Server population is dropping...

[Strangefate]

That did make me laugh.

 

Im in Alderaan right now, lvl 30, its about prime time. There's this guy who has been asking for a group for 'Red Handed' (last Rep Heroic on the planet) for over a half hour.

Tough luck for him tho, cause there's only 15 people on the planet...

 

And that, has nothing to do with people wanting or not wanting to play with anybody sadly.

 

 

And saying that the devs know anything is second guessing, if devs generally did, we wouldn't be playing on empty servers and other MMOs like Warhammer wouldn't have failed.

 

I really like this game, and I want to enjoy the typical things of an MMO, mainly the massively part of it, with a community and people around to play with.

[BlackZoback]

I really like this game, and I want to enjoy the typical things of an MMO, mainly the massively part of it, with a community and people around to play with.

 

Join a guild, problem solved.

[BlackZoback]

ok, now you are just frustrating me. Do you seriously think the population is holding steady or growing? Anyone that plays this game can SEE the decline in population for themselves. I don't have to read the forums to know that it's true. I can see it for myself. So can you, open your freakin eyes and quit lying to yourself.

 

Already posted number that show, that the population is growing, page 80 bottom post.

 

Feel free to disprove it.

[Strangefate]

I don't need to disprove anything, I just need to look at my server.

 

I shouldn't have to ask a guild for help to be able to make it through the regular content on a MMO that just came out because most planets are empty... that's just avoiding the issue.

 

 

Its like me saying hey, these tomatoes I bought from you are rotten, and you saying: but the bananas are good, eat those instead.

[Andryah]

"Standard" is based off the same method for finding the "light" number, found one server with 1038 people and another with 1385 people, both in the "standard" category.

 

Feel free to disprove me, but use numbers and not speculation.

 

Yeah, I have done a level based /who on both factions on enough STANDARD servers now to know that they have STANDARD set to 1000-1500 right now. In both EU and NA, most servers are STANDARD during the 5 hour prime time local time and the LIGHT and HEAVY+ are about equal now days during prime time. Which means they cancel out and you can just consider every server effectively STANDARD at prime time.

 

So that is 226,000 to 339,000 concurrent players during prime time windows. Being generous in favor of the "population is dropping" crowd, let's assume 20% of accounts active at any given time. That means 1.1-1.7 million active accounts. If you use a more realistic 15% assumption (since a lot of people self admit they are logging on less since they capped level, holidays are over, more work or school, etc. etc.), the number is 1.5-2.25 million.

 

It's not rocket science to run the numbers and see where things stand at the macro level. The trend is upward right now.

 

Now, that does not mean there are not some servers with serious faction imbalances, and losing populations. It just means that the sky is not falling like some people would like you to think. Character transfers are coming (according to Bioware) and you can re-roll on a more desireable server if you cannot wait (or cancel and come back when they activate character transfers. You have the ability to stop playing the victim and do something about it.

 

What is annoying in this discussion though is people saying, oiy....it's 1 AM and my server only has 25 people in fleet. 1) 1:00 AM local time IS-NOT prime time 2) fleet IS-NOT a valid test of population anymore on the servers.

Edited March 6, 2012 by Andryah

[Strangefate]

This is funny. Always the same type of people who complain.

 

Here is the simple answer. People dont want to play with you. It isnt that the server pop is dropping. nope that is ok. They are out and about doing their thing and running with their guilds. Chances are they decided that due to other bad experiences with various tools that they simply dont want to answer a call whenever someone post for a run. Second point. You decided to rush through the content as fast as possible. Now you are bored. Your options are simple. Run with your guild; create an alt and join those who are doing the low level runs; wait...as in just wait and see what occurs (as in give it time); or leave.

 

These complaints are the same complaints that occurred with Rift. They opened servers up due to a heavy launch. Cries went out to "merge" servers due to "low pop". Guess what? Those who complained left. No servers were merged and Rift is now a year old and apparently is expanding into new markets.

 

The thing I ask is simple. Just wait and see what develops. The developers know when it is time to merge if the need arises. Now is not that time.

 

 

 

Actually, RIFT had server mergers and people seem now happy with the population density.

[Andryah]

I shouldn't have to ask a guild for help to be able to make it through the regular content on a MMO that just came out because most planets are empty... that's just avoiding the issue.

