was an intense fight, of course I would hit them with a super charged kolto then go into my healing rotation. Although 5% was already a small healing bonus, 3% is very small for a 2 point talent skill. Do you guys think this is still worth it? If not, what should replace it?

 

Field Triage -- Now we will only reduce the cost of medical probe by 1 instead of 2. Is it worth 3 skill points?

 

Trauma Probe -- Very expensive with little healing benefit.

 

Psych Aid -- I wonder how much field aid will heal by when you have this talent.

 

 

 

So I was thinking...... http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#800rfRRodbdoqZrcoM.1

 

This is a 31/10/0 that Ignores Kolto Residue, Field Triage and Trauma Probe completely and focuses more on being extremely hard to kill.

 

Mind you I'm talking about a build for pvp, not pve. I typically find that in PVP one of my greatest assets is the ability to have 3 or 4 guys on me and NOT die. And once opponents figure out that I am the healer, they will be on me like flies on doodoo.

 

In order to conserve ammo, I maxed out recharge cells with 2 points and also put a point in efficient conversions because I use cryo grenade a lot and I could save some ammo there. That would offset some of the ammo pain you will suffer by not having field triage.

 

Then basically you can stick with this rotation: max out super charge, heal with adv med probe and med probe while throwing in field aid here and there for some healing and debuff. Obviously spamming bacta infusions when it's necessary.

 

Cheers!

[Jinkblade]

For 1.2 I unspeced trauma probe (just a sad excuse of an ability now), got the CM talent that reduces cc cost and the AS parralactic stims talent for the extra ammo.

[Gabe_Grinstead]

Even though Field Triage is a huge nerf, it is still useful. Being that there are not many useful abilities in the tree and you need to spend 30 before getting access to Bacta infusion, this makes Field Triage a must.

 

Besides, Field Triage is saving you 1 ammo every 9 seconds (8 if you 4 piece PVP/PVE armor set). And despite the huge nerf when used in conjuction with SSC, it is still better than nothing. It just means you will have to hold back.

 

If you merely pop SSC and then AMP over and over, you are losing out on the 2 additional ticks that it will provide. Since 2 AMPS is going to use the same ammo as AMP/MP combo it wouldn't be wise to use AMP/AMP as you are wasting any ability for AMP to match MP in healing power. In a group type setting, you would avoid AMP/MP twice on the same target (assuming they are not going to die) as you want to ensure AMP is going to tick three times.

 

So when you pop SSC because everyone is taking damage

 

Kolto Bomb first, then AMP/MP on MT then switch to secondary target who has taken damage and cast AMP and immediately switch back to MT for MP. Then switch AMP to another party member, and finish MP on the MT. Once the full tick of AMP has ran its course (9 seconds) on the MT, you can follow up with another AMP/MP combo on the MT. Obviously, MT is the main tank, the one who should be taking the majority of the damage. But you can replace MT with ET (effective tank) if you want. Essentially the person taking the damage. They key here is use AMP intelligently when using SSC. You may have to hold back due to the nerf on Field Triage, but not picking up Field Triage is a HUGE mistake, despite the ability being nerfed heavily.

 

You might also want to pickup the 4% Alacrity Bonus, as you already have the 5% via the crit proc. I would just remove as much Alacrity from gear as much as possible. However, with the focus of this thread on PVP, you still might want to keep all of your Alacrity on your gear. Being able to cast a 1.2s AMP and a 1.6s MP is huge in PVP.

 

FYI - I do play both PVE and PVP quite heavily (probably more PVP, though) but until dual spec comes out, I always keep both in mind when chosing my skill points. From a ammo conversation stand point, Alacrity is pretty bad with our nerf. But from a PVP stand point, not a lot has changed, in my opinion and Alacrity is still important. So, I suppose the best action is to have two sets of gear. I couldn't stand the look of Tionesse/Collumi gear (personal preference) so I didn't really have a full set of PVE and PVP gear. I just left Alacrity at what BattleMaster gear gives. But now 1.2 should open up my appearance options quite a bit allowing me to have two different sets of gear that can look the same, but function differently based on whether I am doing PVE or PVP.

