PvP Sorc Healing & 1.2 (Bioware pls let us discuss)

[_Minmaxer_]

People here think I am good, but they are either bad or my friends. http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=424629 It will be nice when either x-server queues or rated WZ's come out so that some of us could play against each other. Until then, just consider me a baddie that posts on the forums for e-peen.

 

On topic:

If you find you are getting your heals interrupted a lot you are either casting at the wrong time,or from the wrong spot. That is why Innervate is our most important heal, if its interrupted at 75%, you still get 75% of its value. Dark Infusion should only be used when no one is attacking you, or you have created a big enough gap that you can heal before they reach you again. Dark Heal is still pretty useless, but if the melee with a charge that you just sprinted from is about to come around the corner, might as well get that off instead of the Dark Infusion that will get interrupted.

 

This might also be counter-intuitive to some, but a healers job is to help his team win the WZ, NOT keep everyone alive, sometimes the correct play is to let people die. Simplest scenario, you here a call for help and arrive to find: Your friend is at 10% and stunned with his CC break on CD and being attacked, someone else is capping the node and almost done. You let your friend die, protect the node, and defend as long as you can.

 

tldr; There is a lot more to healing in WZ's than making people's health bars go up.

[stafaureus]

People here think I am good, but they are either bad or my friends. http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=424629 It will be nice when either x-server queues or rated WZ's come out so that some of us could play against each other. Until then, just consider me a baddie that posts on the forums for e-peen.

 

Lmao, ok guy, post a link to a thread that has some person spoutingoff names from one or two servers? Apparently, you didn't even understand the point of this thread. All I can say, when the time comes for people to see ratings I hope you don't embarass urself. Link me your gladiator toon in WoW and I'll give you props. At least the OP had the balls to tell us his. In any case, guessing from your sig, WoW (the only game that has meaningful rankings) is the one you didn't play lmao yeah right. Or, you played it but never got gladaitor (most likely). Give us the name of your WoW toon if you played it; If you can prove it was you I will give you props. Same with OP if you didn't quit already. Otherwise, keep linking forum posts on who is popular as your evidence looolo. There will prolly be a ton of people who get mad at my post because they never got gladiator in wow and dont want to be reminded in SWTOR because they can have a "fresh start" here hahah. Nothing to see here...more people full of doody most likely.

[Sock_Bramson]

Hah, apparently YOU don't get the point of this thread, staf. Last I checked, it was to discuss sorc pvp healing: specs, strategies, etc. It is not a thread about WoW arena ratings. You don't have to have played WoW arenas, or WoW in general, to be good at an MMO. There have been many MMOs before and after WoW, WoW just happens to be widely played. But what do I know? I never did arenas back in the day, mainly pved, leveled alts, or did the occassional BG.

 

I can't help but notice that you didn't offer up any WoW arena rankings of your own, so it would seem neither of us are qualified to post here.

 

I have no idea if Minmaxer is any good, since I'm not on his server. However, his posts are well thought out and offer constructive feedback, so my guess is he's at least fairly competent. If you want to post something that actually adds to the discussion at hand, please do. If you're just in it for a little of the ol' "ad hominem", go stroke your epeen elsewhere. Sigh... forum trolls really are a sad breed.

 

Back to the topic at hand: I'd be interested to hear what kinds of specs people are enjoying the most. I'm loving 21/20/0, although I've had a lot of fun with other variations of corruption/lit. What are peoples' thoughts on talenting affliction for the slow or snagging the extra crit/ dmg reduction in lieu of the shield burst? I've heard some people express concerns about managing the enemy's resolve with the bubble mez, but it has definitely helped me get away from melee classes, especially stealthers.

 

edit: also, thoughts on 20 pt lightning to grab CL + whatever the talent is called that gives you free CLs vs. more points into Corruption?

