Is there any Jedi heaven ? Do Siths go to hell ?

[Ivanblood]

Do you still have to pay taxes?

 

Yes, you do. The death is not an excuse.

[Ivanblood]

And yes, it means Sith might shoot atoms that used to be 'you' out of their fingertips and molecules/atoms that used to be 'you' might pass through the body of a jedi. But then in our real world the things that currently make up 'you' also used to belong to other things - every atom that you call 'you' came from somewhere else originally (and will move on somewhere else even before you die).

 

No. No. No. I don´t think that force is composed by atoms. It´s some sort of energy or maybe is the dark material. But then a question surges, by what mean siths or jedi manipulate the dark material.

 

But from what we know the force allows to manipulate atoms and molecules.

 

For example, if a sith shoots a bolt from his finger tips, it means that he used the force to distabilize molecules in the atmosphere creating the electron migration from his finger tips to the target, in this way creating an electric current. But the force itself is not made from atoms or molecules. And, as I will be one with force, my essence will not be made from them either.

 

Actually do you that a sith would be unable to shoot electricity in the space. Because there is no medium there, no atmosphere, no atoms to propagate.

[Ivanblood]

Well... I red all posts above, and all this lead me to one conclusion.

It actually doesn´t matter if you are sith or jedi. They all will become one with the force, loosing their identity or conscience.

 

Well... there are some slight differences:

Jedis will float in a pieceful state, and Siths, in a maddening one (the latter is not quite certain).

 

But as I, devoid from my identity, will not even notice it. Because identity implies memory of what I am, and what I did.

 

From what I deduce that Jedi/Sith pilosophy is lacking completely the charma concept.

 

And a problem is surged. Being Jedi sucks. Being Sith I can be anyone: I can be emotinal, I can do what ever I want, I can indulge all my whims, I can have girlfriends, I can love and be loved, I can hate and be hated.

 

While being a Jedi is basically being a monk. NO GIRLFRIEND., no strong emotions, no joys.

 

Is it a life at all ? And for what, to be even more tranquille in the afterlife ?

 

THEN I CHOOSE TO BE A SITH.

Edited March 22, 2012 by Ivanblood

[Rouge]

Well... I red all posts above, and all this lead me to one conclusion.

It actually doesn´t matter if you are sith or jedi. They all will become one with the force, loosing their identity or conscience.

 

The Sith and other Dark Siders can suffer "eternal damnation", endless suffering and possibly can't become part of the Force, ever. It's the Jedi and possibly other Light Side Force users who can lose their identity and consciousness and become part of the Force, existing no more.

[schmakman]

Well seeing how there is no afterlife in real life becoming one with the force is good for me.

[Ivanblood]

Well seeing how there is no afterlife in real life becoming one with the force is good for me.

 

Have you heard the expression "It is from Ashes we Come and Ashes we Shall Return To"

 

Well... replace ashes by force, and we have the same meaning.

Loosing your identity and conscience is equal to no afterlife.

[Ivanblood]

The Sith and other Dark Siders can suffer "eternal damnation", endless suffering and possibly can't become part of the Force, ever. It's the Jedi and possibly other Light Side Force users who can lose their identity and consciousness and become part of the Force, existing no more.

 

Do you have any proof? I´d like you bring some sources that point to this. Besides, THEY CAN doesn´t mean THEY WILL.

 

In SWTOR, I read some codex about dead Sith lords, and basically all of them became one with the force. "No eternal damnation" is mentioned. And I bet that those guys weren´t good makers.

Edited March 23, 2012 by Ivanblood

[Vagessel]

Breaks my heart to have to break this to you but. . .

 

All concept of afterlife are myths. Faiths. No one has been documented to come back to talk about it. So You die, your body rots under the forces of entropy, you cease to be. Force is just another way to bring comfort to people afraid of death and final dissolution. It's science fiction in this game, and comfort from fear of death in life.

 

Ah, and this is not being said to be a meanie head or anything. You have ONE life. Live it well. That usually means at peace, with satisfaction, with friends, with success and contributions to society.