 

My plan is to use the following 31/10 build here or possibly this one here

Edited April 12, 2012 by Gabe_Grinstead

[Niconogood]

I just tried a couple a matches, and the nerf is really bad...

 

Forget kolto residue. Thats a pointless talent. Forget the alacrity talent. I still keep trauma probe, but you will not be able to rotate it due to extreme ammoissue now. Just keep it on yourself as you will be alot more squishy now, people will now it, and you will be targeted alot more.

 

With the expertise change PvP damage is increased ALOT and healingbuff is nerfed to be even worse than it was before.

[Gabe_Grinstead]

I just tried a couple a matches, and the nerf is really bad...

 

Forget kolto residue. Thats a pointless talent. Forget the alacrity talent. I still keep trauma probe, but you will not be able to rotate it due to extreme ammoissue now. Just keep it on yourself as you will be alot more squishy now, people will now it, and you will be targeted alot more.

 

With the expertise change PvP damage is increased ALOT and healingbuff is nerfed to be even worse than it was before.

 

Keep in mind that usually the hardcore player base are the first people to PVP on the server after a patch. So you are playing against very skilled players most likely. The fact of the matter was that you would still have died performed poorly under patch 1.1 under the same scenario. Wait until the average players are part of warzones. I am sure you will not feel the nerf as badly.

 

Again, I want to reiterate that even in 1.1 we didn't stand a chance against an extremely well skilled and cordinated team and I personally believe you are running into them already because the patch just came out and us casual players are still at work (on lunch break!) not able to play...

Edited April 12, 2012 by Gabe_Grinstead

[Trexcapades]

Thanks for the replies.

 

Is trauma probe even worth it? Or just put that point in cell capacitor?

 

If it is worth it how will you use it?

 

What about field aid...how much does it heal?

 

Thanks

[Gabe_Grinstead]

Thanks for the replies.

 

Is trauma probe even worth it? Or just put that point in cell capacitor?

 

If it is worth it how will you use it?

 

What about field aid...how much does it heal?

 

Thanks

 

Trauma Probe - Yes, because it only costs 1 skill point and is still useful. If it crits on all 10 ticks, it will heal for 6K. If it crits on 40% of them, around 4.5K. That isn't bad for 2 ammo. With that said, the ammo cost is too high for what it is. But it still isn't useless. At the very least, use it at the beggining of a pull/fight/warzone and refresh it when there is downtime and full ammo.

 

Field Aid - Yes, for the same reason above. It heals for around 350 or so, I believe. Is it weak? You bet! But useless? No. Almost useless? Yes.

 

Again, there is not much to pick from that is worth while in the tree and you need to spend 30 points to get access to Bacta Infusion. So it is a matter of picking the best from a lot of lackluster talents.

Edited April 12, 2012 by Gabe_Grinstead

[Jinkblade]

Thanks for the replies.

 

Is trauma probe even worth it? Or just put that point in cell capacitor?

 

If it is worth it how will you use it?

 

What about field aid...how much does it heal?

 

Thanks

 

Don’t use it.

[Segedahl]

Tried some warzones and I don't know what to say really.

Healing are much harder and my BM gear is made of paper.

I find it hard to believe that a new build can help much.

But who knows? Maybe I'll get better when used to the nerf

[Tipkaee]

Iv been a long time WZ healer for my guild. I have played 10 games with nearly the same 31/10/0 spec as before it it seems to work fine. The only thing i am considering rearrangeing is the 2 points for the kolto shield 20% healing taken talent, but right now I don't think its worth it. Also i think the kolto residue discussion is interesting, its hard to tell if the damage healing buff is worth it in pvp because if i need some big heals, I don't think let me kolto bomb first for that 3%.