-Hedley Melange, Dreshdae Cantina-

Edited April 24, 2012 by Sock_Bramson

[Heimur]

Back to the topic at hand: I'd be interested to hear what kinds of specs people are enjoying the most. I'm loving 21/20/0, although I've had a lot of fun with other variations of corruption/lit. What are peoples' thoughts on talenting affliction for the slow or snagging the extra crit/ dmg reduction in lieu of the shield burst? I've heard some people express concerns about managing the enemy's resolve with the bubble mez, but it has definitely helped me get away from melee classes, especially stealthers.

 

edit: also, thoughts on 20 pt lightning to grab CL + whatever the talent is called that gives you free CLs vs. more points into Corruption?

-Hedley Melange, Dreshdae Cantina-

I have thoroughly enjoyed full madness and the corruption-lightning hybrid.

 

When it comes to the corruption-lightning hybrid I am not a big fan of AFL slow, because if you apply AFL to someone it will break both Backlash and the Overload root. On that note, I am also a big fan of Backlash because it buys you just enough time to get off a heal every now and then, not to mention how immensely useful it is when you or your ally get trained by something like three warriors. I used to be very concerned about the resolve it grants as well, but I find that it's a small price to pay.

 

The CL+Lightning Storm instead of putting the excess point in either +Willpower or Life Surge is something I have considered too. Mainly because I end up using Force Storm every now and then anyway, either to stop caps or to assist when the dps are not focus firing. It seems logical to me that getting an instant CL off in those situation could be more useful than the very marginal gain one talent point spent somewhere else is. I think I will try it, and if I find the CL pointless I may switch back.

[Rotoroot]

You again? Selling more of your "hybrid is a perfectly legitimate pigeonhole for BW to force us into" nonsense? Look, I don't give a crap that a gimpy hybrid spec has become slightly more viable than a full healing spec. IT IS BAD DESIGN. PERIOD. You can disagree with that all you want, but that's my position whether you like it or not.

 

It has nothing to do with "oh, well, at least we have a work-around by going hybrid." Rather, it has everything to do with BW having a horrible design philosophy and ZERO understanding of what people consider to be fun and enjoyable and fair. There is absolutely NO justifiable reason to force us out of a full healing spec in order to be viable in PvP and have survivability. NONE. My healing should NOT have to be gimped in order to continue to play my class competetively and I should not be punished severely for taking my 31 point healing talent if that is the style and role I wish to play.

 

Now run along...nobody wants to read you patting yourself on the back and pretending you have it all figured out and know how to play better than everyone who disagrees with you. You're just carrying BW's water and it's people like you who will provide BW with the justification for not fixing the problems they've created.

 

Don't think it can be said much better than that. Sorc healing is awful now.

[_Minmaxer_]

I never played WoW, sorry, or I'm too ashamed to name my character, you decide. Of course the post I referenced means nothing, am I not allowed to troll the trolls?

 

On Topic:I used affliction snare for a while, it kind of gave me a reason to cast a spell I really didn't want to be using. It was useful sometimes, but I don't miss it. I think the WP bonus talent is better than the Force Storm/CL talents. Though with the new WZ I find myself using Force Storm more than previously. Curious how often you ended up casting instant CL's in a match. I think Backlash is OK if you don't spam your bubble on everyone and use it with intent. What I really hate is seeing any army of white-barred enemies because people spam their CC for no reason.

[Hamatula]

amazing people still discuss this..

 

Sorc healing is gimp... pvp healing is gimp, but Sorc takes the cake...

 

Sorc are the worst healers in the game... its kinda funny and should indicate just how in touch bw is with swtor pvp.

[Sock_Bramson]

Sigh, yet another super constructive post. Do you even play a sorc healer, Ham? Yes, we were nerfed, a bit overboard imo, but we did need toning down. Yes, healing in general was nerfed through the changes to expertise. Does this make healers, especially sorc healers, useless? Not by a long shot. In basically every game, no matter how quick or prolonged, my healing is on par - and usually a bit higher than - the top dps. Try playing a game without a healer vs a team with even one competent one and you'll pray for a "gimp" to show up.