 

You do not need any group to get to level 50. You can solo this game just fine unless you fight nekid, with no companion, and use a cheese shreder for a weapon.

 

If you want to do end game content at level 50, YES you need to joing a guild. That is common sense, even on a high population server.

[Andryah]

Actually, RIFT had server mergers and people seem now happy with the population density.

 

RIFT did not take the merge approach.

 

Rift implemented character transfers (user decides, and moves) about 5 months into the game. They issued vacate notices on some really low pop servers (which means people needed to pick a new server and transfer by some date), and they retired the server after the end date (actually renamed them trial servers, which was just a good PR move).

Edited March 6, 2012 by Andryah

[Strangefate]

You do not need any group to get to level 50. You can solo this game just fine unless you fight nekid, with no companion, and use a cheese shreder for a weapon.

 

If you want to do end game content at level 50, YES you need to joing a guild. That is common sense, even on a high population server.

 

I don't know what game you're playing, Im playing an MMO, not a single player game.

 

 

 

RIFT did not take the merge approach. Rift implemented character transfers (user decides, and moves) about 5 months into the game. They issue vacate notices on some really low pop servers (which means people needed to pick a new server and transfer by some date), and they retired the server after the end date.

 

Same result, call it Tomato or tomahto... if that was what they want to do here, I'd be happy with it.

I really don't care whether they merge or offer free transfers, whatever bring more population will be fine for everybody I'm sure.

Edited March 6, 2012 by Strangefate

[BlackZoback]

Yeah, I have done a level based /who on both factions on enough STANDARD servers now to know that they have STANDARD set to 1000-1500 right now.

 

Good to know, I thought it was around those numbers. Went though about 10 servers and those where the highest and lowest numbers I found.

 

Any idea on Heavy and Very Heavy? I'm assuming its 1500-2000 and 2000-2500 but I have a feeling its a bigger increment then 500.

[Andryah]

I don't know what game you're playing, Im playing an MMO, not a single player game.

 

 

Now you are just whining. It's not like there are not people to play with in game, they just are not there at your beck and call.

 

If you play and MMO, join a guild. It's what people do in MMOs, well, until WoW went silly with it's last two expansions and people just went PUG rogue for the most part since their reps were crap anyway in many cases.

Edited March 6, 2012 by Andryah

[Andryah]

Good to know, I thought it was around those numbers. Went though about 10 servers and those where the highest and lowest numbers I found.

 

Any idea on Heavy and Very Heavy? I'm assuming its 1500-2000 and 2000-2500 but I have a feeling its a bigger increment then 500.

 

From my sampling, it looks like increments of +500 per step. I'm just not sure what the final step is between Full and Full-(with a queue). Because a server can be tagged as Full and still be taking log-ins, so I think their might be another 500 step between Full and actually beginning to queue logins.

Edited March 6, 2012 by Andryah

[Strangefate]

Now you are just whining. It's not like there are not people to play with in game, they just are not there at your beck and call.

 

If you play and MMO, join a guild. It's what people do in MMOs, well, until WoW went silly with it's last two expansions and people just went PUG rogue for the most part since their reps were crap anyway in many cases.

 

 

I'm not whining, I'm just stating something, and you're making no sense,

 

I have been playing all of tonight on Alderran, 14 people when I arrived, 23 now and it wont get any higher, this is as prime as prime time goes. Those are not healthy numbers for a server.

 

Don't say there's people around because there's clearly not, not here.

 

 

I've explained this before but I'll do it again. The game works with shards, a planet can have 400 players split into shards of whatever they want, 20, 50, 100 players...

People will still be able to chat and group up across shards, instances throw all players together, and people can switch to the shard they want by hand to join their group mates if they want.

That tech is already in the game and worked just great during release time.

Everybody was happy, nobody had to struggle to find groups.

 

They can have both things, healthy populations and zones that still feel empty enough through sharding, so that nobody has to wait in line for outdoor kills.

 

I've played many MMOs too in my life, and I can tell empty servers just fine, as can all the others with the same problem.

 

 

I may be wrong, but I don't think there's been any doom-sayers on this thread, I don't think that's what this is about at all.

There's just a problem and people like to talk about it.