 

Also field aid is super strong now, cleanse (which can prevent 2k+ damage or remove some forms of CC) anything you can and get a 400-600 heal for only 1 ammo. People need to learn to incorporate this skill more, its really helpful to have another instant cast heal for when you are getting interrupted hard.

Edited April 13, 2012 by Tipkaee

[Easpeak]

Also field aid is super strong now, cleanse (which can prevent 2k+ damage or remove some forms of CC) anything you can and get a 400-600 heal for only 1 ammo. People need to learn to incorporate this skill more, its really helpful to have another instant cast heal for when you are getting interrupted hard.

 

I got rid of everything else that give irrelevant buffs and put it in stuff that will make me beefier + psych aid.

[Redcorn]

Best build is reroll to another class.

[SWImara]

Best build is reroll to another class.

Doom and gloomy but there's something to be said for this at the moment. After just a few PvP matches I moved over to Gunnery, I can't see any purpose in speccing above Kolto Bomb at the moment and being a spot healer where necessary. As far as Gunnery, unsurprisingly turret play in PvP without any interrupts is as fun as I remembered at 50. The nerf/buff juggling of Grav Round and Demolition/Full Auto did 0 to make Gunnery more enjoyable, it is still totally immobile, vulnerable to interrupts and repetitive. I figure after things cool down for a few weeks I'll try again but for now I am rolling up a Marauder, it seems pretty clear that the PvP "design" atm is set up for quick kills which means relatively worthless healers and DPS as king.

Edited April 13, 2012 by SWImara

[Nuzt]

Use the scoundrel build. Its goes something like this

 

1) log in

2) delete CM

3) roll smug

4) choose scoundrel

5) spec healing

6) forget that the CM ever exsisted

[Stovokor]

Ran quite a few warzones yesterday. Every single one featured experienced opposition coming out and many featured multiple top 3 of their respective class on server.

 

Did not respec for 1.2 and was running with high latency on the day. Despite this I think 1.2 just takes some getting used to. Over the course of the day my outlook changed from frustration to optimistic. Had many good comeback games in the process.

 

As with many players I run full BM CM with about 18 k HP.

> 1000 k Expertise ( ~ 12 % healing / 18 % dmg reduced / + 22 % dmg output )

• I did not feel overtly squishy. Many times I dragged 2 -3 players away from objective in Novarre for long periods.
   
  
• Ammo management seems to be the main issue. Really need to utilize active ammo skills in rotation without fail.
   
  
• Against good opposition I felt the timing of chain stuns was also brutal. This however does not happen vs average players. The DPS burst level seems about the same as pre-1.2
   
  
• Its imperative to have the tank + healer synergy for tough matchups. The whole squishy thing might be due to this. I also pay attention to CLEANSE even if it puts me in a worse light when it comes to healing numbers.
   
  
• If you are the only Commando Healer in a Warzone then it is pretty much uphill to heal for extended periods. However you build plenty of synergy if there is another healer or tanks peeling.
   
  
• Each healer has ability to perform slightly better in niches. Not always about numbers but getting the win. Sages are king with pull utility in Huttball + heals. They might excel in clumped VS situations but plenty of times the VS numbers are fluff. CM do really well with focused healing especially with the triangle placement in Novarre. We also have offensive and defensive tools for VS. Point being, Its not apocalyptic as made out to be for CM, we can still get the job done in PvP.
   
  

 

I like what you guys are coming up with, likely go with one of the specs in this thread after but Kolto Residue is def gonna be removed.

Edited April 13, 2012 by Stovokor

[SWImara]

I like what you guys are coming up with, likely go with one of the specs in this thread after but Kolto Residue is def gonna be removed.

Definitely appreciate the semi-positive feedback on your play experiences so far. While obviously my experiences were contrary it'd be pretty solid imo to hear from others about what abilities are worth speccing into at this point. Essentially with so many of our heal buffing talents dropped in efficiency I find it increasingly worthwhile to just not spec into them and pick up gunnery talents while playing medic (basically the playstyle still seems feasible the talents are just useless). One of the harder decisions for me yesterday after trying out a hybrid build for a few hours was figuring out what to do with my ammo type.