 

Minmaxer: I really haven't noticed/ taken the time to figure out, but do shields I put on other people gain the same blind-on-break? The wording on the talent led me to believe it was only for my shields. If they all blind, though, I may have to consider respecing, dropping said talent along with CL and Lit. Storm for 6% more WP, 1% crit, and 1% dmg reduction. As it stands now, I'm not throwing out that many CLs, but the ability to do so is kinda nice.

 

-Hedley Melange, Dreshdae Cantina-

Edited April 24, 2012 by Sock_Bramson

[_Minmaxer_]

Sigh, yet another super constructive post. Do you even play a sorc healer, Ham? Yes, we were nerfed, a bit overboard imo, but we did need toning down. Yes, healing in general was nerfed through the changes to expertise. Does this make healers, especially sorc healers, useless? Not by a long shot. In basically every game, no matter how quick or prolonged, my healing is on par - and usually a bit higher than - the top dps. Try playing a game without a healer vs a team with even one competent one and you'll pray for a "gimp" to show up.

 

Minmaxer: I really haven't noticed/ taken the time to figure out, but do shields I put on other people gain the same blind-on-break? The wording on the talent led me to believe it was only for my shields. If they all blind, though, I may have to consider respecing, dropping said talent along with CL and Lit. Storm for 6% more WP, 1% crit, and 1% dmg reduction. As it stands now, I'm not throwing out that many CLs, but the ability to do so is kinda nice.

 

-Hedley Melange, Dreshdae Cantina-

 

TBH, I cannot say for %100 certainty that they do. I played with the skill pre 1.1 very briefly and was not impressed with it in the slightest so I moved on. I always assumed that it did, as the 2pc healer bonus reduces the lockout duration of static barrier for others as well. I'm sure someone who still actively plays the spec can confirm.

[DarthRaw]

Befor The patch i loved heals and i was full heals spec. The burst DI was awesome and deff not OP compared to the amount of damage a good dps cann get out. But BW had to screw it up with the cast time increse and how consumption takes health

[stafaureus]

Hah, apparently YOU don't get the point of this thread, staf. Last I checked, it was to discuss sorc pvp healing: specs, strategies, etc. It is not a thread about WoW arena ratings. You don't have to have played WoW arenas, or WoW in general, to be good at an MMO. There have been many MMOs before and after WoW, WoW just happens to be widely played. But what do I know? I never did arenas back in the day, mainly pved, leveled alts, or did the occassional BG.

 

I can't help but notice that you didn't offer up any WoW arena rankings of your own, so it would seem neither of us are qualified to post here.

 

I have no idea if Minmaxer is any good, since I'm not on his server. However, his posts are well thought out and offer constructive feedback, so my guess is he's at least fairly competent. If you want to post something that actually adds to the discussion at hand, please do. If you're just in it for a little of the ol' "ad hominem", go stroke your epeen elsewhere. Sigh... forum trolls really are a sad breed.

 

Back to the topic at hand: I'd be interested to hear what kinds of specs people are enjoying the most. I'm loving 21/20/0, although I've had a lot of fun with other variations of corruption/lit. What are peoples' thoughts on talenting affliction for the slow or snagging the extra crit/ dmg reduction in lieu of the shield burst? I've heard some people express concerns about managing the enemy's resolve with the bubble mez, but it has definitely helped me get away from melee classes, especially stealthers.

 

edit: also, thoughts on 20 pt lightning to grab CL + whatever the talent is called that gives you free CLs vs. more points into Corruption?

-Hedley Melange, Dreshdae Cantina-

 

You are just plain dumb, to be honest. First you use the FOTM ad hominem incorrectly. Secondly, you put quotations around it with no purpose except to draw attention to the fact that you used a trending word on SWTOR forums. LMAO.

 

I never said I am a gladiator. That's one reason why I refuse to prance around the forums making threads about helping people. Just trust me, 80% of these so-called experts will get their butts handed to them by the silent minority of hardcore (likely WoW glad) pvp'ers who read this crap and laugh. I've seen very few posts from people who actually have glad rankings and, in none of them, do they sit here and try to give lessons to people. The OP in this thread just asked a question, I didn't see him post how to do this or that. You know why- because to be the best top 0.5% or whatever it is is ridiculously hard and why would they sit in a forum for epeen?

