TheFreshBrew Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 how does a pvp-gear nerf affect your ability to compete with other BM's? that was a line concerning all those people who believe people in BM's just did it so they could roll Fresh 50's. it seems to be a popular opinion with with everyone who can't win a warzone because they're inexperienced and under-equipped. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kuari Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 that was a line concerning all those people who believe people in BM's just did it so they could roll Fresh 50's. it seems to be a popular opinion with with everyone who can't win a warzone because they're inexperienced and under-equipped. Amazing how you ignored what I stated previously on the flaws of your argument. You have no idea how some of the people who don't mind the change are geared. Obviously the fresh 50s are the happiest, yes, but you keep stating they are the only ones who'll be happy with it. Again, fair fights are not easy mode. Having over a 30% gap? That is. Not to mention you did it to compete with other BMs? There were hardly any until recently, so no, at this point of time, you really can't make that argument. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skodar Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 Na, just give us blue 50 pvp gear (entry expert.), and crafted gear that's comparable to champ gear. No grinding required *shock*. All the kiddies who near gear progression can still try and get BM gear, whilst the rest of enjoy PVP that isn't so.... gear dependent? There is 50 blue pvp gear... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calei Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 (edited) that Fresh 50 isn't entitled to beat that BM 50 ... its a mmorpg, not a mmo-welfare state. Why do you need gear to beat other people? Do you suck THAT much? Edited February 2, 2012 by Calei Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kuari Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 There are two camps here: Camp I - PvP should be about skill, and gear and time-in-game do not equal skill. There should be little or no gear advantage. Camp II - Skill is closely tied to the time spent to acquire gear, and time-in-game should be rewarded with a significant gear advantage. I'm firmly in Camp I, and I don't see a way to make both camps happy. This problem is also compounded by mistakes that Bioware made early on. We have people at each other's throats because of advantages that may have been obtained during the time that exploits (for lack of a better term) were being used. There's got to be some middle ground where we can move on past the mistakes that were made. Problem is there's no middle ground. If people want a huge advantage, they'll fight and fight and fight to keep it. Those who suffer from the problems or think about more then themselves? Will be more leaning towards Camp I Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheFreshBrew Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 Amazing how you ignored what I stated previously on the flaws of your argument. You have no idea how some of the people who don't mind the change are geared. Obviously the fresh 50s are the happiest, yes, but you keep stating they are the only ones who'll be happy with it. Again, fair fights are not easy mode. Having over a 30% gap? That is. Not to mention you did it to compete with other BMs? There were hardly any until recently, so no, at this point of time, you really can't make that argument. I didn't level my valor so I could compete with people with lower gear, for the same reason I don't go to tattoine and gank 20's. and there are plenty of BM's on my server. has been for a couple weeks. so, don't talk to me about easy mode - I don't go easy mode and I didn't grind warzones in easy mode, if I wanted easy mode, I would have waited a couple days, and let Bioware rescue me from the scary BMs. But instead, I took my lumps, won my share, and there I am. Watching Easy Mode CareBears diminish my accomplishments. Again, gratz. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daedricshots Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 Why do you need gear to beat other people? Do you suck THAT much? In most mmo games pvp comes down to gear compensating for skill. Its understanable for those players to panic when that gap is lessened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheFreshBrew Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 (edited) Why do you need gear to beat other people? Do you suck THAT much? When did I ever say I needed gear to beat people? I earned that gear. What part of that are you unable to do, or understand? And obviously, you need a gear boost, for your lack of skillz... so I'm kinda amused by that whole 'you have no skills' argument. Edited February 2, 2012 by TheFreshBrew Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daedricshots Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 I didn't level my valor so I could compete with people with lower gear, for the same reason I don't go to tattoine and gank 20's. and there are plenty of BM's on my server. has been for a couple weeks. so, don't talk to me about easy mode - I don't go easy mode and I didn't grind warzones in easy mode, if I wanted easy mode, I would have waited a couple days, and let Bioware rescue me from the scary BMs. But instead, I took my lumps, won my share, and there I am. Watching Easy Mode CareBears diminish my accomplishments. Again, gratz. ez mode care bears? lol you must be 15. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bamajawn Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 (edited) Problem is there's no middle ground. If people want a huge advantage, they'll fight and fight and fight to keep it. Those who suffer from the problems or think about more then themselves? Will be more leaning towards Camp I I agree with you. My comment on middle ground was limited to getting past the advantages that were due to dev mistakes. You are correct, and I don't see a middle ground between the two camps either. There are only choices that leave one or both camps unhappy. Edited February 2, 2012 by Bamajawn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kuari Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 I didn't level my valor so I could compete with people with lower gear, for the same reason I don't go to tattoine and gank 20's. and there are plenty of BM's on my server. has been for a couple weeks. so, don't talk to me about easy mode - I don't go easy mode and I didn't grind warzones in easy mode, if I wanted easy mode, I would have waited a couple days, and let Bioware rescue me from the scary BMs. But instead, I took my lumps, won my share, and there I am. Watching Easy Mode CareBears diminish my accomplishments. Again, gratz. Except you'd still be competing with the BMs and still have an advantage over the non-BMs. Diminished? Yes, but really? What's the issue? Why is a 30% gap needed? Why must new people have to work A LOT harder then the people who came before them? Hmm? Obviously it won't ever be 100% equal, but the point stands. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bamajawn Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 I'd be interested to know what % stat advantage due to gear is considered fair by both sides. I'll throw out 10% as something I could agree to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheFreshBrew Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 ez mode care bears? lol you must be 15. I have a 28, a 26, a 14, a 10 and a 50. Now, do you think BW will give my 10 and 14 a stat boost so it doesn't get rolled by a 49 in a warzone? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daedricshots Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 I have a 28, a 26, a 14, a 10 and a 50. Now, do you think BW will give my 10 and 14 a stat boost so it doesn't get rolled by a 49 in a warzone? They already do its called bolster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheFreshBrew Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 They already do its called bolster. I'm referring to a permanent pvp gear stat boost. so if I see a 49 in Open World, I can go roll him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kuari Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 I have a 28, a 26, a 14, a 10 and a 50. Now, do you think BW will give my 10 and 14 a stat boost so it doesn't get rolled by a 49 in a warzone? The difference between a 10 and 14 from a 49 in a warzone with bolster isn't 30%... well, ok, maybe for the 10 it is. They don't even begin getting their useful abilities for a couple levels. Not to mention that the lower levels often benefit from bolster more than the higher levels to some extent. Particularly in the armor department. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dremic Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 i dont have any trouble in pvp and ive been 50 for like 3 days. we lose a lot though.. although i am usually the reason we win in huttball and i have greens Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheFreshBrew Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 Why must new people have to work A LOT harder then the people who came before them? Hmm? Now you're calling it work? You don't have to work any harder than I did. Kill 30 imps, win 3 warzones each day. of course, 30 imps a day might be too many, we may need BW to nerf that down to like 15 or so, because, you know, some of them might be BM's and it'll be too hard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richardya Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 (edited) I think level 1 characters should get all the abilities of level 50 and it should be about skill not level & gear. A level should be able to roll a 50 if he is more skilled. Edited February 2, 2012 by richardya Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daedricshots Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 I'm referring to a permanent pvp gear stat boost. so if I see a 49 in Open World, I can go roll him. You make zero sense. Instead of presenting logical arguments you're just adding your opinion with few facts into random replies. All of your posts ive read boil down to: "im mad because people dont have to spend their life on the game like i did to get gear". Ive heard this flaccid argument over and over and its only from people that equate video game accomplishments to some type of skill which is laughable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheHoodedFang Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 Do you know what level 50s do in pve when they hit 50? They do regular mode 50 dungeons, dailies, get crafted gear and do early hardmode FPs. They match the gear they have with the difficulty of the flashpoint. Do you know what level 50s do in pvp when they hit 50? They have NO CHOICE but to go up against BM players because the only way to get pvp gear is by being stomped over and over and over. Your logic would make sense if there was a matchmaker based on your expertise gear- but there isn't. This would be a more accurate way of saying it. PvErs- the moment you hit 50, you can do nothing but nightmare modes of operations until you get your gear. That seem fair? Well, that's how the pvp system works right now. But rejoice! They're nerfing BM/Champ loot drops, so that gap will be even harder to bypass! This guy gets it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheFreshBrew Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 The difference between a 10 and 14 from a 49 in a warzone with bolster isn't 30%... well, ok, maybe for the 10 it is. They don't even begin getting their useful abilities for a couple levels. Not to mention that the lower levels often benefit from bolster more than the higher levels to some extent. Particularly in the armor department. If Bioware is forcing my 10 and 14 into a warzone with 49's, shouldn't I be all carebear, and demand they give me all my skillz early, so I can compete, and not get rolled by 49's? Thats what this is all about isn't, you people afraid of being rolled by people who've played longer, leveled longer, pvp'd longer? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kuari Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 (edited) Now you're calling it work? You don't have to work any harder than I did. Kill 30 imps, win 3 warzones each day. of course, 30 imps a day might be too many, we may need BW to nerf that down to like 15 or so, because, you know, some of them might be BM's and it'll be too hard. Considering more of those premades will be in BM gear, its harder then befor for pugs to win, not to mention if you get an unlucky match up which will be more likely as time goes on. Also I never said it wasn't work. Work is not the same word as effort. In a game, the word work should be far from anyone's mind to be frank. I'm not talking like making no progression, but if fun isn't on everyone's mind to some extent, then its no longer a game, it becomes work, and people don't like paying for work. Tired of people trying to twist my arguments around because they think two words mean the same thing when they don't. If Bioware is forcing my 10 and 14 into a warzone with 49's, shouldn't I be all carebear, and demand they give me all my skillz early, so I can compete, and not get rolled by 49's? Thats what this is all about isn't, you people afraid of being rolled by people who've played longer, leveled longer, pvp'd longer? Obviously you didn't read my post about me being already fairly geared where while there's a gap with BMs for me, its a reasonable one. If you're going to ignore stuff like that, quit arguing now, because you're not even trying to debate, you're just trying the political ******** approach. Edited February 2, 2012 by Kuari Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bamajawn Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 If Bioware is forcing my 10 and 14 into a warzone with 49's, shouldn't I be all carebear, and demand they give me all my skillz early, so I can compete, and not get rolled by 49's? Thats what this is all about isn't, you people afraid of being rolled by people who've played longer, leveled longer, pvp'd longer? That isn't really what we're objecting to. It's about balance between those players who can play 5 hours a day and those who can only spare an hour or two. I believe that time-in-game isn't a skill, and it doesn't really represent skill. Other rewards can be given for time spent playing, but they shouldn't give anyone a significant advantage in PvP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daedricshots Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 If Bioware is forcing my 10 and 14 into a warzone with 49's, shouldn't I be all carebear, and demand they give me all my skillz early, so I can compete, and not get rolled by 49's? Thats what this is all about isn't, you people afraid of being rolled by people who've played longer, leveled longer, pvp'd longer? No its YOU that is afraid of being rolled because the gear gap will be smaller. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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