Talking about issues usually helps dealing with them.

 

And that's really all there is to it.

[Madwooki]

Cause the peeps saying there are no server population issuse are the same ones that will tell you they get a 100fps everywhere in the game. The servers that are full are few and far between. The ones that aren't are told to reroll or quit. I have seen this pattern time and time again. The only recent game that hasnt made this mistake is...... wow.

[aligalahan]

First of all, I love the game. But lets separate expectations from reality:

 

According to users.telenet.be SWOTR west subscriptions has dropped from 1.8 million to around 1 million, this month. Given that WoW has 10 million subcriptions and around 2 million peak concurrent users (used as an example, never played WoW myself), and if we were to apply similar percentage around %20. Swotr has probably 200k peak concurrent users at this time (this number is not disclosed so we really dont know but see below).

 

In December my west coast server had around 100 concurrent users in popular areas (like Republic Fleet) in peak hours, but now I dont see more than 20 or 30 in RF. Almost all planet shards I play now have around 1 to 10 players. Heroics of the planets are now things of the past, only multiplayer option for me is either to play with guild friends, if they are available, or operations/flashpoints. (Note that I am not a big PvP player until I hit level 50 on all my alts). My server used to be Very Heavy. Not anymore, no.

 

I understand Bioware's usage of sharding is for ensuring to scale if there is a spike in concurrent users. But it is effectively killing their game.

 

There is no reason to server merge (yet), but merge the shards. GTN is also negatively effected by this sharding as well.

 

Let's hope that new updates bring some more excitement, but otherwise the downward trend is concerning.

 

Cheers

[Puppup]

Actually, RIFT had server mergers and people seem now happy with the population density.

 

Rift had several rounds of server transfers.

 

Musical chairs, they are always full when the music stops.

[Furok]

I dont know about server numbers but i do know my whole guild (of 24 former very active players) are now away from the game, some cancelled their subs and some didnt, most of us are awaiting 1.2 (and playing other games while doing so)

 

Dont get me wrong i love the game and so do my guild but we dont want to sit around doing nothing for 2 months either.

 

It's pretty obvious by now that Bioware totally dropped the ball regarding the endgame, on the other hand thats the only thing they need to work on from now on to get the game going again, or maybe they are targetting another type of audience that doesnt care about the usual endgame stuff like raids , progressing your character etc, i honestly dont know but i think 1.2 is going to be a very important patch for Sw:tor.

 

Anvil 50 Vanguard (main)

Rampage 50 Shadow (alt)

Hellscream 50 Scoundrel (alt)

Hidden Bek's server (EU)

Honorbound (guild)

Edited March 6, 2012 by Furok

[Duskrunner]

Ok seriously what exactly were you people then expecting at Endgame? This always also seems to be an issue with every MMO, including WoW. Only thing that anyone can do is give it time. Even though I dont play Rift anymore I still think it is one of the better MMO's on the market simply due to there being new content that comes out on a regular basis.

 

There seems to be this "big surprise" for people when they rush through the content and then wonder why there is nothing to do. It is not lack of foresight from any of the developers, and I am not singling out Bioware on this. It is with all game companies. Each MMO takes an ungodly amount of time to create and develop content, from story design, to game play music and sound effects, to world textures and etc. Today's player now seems to be more focused on getting themselves to Endgame as soon as possible. When they get there is when the normal complaints of having nothing to do occurs, and that the game is "dying" due to them not being able to find others to play with and do the things that they want to do. Why is this a surprise with any new MMO?

 

So my question to everyone who has an issue with Endgame in its current state, or feels that server transfers need to occur is this... Do you have the patience to wait a little while to see what the team (for any new MMO) is developing? If you dont then why not cancel? You would be saving yourself some money, and can always come back at a later date.

[Duskrunner]

 

There is no reason to server merge (yet), but merge the shards. GTN is also negatively effected by this sharding as well.

 

This right here. I agree with this statement in that there should be a requirement in a given shard before it needs to fracture off to create another. Well said, and remember you can always transfer over to those other shards.

[mSum]

Do you think Mass Effect 3 will cause some problems...I do.

[Quip]

Do you think Mass Effect 3 will cause some problems...I do.