 

On one of the servers mentioned in this thread, Dreshdae Cantina, there is a small guild of players comprised of some WoW gladiators, xuktoldoth or something. I was allowed to run with them once in a while and it was eye-opening how they broke down the warzones. There were never one-v-ones in their group. Unfortunately, they haven't been around except maybe one guy, but they had some incredible melee pain-train players and very good healers to include one sorc. I would listen to people like them but for some reason this caliber of player refuses to post in these forums. Same on Fatman server, there is a group of pvp'ers who are gladiators that will roflstomp and I've looked for them here but they never post.

[Sock_Bramson]

Tsk tsk, do a bit of research. "Ad hominem" (I'm using quotes in lieu of italics) is an old Latin phrase, short for "argumentum ad hominem", which means "to the man", i.e. an argument based on attacking someones character instead of debating their logic. It is not a FOTM expression; it's been out for quite a while, actually. The only incorrect thing about how I used it was saying "ol'" instead of "old", because sometimes it's fun to use slang.

 

I'm not sure why you assume good players don't post on forums. There are quite a bit of trolls on basically every forum, true, but they aren't the only people posting.

 

Thanks at least for the shout out to the Xul guys. I haven't seen 'em for a while now, but I always enjoy playing with them. Fortunately, there are plenty of other good pvpers in the Cantina on both factions. (although the Rep. side definitely needs a population boost)

 

-Hedley Melange, Dreshdae Cantina-

Edited April 25, 2012 by Sock_Bramson

[Hamatula]

Sigh, yet another super constructive post. Do you even play a sorc healer, Ham? Yes, we were nerfed, a bit overboard imo, but we did need toning down. Yes, healing in general was nerfed through the changes to expertise. Does this make healers, especially sorc healers, useless? Not by a long shot. In basically every game, no matter how quick or prolonged, my healing is on par - and usually a bit higher than - the top dps. Try playing a game without a healer vs a team with even one competent one and you'll pray for a "gimp" to show up.

 

Minmaxer: I really haven't noticed/ taken the time to figure out, but do shields I put on other people gain the same blind-on-break? The wording on the talent led me to believe it was only for my shields. If they all blind, though, I may have to consider respecing, dropping said talent along with CL and Lit. Storm for 6% more WP, 1% crit, and 1% dmg reduction. As it stands now, I'm not throwing out that many CLs, but the ability to do so is kinda nice.

 

-Hedley Melange, Dreshdae Cantina-

 

yea I have a sorc at vr 78... the nerf to burst healing and throughput makes them the worst pvp healers in the game. The only sorc/sage healers on my server doing well are the ones with decent premades with tanks peeling/guarding... and even then they dont do so well when facing another decent premade team.

 

Sorc lack defensive cd's, burst healing, and throughput. They have some decent utility (on par or sub par with other classes) full spec heals even less. The only real gem they can bring is lifegrip, wich a madness sorc can still provide along with better utility.

 

I dont play my sorc anymore, I have a jugg who now outgears my sorc. so I could care less tbh... I argue for healers first of all, because healing in pvp as a whole needs to be buffed, and sorc healers being the weakest. If the game survives, healing will get buffed and so will Sorc... its out of balance.

[madtycoon]

Cheers to the prospect of a good pvp experience with the new games upcoming or, alternatively, going back to wow to find a team to get gladiator again before season's end. Peace out, yo.

 

Tourney Realm is up and should stay up till pandas.

 

I've tried the hybrid healing specs out pre-patch and didn't like them. Personally, I need every bit of healing power from talents to keep people alive. Revification is too good not to get imo. The knockback root is great don't get me wrong, but the aoe healing is better. Post-patch its rougher, but sorc/sages can still fill the healer's role. You just need to be babysat more. Of course my server is real backwater, so its easy to thrive there.

