RycheMykola Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 I can't believe I just read some PvP kiddy getting on someone for "being lazy" and not "wanting to work" by playing a video game for 5+ hours a day to grind out Battlemaster gear so they won't get facerolled. Oh people of the internets, I love you so. Fact of the matter is that gear based PvP is total trash. That's why 49 and below is extremely fun, and once you hit level 50 the PvP turns into a gigantic **** sandwich. As far as the carrot-on-stick thing people are talking about, you could easily turn the PvP gear into a cosmetic reward rather than a statistical one. Of course I'm sure people wouldn't like that, because God forbid PvP be based anything other than how much of a life you don't have. If the levels 10-49 got 0 XP and no WZ commendations, how popular would the 10-49 bracket be? Same analogy with the 50 bracket, people PVP to get gear. If the WZ's gave nothing out besides "just do this for fun", barely anyone would be PVPing. Heck, even if PVP gear was removed, people would be crying then that Person X has better Mods, Operation Gear, etc............... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
salamanderx Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 (edited) We need a naked (while in) PVP server! Bioware... THE PEOPLE HAVE SPOKEN! Seriously, this would be pretty cool. Basic weapons of course to use your abilities. Edited February 1, 2012 by salamanderx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snaex Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 in my experience good people get the gear. **** and stop whinning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vegathegreat Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 Protip: People PvP mostly for the fun factor and most of those PvPers would be willing to do so for vanity items/mounts etc. Imo, I think all stats should be void in PvP. I think they should only apply to the PvE side of the game. Success in PvP should come down to who can better utilize the PC peripherals. I'm sure the carebears will disagree though. no, the majority of MMO players want to gear up and then take the gear and PVE and PVP with it...... MMO's are about gear progression, FPS shooters and co-op rpg's are baseline with perks......you want another genre of game, not MMO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RycheMykola Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 mmm, cause your first post was so useful. My post in response to your post was in exactly the same line. Also, nowhere in the OP's post did I see him asking for standardized gear. edit: I guess it could be interpreted as such. And lol and you thinking your posts have been on topic and helpful to the conversation. From the OP: .People have been wanting a PvP game that was based on their ability, as opposed to what they wear, for years. This is not it. If you want a PVP game that is NOT based on gear, you either need: A.) Standardized Gear b.) Naked PVP Warzones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shendaar Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 If the levels 10-49 got 0 XP and no WZ commendations, how popular would the 10-49 bracket be? Same analogy with the 50 bracket, people PVP to get gear. If the WZ's gave nothing out besides "just do this for fun", barely anyone would be PVPing. Heck, even if PVP gear was removed, people would be crying then that Person X has better Mods, Operation Gear, etc............... Why do you think people play other competitive games like FPS and RTS? They do it because it is fun. If they removed the need to grind gear in PvP, people would still play it and the competitive players would probably start taking the game more seriously too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asnine Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 From the OP: If you want a PVP game that is NOT based on gear, you either need: A.) Standardized Gear b.) Naked PVP Warzones. You could also interpret it as asking for gear to not be the biggest determinant in who wins a fight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dannythefool Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 If the levels 10-49 got 0 XP and no WZ commendations, how popular would the 10-49 bracket be? I'm all in favour of a pvp system with no direct rewards. I mean I play EVE, PVP battles there have a good chance of you losing equipment or money even when you win, but in the long run your alliance/corporation will benefit from it and may even re-imburse you and/or pay you. It doesn't have to be no rewards at all, PVP for fun only, to be independent of a gear spiral. Funny enough people over in EVE also don't really cry about other players having expensive modules on their ships. May have to do something with the ability to shoot them down in a coordinated effort and take those modules for yourself though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xziled Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 I love these non-assertive posts about how PvP should be in this game. If you want to play a competitive game where gear doesn't play a role, go play an FPS. Fact: Pro-gamers compete at a high level at every game they play. I don't care if it's gear dependent or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asnine Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 ROFL. Pro gamers. "Pro" gamers aren't playing MMOs, buddy. Anyone that thinks they're a "pro" gamer and is playing PvP in SWTOR needs to hurry up and graduate high school or get a real life. Biggest joke post of the day. lmao This is true. Even WoW was removed from the pro-gamer events. