Valor 65 Sniper Explaining [In Detail] State of Snipers in PvP atm -->

[-EVENT-HORIZON-]

real simple. You are taking a dps class that is instant damage to use it as dot based. Your not in a ops.. and start thinking pvp foo. PVP you want instant damage. Period end of topic. For anygame unless the class you play doesnt allow that sort of style.

 

I can take a lvl 10 sniper/slinger and still come out 3rd if not #1 in non 50's. cause im not a lame doter. You rely on dots to get kills and ontop of that rely on killing each targer instead of hitting all targets for the credit kills..Its how this game works. No one gets 40 kills in a wz alone..they are credit kills. Damage over time is for suckers in this game when you can get cleansed lol.

 

Stop ranting and get good.

 

I say one thing.... PROVE IT

[psi_overtake]

I can take a lvl 10 sniper/slinger and still come out 3rd if not #1 in non 50's. cause im not a lame doter.

 

Hard to be a DoTter when you only have 1 at level 10.

 

Damage over time is for suckers in this game when you can get cleansed lol.

 

Perhaps you haven't met my good friend, Lingering Toxins. And that's if BOTH my DoTs get cleansed (since purge only targets 2 effects, they'd both have to be mine and no one else's). There's a chance that even without Lingering Toxins, you'll still be okay if 2 other effects get cleansed.

[StJohnLimbo]

Really hard to read some of these posts. I'm no genius when it comes to spelling and grammar, but damn people at least try. It also helps to not type while in a furious rage. Your fingers don't work as well, because you lose fine motor control.

 

Anyway. It seems to me there are two camps here:

1) those who expect to do everything to everyone and live through it.

2) those who see this as a team oriented game

 

If you are specifically complaining about not being able to down a ball carrier tank then you are definitely in the first group. How about you use that area denial ability that snipers were made for, and deny the tank's healer(s). Your team should be taking care of the tank. Just because Bioware said ”snipers are an area defense/denial class” does not mean we can do so against everything. Play a variety of classes, they all have shortcomings. Some weaknesses are more visible depending on the makeup of the enemy team and how they respond to you on any given day of pvp.

 

I believe that level 50 pvp needs a lot more balancing overall, not just with any one class. Yes, snipers could use a few tweaks, but so could a handful of others. It is by no means apocalyptic doom to the sniper class. Some of these posts would have us wearing tin foil on our heads and stocking up on milk and bread.

 

Here's something that makes all this talk moot: before rated wz's come out there will another class balancing patch. Maybe it will be the same patch. The game will change then -again. I don't think Bioware delayed the release of rated wz's just because the structure of such a system wasn't ready yet, but that they also want to further tweak class balance. Perhaps even to the point of free skill tree resets. Time will tell.

[psi_overtake]

... It seems to me there are two camps here:

1) those who expect to do everything to everyone and live through it.

2) those who see this as a team oriented game

 

If you are specifically complaining about not being able to down a ball carrier tank then you are definitely in the first group. How about you use that area denial ability that snipers were made for, and deny the tank's healer(s). Your team should be taking care of the tank. Just because Bioware said ”snipers are an area defense/denial class” does not mean we can do so against everything. ...

 

Snipers really can do everything against everyone (practically). To pick out the example of a lone tank ball carrier fairly close to the end (seems to be what most snipers complain against):

• All snipers can Flash Bang (or Leg Shot if resolve's up) and OS in front of the tank. If you were able to Flash Bang the tank, you can then use Leg Shot to keep him there longer for elemental damage.
  
• All snipers can use SS to decrease armor and healing done to the tank (when taking out a healer won't help if the tank's close enough to scoring).
  
• All snipers can stand on the top catwalk and entrench, allowing you to knock back most of the enemy group running towards you, and focus on priority targets on those who didn't get knocked back (due to resolve).
  
• All full Engi, full Leth, hybrid Engi, and hybrid Leth can spec into a slow, with full Engi also nabbing a big AoE slow that does unmitigated elemental damage and a stun.
  
• All full MM, hybrid MM, and even dip MM can spec into decreasing the cooldown of Leg Shot, and most MM can decrease the cooldown of OS and casting time of OS.
  
• All full Leth and hybrid Leth use poisons which go through armor.
  

 

And the list goes on. Yes, I know that Leg Shot can be deflected. And yes, I know that Entrench doesn't seem to work for some people (I haven't PvP'd in a couple weeks, so I haven't experienced the problem first-hand). But we have SO MANY utilities, the problem is that most players can't quickly use them all with their keyboard setup, so they don't. If you can find a way to make it work and play smart, though, you'll see that you not only do great damage, but provide great utility.

