Cancrizans Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 EXCEPT unless your stuff is approved by LucasArts, more specifically Leland Chee, your stuff would be NON-CANON and would have ZERO baring on the Star Wars Universe And guess what, a lot of the EU HAS been approved AND accepted by Leland Chee and LucasArts, so those stuff would be MORE Official then stuff you came up with. IDK wth Leland Chee is and I don't care. I care about the spirit of the movies, especially the original films, and all I see now is a bunch of people interested in profiting from those movies who have repeatedly sacrificed their integrity solely for reasons of profit. So frankly they can designate whatever they want as canon, I give such designations as much respect as any decisions made for profit...which is basically zero. As I said, I'll play my Star Wars and you play yours. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord_Scythe Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 In the screwy world of Star Wars "canon" there are no "facts". You have to be nuts to accept what even Lucas says at face value concerning these subjects, much less all of the spin off for profit media that form the EU. My yardstick is simply the obvious meaning and intent in the movies, and common sense. If X author can make stuff up, I can too, and I find my version a better fit than most of what I've seen outside of the movies. Short version: I'll play my Star Wars, you play yours. "Common sense"? You want to keep this alignment based. Star Wars the movie is faction based. There is no common sense in your arguments. No faction whether you want it canon OT or EU should want the current alignment restrictions. The current restrictions do not fall into any camp, OT or EU. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TGBeans Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 (edited) My 2-cents (I skipped to the end so if this point has been raised sorry). I don't mind the restrictions being lifted. I know when I play I like to act like my character collects trophies from his/her fights. (i.e. A Darkside Sith Jug killed a Jedi and now uses his blue/green Lightsaber) That being said if they lift the restrictions on crystal color they might want to consider adding more to the Dark/Light Side Vendors. Relics, boots and gloves are nice but I would like to be able to buy a full set for being all on one side or the other. As of right now there is really no point to being dark/light other than personal choice. Which I like but this brings me to another point. They need to add Neutral vendors so people don't have to play Space Jesus or the Space Devil all the time. They can choose to act like real people in actual situation and not get penalized for it. As small as the penalty for not getting for stuff from vendors is. Edited March 3, 2012 by TGBeans Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cancrizans Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 X author can not just make stuff up. There is an entire group of people who's job it is is to ensure the continuity. Any changes and add ons run through them, short of George making a new movie. When authors write books, they are given basic plots, told if they are allowed to make new characters for the plots, or if it uses established characters etc. If it uses established characters they are not allowed to contradict what is already known about them. X authors do not simply wake up one day and go "I'm going to write Star Wars book and have it be canon and people will just have to accept it." Several authors have quit writing Star Wars novels due to the way some of them are treated. That's a rather naive and wishful conception of how this stuff happens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Altyrell Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 IDK wth Leland Chee is and I don't care. I care about the spirit of the movies, especially the original films, and all I see now is a bunch of people interested in profiting from those movies who have repeatedly sacrificed their integrity solely for reasons of profit. So frankly they can designate whatever they want as canon, I give such designations as much respect as any decisions made for profit...which is basically zero. As I said, I'll play my Star Wars and you play yours. then why are you playing THIS game, which is set in the EXPANDED UNIVERSE, aka outside of the 6 Movies, or the 3 you only look at. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koalachan Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 I care about the spirit of the movies, especially the original films, and all I see now is a bunch of people interested in profiting from those movies who have repeatedly sacrificed their integrity solely for reasons of profit Should I point out that the biggest person doing this is GL himself? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Altyrell Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 That's a rather naive and wishful conception of how this stuff happens. Except that isn't naive or wishful conception, that is how it bloody works. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koalachan Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 That's a rather naive and wishful conception of how this stuff happens. No, its actually how stuff happens. I bet you've never even heard of the wookiepedia. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Divine-Shadow Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 Ok this argument I don't get at all. How the hell was he Darth Vader while doing the above mentioned? It is very clear from the films that these events were a part of his downfall...but he did not become Vader until he fully accepted his position as The Emperors servant, both in name and spirit. The idea that he was already acting in the role of Vader, fought with a blue lightsaber, thus Sith use blue lightsabers is really a bananas type argument. boy oh boy, you're completely lost. Go watch the movie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord_Scythe Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 As I said, I'll play my Star Wars and you play yours. Actually you will be playing Biowares version of Star Wars! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jmannseelo Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 All I know is come Christmastime my Merc will be sporting green and red crystals in his blasters to celebrate the occasion. Ho ho ho.