7.5 seconds on Hidden Strike

[Cwild]

Bioware, I'm sad about this.

 

Can I at least have another move I can use in stealth then?

Edited March 19, 2012 by Cwild

[Grapenut]

sleep dart.

 

Enjoy.

[Cwild]

sleep dart.

 

Enjoy.

 

Yes my favorite skill ever.

[Howbadisbad]

Bioware response:

 

All Operatives just respecced medicine? Working as intended.

[Grapenut]

The class is dead. Re-roll assassin or shadow for stealth burst and utility.

 

Sorry, but it's painful. Took me all weekend to get over it.

 

It would be nice if we got some sort of reasons behind their nerfs. But it appears the developers and player base simply do not see eye to eye on this class.

 

So stop trying, and re-roll.

[Cwild]

The class is dead. Re-roll assassin or shadow for stealth burst and utility.

 

Sorry, but it's painful. Took me all weekend to get over it.

 

It would be nice if we got some sort of reasons behind their nerfs. But it appears the developers and player base simply do not see eye to eye on this class.

 

So stop trying, and re-roll.

 

Can't do it, I never reroll characters. Never have on any game, never will. I will play this class through the bumps and bruises, who am i kidding, the epic car crashes on the parkway that killed 5 kids after hitting a school bus.

 

I'll keep playing it until it no longer becomes fun, if thats the case I'll just quit.

 

7.5 seconds...really bioware?

[TheStrika]

I just don't understand their logic. I have to know I'm capable of killing someone at some point in this game. I worked my butt off after the last nerfs to learn new tricks to make myself viable in a premade. No knockbacks, pulls, sprints or helpful group buffs, logically means I have to be able to take someone out of the equation. I got to a point where I could do this reliably(while also losing a defensive/escape mechanism) and now my reward is being nerfed to the point where I really doubt I will be useful in ranked wz's.

[Cwild]

I just don't understand their logic. I have to know I'm capable of killing someone at some point in this game. I worked my butt off after the last nerfs to learn new tricks to make myself viable in a premade. No knockbacks, pulls, sprints or helpful group buffs, logically means I have to be able to take someone out of the equation. I got to a point where I could do this reliably(while also losing a defensive/escape mechanism) and now my reward is being nerfed to the point where I really doubt I will be useful in ranked wz's.

 

You will be useful bro, just gonna have to relearn everything and make new tactics. I was pretty much set in my game play and how I operated things. That is gonna change big time, but I'm sure you will adapt.

[Bazzoong]

I just don't understand their logic. I have to know I'm capable of killing someone at some point in this game. I worked my butt off after the last nerfs to learn new tricks to make myself viable in a premade. No knockbacks, pulls, sprints or helpful group buffs, logically means I have to be able to take someone out of the equation. I got to a point where I could do this reliably(while also losing a defensive/escape mechanism) and now my reward is being nerfed to the point where I really doubt I will be useful in ranked wz's.

 

Your ability to take someone "out of the equation" reliably will not change with the 7.5 sec cd on HS. 7.5 sec is 3 gcds, this means you will only have to do 3 other moves in between your 1st HS and your 2nd HS. This does not change anything, you still can do AB HS BS crouch EP CD cloak screen AB HS and have the same if not an even higher damage spike than before.

 

Sorry guys QQ regarding 7.5 sec cd on HS is misplaced of all the changes this is the most minor one.

[Cwild]

Your ability to take someone "out of the equation" reliably will not change with the 7.5 sec cd on HS. 7.5 sec is 3 gcds, this means you will only have to do 3 other moves in between your 1st HS and your 2nd HS. This does not change anything, you still can do AB HS BS crouch EP CD cloak screen AB HS and have the same if not an even higher damage spike than before.

 

Sorry guys QQ regarding 7.5 sec cd on HS is misplaced of all the changes this is the most minor one.

 

It's not the damage, its the other utility of switching targets to interrupt and stuff like that. 7.5 is a long time to be able to use an ability in stealth, considering we have that, sleep dart, and sneak.

 

If we had more stealth abilities then yeah, I could see 7.5 but they wanted to take away the double HS opener which is fine cause the damage is nuts but the fact that it takes other aspects away also is what blows.

[Bazzoong]

It's not the damage, its the other utility of switching targets to interrupt and stuff like that. 7.5 is a long time to be able to use an ability in stealth, considering we have that, sleep dart, and sneak.

 

If we had more stealth abilities then yeah, I could see 7.5 but they wanted to take away the double HS opener which is fine cause the damage is nuts but the fact that it takes other aspects away also is what blows.

 

I do not see a problem there either, sorry.