[wavyhill]

Anyway. It seems to me there are two camps here:

1) those who expect to do everything to everyone and live through it.

2) those who see this as a team oriented game

Personally I feel that the first group has a pretty valid point since Bioware seems to believe it's perfectly ok for marauders, hybrid sorcs, and tank assassins to have their cake an eat it too. Denying the huge advantage those classes and specs have thanks to the gross discrepancy in survivability and utility they can leverage in addition to their damage is just sour grapes.

 

 

Here's something that makes all this talk moot: before rated wz's come out there will another class balancing patch. Maybe it will be the same patch. The game will change then -again. I don't think Bioware delayed the release of rated wz's just because the structure of such a system wasn't ready yet, but that they also want to further tweak class balance. Perhaps even to the point of free skill tree resets. Time will tell.

A couple of things:

1) Current game conditions are never moot. Poor experiences are what make people quit and reroll; or just plain quit of course.

2) Waiting for a miracle patch is, essentially, never the intelligent response. Because, unless you're very lucky, they never come quick enough and you just end up torturing yourself for little to no gain. You can feel noble about rolling with the punches if you want, but most people are just going to go find something that isn't frustrating to do instead.

[BubbleDncr]

I'm 59.5 valor. I usually get 1 MVP / game, but it's really highly variable. I find MVP absolutely inexplicable. Not even top DPS: three MVPs. Top DPS, top objectives, top kills, singlehandedly defended a door when they had 7 people that side we had none (except me, sort of) and most of our team was dead*: no votes. Defending that door happened to be the margin of victory, too.

 

Really, I suspect it's mostly based on how well known you are on your server. If you're recognized as a decent player, you'll attract votes. If you don't queue with the same people often enough that they recognize you as consistently decent, much less likely.

 

MVP doesn't really matter...except that it's external validation that you're doing OK. My personal measure of "okay" is "Did I top the other frequent sniper I see all the time who is very irritating when I fight him?"

 

*This consisted of Orbital Strike and then running like mad, but IT WORKED. I give myself credit for surviving -- the Orbital Strike ran for full duration, gave dead guys chance to get out of jailyard.

 

Yea...last night I played a game of Huttball where I spent most of the match controlling the middle, killed the ball carrier a several times, scored a point, got the most medals out of both teams, and did the 3rd highest damage - didn't get a single MVP vote. Not sure what more I can do to be helpful to the team...

 

I think most people just don't notice when Snipers are helping them out.

[Gravesson]

My problem isn't so much damage. I always finish in the top 2-3 in WZs for dps, my problem is I feel snipers don't have enough abilities to really contribute in terms of winning a game. In fact I'll go as far as saying they have the least to contribute outside of trying to control areas which doesn't often translate well if other teammates have tunnel vision. I've started to find myself playing my Juggs more simply because I know I can play a bigger role in getting a W.

 

I could go down the list if things that each class has vs. the sniper in terms of contributing but I'm sure most here know what I'm refering to. The only other pure dps class is the Mara's and they at least have force charge, do a ton of damage (even more so then a sniper) , and midigate better then a sniper.

 

I'd love to see them give snipers something that can contribute to the team better (shield outside of cover, or pushback outside of cover, or a group sprint for a few secs, something).

[Owlhowl]

I can't agree more than with one very essential thing for our sniper class.

 

Why the hell does Sniper not have camouflage which snipers are famed for. To give it Marauder is simply beyond words....

 

I feel like a glass cannon and my only real role in PvP is to burst down Healers (if left alone)

[Nyaara]

Snipers really can do everything against everyone (practically).(...)

 

But we have SO MANY utilities(...).

 

I play a 84-85 (dont remember and dont care really) Valor Gunslinger. I know im talking about.

 

Yes, we have so many utilities but many are bad designed. I´d prefer a one good shield and not 2 like Defense Screen and Dodge like right now. I got a stun but is MELEE range and my flash grenade is nice but breaks with damage and i got some dot skills.

 

The problem about Sniper/Gunslinger is the sinergy between skills in terms of CC/defensive. The sinergy is pretty bad. Very bad design.

 

About dps. A MM is nice doing burst but any good player knows how unplugs a MM sniper. I kill MM Sniper very easily cos i know where they are and i know how cover sucks in that situation.

 

Leth and Eng do nice dmg but not burst. A Leth needs several GCDs to start using Cull and sometimes you see dead cos other classes just outdamaged you before. For exemple, a PT.