[Sock_Bramson]

Ham: Well, I don't feel like I'm the weakest healer right now. I'm definitely weaker, can't argue that, and I do think we need some buffs, but so far my post 1.2 pvp experience hasn't been discouraging at all. If anything, it seems like Merc Healers got the rawest end of the deal for pvp. Glad you're enjoying your jugg, seems like a pretty damn fun class to play. I'm still addicted to my Sorc, though, so I'm not gonna do a full-on re-roll anytime soon. I am having a lot of fun slowly leveling my PT alt (started out as pyro, but I'm really liking AP now), but he always has to wait for me to get the urge to heal out of my system.

 

As far as Reviv goes, I'm finding that I really don't miss it. Sure, it's nice on node-based matches, but the ability to cc/root/interrupt more often helps me keep healing longer. (and helps win objectives) Really, though, it's all a matter of preference. I've seen sorcs doing pretty well with their purple puddle, but they definitely have to play very carefully.

 

-Hedley Melange, Dreshdae Cantina-

Edited April 25, 2012 by Sock_Bramson

[Genttry]

Thanks at least for the shout out to the Xul guys. I haven't seen 'em for a while now, but I always enjoy playing with them.

 

Damnation, I said I wouldn't post again but It's a small world! Actually, my sorc's name is Jiblets and I play on Dreshdae in the guild Xukuth d Oloth. I have no idea who stafaureus is, but I'm pretty sure my guild never grouped with someone by that name. And I'm the only sorc healer in our guild. Unfortunately, XdO pretty much quit when Bioware announced, last minute, that they were pulling rateds from 1.2 I unsubbed myself because I have no guildies to play with. I guess I qualified for the extra 30 days, but I have yet to get an email about it. Anyway, it is pretty neat to get a shout out, albeit inadvertantly and from this penile infiltrator who ruined my thread! Staf, don't get this thread deleted.

 

There are, indeed, some good players on Dreshdae imo. I never really got great gear in this game, only half BM, but I've had the chance to play along with some good, fun people outside of my guild. Ok, mebe I'm done posting now! Have fun in game my fellow sorc healers!

[Sock_Bramson]

Oh nice, I'm pretty sure I saw you kicking gluteus maximus in a few games before you left. Shame to lose ya, but I can understand if your guild stopped playing. Am I remembering correctly that Loafy-breadicus was in XdO with you? Either way, he was always fun to play with too, but I think he probably stopped playing as well. Here's hoping rated wzs draw you guys back in.

 

-Hedley Melange, Dreshdae Cantina-

Edited April 25, 2012 by Sock_Bramson

[Midumass]

On topic:

If you find you are getting your heals interrupted a lot you are either casting at the wrong time,or from the wrong spot. That is why Innervate is our most important heal, if its interrupted at 75%, you still get 75% of its value. Dark Infusion should only be used when no one is attacking you, or you have created a big enough gap that you can heal before they reach you again. Dark Heal is still pretty useless, but if the melee with a charge that you just sprinted from is about to come around the corner, might as well get that off instead of the Dark Infusion that will get interrupted.

 

So what you are saying is: Our most potent heal is highly situational, almost to the point of non-viability and our new "primary" heal is useless? In what world is that not the definition of broken? We have 2 heals on a timer and one of those is channeled, and our only "burst" heal is a shield that debuffs the target. 3 buttons out of the 48 I have on my screen being "heals" does not make me a healer especially in a team environment, it makes me a soloer. I understand you have effectively adapted to the changes, but that doesn't mean they were acceptable.

[_Minmaxer_]

So what you are saying is: Our most potent heal is highly situational, almost to the point of non-viability and our new "primary" heal is useless? In what world is that not the definition of broken? We have 2 heals on a timer and one of those is channeled, and our only "burst" heal is a shield that debuffs the target. 3 buttons out of the 48 I have on my screen being "heals" does not make me a healer especially in a team environment, it makes me a soloer. I understand you have effectively adapted to the changes, but that doesn't mean they were acceptable.