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AKfourtyseven Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 (edited) Why is it, that statements like "case closed" and "Nuff said" are always preceded by glib statements, strawmen, and fallacy, that never actually say enough, or close a case? Anakin Skywalker, a jedi on his path to the darkside, used his jedi saber. Afterward, he constructed a red one. You know, like Palpatine used in that same film? Same as Count Dooku, and Darth Maul. No. Go back and watch the film again. he was titled Darth Vader after the incident with Windu. At that moment he ceased to be Anakin Skywalker. When the fight against Obi-Wan happened later in the film, it was between Obi and Darth Vader, not Anakin Skywalker. "If you're not with me, you're against me" "Only a Sith deals in absolutes" The case is closed because somebody who has been appointed the title of Sith and has fallen to the darkside (the entire purpose of killing all at the temple was to 'gain darkside points') was still able to use the exact same lightsaber he used as a Jedi. If the mechanic the game implemented was one backed up by SW lore, then as soon as Anakin had killed everyone at the temple, he would be unable to use his saber anymore, because he had clearly gained a rank in darkside and it would no longer be attuned to him- As evidenced by the change in eye colour to the "sith eyes"... So, yes it actually is case closed with regards to the arbitrary system this game imposed which is not based on film evidence nor EU. If we were basing it on the films, then the PvP colour for Jedi would have been purple, not for Sith, since that is the colour Windu uses (but that is contradicted by the EU where Sith use the colour liberally). At any stage you examine it, there is no basis for a limitation on colour. Colour was personal preference and nothing more. Edited March 3, 2012 by AKfourtyseven Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cancrizans Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 Um, he became Darth Vader when Palpatine said that he was to be called Darth Vader shortly after Windu did the Electric Slide out the window. Guess what, he was Darth Vader from that moment forward, and it means that Sith CAN use Blue Lightsabers I also like how you skipped the part where he used a Red Lightsaber, AS a Jedi against Dooku. Um, he didn't have time to make a new lightsaber maybe? I never argued that a blue lightsaber would melt the skin off your hand if you tried to wield it with a Dark Side alignment. And what are you talking about "used a red lightsaber against Dooku"? What in the last ten seconds there when he grabbed Dookus red saber after he dismembered him lol? Reaching for straws... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terminova Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 I am for the colors representing alignment, not faction. The system the game has is not perfect. As someone else mentioned, going total Dark Side as in truly becoming evil ought to result in a faction change, and vice versa. As it stands, the whole alignment/faction thing is a bit confusing. So it is my opinion that keeping blue/green for Light and red for Dark is one mechanic that imposes SOME limited kind of order. Perhaps the system would have worked better if Bioware had provided an equal number of interesting and appealing, yet different, color choices for each alignment. They didn't do that. I still think the game is better off with the restriction in place than without. Why would going LS as Empire require a faction change? Just because someone is in the Empire does not mean they are totally evil. Likewise, just because someone is Republic does not mean they are not completely rotten or totally corrupt. Even if my Sith Marauder decided to not slaughter everything that stood in his way, I'd still want to have red sabers because he's a Sith and still not a good person. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Altyrell Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 Um, he didn't have time to make a new lightsaber maybe? I never argued that a blue lightsaber would melt the skin off your hand if you tried to wield it with a Dark Side alignment. And what are you talking about "used a red lightsaber against Dooku"? What in the last ten seconds there when he grabbed Dookus red saber after he dismembered him lol? Reaching for straws... Lets see, the time from Coruscant to Mustafar is a lot longer then shown. Time after killing the Sep Leaders before Padma & Kenobi showed up. Oh yeah, he had no time. And he wasn't just DS Aligned he was a SITH And you are reaching for straws too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kisharrr Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 As I said, I'll play my Star Wars and you play yours. My Star Wars has no restrictions on lightsaber colors. Yours can have all the restrictions you want -- just don't impose your Star Wars on me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord_Scythe Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 My 2-cents (I skipped to the end so if this point has been raised sorry). I don't mind the restrictions being lifted. I know when I play I like to act like my character collects trophies from his/her fights. (i.e. A Darkside Sith Jug killed a Jedi and now uses his blue/green Lightsaber) That being said if they lift the restrictions on crystal color they might want to consider adding more to the Dark/Light Side Vendors. Relics, boots and gloves are nice but I would like to be able to buy a full set for being all on one side or the other. As of right now there is really no point to being dark/light other than personal choice. Which I like but this brings me to another point. They need to add Neutral vendors so people don't have to play Space Jesus or the Space Devil all the time. They can choose to act like real people in actual situation and not get penalized for it. As small as the penalty for not getting for stuff from vendors is. I am sure all this is coming eventually. They changed so much near the end of Beta that it feels to me that they did not have time to create and itemize stuff to put in the game. I love the game and am a big fan of SW and Bioware but this game feels like it needed 6 more months of development! