Azzras Posted March 28, 2012 Share Posted March 28, 2012 And every other MMO that can/does measure internationally in the far east would do/is doing the same thing! So the numbers are all correct and relative to industry reporting. i.e. Blizzard dominance. Also, the average HHI in China, in 2010 at first glance appears to be about $10,000US. In the US, the average HHI was about $84,000US. So their salaries are about 8 times less than ours, and their game payments are about 6 times less than hours. Seems to all line up. And yes, I play WoW and have had an active subscription since day 1 on November 23, 2004. I think your US data is off...I could be wrong but: http://www.census.gov/hhes/www/income/data/statemedian/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lethality Posted March 28, 2012 Share Posted March 28, 2012 In the old days, billions of people thought the Earth was flat and the Sun/galaxy revolved around us. How did that turn out for them? I just want to be clear, are you here to defend TOR or bash WoW? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drewser Posted March 28, 2012 Share Posted March 28, 2012 (edited) But that is completely subjective. "Better" isn't something you can quantify. And it also doesn't automatically mean that the business or services with fewer customers is "better" - as a matter of fact as is often the case, it is not. For WoW, I think the consumers got it right this time. The best product does indeed have the most customers. Few would debate that WoW is mechanically superior in gameplay, systems and otherwise... No one is saying that "all businesses with fewer customers are better". We are just pointing out the fallacy that large numbers/popularity equals the best. We know your subjective opinion is that WoW is the best. Edited March 28, 2012 by Drewser Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azzras Posted March 28, 2012 Share Posted March 28, 2012 I just want to be clear, are you here to defend TOR or bash WoW? This is the SWTOR Vs WoW thread isn't it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vankris Posted March 28, 2012 Share Posted March 28, 2012 The old days u speak of, well there werent billions of people. Try a new analogy. I may check back later to see how you go with that. a new analogy, let me think, ah yes... got one It is istimated that McDonalds serve about 50,000,000 costumer a day world wide. Either , that is the best restaurant in the world. or blizzard is the "Fast-Food" of the MMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lethality Posted March 28, 2012 Share Posted March 28, 2012 I think your US data is off...I could be wrong but: http://www.census.gov/hhes/www/income/data/statemedian/ Median != Average Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harleyz Posted March 28, 2012 Share Posted March 28, 2012 Comparing the two is like saying my honda rocks because it has 4 doors. That 7 year old s500 benz sucks because it only has 2. I taught u analogy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lethality Posted March 28, 2012 Share Posted March 28, 2012 a new analogy, let me think, ah yes... got one It is istimated that McDonalds serve about 50,000,000 costumer a day world wide. Either , that is the best restaurant in the world. or blizzard is the "Fast-Food" of the MMO. Oh, I'm not saying that just because the masses flock to something it's the best... hell, Windows is living proof that that theory is a joke. But I do think it is the case sometimes, and consumers got it right with WoW. The most are playing the best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shingara Posted March 28, 2012 Share Posted March 28, 2012 Oh, I'm not saying that just because the masses flock to something it's the best... hell, Windows is living proof that that theory is a joke. But I do think it is the case sometimes, and consumers got it right with WoW. The most are playing the best. Millions of people love bieber so are you saying he is the best ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harleyz Posted March 28, 2012 Share Posted March 28, 2012 a new analogy, let me think, ah yes... got one It is istimated that McDonalds serve about 50,000,000 costumer a day world wide. Either , that is the best restaurant in the world. or blizzard is the "Fast-Food" of the MMO. No. ...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azzras Posted March 28, 2012 Share Posted March 28, 2012 Median != Average And your data was wrong according to the US census, unless I misinterpreted something...it's happened once or twice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Offended Posted March 28, 2012 Share Posted March 28, 2012 Lets talk statistics WoW around 1 mil subs in US and 1 mil subs in Europe around 7 mil subs in china and korea. But... there is a but..... KOREA and CHINA subs aren't pay per month They are pay by hour... this means that an account with 20min in it, but inactive for a year is considered active and looks good for statistics Its a marketing trick. This is an old announcement from 2008, they haven't had an update like this in some time. http://www.gamasutra.com/php-bin/news_index.php?story=17062 Blizzard Entertainment has announced that World of Warcraft has recently passed 10 million subscribers worldwide since its launch on November 23, 2004. According to Blizzard, WoW now hosts more than 2 million subscribers in Europe, more than 2.5 million in North America, and approximately 5.5 million in Asia. So right there, your numbers are already incorrect. Even by some logical extrapolation methods, your number would still be wrong. the pay by hour thing, well they addressed that also. Blizzard also took its customary step of explicitly defining who it counted as subscribers, clarifying that the 10 million number refers to those who have paid a subscription fee or have an active prepaid card to play World of Warcraft, as well as those who have purchased the game and are within their free month of access. The count does not, however, include free promotional subscriptions, expired or canceled subscriptions or prepaid cards. Blizzard also counted Internet Game Room players who have accessed the game over the last thirty days. The subscribers of its licensees were also counted under the same rules. So no, if you buy a card and activate it and don't play again for 30 days, then you're not counted as a subscriber. