1.1.5 - death of rarity and achievements?!

[Buttered]

and maybe by 1.1.2, or whatever patch we're talking about, the magenta crystals just wont be that good anymore, like how they are now, and so on...better things will always replace the best...but i get ur gripe OP

[Leovinus]

Could be. And if so, so what? No harm that a game is written for the (gasp) "casual". In fact, they represent a rather large portion of the total playerbase these days.

 

I would also wonder at the "good at mmos" bit. Well, yes, I suppose "good" can be defined as "beats the content quickly". If so, I'm sure glad I am "not good at mmos". I can have fun for a long, long time!

 

I would have quoted the same post you did, but I don't know where it is, and I don't feel like going back through the whole thread to find it, but I agree with you.

 

And I'll say this.

 

The people who are "good at MMOs" and have already left, are the types who never, EVER stay with an MMO long. They plow through content so fast that no developer ever could cater to them and remain profitable, because they would be the only ones playing that game, and it would require a dev team the size of which could only be paid for with WoW like income.

[Gohlar]

You would be wrong, though. See...I intend to play every class, mainly for the stories but also because I enjoy tinkering with builds and seeing how I can dither along with what I think is effective and/or interesting to play. Now...I may not play the "mirror" classes (jugg vs. guard. etc.) but I will work my characters to 50 and have fun doing it.

 

See, I'm in no hurry. Getting to 50 is NOT, I repeat NOT my goal. I've seen too many people get there in a blazing hurry and then...deflate. No. I will enjoy the journey.

 

So, no...I will not be leaving before long. I've been here since 27 December and my highest char. is 37. See? No blazing to end game for me. No driving need to see 50. Too busy seeing the REST of the game.

 

I didn't blaze to endgame at all, I watched all the movies, I did lots of stuff leveling up. It took me over a month. I mean if you play 3 hours a week that's cool but if you play more than that there really isn't that much game to be played. It sounds like you are trying to make excuses for what is really not a very good mmo. The "REST" of the game? I bet you don't even know what that means...

 

None of this changes the fact that the game is just plain bad at 50 and I don't think endlessly rerolling alts is a recipe for success. In fact, that's the worst design philosophy for an mmo I've ever heard of.

 

At this point you are happy with literally whatever happens and that's fine, but I'm warning you, it's going to wear off and it's going to happen very suddenly. Once the illusion of quality wears off and you realize how stale the design here is you'll see.

 

There is a reason nobody is sticking around, don't say I didn't warn you.

Edited February 25, 2012 by Gohlar

[Didact]

Ok... I've seen new vendors in public test server for 1.1.5 and I'm seriously terrified buy what's about to come.

 

Looks like Bioware plans to screw everyone who achieved something.

 

See what we get:

- Magenta crystal schematics almost free from vendor.

- Very rare Ops speeders for 1m from vendor

- PvP and daily speeders for 1M+ from vendor

- VIP speeder from vendor

- all rare color crystals, including crystals from Karraga drops PvE sabers almost free from vendor. Or at higher cost, but still only credits - no achievement involved.

 

What the heck?!

 

My guild downed world bosses about 20 times to get specific magenta crystals schematics. It was a huge achievement engaging guild multiple times on raids always requiring our artificer to come online when we groupped and it took few weeks to get it.

Now everyone will get it for 25k

 

I took part in Ops god-knows how many times and still don't have cyan color crystal, and each time I see player with PvE saber using it I see someone who achieved something I thrive for (ps. Screw the rakata black-core saber, it's a joke) - now you plan to give it away for some spare cash I earn by selling one high-grade item on GTN.

 

I won't even say anything about introducing more black-core sabers, especially for lvl50 players which is A HUGE IMMERSION BREAKER. Now all the ppl who care nothing about lore will run with this joke in Star Wars looking like a training saber being absolutely sure it makes them "l33t" and "special" cause they preordered (ps. it's not about being jelaous - I got preorder, I got rakata saber, it doesn't change anything) or bought stuff for 25k at vendor

 

Ps. Before someone pop-up telling that it won't hit the live servers - give me a quote. Otherwise it's just random opinion.

