Upcoming titles = pvp a lost cause in SWTOR?

[Ryton]

The same thing happened when WOW released BC. Everyone would get pissed if you attacked the other faction in Hellfire Peninsula because then you couldn't quest due to the all out PVP war. I for one thoroughly enjoyed the battle that ensued.

[Kaarak]

very good read

http://www.darkademic.co.uk/blog?id=202

 

Pretty big point. You can have sex 1000 times and have nothing to show for it.

Gotta have progression and achievements as reward for great sex, otherwise the nerds won't come.

 

The experience of the activity is often all the reward needed, if that experience is good.

Fun activities do not require progression. Progression is a cheap substitute.

 

Were there MMOs in the last couple of years without gear-progression in pvp?

I think GW was the only one in the last 7 years and it worked, it had a big pvp-community of mostly hardcore pvp'ers (in the competitive formats atleast).

But GW could only work this way, cause they had enjoyable content for pvp'ers, which SWTOR lacks completely.

[Chrisbox]

Its not bioware or our fault if the people on your server hate actual pvp. Ilum is extremely fun with two even forces.

[Candykissesxoxo]

Wether or not GW2 will fail or not noone really knows. But you can bet your ***** i'll be trying it. If it sucks then i'll move on to the next on my quest for the best pvp experience I can find. So far it looks good...but then again this game looked promising as well =/ we'll see.

[TehMerc]

Did that quote really compare pvp to sex?

 

ooooook........

[WoodyDave]

Its not bioware or our fault if the people on your server hate actual pvp. Ilum is extremely fun with two even forces.

 

This must be your first mmo

[HileyQuiggley]

If GW2 comes out without any gamebreaking bugs then im all over it. They are taking their time with the beta's so thats a good sign. If they listen to feedback unlike some other company I forget who then the game will be just fine.

 

If not, there is always DAoC

[TehMerc]

If not, there is always DAoC

 

 

Ugh, nostalgia. People never wanna remember all the crap that came along with Dark Age.

[HileyQuiggley]

Ugh, nostalgia. People never wanna remember all the crap that came along with Dark Age.

 

What?! You saying this is crap?

 

http://www.gametrailers.com/user-movie/daoc-dem-hibbies/168579

[TehMerc]

What?! You saying this is crap?

 

 

Dark Age's 3 realm combat and siege warfare was really great don't get me wrong, it kept me happy for a bit even though my first computer could never handle the major keep battles so I stuck to the battlegrounds. Crafting was fun too, but after that it was all pretty meh. Class balance was pretty non-existant. You had to have certain classes to even have a chance most of the time, etc.

 

I'd certainly be happy if more MMO's stole it's siege warfare and had more than 2 factions. Dark can keep the rest though.

[Rhogn]

I'm hoping the majority of people who want gear grinds, only want it because they have never played a MMO without it. People actually enjoy the 'grind'?

 

Seems a big portion of the pop thinks gear grind = mmo = imutable law of physics.

 

Related to the above is that people like win. To increase odds of winning people like to play with an advantage - see fotm, camping lowbie zones etc. People don't like grinds per se - but they like the advantage that finishing a grind gets them and that the grind is there to slow others from matching them.........take away obtaining an advantage by living in game 12 hours a day then you'd be left with what?...player skill?...blasphemy...this is an MMO!

 

I'm looking fwd to GW2, and hope it is successful and can at least show another model that works. Any mmo that introduces new ideas can help move the industry forward and we all benefit imo....and BW should not be shy about taking what works from any of them.

[CaptainInsano]

i mean, yeah let's be honest. GW2 will marginalize this game's PvP to the point of a very tiny minority of Star Wars diehards. This game wasn't built for PvP and GW2 is, and it shows. A lot of PvPers are just playing this because its the hot new MMO for now, the ones who haven't left already that is. Edited February 21, 2012 by CaptainInsano

[Rasheth]

Lets look at some numbers now while these are not the end all be all I think they raise some interesting questions.

 

 

Youtube search Guild Wars 2 most viewed video 1,000,656 views (9 months ago) was previously around 974,000 last time I posted this info 10 DAYS AGO) check my post history.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xBC_ig73aMs

 

Youtube search SWTOR Most viewed video 8,000,000+ (1 year ago) 2,451,327 for video 7 month ago. (was 2,000,000 mil last time I posted this info 10 DAYS AGO)

 

Update on illum open world 3,053 Replies

 

Post 1.1 Illum issues 2,820 Replies

 

 

I've been checking this info because I think well forum perception sometimes isnt reality in swtor.

