Liamo Posted April 10, 2012 Share Posted April 10, 2012 Lmao OP says he views same faction WZ (which is clearly stated to be training simulation for RP purposes) as game and immersion-breaking but when his character dies in a pit of fire or a pool of acid and magically respawns 30seconds later instead of "transcending to the Force", it's fine? Game mechanics that have ZERO impact on story / lore. 2 can play this game bro Everyone playing knows it's a game. They accept the fact that blasters don't kill in one shot and Lightsabers don't decapitate people. Repeating things aren't an issue because it's not like they say, in the Warzone, "you've done this 50 times, do it again." The lore is consistent because it's more like the first time doing it all the time. Same with respawning not breaking lore. It's looked at as part of the game mechanic-same as the credits on a movie don't break lore. They are part of the medium. As for the change, I think most of us, myself included, are worried that Bioware is forgetting how important "story" is for this game. They talked about it for 3 years until release, yet any new updates do nothing for the "story" and seem all about the "pew pew." As I previously stated, the "simulation/War game" doesn't really make sense since you'd be along side the enemy-no one trains that way. What else are the going to sacrifice for gameplay? SWG did that and they lost even the Star Wars fans. When this game stops respecting them, the game is in the death spiral. Keeping Star Wars fans should be more important than any other group-since this is Star Wars, after all. This is a rich part of Star Wars history that has been untapped before. This IS canon. Bioware needs to be constantly reminded they have been given the keys to the Kingdom and not to screw it up because they have issues with matching players for PvP (which is VERY important.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LifeOfMessiah Posted April 10, 2012 Share Posted April 10, 2012 when you are fighting against the same faction, the cutscenes and audio will reflect that of a Training session instead of an actual battle, so it won't mess with lore at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liamo Posted April 10, 2012 Share Posted April 10, 2012 when you are fighting against the same faction, the cutscenes and audio will reflect that of a Training session instead of an actual battle, so it won't mess with lore at all. Why would a training simulation have a Jedi and Sith fight together? It's not just whom you are fighting against but whom you are fighting with. I think those of us that feel lore is the biggest pillar of the game, should ignore those instances that disagree with it and just accept the opposite side against each other, as canon. BTW, will the new cutscenes say ALL of them training simulations or just the ones that happen to put same faction fighting one another? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guildrum Posted April 10, 2012 Share Posted April 10, 2012 Why would a training simulation have a Jedi and Sith fight together? It's not just whom you are fighting against but whom you are fighting with. *Facepalm* When was this ever said? Same Faction PVP means... Republic vs. Republic Empire vs. Empire When was the last time you played Huttball with your Jedi fighting alongside an Agent? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liamo Posted April 10, 2012 Share Posted April 10, 2012 *Facepalm* When was this ever said? Same Faction PVP means... Republic vs. Republic Empire vs. Empire When was the last time you played Huttball with your Jedi fighting alongside an Agent? To me, "Same Faction PvP" just means you'd be fighting against the same faction at times when they couldn't get a full "opposite faction" group. I figured, if they had 16 people wanting to PvP, and 12 were Empire than 4 Empire players would join the 4 Republic players. *** for Huttball, I've been PvPing for 3 days now. I figured I'd been lucky. Now I have no idea how this is going to help people find Warzones to play any easier. So, instead of needing 8 people, of the same faction, you will now have 16 same faction players as an option, when it comes to matching? So take your *facepalm* some where else and stop acting like an elitist because the "lingo" isn't 100% clear and you are one of the lucky ones that understands. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CJ_SAX_MAN Posted April 10, 2012 Share Posted April 10, 2012 The idea of it being a "training simulation" for same faction battles is creative, but still I always prefer fighting people of the opposite faction. They do need to implement the cross server stuff indeed for both WZs and FPs though I am not even going to try to argue about how hard that probably is to do. But i have to be honest, I miss rolling a tank on WoW and having dungeon instaQs Though I guarantee PuGs wouldn't be as polite about my computer situation and having to wait on me as my guildies are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaWaffle Posted April 10, 2012 Share Posted April 10, 2012 To me, "Same Faction PvP" just means you'd be fighting against the same faction at times when they couldn't get a full "opposite faction" group. I figured, if they had 16 people wanting to PvP, and 12 were Empire than 4 Empire players would join the 4 Republic players. *** for Huttball, I've been PvPing for 3 days now. I figured I'd been lucky. Now I have no idea how this is going to help people find Warzones to play any easier. So, instead of needing 8 people, of the same faction, you will now have 16 same faction players as an option, when it comes to matching? So