 

If you open on someone with HS and the have to interrupt with so high priority that you will want to blow cloak screen for another HS, you just can use your other abilities for the same effect way more efficacious. Simply because the guy you want to interrupt is in melee range anyway (if he is not the cloak screen HS would be not viable anyway). So flash bang as an interrupt and/our a focus stun easily bridge the time until your HS is of cd again.

 

The only aspect where this change MIGHT be of importance is if you use HS as a "fake opener" and instantly switch, but even in that case there will be no problem since all you have to to is: HS 1st target, switch (1gcd for that maybe with ST if necessary) BS shiv, and you can do cloak screen HS again.

Edited March 21, 2012 by Bazzoong

[Cwild]

I do not see a problem there either, sorry.

 

If you open on someone with HS and the have to interrupt with so high priority that you will want to blow cloak screen for another HS, you just can use your other abilities for the same effect way more efficacious. Simply because the guy you want to interrupt is in melee range anyway (if he is not the cloak screen HS would be not viable anyway). So flash bang as an interrupt and/our a focus stun easily bridge the time until your HS is of cd again.

 

The only aspect where this change MIGHT be of importance is if you use HS as a "fake opener" and instantly switch, but even in that case there will be no problem since all you have to to is: HS 1st target, switch (1gcd for that maybe with ST if necessary) BS shiv, and you can do cloak screen HS again.

 

We will see how it turns out, everything will probably be fine. I finally started to see what everyone was complaining about in terms of "nothing to do in the game though" Since I got BM and most of my pieces I have less and less desire to log on each day, my friends aren't playing as much either. Fastest i've lost interest in an MMO minus the new final fantasy MMO, I played that for 2 days, that was awful lol.

[Ahebish]

And this 7.5 sec cd thing doesn't effect me either.

 

As others have said this is the LEAST of our worries in 1.2

[Ahebish]

We will see how it turns out, everything will probably be fine. I finally started to see what everyone was complaining about in terms of "nothing to do in the game though" Since I got BM and most of my pieces I have less and less desire to log on each day, my friends aren't playing as much either. Fastest i've lost interest in an MMO minus the new final fantasy MMO, I played that for 2 days, that was awful lol.

 

lol

 

You should have played STO then

 

Took a week to lose interest in that game... 3-4 days to hit max level and then no end game content to boot.

 

Trust me 3 months is very good for this game.

[EnochThompson]

Your ability to take someone "out of the equation" reliably will not change with the 7.5 sec cd on HS. 7.5 sec is 3 gcds, this means you will only have to do 3 other moves in between your 1st HS and your 2nd HS. This does not change anything, you still can do AB HS BS crouch EP CD cloak screen AB HS and have the same if not an even higher damage spike than before.

 

Sorry guys QQ regarding 7.5 sec cd on HS is misplaced of all the changes this is the most minor one.

 

Try to do that on my sorc healer Ill lol you to death... when you do your 3 other moves my health will be back to full bubble refreshed, and Ill cc the **** outa you, by the time you get out of my CC you will be dead by a mob of people for even trying to touch me, or Ill be gone with my force run ability.

 

On my Merc healer Ill lol because you wont do enough damage since Ill mitigate all the damage you do with my armor and heals, with my 25% bubble damage reduction, you will be knocked back pretty far with a snare.

 

Remember BM gear will be basically free so expect everybody to have top gear by a week after the 1.2 comes out.

[Bazzoong]

To the pro sorc: Your sig says all I bet you rolled the chars in top to botton order, haha. You might want to start a Marauder fast.

 

And you claim of cc`ing the **** out of me is funny since you will never ever be able to prove that point, making such claims is really funny since you will never play against me.

 

Just because you can not kill healer sorcs on your operative is no proof whatsoever that it can not be done, and going from the general discussion of a generic opener to a 1v1 operative vs sorc healer scenario assuming that opener would be used and then bring in a mob of people is: well, forget it I am wasting my time.

Edited March 21, 2012 by Bazzoong

[EnochThompson]

To the pro sorc: Your sig says all I bet you rolled the chars in top to botton order, haha. You might want to start a Marauder fast.

 

And you claim of cc`ing the **** out of me is funny since you will never ever be able to prove that point, making such claims is really funny since you will never play against me.

 

Just because you can not kill healer sorcs on your operative is no proof whatsoever that it can not be done, and going from the general discussion of a generic opener to a 1v1 operative vs sorc healer scenario assuming that opener would be used and then bring in a mob of people is: well, forget it I am wasting my time.

 

wrong I rolled a Merc first, Sorc, then OPS, and I already have a Jugg in the works but thats just for the story line or if the guild needs a backup tank for PVE.