Edited March 23, 2012 by Vagessel

[Ivanblood]

You have ONE life. Live it well. That usually means at peace, with satisfaction, with friends, with success and contributions to society.

 

As a sith ? Because Jedis can´t have even a girlfriend.

[Ivanblood]

Breaks my heart to have to break this to you but. . .

 

All concept of afterlife are myths. Faiths. No one has been documented to come back to talk about it. So You die, your body rots under the forces of entropy, you cease to be. Force is just another way to bring comfort to people afraid of death and final dissolution. It's science fiction in this game, and comfort from fear of death in life.

 

Ah, and this is not being said to be a meanie head or anything. You have ONE life. Live it well. That usually means at peace, with satisfaction, with friends, with success and contributions to society.

 

Well...I actually believe in afterlife, and I am not naive or religiously blind or brute person.

Albert Einstein believed in afterlife too. I don´t belive in traditional interpretation of hell and heaven.

 

I guess it all depends from a personal perspective of the universe. My personal vision is leaded by the phisical law that nothing desapears in the universe, but it´s transformed into something else.

 

But returning to our main debate. Nobody refuted my earlier post

 

Well... I red all posts above, and all this lead me to one conclusion.

It actually doesn´t matter if you are sith or jedi. They all will become one with the force, loosing their identity or conscience.

 

Well... there are some slight differences:

Jedis will float in a pieceful state, and Siths, in a maddening one (the latter is not quite certain).

 

But as I, devoid from my identity, will not even notice it. Because identity implies memory of what I am, and what I did.

 

From what I deduce that Jedi/Sith pilosophy is lacking completely the charma concept.

 

And a problem is surged. Being Jedi sucks. Being Sith I can be anyone: I can be emotinal, I can do what ever I want, I can indulge all my whims, I can have girlfriends, I can love and be loved, I can hate and be hated.

 

While being a Jedi is basically being a monk. NO GIRLFRIEND., no strong emotions, no joys.

 

Is it a life at all ? And for what, to be even more tranquille in the afterlife ?

 

THEN I CHOOSE TO BE A SITH.

[Vagessel]

O, yea, absolutely.

 

I think all this Jedi monastic garbage introduced with the prequels fit into the category of Gungans and midichloridians.

 

Playing a lights Jedi in this game feel like trying to play an alien creature from planet-X. Can't relate to them at all. That's why I think Sith's are more popular in actual gameplay because yOur characters are people you can relate to, feeling lust, envy, pent up anger and reveling in it's release. They are surrounded by a corrupt dark society that is at least open about it while the Republic is just as corrupt but hypocritical about it. Being Sith doesn't necessarily mean you're evil, but you have the freedom to choose evil or, like a lightside Sith, live righteously.

 

Or something...

[DarkCelestial]

Well... I red all posts above, and all this lead me to one conclusion.

It actually doesn´t matter if you are sith or jedi. They all will become one with the force, loosing their identity or conscience.

 

Well... there are some slight differences:

Jedis will float in a pieceful state, and Siths, in a maddening one (the latter is not quite certain).

 

But as I, devoid from my identity, will not even notice it. Because identity implies memory of what I am, and what I did.

 

From what I deduce that Jedi/Sith pilosophy is lacking completely the charma concept.

 

And a problem is surged. Being Jedi sucks. Being Sith I can be anyone: I can be emotinal, I can do what ever I want, I can indulge all my whims, I can have girlfriends, I can love and be loved, I can hate and be hated.

 

While being a Jedi is basically being a monk. NO GIRLFRIEND., no strong emotions, no joys.

 

Is it a life at all ? And for what, to be even more tranquille in the afterlife ?

 

THEN I CHOOSE TO BE A SITH.

 

You can marry as a jedi depending on the era. Jedi also can love and hate the difference is that they don't give in to it or let them impair their judgement. Also have fun in the eternal hate environment.

[MORTTUUM]

The Jedi go to Heaven, but they only get to listen to Brahms and Liszt 24/7.