take your *facepalm* some where else and stop acting like an elitist because the "lingo" isn't 100% clear and you are one of the lucky ones that understands. Defensive much? So you got it wrong, live with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guildrum Posted April 10, 2012 Share Posted April 10, 2012 To me, "Same Faction PvP" just means you'd be fighting against the same faction at times when they couldn't get a full "opposite faction" group. I figured, if they had 16 people wanting to PvP, and 12 were Empire than 4 Empire players would join the 4 Republic players. *** for Huttball, I've been PvPing for 3 days now. I figured I'd been lucky. Now I have no idea how this is going to help people find Warzones to play any easier. So, instead of needing 8 people, of the same faction, you will now have 16 same faction players as an option, when it comes to matching? So take your *facepalm* some where else and stop acting like an elitist because the "lingo" isn't 100% clear and you are one of the lucky ones that understands. I *facepalm*ed because you were talking as though you knew what you were talking about, when obviously you didn't quite. And "lucky ones" that understand is not quite accurate. Never ran into anyone who didn't know how it worked. Basically, if you are debating PvP like this, but have only been doing it for 3 days. It would be like reading a Star Wars book for 3 pages, then debating the finer points of said book, despite being only 3 pages in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaskava Posted April 10, 2012 Share Posted April 10, 2012 How can republic fight rep and emp fight emp? Its a planet full of resources and both the rep and the emp want to get their hands on those resources. Same faction battles don't make sense unless its huttball but that is more of a sport and makes sense. What are your thoughts on this? To me its kinda lorebreaking and immersion breaking. I heard a rumor that, in the military, they like to do this thing called training. It's crazy, I know, but I've heard that it helps prepare you for when you fight the actual enemy. Also, it's so Imps now have a better chance of playing something other then Huttball 75% of the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NRieh Posted April 10, 2012 Share Posted April 10, 2012 I heard a rumor that, in the military, they like to do this thing called training. It's crazy, I know, but I've heard that it helps prepare you for when you fight the actual enemy. If that's a virtual-like training - why rewarding people for killing, as no one kills anyone. If that's "real" training...then, once again, WHY rewarding people with medals for killing their own people?.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guildrum Posted April 10, 2012 Share Posted April 10, 2012 If that's a virtual-like training - why rewarding people for killing, as no one kills anyone. If that's "real" training...then, once again, WHY rewarding people with medals for killing their own people?.. To put it simply. Game mechanics. One can say that they aren't actually killing one another, but the "killed" soldier is simply knocked out when they take too much damage and are redeployed. They are given medals based on their actions in the virtual/real battlefield. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sithlordcip Posted April 10, 2012 Author Share Posted April 10, 2012 I heard a rumor that, in the military, they like to do this thing called training. It's crazy, I know, but I've heard that it helps prepare you for when you fight the actual enemy. Also, it's so Imps now have a better chance of playing something other then Huttball 75% of the time. Yes but are soldiers training on the battlefront? no they are training at their baracks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guildrum Posted April 10, 2012 Share Posted April 10, 2012 Yes but are soldiers training on the battlefront? no they are training at their baracks I have said, and you've conveniently ignored that it can be explained via "virtual realities". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sithlordcip Posted April 10, 2012 Author Share Posted April 10, 2012 "virtual realities". There is no such thing in star wars Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guildrum Posted April 10, 2012 Share Posted April 10, 2012 There is no such thing in star wars Star Wars have holocrons and holograms that can answer questions and carry conversations without recorded responses. Yet they do not have what humans nowadays are getting close to/have? Let's not forget Lucasarts gave Bioware the keys to the kingdom in a sense. If they say there are virtual realities, then there are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NRieh Posted April 10, 2012 Share Posted April 10, 2012 I have said, and you've conveniently ignored that it can be explained via "virtual realities". .....and awarded with virtual medals and comms? No, really. WHY should high command award virtual action with real stuff? (I know about mechanics, I'm just curious for non-RL reasons) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthTimmy_ Posted April 10, 2012 Share Posted April 10, 2012 How can republic fight rep and emp fight emp? Its a planet full of resources and both the rep and the emp want to get their hands on those resources. Same faction battles don't make sense unless its huttball but that is more of a sport and makes sense. What are your thoughts on this? To me its kinda lorebreaking and immersion breaking. As a true fan of the Star Wars Universe, I believe lore should be put above gameplay...however, I think you are missing the point of the PVP WZ. These warzones are like Team Slayer on Halo...does it have anything to do with the rest of the story really?No... Is this the best solution? No...but at the same time the outcome does not affect the overall story and provides shorter que times so people aren't sitting around picking boogers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guildrum Posted April 10, 2012 Share Posted April 10, 2012 .....and awarded with virtual medals and comms? No, really. WHY should high command award virtual action with real stuff? (I know about mechanics, I'm just curious for non-RL reasons) The training wasn't real, but it was treated (to an extent) like reality, and soldiers are rewarded for their abilities and accomplishments in these test scenarios. Alternatively, same reason you are given medals for killing your own allies in Huttball. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rehneu Posted April 10, 2012 Share Posted April 10, 2012 It's the Chewbacca theory! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NRieh Posted April 11, 2012 Share Posted April 11, 2012 Alternatively, same reason you are given medals for killing your own allies in Huttball. Huttball is sport. It is designed to be sport. If they made all the zones huttball-like, replaced initial "war" idea with some Hutt-entertaining things - it could fit. But Rewarding a trooper for killing fellow jedi (either in real or in VR) is just stupid. Not to mention that I can't imagine jedis taking part in virtual tranings alongside all the troopers....and smugglers are also hard to imagine there, by the way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlyxDinas Posted April 11, 2012 Share Posted April 11, 2012 Lore concerns always need to be trumped by those of mechanics and gameplay. At least in the cases where they're not able to be integrated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaedusz Posted April 11, 2012 Share Posted April 11, 2012 (edited) Is it realy going to be sith and jedi on one side vs sith and jedi on the other side? Oh man... this is realy going to mess up the game. Imagine Sidious and Yoda fighting alongside each other TO TRAIN. AHAHAHAHAHAHHA utter ********. Ok i can live with sith vs sith.It does make sense.What does not make sense is jedi vs jedi and sith and jedi vs sith and jedi. If they wanted to make same faction vs same faction why didnt they create another sport like hutball,instead of a real contested territory between the sith empire and the republic? Edited April 11, 2012 by Kaedusz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilikaa Posted April 11, 2012 Share Posted April 11, 2012 (edited) Is it realy going to be sith and jedi on one side vs sith and jedi on the other side? Oh man... this is realy going to mess up the game. Imagine Sidious and Yoda fighting alongside each other TO TRAIN. AHAHAHAHAHAHHA utter ********. Ok i can live with sith vs sith.It does make sense.What does not make sense is jedi vs jedi and sith and jedi vs sith and jedi. If they wanted to make same faction vs same faction why didnt they create another sport like hutball,instead of a real contested territory between the sith empire and the republic? Someone already explained it earlier in the thread. SAME FACTION is just that. Republic vs Republic. Empire vs Empire Jedi will NOT be fighting alongside Sith. This whole Jedi/Sith fighting together thing was started by someone who had no clue what he was reading. Hope this clarifies things for ya Edited April 11, 2012 by Kilikaa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaedusz Posted April 11, 2012 Share Posted April 11, 2012 (edited) pfew... i was afraid there for a sec.. * * * Lore reason for jedi vs jedi can be 2 republic generals arguing about what coarse of action to take in a given time with all playable classes on both side of the arguement. One general is more ''dark'',the other is more ''light''.This does not mean its going to be only dark aligned republic characters vs light aligned ,but the whole scenario works,for the same faction vs same faction to make any sense. Edited April 11, 2012 by Kaedusz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bewareofcrazies Posted April 11, 2012 Share Posted April 11, 2012 .....and awarded with virtual medals and comms? No, really. WHY should high command award virtual action with real stuff? (I know about mechanics, I'm just curious for non-RL reasons) It's the same reasons why soldiers are rewarded with praise and commendations and mentions in their files and even, sometimes, for mere war games. What you do in practice says a lot about who you will be on the field. This is military belief; that is why war games are taken so damn seriously in the military. I mean... you ever see a Fort about to go into a war game, and you'll feel like they're getting ready for real battle. A war game can make or break a soldier's career. A lot of the time it's not nearly as dramatic as that, but it can depending on how they perform. So, when my jedi goes out there against other jedi and practices taking the Void Star, and I manage to heal through a ton of damage and help win this thing... I'm going to be recognized, and given commendations for my efforts. Because I'm a Jedi Master, I can't be promoted, so I'm also given credits. However, my trooper can be promoted, so she'll receive experience points along with her commendations. It's... not rocket science, guys. It's all very logical. Even the rewards. Seriously, when I'm PvPing, I barely recognize what class everyone is, let alone what side they're on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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