 

REMARKS:

- It's not about "feeling special" - it's about having an objective in game. And keeping things people worked for worthwhile. And having the point in keeping subscription instead of just getting all the stuff from vendor in moment one hits lvl50.

- Patch 1.1.5 won't make your crafting useful. 1.2 will but we aren't talking about that patch. Also: The artificers get screwed most of all by 1.1.5 cause we won't need you anymore after 1.2 - all the crystals majority of people thrive for will be handled to us from vendors already.

- I'm a casual player, not "hardcore raider" as majority of people falsely assume here. And as casual I ask for keeping achievement items as an achievements instead of give-away stuff

 

Prices on the test servers are not necessarily final. Blizzard did this all the time with their PTRs by making raids easier to test mechanic functionality or providing high end gear for cheap so that set bonuses worked as intended.

 

Whatever the case, getting angry over something on the test servers is a little ridiculous. They're there to test content, not an early copy of the upcoming patch for you to enjoy. For all you know, that vendor is a temporary convenience so that the things he sells can be easily accessed. In short, complain about the patch when it is finalized and released, not before anything is set in stone.

[Nightfox_]

Perhaps in 1.2, Rakata will no longer be top tier, and saber-crystal colors will have new rare colors obtainable by artifice, and drops only?

 

This might just be a credit sink for the economy, a chance for some newer players to catch up, after the hard-cores have already been farming for at least a month. Then we get new stuff, and the first to have it again.

Edited February 25, 2012 by Nightfox_

[Gohlar]

Prices on the test servers are not necessarily final. Blizzard did this all the time with their PTRs by making raids easier to test mechanic functionality or providing high end gear for cheap so that set bonuses worked as intended.

 

Whatever the case, getting angry over something on the test servers is a little ridiculous. They're there to test content, not an early copy of the upcoming patch for you to enjoy. For all you know, that vendor is a temporary convenience so that the things he sells can be easily accessed. In short, complain about the patch when it is finalized and released, not before anything is set in stone.

 

Wait, giving feedback over things on the test server is ridiculous?

 

Um....no.

[Jamus_Divinus]

Problem is you will get bored and leave before long.

 

Wait and see, I loved this game until 50. After that it gets very old very fast and the VAST majority of players quit shortly after hitting 50, myself included. I got a time card for Christmas and the forums are more fun than the game at 50, that's the only reason I can post.

 

Honestly, it is short sighted. Now the poor quality at 50 is a much bigger problem, but it's still not good to trivialize rewards imo.

 

Vast majority of players quit at lvl 50?

 

Are you another one of those people who use their opinions as facts.

 

My guild is still growing. Not one person has unsubbed yet. My server is steady pop-wise. Not sure when you crossed the line between opinion and fact but it seems like it was a long time ago...in a galaxy far, far away

 

I have 3 lvl 50 toons. I raid 3 times a week. I pvp in the downtime. Been playing since Dec 13th.

 

I have many features I'd like to see in TOR. As many things i'd like to see adjusted/fixed. However please don't speak on other's behalf. Noone voted for you to represent them. You believe many are quitting at lvl 50...I don't agree.

[DieAlteHexe]

I didn't blaze to endgame at all, I watched all the movies, I did lots of stuff leveling up. It took me over a month. I mean if you play 3 hours a week that's cool but if you play more than that there really isn't that much game to be played.

 

None of this changes the fact that the game is just plain bad at 50 and I don't think endlessly rerolling alts is a recipe for success. In fact, that's the worst design philosophy for an mmo I've ever heard of.

 

At this point you are happy with literally whatever happens and that's fine, but I'm warning you, it's going to wear off and it's going to happen very suddenly. Once the illusion of quality wears off and you realize how stale the design here is you'll see.

 

Don't say I didn't warn you.

 

Okay. You warned me. Thank you. Very kind of you to be so concerned with my welfare!

 

I do, however, think I might just know me a bit better than you do.

 

Stale design or "formula that works"? Same diff? And that doesn't bother me over much. I was not expecting anything earth-shatteringly different. Only so much that CAN be done with an MMO that is meant to appeal to the masses. Get too deviant from that and you can go sit next to Brad McQuaid and have a wee chat.

