PvP in Update 1.2: The Failure of Ranked WZs

[Rheeling]

I believe it was also stated that this flexibility would only last in the pre-season, which doesn't mean anything anyway as it's basically just a test for ranked warzones.

 

Once the real first season hits, they said there wouldn't be flexible queuing, because cross server will be implemented at the same time.

[BeeSiK]

rated wz's are just another thing to make people think they have skill in a game that requires very little...

[me_unknown]

and where did they said that?

[Rheeling]

and where did they said that?

 

I think that was meant for me?

 

In any case, I found it. It was actually stated in the very next paragraph which the OP conveniently left out. Just go to Developer Blog and click on the 1.2 PvP one at the top.

Edited April 3, 2012 by Rheeling

[Rogozhi]

actually yes. there is no server with enough players to have any kind of ranked pvp. if they grp servers to a cluster it might work a bit. but considering the low population they need to put all us servers in one grp, all europen in another etc.

 

this game is dead.

 

i am still around and probalby will stay another month as i stilll have some things with my current char i want to try out. but that's it.

 

Fatman?

[Tonhl]

Hm. I never have a problems getting 8v8 on my server. Yes, occasionally it starts 7v8 but it fills up quickly.

 

Anchorhead.

 

Same on Kaikan

And i speak about lvl 50 ones and lvl 1-49 ones (i play with alts too).

[portichae]

TOR's PvP was dead at the gate. The developers made the mistake of following WoW's pvp model a model anyone who PvPs competitively knows is a complete joke.

 

My two cents for what it's worth in today's economy (not much) despite TOR being a WoW-clone in every aspect of the word it's a fun game and I don't see any reason for leaving untill late or early summer.

 

Most of us who enjoy PvP are waiting for GW2 anyways.

[Rogozhi]

OP, I'm just as surprised you managed to find something to complain about in that paragraph.

 

BioWare is trying to make everyone happy, and came up with a half decent solution for a change, and you still have to find a reason to cry doom on it.

 

That mechanic is only going to happen on very low pop servers, or at times of day where there are very few people queuing up PVP. If you've ever been in that situation, you'd realize that getting a match isn't so bad at all, especially if you're being treated like you're in your own "personal" match, queued for the type of match you wanted.

 

Who cares if 6 people queued for rated and 10 queued for unrated? If not enough people are on to find a real match, in most cases those people would rather play *something* than wait around all night to start in an undermanned warzone.

 

The rated system is fine, especially for a pre-season.

 

If you don't like Warzones, don't do them. If you do like Warzones, enjoy, now you'll get your stats tracked. If people are scared of facing the people on their servers maybe they've been losing to them a lot? Not sure, but there's no reason why this system will suck just because they haven't implemented cross server queuing yet. I'll give you a hint- cross server is going to make it more competitive. If you're sick of losing to the same teams over and over, you're going to be chum for a whole bunch of new teams once all the big fish enter the bigger pond and need something to cut their teeth on.

 

Well said. I'm pumped for this system even if it won't launch perfectly polished. The mixed matches will likely only be happening during off peak hours, and on PvP servers, not likely at all. People need to see the bigger picture.

[heikaze]

TOR's PvP was dead at the gate. The developers made the mistake of following WoW's pvp model a model anyone who PvPs competitively knows is a complete joke.

 

My two cents for what it's worth in today's economy (not much) despite TOR being a WoW-clone in every aspect of the word it's a fun game and I don't see any reason for leaving untill late or early summer.

 

Most of us who enjoy PvP are waiting for GW2 anyways.

 

Pretty much this. But I liked the animation and the combat of TORs pvp. It's just the design of the map and the usual Tank / Healer / Dps combination that ruined it for me.

[portichae]

Pretty much this. But I liked the animation and the combat of TORs pvp. It's just the design of the map and the usual Tank / Healer / Dps combination that ruined it for me.

 

Oh don't get me wrong I find the PvP enjoyable and I do believe TOR should be taking meticulous notes from WoW when it comes to raiding mechanics. But that's it.

 

TOR is using a skill tree for heavens sake. A system more conducive to a single player game than competitive PvP system, it took WoW 7 years to realize this.

 

Que sera, sera...

[Hatori_Hanzo]

You do know that 1,2 will be pre-season and that they are adding cross server for WZa with season 1. All rankings will reset with season 1.