 

If you just look at the number 1 thread with the number 1 amount of replies in the PvP forums 3k isnt anything and as many so called hardcore pvpers want to believe they are small percentage of population they are not.

 

Im pretty sure more than 3k people pvp in this game. Most probably don't hit the forums.

 

In my opinion most are idle threats of quitting and if they do in the end 3k or 2k or 5k if you want to combined the numbers isnt significant at all compared to 1.7 mil subs

 

If you look at the video views you see SWTOR has a video that has gained 400,000 views in 10 days.

 

Guildwars 2 Gained around 30,000 in that same time period and that video has been out longer period of time than the SWTOR video which is closest i could find around that time.

 

So to me this says GW2 has buzz but it isnt no where near the casual buzz which is what would make it this SWTOR Killer or WoW killer for that matter. Anyone that knows about GW2 is gonna buy it and I wish it success Ill buy it probably but if you read these forums and believe everything its the next messiah MMO that based of these numbers has less buzz than SWTOR.

 

TL;DR PvP is probably fine for most in this game needs work but enjoyable probably to most that play it. Forums full of troll spreading misinformation and alot of doomsayers in the pvp forums (some not all)

 

GW2 has buzz but its not as big as these forums make it seem to be.

Edited February 21, 2012 by Rasheth

[WoodyDave]

Lets look at some numbers now while these are not the end all be all I think they raise some interesting questions.

 

 

Youtube search Guild Wars 2 most viewed video 1,000,656 views (9 months ago) was previously around 974,000 last time I posted this info 10 DAYS AGO) check my post history.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xBC_ig73aMs

 

Youtube search SWTOR Most viewed video 8,000,000+ (1 year ago) 2,451,327 for video 7 month ago. (was 2,000,000 mil last time I posted this info 10 DAYS AGO)

 

Update on illum open world 3,053 Replies

 

Post 1.1 Illum issues 2,820 Replies

 

 

I've been checking this info because I think well forum perception sometimes isnt reality in swtor.

 

If you just look at the number 1 thread with the number 1 amount of replies in the PvP forums 3k isnt anything and as many so called hardcore pvpers want to believe they are small percentage of population they are not.

 

Im pretty sure more than 3k people pvp in this game. Most probably don't hit the forums.

 

In my opinion most are idle threats of quitting and if they do in the end 3k or 2k or 5k if you want to combined the numbers isnt significant at all compared to 1.7 mil subs

 

If you look at the video views you see SWTOR has a video that has gained 400,000 views in 10 days.

 

Guildwars 2 Gained around 30,000 in that same time period and that video has been out longer period of time than the SWTOR video which is closest i could find around that time.

 

So to me this says GW2 has buzz but it isnt no where near the casual buzz which is what would make it this SWTOR Killer or WoW killer for that matter. Anyone that knows about GW2 is gonna buy it and I wish it success Ill buy it probably but if you read these forums and believe everything its the next messiah MMO that based of these numbers has less buzz than SWTOR.

 

TL;DR PvP is probably fine for most in this game needs work but enjoyable probably to most that play it. Forums full of troll spreading misinformation and alot of doomsayers in the pvp forums (some not all)

 

GW2 has buzz but its not as big as these forums make it seem to be.

 

GW wasnt as popular to look up as swtor at the time. SWTOR was the spotlight for a while because it was closer to release, and the fact that its bioware.

 

Thats slowly changing now that the press beta is over and we're starting to get actual info. With the failure that is swtor pvp, its only going to increase now that the WvWvW videos are out.

 

Now add this into the equation. Swtor was getting its fair share of good and bad reviews during press beta events. Guess what? There hasnt been a single bad review for gw2 yet. Go check ign, gamespy, mmorpg.com, all of which are saying this game beats anything that is currently released. Even the questing system that gw2 uses makes the old click and accept system that wow/rift/swtor use and turns them into an embarrassment.

 

. And if there is a bad review, i'd certainly like to see it.

Edited February 21, 2012 by WoodyDave

[AesirUesugi]

I feel for you OP, this never happens on my server. QUite frankly due to the decreased spawn rate on boxes it wouldn't even be feasible with anything more than 5-6 at central gathering at any one time.