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shingara Posted March 28, 2012 Share Posted March 28, 2012 (edited) So no, if you buy a card and activate it and don't play again for 30 days, then you're not counted as a subscriber. Different cards, our cards in the western market run out after 30 or 60 days, show me where that pre paid time cards that buy minuite slots actualy expire or that people who only play 2 hours a day or even 2 hours a month on these cards arnt counted ? Blizzard has, at one time, issued a statement saying that the people that multibox do not add any meaningful results to the subscription numbers (meaning they are rounded off). And when was this time exactly and where are the figures of how many accounts are held by one person as multi accounts. Edited March 28, 2012 by Shingara Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kinrain Posted March 28, 2012 Share Posted March 28, 2012 (edited) But that is completely subjective. "Better" isn't something you can quantify. And it also doesn't automatically mean that the business or services with fewer customers is "better" - as a matter of fact as is often the case, it is not. For WoW, I think the consumers got it right this time. The best product does indeed have the most customers. Few would debate that WoW is mechanically superior in gameplay, systems and otherwise... As a poster above said, being smaller doesn't necessarily mean worse either, assuming the largest is the best is a false premise. And I guess I must be one of the few then, I do, and will, debate that WoW is certainly NOT superior in gameplay, systems or anything else. Don't get me wrong I admire WoW for what it did but nor for what it has become. A travesty. WoW's gameplay is based on a endless grind. Grind to max level, grind instances or raids to get the best gear, when you've done that Blizz will raise the level cap, make all your hard earned gear obsolete and you go back to grinding. Its a pointless treadmill that never ends. The only thing that changes is the number of hit points everyone has (including bosses) and the difficulty is based almost exclusively on gear checks rather than skill and co-ordination checks. At some point you will realise that battering the latest mobile loot pinata until your goodies fall out is ultimately pointless and your investment in the game and your 'effort' to get to the temporary top is a waste of your time. With SWTOR at least the grind is either removed or disguised and the journey is as much fun as the destination. I could not bear the thought of grinding another WoW character for 85 levels but in TOR I actually enjoyed the process so much I can't wait to do it on all the classes. Edited March 28, 2012 by Kinrain Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DigitalPrime Posted March 28, 2012 Share Posted March 28, 2012 This is an old announcement from 2008, they haven't had an update like this in some time. http://www.gamasutra.com/php-bin/news_index.php?story=17062 So right there, your numbers are already incorrect. Even by some logical extrapolation methods, your number would still be wrong. the pay by hour thing, well they addressed that also. So no, if you buy a card and activate it and don't play again for 30 days, then you're not counted as a subscriber. And I bet you believe anything governments say ey. Remember the term marketting spin. Dont take everything you read from any company making money as correct. Bottom line Bliz covered themselves, yeh it could be true. but knowing Bobby Koticks ways. I doubt it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lethality Posted March 28, 2012 Share Posted March 28, 2012 Millions of people love bieber so are you saying he is the best ? To the people that like him? Absolutely. It's un-quantifiable. Which is why I said it doesn't happen every time. But it happened in the case of WoW. The best product got the most customers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shingara Posted March 28, 2012 Share Posted March 28, 2012 (edited) To the people that like him? Absolutely. It's un-quantifiable. Which is why I said it doesn't happen every time. But it happened in the case of WoW. The best product got the most customers. but thats the thing, you cant quantify one and not the other. Either something that has a big following is great or it just means that it has alot of followers. Cults have alot of followers but it in now states that they are great, it just means that alot of people follow it. The only thing it does mean is that the people that follow it feel it is great via there opnion. Edited March 28, 2012 by Shingara Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harleyz Posted March 28, 2012 Share Posted March 28, 2012 It means it was great. Haters are the people that hate sucess. Lil cowards hating on the winners. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DigitalPrime Posted March 28, 2012 Share Posted March 28, 2012 To the people that like him? Absolutely. It's un-quantifiable. Which is why I said it doesn't happen every time. But it happened in the case of WoW. The best product got the most customers. Ive bolded the part in which you should of stated "Your opinion" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harleyz Posted March 28, 2012 Share Posted March 28, 2012 Ive bolded the part in which you should of stated "Your opinion" Tbh its fact, name another mmo that has everhad more active subs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lethality Posted March 28, 2012 Share Posted March 28, 2012 With SWTOR at least the grind is either removed or disguised and the journey is as much fun as the destination. I could not bear the thought of grinding another WoW character for 85 levels but in TOR I actually enjoyed the process so much I can't wait to do it on all the classes. And which goes to show there are VERY different players out there. I couldn't possibly ever imagining leveling another toon (in either game.) I prefer to level and advance on character, always (the heart of what an RPG is.) There was story and immersion in WoW as much or more so than TOR, except TOR has digital actors read the dialog to you... that certainly does not improve my gameplay, as a matter of fact it breaks immersion because it's not "me" talking and leaves nothing to my imagination. I'd much rather read the highlights of my goals and then fill in the blanks through adventure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustTed Posted March 28, 2012 Share Posted March 28, 2012 Which is why I said it doesn't happen every time. But it happened in the case of WoW. The best product got the most customers. You do understand that your assessment of "best product" is an opinion, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lethality Posted March 28, 2012 Share Posted March 28, 2012 You do understand that your assessment of "best product" is an opinion, right? There are objective measurements you can use: - sloppy and loose combat vs. tight and responsive - large areas of silence vs. ambient music that persists throughout - lack of social and multiplayer systems and tools vs. the exact opposite of that - etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drewser Posted March 28, 2012 Share Posted March 28, 2012 It means it was great. Haters are the people that hate sucess. Lil cowards hating on the winners. McDonald's is a great restaurant using your logic. American Idol - great Bieber - great etc... BTW, just because something is a financial success doesn't mean it is a great product. Pet Rock - great marketing gimmick - stupid/useless end product. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harleyz Posted March 28, 2012 Share Posted March 28, 2012 You can also use - decline in servers population after 4 months. That is all really. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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