ferroz Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 (edited) Why do you keep spamming this?Because people keep claiming to have proven it wrong, but haven't. They also won't actually prove it wrong. maybe it's because they can't? Its already been proven wrong.No, it hasn't... prove it wrong if you can. what? where?What navarh said. Edited February 14, 2012 by ferroz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amiracle Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 No, it hasn't... prove it wrong if you can. It was. Prove it right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amiracle Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 what? where? Go back a couple pages and read. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferroz Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 Go back a couple pages and read.translation: It doesn't exist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
navarh Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 (edited) Go back a couple pages and read. couple? more specific plz and don't say you meant taht dartkhaos nonsense?… Edited February 14, 2012 by navarh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meepee Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 Your calculations consider the increased pool of Tanks and healers made available. But do they take into account the increased pool of DPS looking for them? for end game content: Larger Servers wait time will increase, Smaller servers wait time will decrease. There will not be a decrease across the board on all servers. Current LFD tools in wow were originally designed, and most effective, in finding groups for lower level dungeons that no one ran when leveling. Not for current content. That was never ever an issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
navarh Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 (edited) Your calculations consider the increased pool of Tanks and healers made available. But do they take into account the increased pool of DPS looking for them? so? what you (and anti-lfg creatures liek you) fail to understand is real problem in like x100 scale people search for different FP at given time, less people avilable less chance that some of them need same stuff as you, LFG solve this no friend list or guild can't solve this task stop lie to people you need friend list as long as whole euro-region at that_game to match same avg wait time for party… Edited February 14, 2012 by navarh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vlaxitov Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 (edited) I'm not holding anyone hostage. I made a statement. Your response was equivalent to "lol, math error" ... I asked you what the error was, and you have repeatedly refused to answer the question. I'll reiterate, and make everything as clear as I can. In queue A: 4 groups form every hour; the average group formation wait time is 15 minutes. In queue B: 3 groups form every hour; the average group formation wait time is 20 minutes. In queue C: 2 groups form every hour; the average group formation wait time is 30 minutes. In queue D: 9 groups form every hour; the average group formation wait time is 6 minutes, 40 seconds. 1-4 is 4x15=60 minutes total 3-7 is 3x20=60 minutes total 8-9 is 2x30=60 minutes total Overal total = 180 minutes. Divide that by your 9 groups and you have a 20 minute average, not 6 minutes 40 seconds. Scenario 1: Single server queues server A (queue A): wait time = 15 minutesserver B (queue B): wait time = 20 minutesserver C (queue C): wait time = 30 minutes overall average wait time = 20 minutes. 65 divided by 3 is over 21 minutes. There, you've successfully held me hostage to your nonsesne. Your arguments are starting to sound like an undewear gnome's plan. LFD + ? = profit. Edited February 14, 2012 by Vlaxitov Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zarnakrider Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 *short cut* we need it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthKhaos Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 couple? more specific plz and don't say you meant taht dartkhaos nonsense?… I love you too. However the first mistake was assuming that in the hour only 4 groups can be formed with an average wait time of 15mins. Why? Because if the average wait time is 15mins and every 5mins someone queued and only waited 15mins you'd have 10 parties formed at the end of the hour. However we're talking about average wait time. So that could mean one person waited 5mins, one person 10mins, 2 people waited 20mins and one person 35mins. That averaged out to being 15mins average wait time. This is bad start to your equation. The second thing is you cannot have the average number be less than the smallest number of the set being averaged. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
navarh Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 1-4 is 4x15=60 minutes total 3-7 is 3x20=60 minutes total 8-9 is 2x30=60 minutes total Overal total = 180 minutes. Divide that by your 9 groups and you have a 20 minute average, not 6 minutes 40 seconds. BLOOODYYY HELLLL … really? … no kidding here?… Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vlaxitov Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 BLOOODYYY HELLLL … really? … no kidding here?… Yeah I know its amazing... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferroz Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 (edited) Overal total = 180 minutes.This is only the case for the single server queues.; for a cross server queue, there's only 60 minutes. Divide that by your 9 groups and you have a 20 minute average,There's your math mistake. There's only one queue. So if 9 groups are formed in a single queue in an hour, then a group is formed (on average) every 6:40 Edit: 65 divided by 3 is over 21 minutes.Good catch. When I was responding, this didn't make any sense (you had different numbers, 18 with 3 repeating or something like that). In queue A: 4 groups form every hour; the average group formation wait time is 15 minutes. In queue B: 3 groups form every hour; the average group formation wait time is 20 minutes. In queue C: 2 groups form every hour; the average group formation wait time is 30 minutes. In queue D: 9 groups form every hour; the average group formation wait time is 6 minutes, 40 seconds. Scenario 1: Single server queues server A (queue A): wait time = 15 minutesserver B (queue B): wait time = 20 minutesserver C (queue C): wait time = 30 minutes overall average wait time = 21 minutes, 40 seconds. Scenario 2: cross server queues one cross server queue (queue D). Wait time = 6:40 Individual wait times are directly proportional to the group formation wait times. feel free to actually pick it apart. But bear in mind that "lol math error" doesn't actually constitute picking it apart. Edited February 14, 2012 by ferroz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