[Rasheth]

GW wasnt as popular to look up as swtor at the time. SWTOR was the spotlight for a while because it was closer to release, and the fact that its bioware.

 

Thats slowly changing now that the press beta is over and we're starting to get actual info. With the failure that is swtor pvp, its only going to increase now that the WvWvW videos are out.

 

Now add this into the equation. Swtor was getting its fair share of good and bad reviews during press beta events. Guess what? There hasnt been a single bad review for gw2 yet. And if there is, i'd certainly like to see it.

 

Read again man. I posted those video numbers 10 days ago. SWTOR has been out since then it has gained 400,000 views in 10 days.

 

GW2 video gained 30,000 in that same time span.

 

So how is SWTOR gaining 400,000 views in 10 days and the game has been out for almost 3 months now and some have played it longer than that in beta? That video is the opening cinematic for SWTOR btw.

 

I understand being optimistic but my point is that there isnt no where near as much hype as you would like to believe it is or some on these forums. There are tons of GW2 videos out there already.

 

Just be realistic

[Jebi]

Lets look at some numbers now while these are not the end all be all I think they raise some interesting questions.

 

Youtube search Guild Wars 2 most viewed video 1,000,656 views (9 months ago) was previously around 974,000 last time I posted this info 10 DAYS AGO) check my post history.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xBC_ig73aMs

 

Youtube search SWTOR Most viewed video 8,000,000+ (1 year ago) 2,451,327 for video 7 month ago. (was 2,000,000 mil last time I posted this info 10 DAYS AGO)

 

OMG, a live mainstream star wars themed PVE MMO with million dollar cinematics and massive marketing campaign is getting more hits than an MMO that doesn't even have an official release date yet!!!!!

 

TL;DR PvP is probably fine for most in this game needs work but enjoyable probably to most that play it.

 

In English please?

 

Forums full of troll spreading misinformation and alot of doomsayers in the pvp forums (some not all)

 

There were plenty of your kind around to, but they seem to be a dying breed.

 

GW2 has buzz but its not as big as these forums make it seem to be.

 

The fact that there is so much buzz here, on the TOR PVP forum, kinda speaks volumes in itself. But feel free to listen to chat in game, check out other game forums etc... GW2 is a pretty hot topic.

 

But TBH, i couldn't care too much about the popularity contest - like many others, I just want a good PVP MMO. Unfortunately TOR fell well short of that mark. Will GW2 hit it? Who knows, time will tell.

 

TLDR: nobody cares about youtube hits or popularity contests. If you want popularity go back to WOW and put your britney spears album back in.

Edited February 21, 2012 by Jebi

[Rasheth]

OMG, a live mainstream star wars themed PVE MMO with million dollar cinematics and massive marketing campaign is getting more hits than an unreleased MMO!!!!!!!

 

OMG the opening cinematic for a game thats been out for 3 months = new users = game not dying

 

 

The fact that there is so much buzz here, on the TOR PVP forum, kinda speaks volumes in itself.

 

Again it doesnt and the fact that you think these forums (especially the pvp forums) speaks volumes of anything shows your lack of perspective. If you read my original posts number 1 replied topic in pvp forums is 3k. You think that the pvp forums has alot of unique posters or the same ones over and over? I'll take the latter

 

But TBH, i couldn't care too much about the popularity contest - like many others, I just want a good PVP MMO. Unfortunately TOR fell well short of that mark. Will GW2 hit it? Who knows, time will tell.

 

TLDR: nobody cares about youtube hits or popularity contests.

Edited February 21, 2012 by Rasheth

[WoodyDave]

Read again man. I posted those video numbers 10 days ago. SWTOR has been out since then it has gained 400,000 views in 10 days.

 

GW2 video gained 30,000 in that same time span.

 

So how is SWTOR gaining 400,000 views in 10 days and the game has been out for almost 3 months now and some have played it longer than that in beta? That video is the opening cinematic for SWTOR btw.

 

I understand being optimistic but my point is that there isnt no where near as much hype as you would like to believe it is or some on these forums. There are tons of GW2 videos out there already.

 

Just be realistic

 

 

So what you're saying is, by your logic....

 

 

You like Justin Bieber?

Edited February 21, 2012 by WoodyDave

[Jebi]

OMG the opening cinematic for a game thats been out for 3 months = new users = game not dying

 

Proof?

 

They could just be star wars fans looking at the cinematic for entertainment value, which most of the comments seem to suggest.

