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I Really Enjoy Juggernaut

rweiowjerwei

By rweiowjerwei
in Guardian / Juggernaut

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rweiowjerwei

rweiowjerwei

Posted
Posted (edited)

To hell with everyone rerolling based on what is considered the 'best' class at certain times. I play some of the more underdog setups on this game (my sig) and have a blast in PVP. I feel no less competitive than if I were to have been a different class/spec, and I see no reason why other people would...

 

Juggernaut does competitive damage (I regularly beat Mara's on the scoreboard - and that's even those who are 40+)*, tanks better, has more utilities such as taunts and AoE slows, force push, can run the ball better, survive against greater odds, etc ...

 

Maybe I'm missing something, but I dont see why everyone thinks DPS Jugg is so inferior.

 

*When I say that - I - beat them, that does not imply that a few players represent the skill level and capabilities of marauders. I'm sure that a good marauder could easily beat me on the charts for damage, but I am simply stating my experiences pre 50. I needed to write this so that people dont start claiming I am ignorant.

Edited by rweiowjerwei
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Bastus

Bastus

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Posted

People call Jug DPS inferior because we have the least potent DPS of all the melee classes. I have a Marauder and and Jug and I've compared the two and I can honestly say, Marauders are more of a killing machine, however their talents also give them an advantage. Jug talents aren't just about damage, there's a lot of other crap that is situational (and rage boosters) while marauder talents are more focused.

 

For instance, Marauders in the middle tree (the ataru form one) can get a talent that roots enemies while they use ravage. This gives them a HUGE advantage over Jugs for the simple fact that they can actually fully complete a ravage (unless pushed), and immediately attack after, while Jugs have to chase peoples azzes around and whack them. Honestly I think it was extremely stupid of BW not to give this talent to Jugs as well. Mara's can vanish when things get too hot, and they already crank out the damage, I personally think Jugs could have used it more.

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Elyx

Elyx

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Posted (edited)

First off, Jugg's are awesome :) My favorite class!

 

Secondly, score boards are a horrible way to determine viability. there are soo many variables in a PvP game that a scoreboard really only shows you who was lucky that day.

 

lastly, there is no current data showing that ANYONE does more damage then ANYONE else. if you were to look at 1.2 changes solely to determine who was the most OP, it would be Sorc/Sage by a longshot (hybrid build only). based solely on 1.2 changes, Mara's almost looked like an under performer. juggs' got a mild buff. mara's got more of a buff. so in spite of "Player perception", Bio thought that Jugg's were in a decent spot for DPS, but mara's needed some help. in some ways (some players argue about some of the Mara buffs for PvP).

 

I've played MMO's long enough (10yrs or so) to know NOT to trust player perception. But Dev's also can miss things (and the current testing environment isn't conductive to empirical testing atm, so it doesn't help). Only thing we can do is wait till combat logs come out, and people start posting data.

 

Until then, It's all anecdotal information. And the Mara/Jugg class are both tactically challenging enough to play that you HAVE to consider player skill into the mix. given that, the actual tests i see people doing show Mara's and Juggs very close. close enough that it doesn't matter which one you prefer.

 

The times I see people state that Mara's do more DPS are either 1: with no real data or tests to prove it, or 2: they post PvP scoreboards (read my second comment above). I don't think that Jugs are better, but I KNOW that most people go purely off of personally perception, which after 10 yrs in the industry has proven itself to me to be very INCORRECT.

Edited by Elyx
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LordXalas

LordXalas

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People call Jug DPS inferior because we have the least potent DPS of all the melee classes. I have a Marauder and and Jug and I've compared the two and I can honestly say, Marauders are more of a killing machine, however their talents also give them an advantage. Jug talents aren't just about damage, there's a lot of other crap that is situational (and rage boosters) while marauder talents are more focused.

 

For instance, Marauders in the middle tree (the ataru form one) can get a talent that roots enemies while they use ravage. This gives them a HUGE advantage over Jugs for the simple fact that they can actually fully complete a ravage (unless pushed), and immediately attack after, while Jugs have to chase peoples azzes around and whack them. Honestly I think it was extremely stupid of BW not to give this talent to Jugs as well. Mara's can vanish when things get too hot, and they already crank out the damage, I personally think Jugs could have used it more.