 

It seems clear that in any situation ammo is going to be an issue in PvP as a heal-specced Commando, but that's something I'm willing to work around, Combat Support Cell still seems typically the way to go unless talented into one of the other ammo boosts. That said, I'm having a really hard time justifying activation of Supercharge Cells, basically I am not sure if it's helping or harming me to do so. 1 energy cell and +5% healing seems really really situational over just staying at a solid +3% from keeping Combat Support active.

 

So far to me it seems that:

• MP & AMP are still our bread & butter.
  
• Kolto Bomb is still pretty useful when your group is getting creamed, something you toss out and hope the right people get healed. Currently quite uncertain about Supercharge for the damage shield.
  
• Trauma Probe I personally totally specced out of, but I'd love to hear others thoughts on it.
  
• Field Aid strikes me as distinctly meh given the cost contrasted with the ease of re-applying whatever debuff was removed.

 

Overall my hybrid seems functional if less enjoyable than my Combat Medic was before. The only real noticeable issue I am having is that running into a Marauder is basically a death sentence at the moment, I think this is probably just an interaction of the changes to expertise and that class' re-balancing. It'll probably take me a while to figure out how to deal with them again.

Edited April 13, 2012 by SWImara

[Aaoogaa]

TTK for a healer now is about 4-8 seconds against 2 dps. You will die in the first 2 stuns against competent players. So if you can't beat em join em...6.9k demo round is allowing me to 4 shot people. BW might see the error of their ways here soon and restore healing but no sense in suffering through until they do.

[Tipkaee]

TTK for a healer now is about 4-8 seconds against 2 dps. You will die in the first 2 stuns against competent players. So if you can't beat em join em...6.9k demo round is allowing me to 4 shot people. BW might see the error of their ways here soon and restore healing but no sense in suffering through until they do.

 

4-8 second deaths are simply not true, unless their is a giant gear issue. If you really are dyeing in 2 stuns, reconsider your positioning and not getting into that situation. Also between medpac, shield, bacta infusion, trauma probe, heavy armor, and our knockback we have plenty of defensive measures for when we get opened on. Many other CMs and myself included have had equally geared dps 2v1 us for extended periods of time, usually long enough to pell others from the objective.

 

As for current spec im using http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#800dfRzRdcdkqZMckM.1

 

You only really need 1 point in first responder since the second point with high crit rate only increased uptime by around 20-30%. Also with the nerfs to ammo, i rather have 1 more in cell capacitor, and less alacrity actual helps our ammo issues currently.

 

The only points i would consider reshuffling would be the 2 from heavy trooper into med zone, but I find that with the bubble on I never die anyways and often the bubble is popped so I can heal teammates uninterrupted, not myself. These 2 talent point are more personal preference.

 

Lastly for rotation it is largely the same, i just have to stop myself from casting when my teammates don't need it immediately if i'm at 4-6 ammo and everyone should spam some hammer shot and field aid.

 

*This is a pvp viewpoint

Edited April 13, 2012 by Tipkaee

[Khalous]

CM in warzones are fine, we just don't have as much longevity as we had before 1.2.

 

As for the balance of heals vs. dps, expertise is favoring dmg done over dmg reduction by about 3% in full BM gear, which makes high damage/low survivability specs marginally more useful than they previously were.

 

Running with Tanks or other Healers definately takes the edge off, just as it did before 1.2. Unfortunately, many healers didn't like the balancing that happened, and are rolling dps now, which means you really have to find some friendly tanks to watch your back.

(I have 2 shadow tanks, 3 jedi gaurdians, and 7 vangaurds on my friends list)

 

I am running a 30/11/00 hybrid CM/GR spec atm because GR'ing sent/rauders to death is > a 2.5k heal every 20 seconds.