 

No, our "primary" heal is Innervate. It is our most potent heal, and still heals even if you get interrupted. You should be planning your healing around it. Our second most important heal is Resurgence (arguably most important as it procs force bending). On top of the you have bubble, Dark Heal, Dark Infusion, and the 31pt heal. All have their uses. DI and the 31pt when you aren't getting attacked, Dark Heal to use up the force bending proc between Innervates and static barrier as required. And you can't forget about talented purge, which is a weak heal but virtually removes all Marauder/Sentinel damage. You will get way more effective healing out of purging someone being attacked by a Marauder/Sentinel than actually trying to heal them, especially with the heal debuff they apply. Lucky for us, purge removes that too!

[madtycoon]

You can't cleanse the healing debuff from marauders/sentinels anymore. That was changed last patch.

[_Minmaxer_]

You can't cleanse the healing debuff from marauders/sentinels anymore. That was changed last patch.

That sucks, but that does give more incentive to purge the dots than trying to out heal the damage they do. I really wish they had more debuff symbols, two of the marauders debuffs have the same icon, and they share that icon with another class debuff that is tech and can't be dispelled.

[madtycoon]

That sucks, but that does give more incentive to purge the dots than trying to out heal the damage they do. I really wish they had more debuff symbols, two of the marauders debuffs have the same icon, and they share that icon with another class debuff that is tech and can't be dispelled.

 

Agree 100%

 

The debuff symbols are a *********** joke. Let's make all the bleed effects the same icon, but then have some be tech and other physical. I also love how theres like 4 extra debuffs that are put on players just from being in warzones. The general PvP trauma debuff (should be hidden), medals in the form of a debuff (lol put that up at the top with the rest of the warzone interface please) and bolster (just plain stupid that this is there in 50 warzones, considering it doesn't even effect level 50s). Then theres the rakghoul crap and the ilum valor debuff and theres one for when you max medals still?

[Toadstool]

Agree 100%

 

The debuff symbols are a *********** joke. Let's make all the bleed effects the same icon, but then have some be tech and other physical. I also love how theres like 4 extra debuffs that are put on players just from being in warzones. The general PvP trauma debuff (should be hidden), medals in the form of a debuff (lol put that up at the top with the rest of the warzone interface please) and bolster (just plain stupid that this is there in 50 warzones, considering it doesn't even effect level 50s). Then theres the rakghoul crap and the ilum valor debuff and theres one for when you max medals still?

 

I would love to see debuff icons be better. I have such a hard time realizing when I can and can not purge things!!

[Mookind]

I would love the option to increase icon scale, pisses me off i can get my bars big but my icons don't scale with it.

 

PvP healing is broken period. There is no way sorcs are hitting their healing marks. Because against a premade or any monkey that knows how to mark i have to line of sight to get heals off. And that just doesn't work when you are on grass or snow. Or have 2 sentinels chasing you around because you have a big star on your head.

 

Fix it bioware, or give me dual spec so i can stop being a fail healer that gets laughed at as my heals are interrupted. At least as deeps i can just run away if they chase me.....No point in healing myself......

 

PvE is awesome and I hope they keep the changes. on that front.

 

But like i said. There is no way sorcs were close to meeting our healing goals when we get interrupted every spell. And every spell but one has more than a second cast. If their metrics on the test servers are spouting out that ******** they need to find people who know how to pvp

 

Oh wait thats right PvP wasn't tested. Thats why I still don't have ranked WZs

[Wynn]

So I took endless flaming and trolling on the ptr boards because I said the spec(healing) wasn't dead, even healing since EQ and having a BH and IA healer I was call a scrub and I know nothing till I hit 50 on a sage/sorc..

 

So today I ding bought all recruit gear(13k health) and pvp and did fine and always in top 3 healing I play as a team and always have a tank with me.

 

The only time I got truly wreck was when a War hero smuggler melee single me out and with the gear gap it should have been like that.

 

Try both healing specs tonight seems like specing in lighting for aoe root and faster cooldown on force speed might be worth more then the aoe heal.