 

But tell you what, drop me a PM with an email and I PROMISE (not a thing taken lightly by me) that I shall email you when the time comes that I am bored. It will happen, I know that but I don't see that occuring any time soon. I'm entirely too busy with friends, quests, fiddling with characters, learning new stuff etc. I also want to see where this game goes over the next year or so (which is usually about my limit anyway for an MMO).

 

But I promise to let you know when you are "right". Deal?

[Gohlar]

Vast majority of players quit at lvl 50?

 

Are you another one of those people who use their opinions as facts.

 

No, I use facts as facts. My server is empty. The server list shows most servers are empty. Mine is listed as standard and is a ghost town.

 

These are not opinions, these are facts. Retention is a HUGE problem.

 

I do, however, think I might just know me a bit better than you do.

 

 

No you are following the same path that nearly everyone does. Defend the game before you've played it only to be disappointed once you actually have played it.

 

I used to be just like you. You call it a formula that works, if it works for you hey cool but I haven't seen people bail like this since Warhammer.

Edited February 25, 2012 by Gohlar

[Jamus_Divinus]

No, I use facts as facts. My server is empty. The server list shows most servers are empty. Mine is listed as standard and is a ghost town.

 

These are not opinions, these are facts. Retention is a HUGE problem.

 

They are not facts. Having the ability to string 2 words together and formulate an opinion does not make you Yoda matey.

 

You can speak for your own server. I can speak for mine. Anything else is you extrapolating an opinion from a brief gander at the server lists.

 

I may be right. You may be instead. Regardless we don't have any hard numbers so it's speculation at best.

Edited February 25, 2012 by Jamus_Divinus

[tegororn]

Although i'm not interested in these Magenta crystal schematics, very rare Ops speeders for 1m from vendor, VIP speeder from vendor or all rare color crystals, i totally agree with OP.

 

Swtor is already a casual friendly so called MMO. Don't take the fun from ppl's hands who organize and struggle to gain these rare items. And these items are not so many in numbers in this game.

[Cyclonit]

The game engine can't even handle 24v24, there will be no large scale pvp in this game.

 

And I still cannot believe that this is a fact (I know it is but I don't know how BW did this). Comparing this game to BF3 is kind of redundant but in BF3 I get faster loading screens when I join 64 player servers than I get when I enter my own space ship and higher framerates too.

[DieAlteHexe]

...No you following the same path that nearly everyone does. Defend the game before you've played it only to be disappointed once you actually have played it.

 

I used to be just like you. You call it a formula that works, you are wrong and will eventually see.

 

Dood. I am playing it. Well, not at this precise moment. And know what? IF I get to 50 with a character and find that you are right, then I will have had fun on the way. If that's ALL I get out of the game, it was entertainment time well spent. I'm not defending anything here, actually, except my way of gaming. I do it, 'til it's no longer fun.

 

The minute it ceases to be fun, I'm gone. That's how I've handled every MMO since UO days. Some lasted years, some lasted months, some had me saying: Urk, I might as well have just tossed that money down the flusher.

 

So what? Not the end of the world.

[Gohlar]

They are not facts. Having the ability to string 2 words together and forumlate an opinion does not make you Yoda matey.

 

You can speak for your own server. I can speak for mine. Anything else is you extrapolating an opinion from a brief gander at the server lists.

 

I may be right. You may be instead. Regardless we don't have any hard numbers so it's speculation at best.

 

Unless the server status is wrong, which I doubt it is, this game is sinking faster than the Titanic.

[Cyclonit]

So what? Not the end of the world.

 

But seeing myself uninstalling a game which I have waited 4 years for is disappointing non the less.

[Valkirus]

this will only bother people with mentality like this: "i've got it the hard way so noone else should have it easier"

 

if anything - it should matter only to you that you got it the hard way, leave the rest alone

 

I agree. There is no problem with the changes. Only for those who want to feel specail and not see anyone esle with them. They will be expensive, so not like many will get them unless they "earn" a lot of credits before this patch goes live. Good change Bioware.

[Gohlar]

But seeing myself uninstalling a game which I have waited 4 years for is disappointing non the less.

 

Exactly.