 

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#800rfRRRdbozVZrcoMo.1

[Stovokor]

Definitely appreciate the semi-positive feedback on your play experiences so far. While obviously my experiences were contrary it'd be pretty solid imo to hear from others about what abilities are worth speccing into at this point. Essentially with so many of our heal buffing talents dropped in efficiency I find it increasingly worthwhile to just not spec into them and pick up gunnery talents while playing medic (basically the playstyle still seems feasible the talents are just useless). One of the harder decisions for me yesterday after trying out a hybrid build for a few hours was figuring out what to do with my ammo type.

 

It seems clear that in any situation ammo is going to be an issue in PvP as a heal-specced Commando, but that's something I'm willing to work around, Combat Support Cell still seems typically the way to go unless talented into one of the other ammo boosts. That said, I'm having a really hard time justifying activation of Supercharge Cells, basically I am not sure if it's helping or harming me to do so. 1 energy cell and +5% healing seems really really situational over just staying at a solid +3% from keeping Combat Support active.

 

So far to me it seems that:

• MP & AMP are still our bread & butter.
  
• Kolto Bomb is still pretty useful when your group is getting creamed, something you toss out and hope the right people get healed. Currently quite uncertain about Supercharge for the damage shield.
  
• Trauma Probe I personally totally specced out of, but I'd love to hear others thoughts on it.
  
• Field Aid strikes me as distinctly meh given the cost contrasted with the ease of re-applying whatever debuff was removed.

 

Overall my hybrid seems functional if less enjoyable than my Combat Medic was before. The only real noticeable issue I am having is that running into a Marauder is basically a death sentence at the moment, I think this is probably just an interaction of the changes to expertise and that class' re-balancing. It'll probably take me a while to figure out how to deal with them again.

 

I did a few more warzones. I also agree with many of your observations

 

• The major factor now is Marauder( s )
  
• Positioning is also paramount now
  
• TTK has gone up but it feels more like a factor of specific classes rather then all DPS
  
• Dying in 4-8 seconds each time means you have bad positioning. There are other variables inc defensive skillset that should prevent this ( reference to another post on this thread )
  
• Healing is still viable but effectiveness varies. Now it is more dependent on :
  a .) Taunt + dedicated peels
  b. ) Having 2 healers ( increases lifespan significantly )
  c .) Not overextending to heal the wrong targets. Tough choicess rather then being Rambo with shield
  d. ) Enemy composition. Example If its highly geared group of Marauder + Jugg + Powertech .... the burst is exponentially compounded. That kinda composition will roll most setups & they will not need a healer to do so.
  

 

It still feels that in warzones the healing makes a difference tactically especially if you have good DPS on your side. You might die fast but you do enough overall to help with the objective. Other then MP + AP I am still messing around with what to drop. I still use field aid especially in HB on the ball carrier. Many procs are also dependant on DoTs so if I am targeted : Get separation ---> Cleanse/Shield --> Heal. I also consciously try to not eat initial stun from Powertech, AOE Jugg, Operative.

 

Considering testing Hybrid healer + Grav which I loved prior to 1.2

 

Have any of you guys tested healing in premade vs premade ?

Edited April 15, 2012 by Stovokor

[doppleprophet]

Hola.

 

I'm pretty new to this game. My Commando is only level 21. Maybe someone with experience at 50 would comment on the following spec I'm working on:

 

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#800rfMokzdZZbIrRzGM.1

 

This started off as an attempt to make the most durable (PvP) commando possible. But I'm not into going all-out healer (so no Bacta or the upper-tier medic-tree abilities.) Instead, I ended up trying to get all I could out of Reactive Shield. This meant spreading points between CM and Assault. Which seems reasonable since if I wanted to go for Burst DPS, I'd just climb the Gunnery tree. Instead, I will hang around spot-healing and dropping DoTs and AoEs, being annoying as possible.