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cancrizans Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 Lets see, the time from Coruscant to Mustafar is a lot longer then shown. Time after killing the Sep Leaders before Padma & Kenobi showed up. Oh yeah, he had no time. And he wasn't just DS Aligned he was a SITH And you are reaching for straws too. OK let me spell this out differently...forget the time issue, he simply HAD NOT CRAFTED HIS RED SABER YET. Which he ends up with and uses until he eventually dies. Did he do that just for fun? It seems obvious that he uses the blue one because he had not yet had the opportunity, or had not CHOSEN yet to make a red saber. I see this case as more evidence that a Sith WILL choose to use a red saber as a natural preference, trying to interpret these scenes as evidence that Sith use blue sabers is really, really silly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koalachan Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 OK let me spell this out differently...forget the time issue, he simply HAD NOT CRAFTED HIS RED SABER YET. Which he ends up with and uses until he eventually dies. Did he do that just for fun? It seems obvious that he uses the blue one because he had not yet had the opportunity, or had not CHOSEN yet to make a red saber. I see this case as more evidence that a Sith WILL choose to use a red saber as a natural preference, trying to interpret these scenes as evidence that Sith use blue sabers is really, really silly. Could of just jacked one of the three Palps kept in his desk, in the room where he was "knighted," that palps never uses. I mean, considering Palps gave Dooku his red saber, and Dooku gave Ventriss hers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FkLex Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 How exactly did this stop Grivous from using blue and green lightsabers? I'm pretty sure there are dozens of other examples in SW Lore but cba looking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJediKnight Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 (edited) The idea that he was already acting in the role of Vader, fought with a blue lightsaber, thus Sith use blue lightsabers is really a bananas type argument. I take it you've never seen Episode III? The moment Anakin lops off Windu's arm, he has fallen to the darkside. Thirty seconds later, he takes a knee and pledges himself to Sidious, becomes a Sith, and acquires the lord title. There are no secret scenes where Anakin is slowly counterbalancing his bad acts with kitten rescues and putting out house fires. The dude is just bad, and he gets progressively worse. Even if Anakin wasn't truly darksided by the time he stalked into the Jedi Temple to slaughter his former fellow Jedi and murder a dozen or so children (and I'd argue he was firmly darkside before even doing that -- you can't kill an entire town's worth of sand people in vengeance, have a secret wife, lop off the head of a beaten opponent in even more vengeance, and then kill a Jedi Master and not be at least DS I. I mean, Jesus, I'd argue Anakin was already DS I at the start of Ep. II! He was never a 'good' Jedi as we saw in the films), he was certainly a full-fledged darksider by the time he arrived on Mustafar. Anakin was a darkside character, fighting with the Sith, as a Sith, who used a blue saber. And it didn't blow up in his hand, or fail to turn on when he pressed the button, or anything else that an unequippable item might do. Edited March 3, 2012 by AJediKnight Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AKfourtyseven Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 I see this case as more evidence that a Sith WILL choose to use a red saber as a natural preference, trying to interpret these scenes as evidence that Sith use blue sabers is really, really silly. Ok, see now we are getting somewhere. A Sith will make the choice to use a red saber, but for that to be true it means they can also make the choice to use another colour entirely- since choice requires freedom. This game does not give darksiders the choice to use blue, so it does not represent even the argument you yourself presented. The scenes are not to prove Sith use blue sabers, its to prove that not all Sith are required to or did use Red. And the films are the highest authority in Star Wars, but if we consider this game is part of the Eu then restrictions go out of the window: Exar Kun rocked blue while being one of the most ****** Sith of his era. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Altyrell Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 Well Conciz, considering you are LIMITING us to ONLY the Movies for our Proof, yeah that means that Sith CAN use Blue Lightsabers. Oh, and he had to create a New Lightsaber because Kenobi STOLE his Blue Lightsaber. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cancrizans Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 Why would going LS as Empire require a faction change? Just because someone is in the Empire does not mean they are totally evil. Likewise, just because someone is Republic does not mean they are not completely rotten or totally corrupt. Even if my Sith Marauder decided to not slaughter everything that stood in his way, I'd still want to have red sabers because he's a Sith and still not a good person. Well, it is possible that a person could go Light as an Imperial because they have come to some realization and want to bring change from within...in which case I very much doubt they would be parading around with a blue or green lightsaber that yells "hay gusy I'm gonna be an individual and buck the trend" in this RIGID MILITARISTIC SOCIETY(per Biowares desciption). I see no other real reason someone would follow a Light Side path yet remain in service to the Empire. In the case of a "Jedi" making Dark Side choices...there is a serious difference between being a bit of a rebel and truly following the Dark Side. If you follow the Dark Side you are no longer a Jedi in spirit. Unless, again, you wanted to act as an instrument of change to corrupt the Jedi Order(in which case you would not be calling attention to yourself by sporting a red saber) there is no reason for you to remain a Jedi...you would simply defect to the Empire. And you don't have to be totally evil. The crystal colors are also a matter of tradition, one that is tightly connected to the NORM of Dark Side connected with Empire and Light with Republic. That tradition will be dismembered if Bioware makes this change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord_Scythe Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 That's a rather naive and wishful conception of how this stuff happens. Yet no less true. Any big changes to "canon" as you call it gets approved through Lucas Arts. One of my favorite authors, Jim Butcher, has been asked if he would ever write a Star Wars book since he is such a huge Star Wars fan. He said he would like to but Lucas Arts is very restrictive on what you can write about and they only pay scale. That means a lot of work to create a good book for very little pay. Why do you think so many of the books are meh or out right terrible? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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