navarh Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 (edited) There's only one queue. simple answer 2 3 4 party on server A B and C in lfg mean 9 party per hour withing LFG just like one big server people search for different FP at given time, less people avilable less chance that some of them need same stuff as you, LFG solve this all other "problems" that LFG create are pawns for greater good Edited February 14, 2012 by navarh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferroz Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 Yeah I know its amazing...I think he was being sarcastic... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vlaxitov Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 There's your math mistake. There's only one queue. So if 9 groups are formed in a single queue in an hour, then a group is formed (on average) every 6:40 If any four classes and roles could run all the HMs then I would concede. Otherwise, your claims don't hold water. The average wait of 20 minutes will still be there and be distributed between the least played roles having literally no wait, and the most played roles having much much longer waits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJediKnight Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 It destroys the community. OP, you can scream into the wind as much as you like, but the fact remains that whatever little community WoW had was absolutely rent asunder by the x-server LFG tool. People no longer cared about ninjaing, playing nice, playing well, or getting a bad reputation. The 'gloves came off' for every would-be MMO troll. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferroz Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 I love you too. However the first mistake was assuming that in the hour only 4 groups can be formed with an average wait time of 15mins.Actually, I'm talking the other side of the problem, starting from an example, known throughput rate. Given 4 groups come through in an hour, the average group wait time is 15 minutes. The individual wait times will vary, but they're directly proportional to the group wait times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emeda Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 (edited) There is NO valid reason NOT to have an Aion style, server wide LFG tool. None. Period. End of story. You can make a valid case against a cross-server LFG tool. We can make a case against any LFG tool that is cross server or automatically puts you in a group. I dont think anyone is against a tool that will make it easier for you to find people to run a flashpoint with as long as the players make the group themselves. I mentioned this in another thead. A LFG that I see having no negative effects on the server community. Allow someone to enter their name into a LFG tool where they can select what type of player they are looking for and what flashpoint I as wanting to form a group can put my name in and have a checkbox of all the flashpoints I would like to run and it allows me to pick 1 or more of those flashpoints. Then after that I can again check off what type of player I am looking for, TANK BH sith warr Healer BH agent inquisitor Dps BH warr inquisitor agent I can check off any of them that I would like or all if I wanted The LFG tool would also have it so someone looking to join a group could just put in what flashpoint they are looking for, again another checkbox system so you can pick more than one. and then list what you are BH healer. The system would take all that data and then instantly or ever 30 sec or min whatever, it would send messages to the people wanting to form a group with "we have found possible players for your group" tank sith warr player name XXXXXXXX tank bh player name YYYYYYYYY DPS inquisitor player name ZZZZZZZZ the leader then could talk to these players and see if they wanted to join his group or just invite them to the group. This would continue untill the player gets a full groups and marks their status as full. Once the player marks his status as full they will no longer get messages but players that are looking for a group can see that they were still looking for the players he original checks off but that the group is full. This will allow a backup system so if someone leave it will be quicker to find a replacement. If the player that was in q waiting finds a group different group then his name will be removed. That to me sounds like it would work. It gives the players the option to choose who they would like in the group in case they want to seperate classes so no one will be rolling on the same loot or if they dont care about getting loot they can just get the flashpoint done. It also removes the getting put into a group already in progress past the boss that you wanted loot off of incase you were there to get loot. This system also preserves the community because someone who ninjas or dosnt help the group will be known and not invited unless the group leader doesnt care. Edited February 14, 2012 by Emeda Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
navarh Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 The average wait of 20 minutes will still be there how? one hour, 9 groups must be filled somehow and with 20 minutes of waiting time between? how? you just don't understand how it works, stop posting Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vlaxitov Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 The individual wait times will vary, but they're directly proportional to the group wait times. Nice backpedal there. No, there will be an average healer wait time, and average tank wait time, and and average dps wait time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferroz Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 If any four classes and roles could run all the HMs then I would concede. Otherwise, your claims don't hold water. The average wait of 20 minutes will still be there and be distributed between the least played roles having literally no wait, and the most played roles having much much longer waits.so... you can't find a math mistake? We can make a case against any LFG tool that is cross server or automatically puts you in a group.You can make a subjective one. Or one based on opinion. I've yet to see an objective, fact based one though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferroz Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 Nice backpedal there.it's been in pretty much every post I've made on that topic. I might have missed one here and there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vlaxitov Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 how? one hour, 9 groups must be filled somehow and with 20 minutes of waiting time between? how? you just don't understand how it works, stop posting No you're making the pressumption that any 4 players can run an instance or that theres always equal amounts of those 4 roles looking to group. I've heard this bad argument before many times. Its you who just doesen't get it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferroz Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 No you're making the pressumption that any 4 players can run an instance or that theres always equal amounts of those 4 roles looking to group. I've heard this bad argument before many times. Its you who just doesen't get it.This just looks like tap dancing to me. 9 groups form, in one 60 minute queue; the average wait time is 6:40. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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