 

In this spec, Reactive Shield is augmented by:

Combat Shield: -30% pushback (on top of Steady Hands' 70% healing pushback reduction); interrupt immunity

Med Zone: +20% healing received

Reflexive Shield: every 1.5 sec, taking damage reduces RS's cooldown by 3s

Degauss: movement-impairing effects are removed by RS

 

Regarding ammo issues:

Cell Capacitor: +2 cells on Recharge Cells

Efficient Conversions: Cryo, CC, CR -1 cell

Parallactic Stims: +1 cell when cc'd

Rapid Recharge: -30s cooldown on Recharge Cells

 

Miscellaneous:

The only reason I put a point in Kolto Residue is I needed it to activate the next tier. The other options were Supercharge and First Responder, both of which are "do not want."

 

Thoughts?

Edited April 16, 2012 by doppleprophet

[Koenig-O-Riain]

The 30-11-0 is where it's at for CM spec'd commandos.

 

I highly advise against playing a Combat Medic spec'd commando as a dedicated healer for a premade in PVP or raid group in PVE. It's impossible post 1.2, so stop worrying about it, and move on. No reroll needed, just adjust play style and rotations. (I did, and I still dominate on my CM)

 

I can speak for PVP, but not PVE.

We are far better as hybrid dps/healers in a support role. You will quickly find out that the extra dps and clutch heals that a bursty combat medic can provide in PVP is where the love is.

 

We are Combat Medics. COMBAT first, MEDIC second. Why do I state the obvious....cause some of the CM's have their heads in the sand and want Bioware to give us back our indestructible commando healers. I felt overpowered pre 1.2. If you didn't then I'm sorry but you were either undergeared or just sucked.

 

DPS in PVP post 1.2 is even more bursty. SO THROW THAT GAS ON THE FIRE AND LET IT BURN! AKA help out DPS.

 

CM's heals are pretty bursty. Clutch heal your focus'd comrades, they will love you, even if they don't give you the MVP medal that you know you deserve more than anyone. (some trailing sarcasm)

 

Follow this path to PVP CM spec'd enlightenment and remember, your not just a healer, your a COMBAT MEDIC OF HAVOC SQUAD!!!!!!!!!

[jeffrico]

The 30-11-0 is where it's at for CM spec'd commandos.

 

I highly advise against playing a Combat Medic spec'd commando as a dedicated healer for a premade in PVP or raid group in PVE. It's impossible post 1.2, so stop worrying about it, and move on. No reroll needed, just adjust play style and rotations. (I did, and I still dominate on my CM)

 

I can speak for PVP, but not PVE.

We are far better as hybrid dps/healers in a support role. You will quickly find out that the extra dps and clutch heals that a bursty combat medic can provide in PVP is where the love is.

 

We are Combat Medics. COMBAT first, MEDIC second. Why do I state the obvious....cause some of the CM's have their heads in the sand and want Bioware to give us back our indestructible commando healers. I felt overpowered pre 1.2. If you didn't then I'm sorry but you were either undergeared or just sucked.

 

DPS in PVP post 1.2 is even more bursty. SO THROW THAT GAS ON THE FIRE AND LET IT BURN! AKA help out DPS.

 

CM's heals are pretty bursty. Clutch heal your focus'd comrades, they will love you, even if they don't give you the MVP medal that you know you deserve more than anyone. (some trailing sarcasm)

 

Follow this path to PVP CM spec'd enlightenment and remember, your not just a healer, your a COMBAT MEDIC OF HAVOC SQUAD!!!!!!!!!

 

I haven't tried a build with grav round yet- but I wonder why you take cell capacitor and not efficient conversions? Personally, I use cryo grenade, knockback, and conc. round more than enough to outweigh the 1 extra ammo every two minutes you get with cell capacitor.

[ryuzo]

Commando heals in 1.2 is nowhere near as broken as people try to make it out to be.

 

The main issue right now is the imbalance between Commando/Sage heals and Scoundrel heals. Holding skill equal, right now I believe that a Scoundrel healer will just downright outperform the Commando healer.

 

This is because of the fact that they have lots of heals which are instant cast and therefore uninterruptible. They are nowhere near unkillable, but definitely look to be a cut above the rest.