 

The Sith go to Hell, but it's sound-tracked by Jimi Hendrix,Jim Morrison, (Dimebag) Darrell Abbott, Keith Moon, etc., so they're OK with it ! LOL

[Exemplar]

Heaven and Hell are mythological places of a religion... That religion does not exist in the SW universe... Therefore there is no Heaven or Hell

[Ivanblood]

Heaven and Hell are mythological places of a religion... That religion does not exist in the SW universe... Therefore there is no Heaven or Hell

 

I was meeting worshippers and cultists during my gameplay and through the novels. If there are these guys then there is a religion.

Edited March 23, 2012 by Ivanblood

[ProfessorWalsh]

This is the question. Is there any Jedi or Sith heaven ? Where the siths and jedis go after death. Well...We are alredy saw Jedi ghosts. "Luuuuke. Uuuuse the force. Ouuhhh":eek:

But from where the Jedi ghosts come from ?

 

Do the siths go to hell ? Or there´s some sort of Sith heaven too?

 

How would look like hell or sith/jedi heaven ?

 

This is actually a major point in the "Star Wars: Fate of the Jedi" novel series.

 

When anyone (Jedi or Sith) dies in Star Wars they become "One with the Force" and rejoin the underlying energy of all life.

 

For some, they have not yet abandoned attachments completely, and they end up in a purgatory like place. This is the realm Jedi and Sith can enter through Dreamwalking.

 

While there Luke Skywalker speaks with Jacen Solo, Darth Caedus, who confirms that as a Sith and as a Dark Sider he was condemned to damnation. (Darn nation? Silly censor.)

 

Basically it works like this.

 

When one rejoins the Force their individuality is forcibly ripped away. For a Sith this is the worst thing they can imagine. Their ambition and their passions are burned away. This feels, to them, like eternal torment. For a Jedi this is normal as they are taught to detach.

 

Here is the messed up part.

 

If a person actually willingly lets go of their passions the Force doesn't strip their individuality away and they can exist with their individuality in a state of bliss.

 

Thus there is a heaven and a hell in Star Wars.

Edited March 23, 2012 by ProfessorWalsh

[Rayla_Felana]

This is actually a major point in the "Star Wars: Fate of the Jedi" novel series.

 

When anyone (Jedi or Sith) dies in Star Wars they become "One with the Force" and rejoin the underlying energy of all life.

 

For some, they have not yet abandoned attachments completely, and they end up in a purgatory like place. This is the realm Jedi and Sith can enter through Dreamwalking.

 

While there Luke Skywalker speaks with Jacen Solo, Darth Caedus, who confirms that as a Sith and as a Dark Sider he was condemned to damnation. (Darn nation? Silly censor.)

 

Basically it works like this.

 

When one rejoins the Force their individuality is forcibly ripped away. For a Sith this is the worst thing they can imagine. Their ambition and their passions are burned away. This feels, to them, like eternal torment. For a Jedi this is normal as they are taught to detach.

 

Here is the messed up part.

 

If a person actually willingly lets go of their passions the Force doesn't strip their individuality away and they can exist with their individuality in a state of bliss.

 

Thus there is a heaven and a hell in Star Wars.

 

Yeh Bogan offers a quick path to power, and that's about it, ironically Ashla provides the power a Sith could only dream of.

[spectreclees]

Becoming one with the force means you guide it like it guided you, you are it. Whenever a Jedi pushes, you push for him. It's not that hard to grasp

[Ivanblood]

Becoming one with the force means you guide it like it guided you, you are it. Whenever a Jedi pushes, you push for him. It's not that hard to grasp

 

What ?

[Tarfang]

This is actually a major point in the "Star Wars: Fate of the Jedi" novel series.

 

When anyone (Jedi or Sith) dies in Star Wars they become "One with the Force" and rejoin the underlying energy of all life.

 

For some, they have not yet abandoned attachments completely, and they end up in a purgatory like place. This is the realm Jedi and Sith can enter through Dreamwalking.