 

Actually I do very well vs Sorc Healers because I know my own weakness, I tend to use the double HS because a good sorc will get out of the first stun do knockback, whirlwind, healup, bubble, snare dot, stun, knockback again. So before you give a good sorc a chance to do any of this you would do 1st HS rotation then CS and then proceed to the second HS rotation which would make the sorc panick and die.

 

Clicker sorcs will die within the first rotation of HS if he doesnt have guard and has nobody bashing on me.

 

VS mercs its debatable since they can mitigate more damage and IMO have the best single target heals in the game.

 

What Im trying to say is that you just nerfed your own dps by doing 3 useless moves that you suggested. How the hell are you going to burst down any healer that has a clue and that is geared with the 3 moves you just did in any WZ?

Edited March 21, 2012 by EnochThompson

[Ahebish]

wrong I rolled a Merc first, Sorc, then OPS, and I already have a Jugg in the works but thats just for the story line or if the guild needs a backup tank for PVE.

 

Actually I do very well vs Sorc Healers because I know my own weakness, I tend to use the double HS because a good sorc will get out of the first stun do knockback, whirlwind, healup, bubble, snare dot, stun, knockback again. So before you give a good sorc a chance to do any of this you would do 1st HS rotation then CS and then proceed to the second HS rotation which would make the sorc panick and die.

 

Clicker sorcs will die within the first rotation of HS if he doesnt have guard and has nobody bashing on me.

 

VS mercs its debatable since they can mitigate more damage and IMO have the best single target heals in the game.

 

What Im trying to say is that you just nerfed your own dps by doing 3 useless moves that you suggested. How the hell are you going to burst down any healer that has a clue and that is geared with the 3 moves you just did in any WZ?

 

/facepalm

 

not even going to comment on this one.

[EnochThompson]

/facepalm

 

not even going to comment on this one.

 

Sure you wont because there is no other way to suppress a healer unless you have somebody else on him. Trust me Im almost unkillable on any of my healers even when I'm healing on my operative. And trust me when I have guard there is no way an operative or smuggler will slow my heals down unless they do the double HS on me.

[Ahebish]

Sure you wont because there is no other way to suppress a healer unless you have somebody else on him. Trust me Im almost unkillable on any of my healers even when I'm healing on my operative. And trust me when I have guard there is no way an operative or smuggler will slow my heals down unless they do the double HS on me.

 

I will say this.

 

It's not always about killing your target.

 

FYI double HS doesn't work on healers on my server.

Edited March 21, 2012 by Ahebish

[EnochThompson]

I will say this.

 

It's not always about killing your target.

 

FYI double HS doesn't work on healers on my server.

 

My point is slowing the healers down, doesnt mean kill him outright... Seriously Hutball is the worst WZ for Operatives because they only have 1 use, and its to take out targets, I dont know about you but my first targets are always by default healers, rather I slow them down enough or kill them as fast as I can, or just stealth and move on to another target.

 

And yes double HS doesnt faze some healers on our server, since they know what they are doing and have decent gear.

 

Thats what frustrates me the most about this upcoming patch, its bad enough the way it is now how we can do double HS and really not dent good healers with good gear. They have alot of utility to get away from us or have guard that makes our initial dps look lame.

[goulet]

the problem with saying hidden strike needed to have its cd adjusted to avoid back to back use is that you could still only do it once every 2 minutes at best. oddly enough you can still use hidden strike +backstab (both with acid blade) and its a 500 damage loss vs 2 hidden strikes. So the 500 damage was the problem?

 

is it a cc problem? with 2 2s stuns? cause hidden strike used to be a 4s knockdown and we were told that was too long, but that it also limited us from being able to use other cc forms down the line (this was the selling point for tweaking it last patch). Again this can only be done every 2 minutes.

 

hindsight is always 20/20 and people do make mistakes, but when with every patch we get a new explanation of why the class needs to be nerfed, that is antithetical (the opposite) of previous justifications for being nerfed, the question gets raised: "how many times of not getting it right are needed before you rethink the way you examine things?"

 

-hidden strike applies its cc to long allowing you to kill people with out their control, and it additionally hinders operatives from applying cc later in the fight due to resolve limitations. dev's state they want operatives to be able to use more then one form of cc.

 

-hidden strike reduced to 2s kb, other forms of cc become available. armor penetration reduced on acid blade.

 

-1.2 rolls around and now we're doing to much cc.... that too much cc consists of 2 stuns: 1 on a 30 to 45 second cooldown, the other on a 1 minute cd.

 

-a day or two passes, and its not that the operative by themselves that's doing too much cc, its groups of the least played class chain cc'ing that is too much. no mention that any group of one ac/spec that all knows their cc resolve values can do the same.