 

And anyway, relevance?

 

Again it doesnt. If you read my original posts number 1 replied topic in pvp forums is 3k thats alot of people? You think that the pvp forums has alot of unique posters or the same ones over and over? I'll take the latter

 

Except it does, when this is just one EXAMPLE. It definitely doesn't prove the opposite to be true, like your somewhat insinuating.

 

Go to any gaming or MMO forum, or listen to chat in game. GW2 is talked about a LOT.

 

Nobody is saying that GW2 is going to be a big as TOR - a mainstream 200-300 million $ cookie cutter PVE focused MMO, but it's going to be pretty damn popular.

 

I still fail to see your point, or what you are trying to prove. Maybe it's just a case of my MMO is more popular than your unreleased MMO, so mines better? (after seeing your signature, i think that's pretty much it - you think every mmo should be about you).

Edited February 21, 2012 by Jebi

[Rasheth]

So what you're saying is, by your logic....

 

 

You like Justin Bieber?

 

Apples to Apples

 

My logic is that many people post on these forums talk about GW2. In reality these forums as a whole are a small portion of the population that play this game.

 

I'd be willing to bet that hardcore pvpers are the ones that come to the pvp forums for the most part and complain they are moving to the next big thing (insert name here) when its released.

 

I am not directly comparing popularity for the point to say SWTOR is more popular than GW2 omgzorz. I am saying that you must take the majority of these things on the forums at face value.

 

Before swtor came out these same people saying OMG GW2 probably said OMG SWTOR pvp.

[sumfizz]

I think SWTOR was never planning on having as much of thier fan base be into PvP as they have. This has caused them to have to attempt to change things as they go in order to keep them...

 

For Bioware not see that a large part of their player base would be PVP oriented shows an amazing lack of vision on their part. This is Star Wars, an epic story about the struggle between good and evil. Really, how could anyone not see this?

[Rasheth]

Proof?

 

They could just be star wars fans looking at the cinematic for entertainment value, which most of the comments seem to suggest.

 

And anyway, relevance?

 

 

 

Except it does, when this is just one EXAMPLE. It definitely doesn't prove the opposite to be true, like your somewhat insinuating.

 

Go to any gaming or MMO forum, or listen to chat in game. GW2 is talked about a LOT.

 

Nobody is saying that GW2 is going to be a big as TOR - a mainstream 200-300 million $ cookie cutter PVE focused MMO, but it's going to be pretty damn popular.

 

I still fail to see your point.

 

My point is that people are trying to say basically SWTOR has until GW2 comes out or I'm leaving.

 

If we changed the scenario and lets say SWTOR had great PvP that everyone liked you included. GW2 comes out and buzz picks up and everyone is saying whoa GW2 has great PvP not necessarily better but still great PvP.

 

So lets say hypothetically SWTOR: Great PvP everyone loves = GW2: PvP everyone loves

 

Would you still buy GW2 even though you already have SWTOR and like its PvP?

 

Point is if people are interested in GW2 PvP they more than likely planned to buy it or try it in beta anyway. So GW2 does not in fact = SWTOR PvP has MADE ME buy GW2 for its PvP.

Edited February 21, 2012 by Rasheth

[Audenlol]

Aion made me hate hat hate hate ncsoft.

 

 

Like with a passion hate.

[WoodyDave]

Apples to Apples

 

My logic is that many people post on these forums talk about GW2. In reality these forums as a whole are a small portion of the population that play this game.

 

I'd be willing to bet that hardcore pvpers are the ones that come to the pvp forums for the most part and complain they are moving to the next big thing (insert name here) when its released.

 

I am not directly comparing popularity for the point to say SWTOR is more popular than GW2 omgzorz. I am saying that you must take the majority of these things on the forums at face value.

 

Before swtor came out these same people saying OMG GW2 probably said OMG SWTOR pvp.

 

Actually, most of us pvpers were trying to submit feedback on how bad ilum was turning out. Most of us submitting feedback were ripped to shreds by the swtor fanbois, as this game is somehow perfect and has no flaws. It got so bad that any kind of feedback or criticism was quickly deleted because it turned into a flame war within 3 posts. Those were the "omg swtor pvp amazing" people you are referring too.

 

Those of us currently following the press beta details for gw2 haven't been disappointed yet. Unlike swtor which was getting mixed reviews at this point in development.