 

Generally the release of a game like ME3 will cause a drop in activity more than a drop in subs. I know that when you're playing the number of subs is irrelevant if no one is doing anything but a drop in activity like that is seldom permanent.

 

I have no real science to back that up or anything it's just what I have observed over the years.

[Duskrunner]

That did make me laugh.

 

Im in Alderaan right now, lvl 30, its about prime time. There's this guy who has been asking for a group for 'Red Handed' (last Rep Heroic on the planet) for over a half hour.

Tough luck for him tho, cause there's only 15 people on the planet...

 

And that, has nothing to do with people wanting or not wanting to play with anybody sadly.

 

 

And saying that the devs know anything is second guessing, if devs generally did, we wouldn't be playing on empty servers and other MMOs like Warhammer wouldn't have failed.

 

I really like this game, and I want to enjoy the typical things of an MMO, mainly the massively part of it, with a community and people around to play with.

 

Glad I could being some amusement into your life Strangefate.

 

Well I now do have a question for you in regards to the one person who was asking for a group for 'Red Handed". Why do you think he could not get any of those 15 people to join up with him? He only needed a few to do it. You don't think that there might be those out there that simply don't want to group with unknowns?

 

So if saying that the devs know anything is second guessing, what does it say about a portion of the populace calling out for a certain feature/race/etc. If the populace generally did, we wouldn't be having pandas, pokemon, Battlegroup LFG and such in World of Warcraft (also now known as World of Super Happy Neo Pets. I do think that each MMO brings something new to the table. It is simply just finding the right MMO per person, and giving that MMO time to develop into its own, like a baby learning to walk. That is all I am saying.

 

I enjoy this game as well, and seriously hope that the Devs look at the mistakes made by other MMOs that have killed communities.

 

Oh and as to why Warhammer failed (to me anyways). Factions. When is there ever going to be an MMO that has more than two factions (excluding Eve, which I find to be boring and a game that plays itself)? Who knows.

[Duskrunner]

Do you think Mass Effect 3 will cause some problems...I do.

 

 

I don't. Look at Everquest and WoW. Popular single player games really didn't hurt either one.

[Jett-Rinn]

First of all, I love the game. But lets separate expectations from reality:

 

According to users.telenet.be SWOTR west subscriptions has dropped from 1.8 million to around 1 million, this month. Given that WoW has 10 million subcriptions and around 2 million peak concurrent users (used as an example, never played WoW myself), and if we were to apply similar percentage around %20. Swotr has probably 200k peak concurrent users at this time (this number is not disclosed so we really dont know but see below).

 

 

Cheers

 

 

That flies in the face if what they announced yesterday.

 

Still the fastest growing mmo ever, over two million active subscribers and growing and 3 million units sold. They are suppose to announce the new sub numbers when 1.2 drops but at 3 million units sold you can bet that we are looking at a population between 2.5 and 2.7 million possibly more given the Asia launch.

 

So much for reality huh?

Edited March 6, 2012 by Jett-Rinn

[Strangefate]

Glad I could being some amusement into your life Strangefate.

 

Well I now do have a question for you in regards to the one person who was asking for a group for 'Red Handed". Why do you think he could not get any of those 15 people to join up with him? He only needed a few to do it. You don't think that there might be those out there that simply don't want to group with unknowns?

 

Nah, a 'few people' is very relative, it's a 4 man quest, out of 15 available that's a lot, we're talking about needing the help of 1/5 of the whole planet population.

The higher the numbers, the more likely you're gonna find people.

 

I think that there's just a lot of quests and few people are gonna need the same one you need at the same time you do, plus even less will want to abort whatever quest they're currently chasing.

 

In all the MMOs I've played, friends and guildies are great for end game content, but for simple 2 or 4 man quests, any stranger will do, and that's how you meet your future friends and guildies. MMOs are like parties, everybody is a stranger until you talk with them.

If you're just gonna be glued to the 2 people you know, you're probably better off not going to the party.

 

With 15 people on Alderaan, I think it's save to say that everybody just had more important things to do than help somebody with a non shareable quest that they would have to do again once they get it.

 

I'm sorry, I love the game, but 15-20 peeps per planet is pretty crappy for an MMO, no matter how you put it.

Edited March 7, 2012 by Strangefate