 

At the current state, a Tankassin just laughs at our defensive tools. They by far got better than us. Marauders, another pure dps class, laughs at our defensive tools except cover and you cant kite too far cos they will jump to you out of 10 meters, they by far got better outstanding defensive cooldowns as well. Our bubble group screen are 3 mins cooldown and you need to be in cover, for example, they use Undying Rage almost everysingle fight and if things go bad, just vanish and go away. Snipers just die. Not funny. Not balanced at all.

 

Anyway, they can balance snipers balancing other classes instead and i think they will do. But Snipers needs better defensive tools and just redesign some of the current ones. A range stun is mandatory and decrease the cooldown of Escape or make Dogde cleaning Dots, snares or something like that.

 

But if we talk about new skill with short cooldown. I think would be awesome if we could roll into cover (not cruch) where we want to. Right now, we just exit cover, run a bit and cover again. We need some kind of skill to avoid the running, just rolling from one spot to another.

 

We must wait for 1.3 to see the changes. Time will tell.

[Slashpaf]

My problem isn't so much damage. I always finish in the top 2-3 in WZs for dps, my problem is I feel snipers don't have enough abilities to really contribute in terms of winning a game. .

The sniper has the 4 best support skills in this game (30m flash+35m silence+root, bunker), how could he not contribute in terms of winning?

For those who know how to use CCs in the right time and in the right place, sniper becomes ubber. If you persist in thinking that sniper is only a damage dealer, you're doing it wrong.

Edited May 21, 2012 by Slashpaf

[BambulaGTS]

For those who knows how to use dodge relics, deflection and force shroud sniper is a useless frag

 

Nevertherless, solo pugging will never give you any true experience of objective play.

[StJohnLimbo]

I find it funny that every single class forum is the same in this one regard: people complaining about one or two other classes that can defeat them on a regular basis. No one class is meant to be king of them all. Accept the fact that another class using a certain skill tree can beat you. That is fair, that is balanced. Remember this is not a 1 vs 1 pvp game. You have seven other players on your team and some of them should be able to take care of that troublesome class for you. Try your best to slow down that pesky player using your class abilities and line of sight, and then regroup with the main body of your team.

[nikthebeast]

I play a 84-85 (dont remember and dont care really) Valor Gunslinger. I know im talking about.

 

Yes, we have so many utilities but many are bad designed. I´d prefer a one good shield and not 2 like Defense Screen and Dodge like right now. I got a stun but is MELEE range and my flash grenade is nice but breaks with damage and i got some dot skills.

 

Do not flashbang the targets youre are applying dots to.

 

If you know where and when to go into cover it doesn't matter how good other players are. They can't just magic them themselves out of your line of sight. Learning to use cover is the single most important aspect of successfully playing the sniper AC.

 

You first speak of melee's and how their CDs hurt. You earlier mentioned a melee stun. This is exactly the time you should use it. Then you have legshot(even if affected by dots they still are held up). By now you should have put some distance to the target and should have lined up another cull(if on CD, use ambush followed by SoS).

 

Other defencive tools are of course our cover pulse.

 

In essence, I couldn't disagree with you more.

 

EDIT: If you want a solid 1on1 spec. Go engineer. With multiple snare, ranged stun and with burst potential(though back end). IP-PP-EP-Ambush-SoS(or whichever the situation favours). Use CC when needed, laze+snipe if not able to use takedown and don't forget to make use of EMP and shield probes.

Edited May 23, 2012 by nikthebeast

[Invictusthetaru]

I think what a lot of people are forgetting, at least it seems this way, is that snipers are the best area denial class in the game. And, let me count real quick the number of warzones that rely on it...

 

1...2...3...4! Wow! 4! How many warzones are there again?

 

I play sab spec, so I get the defense with my offense and energy upkeep, not to mention good out of cover DPS. I'm constantly on the move. Cover, orbital strike the healer, incend grenade the objective, pick my target.

 

I love 1v1, but where we shine is in team play. If the other team has a lot of melees just drop your FFB or OS on YOUR healer and you and pop your defense shield.

 

Also, I have a mara as well. If you can't take a mara out, even with ALL (yes all, worst is of course saber ward) his CD up when you have all your CD up then the problem isn't the class, I can tell you that right now. Only way a mara wins is if your root gets deflected. Just pop dodge proactively after his first strike (which is always the energy builder) and his next attack (always cauterize / rupture) will miss. If that misses, he gets no dots, no dots, no death.

Edited May 23, 2012 by Invictusthetaru