 

Juggs can spec force choke to use without channeling. Kinda stupid of BW to not give this to maraudars...oh wait no it isnt because they are two different classes. Play for what you have. i hardly ever use ravage on my annilation spec maraudar which is the only TRUE dps spec atm...untill 1.2

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WarSiren

WarSiren

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Posted
People call Jug DPS inferior because we have the least potent DPS of all the melee classes. I have a Marauder and and Jug and I've compared the two and I can honestly say, Marauders are more of a killing machine, however their talents also give them an advantage. Jug talents aren't just about damage, there's a lot of other crap that is situational (and rage boosters) while marauder talents are more focused.

 

For instance, Marauders in the middle tree (the ataru form one) can get a talent that roots enemies while they use ravage. This gives them a HUGE advantage over Jugs for the simple fact that they can actually fully complete a ravage (unless pushed), and immediately attack after, while Jugs have to chase peoples azzes around and whack them. Honestly I think it was extremely stupid of BW not to give this talent to Jugs as well. Mara's can vanish when things get too hot, and they already crank out the damage, I personally think Jugs could have used it more.

 

Eh I get more KBs and deal more damage per Warzone than any Mara on my Veng Jugg the only people that beat me are Good Rage Juggs, and they are kinda rare.

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Scinald

Scinald

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Posted

I have a Battlemaster Juggernaut and a brand new, fresh, only has a couple of pieces of vindicator armor Sentinel (read Marauder) and here is the deal.

 

Damage: My Sentinel is going to do about 10-15% more damage than my Jugg when geared from what I can tell.

 

KBs: Any Sent/Mara not getting near top KBs is b/c they aren't specced into their dot line (which is currently their best). And if they are specced into another line, they should be getting as much as any Jugg.

 

Medals: Jugg wins hands down. Really easy to pick up all the damage medals a Mara/Sent gets and some protection ones as well.

 

Survivability: A Watchman sentinel is far more survivable than a Vengeance or Rage Jugg. They just have more inherent, on demand abilities (20% damage reduction for up to 30s, Saber Ward, Force Cammo, Pacify, 99% damage reduction for 5 seconds) that let them stay in combat under extreme pressure. An immortal Jugg can probably take more, but then again he can't dish out near the same level of damage.

 

Utility: Kind of a toss up. Guard is nice (but don't use it DPS) and so is the AOE damage reduction, BUT Watchman Sentinels can heal the entire team for not-insignificant amouts, give the entire team speed and defense bonuses as well. Both have force choke and both have AOE stun.

 

Anyway, the Jugg is my first love and the story was freaking awesome (although the JK story is pretty good too), but there is no way a DPS Jugg is better than a DPS Mara with the same level of competence of the operator. The upcoming 1.2 patch isn't going to do anything change that relationship either.

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Rumplea

Rumplea

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I have a Battlemaster Juggernaut and a brand new, fresh, only has a couple of pieces of vindicator armor Sentinel (read Marauder) and here is the deal.

 

Damage: My Sentinel is going to do about 10-15% more damage than my Jugg when geared from what I can tell.

 

KBs: Any Sent/Mara not getting near top KBs is b/c they aren't specced into their dot line (which is currently their best). And if they are specced into another line, they should be getting as much as any Jugg.

 

Medals: Jugg wins hands down. Really easy to pick up all the damage medals a Mara/Sent gets and some protection ones as well.

 

Survivability: A Watchman sentinel is far more survivable than a Vengeance or Rage Jugg. They just have more inherent, on demand abilities (20% damage reduction for up to 30s, Saber Ward, Force Cammo, Pacify, 99% damage reduction for 5 seconds) that let them stay in combat under extreme pressure. An immortal Jugg can probably take more, but then again he can't dish out near the same level of damage.

 

Utility: Kind of a toss up. Guard is nice (but don't use it DPS) and so is the AOE damage reduction, BUT Watchman Sentinels can heal the entire team for not-insignificant amouts, give the entire team speed and defense bonuses as well. Both have force choke and both have AOE stun.

 

Anyway, the Jugg is my first love and the story was freaking awesome (although the JK story is pretty good too), but there is no way a DPS Jugg is better than a DPS Mara with the same level of competence of the operator. The upcoming 1.2 patch isn't going to do anything change that relationship either.

 

QFT 5chars

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