 

While there Luke Skywalker speaks with Jacen Solo, Darth Caedus, who confirms that as a Sith and as a Dark Sider he was condemned to damnation. (Darn nation? Silly censor.)

 

Basically it works like this.

 

When one rejoins the Force their individuality is forcibly ripped away. For a Sith this is the worst thing they can imagine. Their ambition and their passions are burned away. This feels, to them, like eternal torment. For a Jedi this is normal as they are taught to detach.

 

Here is the messed up part.

 

If a person actually willingly lets go of their passions the Force doesn't strip their individuality away and they can exist with their individuality in a state of bliss.

 

Thus there is a heaven and a hell in Star Wars.

How does it feel like eternal torment though? Surely their ambitions and passions being burned away is a finite process and they would eventually fade away into the Force?

 

Can one learn to detach after death and thus become one with the Force? Say like Ajunta Pall. Also, is it definitely implied that a Jedi who willingly lets go exists forever in a state of bliss with their consciousness intact? I always thought Obi Wan faded away eventually, rather than just deciding to stop helping Luke.

 

I haven't read FOTJ yet but I don't mind spoilers, tbh it sounds like garbage anyway so what's to spoil.

[Tarfang]

Because of Troy Denning, we sadly now have an afterlife for Force users where people like Denning's main victim Jacen Solo are tortured for at least a century or real time or forever and those with lesser "sins" are left to contemplate their deeds

 

After a hundred years or so, those who are Light enough "move on" and either are assimilated by the Force, ending their personal existence, or move to yet another, unseen level of existence. But Jacen, apparently, is left for "eternal damnation".

 

This afterlife is seen as the living by a kind of lake, where the dead are under the surface, separated from each other.

 

There was another version of the Netherworld in early comics, a place of heavy fog, where the dead could interact with each other. In one comic, the spirit of Yoda is briefly seen meeting two young dead Force using siblings, intending to teach them, even when they are all dead.

Is there any particular reason why Jacen ends up in a Christian hell while everybody else gets away with a sort of Gehenna or Naraka? Why is one person being singled out for eternal damnation when that is not how it works normally? It seems like Denning hates Jacen so much that he breaks his own cartoonish rules for the SW afterlife just to see that Jacen never finds peace.

 

I should read FOTJ before I can engage in a real conversation about this, I know, but it just sounds so crappy.

[shama]

I was meeting worshippers and cultists during my gameplay and through the novels. If there are these guys then there is a religion.

 

The person you are quoting said that heaven and hell are principles of a (particular) religion and that religion doesn't exist here ... not that no religion exists here.

[shama]

No. No. No. I don´t think that force is composed by atoms. It´s some sort of energy or maybe is the dark material.

But your connection with the force is through a biological living thing, midi-chlorians, but by some unknown and unexplained process. They (and so 'your' force) will be returned back to the universe.

 

Actually do you that a sith would be unable to shoot electricity in the space. Because there is no medium there, no atmosphere, no atoms to propagate.

 

Actually there are things in space. Sure not an atmosphere, but most of space is actually far from being a pure vacuum. Energy moves through space, and so to answer your question it depends on whether force lightning is achieved through the stimulation of elements within an atmosphere or just a force phenomena in its own right (like plasma).

[Ivanblood]

Actually there are things in space. Sure not an atmosphere, but most of space is actually far from being a pure vacuum. Energy moves through space, and so to answer your question it depends on whether force lightning is achieved through the stimulation of elements within an atmosphere or just a force phenomena in its own right (like plasma).

 

Yes. For sure, there are other things in space, like gas clouds, junk, radiation in different frequencies which also can be perceived as light in different colours. But in the void, you can not propagate lightening. Certainly you can propel things through the space like plasma. But lightning needs an origin and an end. So if a sith is not Zeus, he can´t fling bolts in space.

Edited March 24, 2012 by Ivanblood

[MORTTUUM]

... But lightning needs an origin and an end. So if a sith is not Zeus, he can´t fling bolts in space.

 

That's not true. Electricity can jump a non-conductive gap. It all depends on the voltage, and, more importantly, the amperage of the charge.