 

Think of pre season as a time for everyone to gear up, so season 1 will be about teamplay more than who got the gear first.

 

Gearing up will be slower as you will earn fewer commodations AND credits with each warzone. Anyone now why in the world they lowered the credits received with each warzone match???

[Daxun]

 

I also suspect, given, again, you're beefing about a system you haven't actively played, that you're the kind of player that would be SCREAMING on the forums about HUGE queue times if this kind of system weren't in place.

 

GG.

 

Er there's only 1 faction that is going to benefit from this "mixed" crapola. Surprise surprise! Another messed up mechanic to make it viable to keep the huge faction imbalance.

 

Here was another chance for them to urge people not to play on the grossly overpopulated side but they failed again. Instead they'll just make it easier for that side to rank up in pvp... brilliant...

[LancelotOC]

The issue I have with them lowering the credit rewards and increasing the costs of gear with the new patch is I imagine they based it off how much everyone currently plays. Well that is a bad trend to follow because a big reason people warzone so much is because there is no other type of PVP to do.

[Zataos]

If they mix 8 man premades against solo pug players, then no that will not be fair, but rated and non-rated could be mixed and balanced as long as they have a proper matchmaker so that there are equal numbers on both sides.

 

Remember all these problems will go away when "season one" starts and cross server queuing begins, the sooner the better.

[Tremont]

i think people already gave up on the pvp in this game

 

90 percent of warzones i join say there gonna close due to not enough players joining

 

This is a fact. WZ population on my server has dropped dramatically. During weekend prime time (last weekend) que times were long (10-15 minutes) and the groups weren't even full. That was just pre-50 WZ's.

 

Level 50 WZ's the same 8 players always faced the same 4 sages and 2 troopers, who by the way had the most healing and damage and we lost almost every game.

 

Either PvP is dead in SWTOR (I think it is) or everyone was playing alts or doing operations. PvP is a joke and with broken resolve and imbalance its no fun.

 

But then again this game was never meant to have a focus on PvP.

[Zataos]

Gearing up will be slower as you will earn fewer commodations AND credits with each warzone. Anyone now why in the world they lowered the credits received with each warzone match???

 

My guess would be to force players into PVE endgame, as only a low percentage participates now, and my guess is that they believe that PVEers are easier to keep subbed with simply adding new content (carrot) every month or so than those that mainly PVP.

[Quinlynn]

This x 1000! I doubt there are even 8 Pubs on my server to even queue with for ranked. Most normal games we're forced to play 5v8, 6v8, or 7v8.

 

This has been my experience as well of late.

 

Unless you are online at optimal prime times, you start WZs out numbered and are lucky if they don't finish that way. Due to faction imbalance on my server, this give the Imps a significant advantage.

 

Once it is past prime time, que takes a long to pop, if at all.

[Manski]

The window of opportunity for this game is closing fast. Cross server queues / server merge needs to happen relatively soon after 1.2 or as stated by many, the fix will be dropped on an empty room as everyone will have left. I have been playing WAY more casually then I'm used to because there isn't much left to hold my interest at this point and i really don't feel like starting a new game, i might even cancel for a month just to wait it out (which i know a TON of people did). Problem with that is, once your away its easier to stay away or go elsewhere...

[Quinlynn]

The window of opportunity for this game is closing fast. Cross server queues / server merge needs to happen relatively soon after 1.2 or as stated by many, the fix will be dropped on an empty room as everyone will have left. I have been playing WAY more casually then I'm used to because there isn't much left to hold my interest at this point and i really don't feel like starting a new game, i might even cancel for a month just to wait it out (which i know a TON of people did). Problem with that is, once your away its easier to stay away or go elsewhere...

 

This is our experience as well. Many have gotten tired of the faction imbalance and lack of lvl 50 content outside of PVE.

 

PVE, while cool, takes too long and costs too many credits.

 

Open world PVP has been fun when it happends, once in a blue moon, if ever.

 

At least 1/2 dozen guildies have fallen by the wayside due to these systemic issues.

[abreen]

this pre season is crap it's not going to bring more people to my server so what's the point Like I keep saying it's stupid that they made ranked a priority over cross server

[Manski]

I've played 10 or more MMO's over 10 years now or so. When a game gives you that feeling like you can't wait to log on no matter where you are or what your doing, thats when i know a game is the one at the moment. This game had that for the first 2-3 months, the last month or two i rarely think about it when I'm not playing and i only play when i have absolutely nothing else to fill my time.