[Jamus_Divinus]

Unless the server status is wrong, which I doubt it is, this game is sinking faster than the Titanic.

 

Ah that's the death knell of your credibility. Pity. Had the makings of a nice discussion.

 

The game is sinking faster than the Titanic. Well, we both know you won't be missed with that attitude.

 

Pity, once more.

Edited February 25, 2012 by Jamus_Divinus

[tegororn]

Vast majority of players quit at lvl 50?

 

Are you another one of those people who use their opinions as facts.

 

My guild is still growing. Not one person has unsubbed yet. My server is steady pop-wise. Not sure when you crossed the line between opinion and fact but it seems like it was a long time ago...in a galaxy far, far away

 

I have 3 lvl 50 toons. I raid 3 times a week. I pvp in the downtime. Been playing since Dec 13th.

 

I have many features I'd like to see in TOR. As many things i'd like to see adjusted/fixed. However please don't speak on other's behalf. Noone voted for you to represent them. You believe many are quitting at lvl 50...I don't agree.

 

I can speak for my guild on Trayus Academy. We were never a huge guild. Almost 20 ppl with 8-10 online. Now only 2 of us left online.

 

There uesd to be 60-80 ppl in Republic Fleet on Rep side now there are usually 40.

 

And yes the populatin is dropping, at least in my server.

[Valkirus]

But seeing myself uninstalling a game which I have waited 4 years for is disappointing non the less.

 

And you would uninstall TOR because of these changes? Get real. If this type of changes have a serous impact on your enjoyment of the game...I suggest you move along or change your "high horse" mentality.

[DieAlteHexe]

But seeing myself uninstalling a game which I have waited 4 years for is disappointing non the less.

 

Yup. It is. And I'm sorry that happened to you. I guess I'm the opposite side of the coin. I was happily dithering along in Rift and got dragged into playing this (husband would NOT shut up about it and guilted me into playing SWTOR). Surprisingly (very), I ended up liking it.

 

Sorry you were so dissappointed.

[Gohlar]

Ah that's the deathknell of your credibility. Pity. Had the makings of a nice discussion.

 

The game is sinking faster than the Titanic. Well, we both know you won't be missed with that attitude.

 

Pity, once more.

 

Truth is truth man, denial won't get you anywhere.

 

Honestly the population "argument" isn't even an argument. It's a fact. Everyone knows it, they do track population change and it's down across the board. Servers once populated are now ghost towns. They spent like 300 million and they can't even fill up 3 servers in the US.

 

It's bad man. Content is going to come extremely slowly. Things are going to get worse before they get better, if they ever even do.

Edited February 25, 2012 by Gohlar

[Jamus_Divinus]

I can speak for my guild on Trayus Academy. We were never a huge guild. Almost 20 ppl with 8-10 online. Now only 2 of us left online.

 

There uesd to be 60-80 ppl in Republic Fleet on Rep side now there are usually 40.

 

And yes the populatin is dropping, at least in my server.

 

I believe you mate.

 

All I speak for is my server (Nightmare Lands) and my guild (Dark Legion). I can use those numbers to show the health of only my server/guild. I can't speak for the game as a whole as I don't have access to those figures.

[Cyclonit]

And you would uninstall TOR because of these changes? Get real. If this type of changes have a serous impact on your enjoyment of the game...I suggest you move along or change your "high horse" mentality.

 

It's not just those changes but they are part of my disappointment. If Bioware does implement all of this with patch 1.1.5 (may it be temporarily) they show, that they do not give a damn on those who actually enjoy spending hours in the game raiding or playing PVP.

 

Oh and would you mind giving me one reason for me to change my "high horse" mentality? If I recall correctly "high horse" mentality is what allowed the whole technical revolution of the past 100 years. Always being happy with what you get might be easier, but does not get you anywhere.

[MackumDog]

Ah that's the death knell of your credibility. Pity. Had the makings of a nice discussion.

 

The game is sinking faster than the Titanic. Well, we both know you won't be missed with that attitude.

 

Pity, once more.

 

The Titanic took about 3 to 4 hours to sink (depending on what report you read ) , in shipping terms thats an achievement The Lusitania took 18 minutes.