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EternalFinality Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 I love these non-assertive posts about how PvP should be in this game. If you want to play a competitive game where gear doesn't play a role, go play an FPS. Fact: Pro-gamers compete at a high level at every game they play. I don't care if it's gear dependent or not. RPGs don't have to be advancement based. Dota, for example. Or are you just suggesting MMO PvP is rotten to the core so no one should play it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RycheMykola Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 You could also interpret it as asking for gear to not be the biggest determinant in who wins a fight. Remove expertise, then what do you do when people start wearing Operation level gear? Then pvp'ers will start crying that they need to PVE in order to be competitive in PVP. Which comes back to: A.) Standardizing gear in Warzones B.) No gear in warzones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Murah Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 mmo pvp is my favourite kind. There are other possible incentives to win pvp, other than gear. Fame (leaderboards), titles, slightly improved stats, new abilities. (DAoC model) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BDutch Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 You need to pay extra for that too, thats another fee above the $15 monthly fee. Also, I believe you receive real life rewards too. If SWTOR had a ladder tournament where the #1 team got a $1000 USD prize, then yes, gear should be equalized. Are you really saying that if people had to pay more per month and had a small chance of winning real stuff that PvP system based on competition instead of gear would suddenly make sense? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lerdoc Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 RPGs don't have to be advancement based. Dota, for example. Or are you just suggesting MMO PvP is rotten to the core so no one should play it? Dota is MOBA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Murah Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 Remove expertise, then what do you do when people start wearing Operation level gear? Then pvp'ers will start crying that they need to PVE in order to be competitive in PVP. Which comes back to: A.) Standardizing gear in Warzones B.) No gear in warzones. and then pve gear should NOT be allowed in pvp. or, make raid progression not about gear. Make it about collecting items that unlock the next dungeon, or something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lerdoc Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 Remove expertise, then what do you do when people start wearing Operation level gear? Then pvp'ers will start crying that they need to PVE in order to be competitive in PVP. Which comes back to: A.) Standardizing gear in Warzones B.) No gear in warzones. Or get their PvP gear with equal stats but different set bonuses? Common sense much? Or you thing stats would not be compensated? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asnine Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 (edited) Remove expertise, then what do you do when people start wearing Operation level gear? Then pvp'ers will start crying that they need to PVE in order to be competitive in PVP. Which comes back to: A.) Standardizing gear in Warzones B.) No gear in warzones. Why can't PvP and PvE give the same gear? Obviously some tweaking on drop rates / bags would be needed. In any case, this isn't even relevant to what I think gear should be. I think (good) PvP should be at least 80% based on skill. For instance, the difference between BM and Champ gear isn't *so* large that it cannot be overcome by a good player. Does it reward more time and effort? Absolutely. But is it the be all and end all determinant of a fight? No. edit: or see above statement. You could do something where, for instance, gear bonuses/stats for PvE lend themselves to more sustained dps, while for PvP stats/bonuses are more about burst damage. Edited February 1, 2012 by Asnine Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EternalFinality Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 Dota is MOBA. That's a made up genre name. It's an MMORPG where you just play battlegrounds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RycheMykola Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 Are you really saying that if people had to pay more per month and had a small chance of winning real stuff that PvP system based on competition instead of gear would suddenly make sense? HUH? I don't work for Blizzard, I didn't design their tournament realms. I'd say a good majority of people PVP in order to receive rewards, NOT "just for fun". Do you think people run Operations and Flashpoints "just for fun" or to get gear and rewards? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ComeAndSee Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 Whether or not expertise is there, battlemaster will still have 20% better stats than fresh 50s. lol, when we actually get items from our bags. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asnine Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 That's a made up genre name. It's an MMORPG where you just play battlegrounds. With no progression..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lerdoc Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 (edited) That's a made up genre name. It's an MMORPG where you just play battlegrounds. You're hopeless if you really believe that. Guild Wars is not MMO and is much more advanced then dota. And its not meda up considering there is a fair share of games of that type and still new ones are being made. Just to name you a couple so you can tell difference from MMO and MOBA: MMOs: WHO, AoC, Aion, TOR, WoW, STO, MO MOBAs: LoL, HoN, BC, WH:WOH, DotA2 And exactly between them, too limited for MMO and too expanded for MOBA lies Guild Wars. Edited February 1, 2012 by Lerdoc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angaurath Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 One way to reward PVP (and pve for that matter) would be to give us *real* housing (Not a generic spaceship) and experience based customizations. This was a huge appeal and motivator for UO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RycheMykola Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 Or get their PvP gear with equal stats but different set bonuses? Common sense much? Or you thing stats would not be compensated? This was done in WOW. The Raiders then stopped doing Raids because getting the best gear in game through Arena was far easier and quicker. People take the path of least resistance for getting gear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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