[lollermittens]

OP, I'm just as surprised you managed to find something to complain about in that paragraph.

 

BioWare is trying to make everyone happy, and came up with a half decent solution for a change, and you still have to find a reason to cry doom on it.

 

There is a difference between crying doom and gloom and expressing my indignation towards a much-hyped patch that consistently fails to deliver -- I have been watching the PTS forums (and videos) very closely; things are not looking great.

 

That mechanic is only going to happen on very low pop servers, or at times of day where there are very few people queuing up PVP. If you've ever been in that situation, you'd realize that getting a match isn't so bad at all, especially if you're being treated like you're in your own "personal" match, queued for the type of match you wanted.

 

No, this situation is going to happen on a majority of servers where Very Heavy = Heavy, Heavy = Medium, Standard = Low, and Light = Very Low. By consistently raising server caps and mismanaging server population by creating too many servers and not merging them fast enough, BW basically tried to catch a falling knife and ended up chopping both their hands and feet.

 

Now they've created a system that is designed to mitigate the problem of subscription loss by forcing players who are queuing for non-Rated WZs to queue with those for Rated WZs. This will create a stagnant PvP environment as we're seeing now with little hopes of finding balanced WZ matches.

 

Your belief that this pooling will be the exception to the rule is where you're mistaken. This system is obviously designed to fill the gap left by the exclusion of a cross-server PvP queue which is in development, will not come out until 1.3 (the devs are hoping to fasten the major patching process and have it released 2 months after 1.2 comes out, which is highly unreliable given their prior patching history), along with server merges. By this time, the state of the game will be so different, the saying "too little, too late" might actually resonate to be true.

 

Who cares if 6 people queued for rated and 10 queued for unrated? If not enough people are on to find a real match, in most cases those people would rather play *something* than wait around all night to start in an undermanned warzone.

 

And this goes back to my point that I've addressed in my OP. If you had bothered to read the entirety of my indignitation with the new Ranked WZ system, this is where the system's biggest issue lies: there will be no need to queue for non-ranked WZs since you will ultimately be pooled into a Ranked WZ game. Thus the avenue which was supposed to give more "hardcore" PvP'ers a chance to PvP with folks who'd have the same determination and end-goals is completely gone out of the window. We're back to point 0; we're back to the system we're currently subjected to.

 

The rated system is fine, especially for a pre-season.

 

Please, let's no resort to baseless statements. Go take a look at the PTS forums. The BW devs are begging for reliable Rated WZ data and they cannot get any. They still don't have a reliable system to transfer your live character to the PTS system hence why it's impossible to gather reliable data. Why do you think it's being showcased at PAX East for 3 days? To gather some much needed production-related Ranked WZ/non-Ranked WZ data.

 

If you don't like Warzones, don't do them. If you do like Warzones, enjoy, now you'll get your stats tracked. If people are scared of facing the people on their servers maybe they've been losing to them a lot? Not sure, but there's no reason why this system will suck just because they haven't implemented cross server queuing yet. I'll give you a hint- cross server is going to make it more competitive. If you're sick of losing to the same teams over and over, you're going to be chum for a whole bunch of new teams once all the big fish enter the bigger pond and need something to cut their teeth on.

 

I'm Valor Rank 63 on my Marauder and 61 on my Assassin. I believe I can fairly claim that I've done my fair share of WZs. I've enjoyed them but I've hated them as well (KBs anyone?). Rated WZs was supposed to be an alternative to the current system and even knowing this is pre-season, there's just no excuse to render a new system into the old one.

[xxIncubixx]

so what u want exactly? stay in queue for hours before u get a pop? seriously u complain about everything in these forums no wonder why nobody cares ~~

[RenzoMalice]

pvp is a joke in this game....most of this game is a joke. if it wasn't for the people i play with i wouldn't even bother paying for a sub anymore

[Khoraji]

Call your "Pre-Season" what it truly is: a stress test of your Rated WZ to check that the mathematical equations utilized to calculate player rankings will function correctly before the implementation of the cross-server Ranked WZs.

 

That would take too long to say every time... pre-season works for most people.