Just dinged 50. Gear... um... wow.

[Ojaix]

I feel the pain of the op but I have no sympathy. I was 50 before the exploit but did not go to ilum until the day after on purpose. I have been grinding match after match and have gotten lucky with a few pieces but have had to grind for most. Unfortunately I have a feeling I will get screwed once it is made easier to obtain what some of us worked to get.

[Torn]

top geared pvpers?

Im over 60 valor and in 2 week of opening bm bags, i only got bm main hand.

I dont even have full champion cause of this lame rng system....

And i see ppl valor 30 with more champion pieces than me....

 

You dont need new bracket, you dont need skill, u only need luck

 

this^

 

IMO they should change champ bags to be the way BM bags are now - so if you do get lucky and RNG goes in your favor you can buy whatever piece of champ gear you want with the token - getting dupes is stupid - if the system is going to rely on RNG at least make it a bit less frustratin, nothing pisses me off more to see that I got lucky but I already have that piece of gear

Edited January 30, 2012 by Torn

[BDutch]

Not sure what you mean...but yes you gear up in PvE by failing at first. You wipe a couple times, adjust your strategy, and then progress and get your loot. Same thing in PvP. You play, die, adapt, win, gear up. As a matter of fact you even gear up when losing. After an hour or two of straight losses you can buy a Champion Bag.

 

Wiping a couple times to learn a fight =/= queue'ing for beat downs for a few weeks, or even a week of consecutive handicapped matches. If you fail the instance entirely you don't get rewarded for it.

 

OK, make that 225 300 (although 25 is only on classes which dual wield and 25 may not be possible - I've not seen moddable bracers yet)

 

Head

Chest

Gloves

Belt

Legs

Boots

Weapon

 

^175

 

If available - offhand weapon

If there are moddable bracers (don't think I've seen any yet) then them too

 

^225 if both of the above are true

 

Where do you get moddable belts from? Without an offhand weapon and the elusive moddable belt... 150.

[FuryNL]

So lemme get this straight. I was lvling up. Playing both PvE and PvP. I was doing pretty well in PVP. Def holding my own. Dinged 50 and went into a WZ. SLAM! BLAM! BLAST! POW! DEAD! DEAD! DEAD! AAAAAAAAHHHHHHH!

 

So.

 

I'm just supposed to get crushed for a while until I slowly gear up over a couple hundred games?

 

Really?

 

It hasn't been any better thant his in any MMO ever. Make the formula better and earn yourself a job @ Blizzard, Bioware, Mythic etc etc etc.

 

Only ''mmo'' (but this only has arena based pvp) that had good balancing and no ''pwnage due to gear'' was Guild Wars.

[BDutch]

Only ''mmo'' (but this only has arena based pvp) that had good balancing and no ''pwnage due to gear'' was Guild Wars.

 

How many MMOs other than WoW can you think of that had good PvP with "pwnage due to gear"?

[DarthBloodloss]

Wiping a couple times to learn a fight =/= queue'ing for beat downs for a few weeks, or even a week of consecutive handicapped matches. If you fail the instance entirely you don't get rewarded for it.

 

If you lose, you gain commendations which can be used to purchase Champ Bags.

 

Where do you get moddable belts from?

 

Galactic Trade Terminal

Edited January 30, 2012 by DarthBloodloss

[Orangeaccord]

I'm just supposed to get crushed for a while until I slowly gear up over a couple hundred games?

 

Lol a couple hundred games. Try thousands of games to get gear based on a lottery and nothing that even resembles hard work and effort. Without a doubt the worst reward system I have ever seen for pvp in any game I've ever played.

[dcgregorya]

Well you have two choices:

 

1) Do your Ilum PVE/PVP dailies and weeklies and slowly gear up, get PVE gear (easier to get by far), go into it once you get a decent set of purple gear PVE and PVP mixed.

 

2) Do those above but then grind warzone dailies and warzone commendations, get kicked in the face repeatedly but have a faster progression to BM gear.

 

I'm going with one and honestly, I'm happier as a person for it. Two will get you BM'd faster but frankly, it makes the game a grind fest and non-fun at that just thanks to getting rolled over and over.

 

Make no mistake, warzones at 50 are a gear-check first and a skill check second.

[kckkryptonite]

You could always do HMs.

[pinealogik]

End-game PvP is utterly retarded in Swtor. Period.

 

/thread

[DarthBloodloss]

The reality of the system: if you can spend 3 hours grinding for PvP gear, you'll get a bag for the WZ daily and you'll be able to buy a bag with commendations. And there's also the weekly.

 

Its not hard at all. Its just not instantaneous unfortunately. Just go join a warzone. Win or lose, you get commendations for bags.

Edited January 30, 2012 by DarthBloodloss

[-Kazim-]

Every single player in our guild is/was having a blast from level 1-49. At 50 everyone's enjoyment has diminished dramatically. All but 2 players are no rolling alt's. My main is stopped just before 50 since first week of January. All I do now is farm mats, craft for alts and do pre-50 pvp ... because it is damn fun now and even lower level well geared players can compete due to bolster.

 

Pretty same for my guild. I'm slacking as much as I can before reaching to level 50 and then I'll roll an alt.

[Noctournys]

So lemme get this straight. I was lvling up. Playing both PvE and PvP. I was doing pretty well in PVP. Def holding my own. Dinged 50 and went into a WZ. SLAM! BLAM! BLAST! POW! DEAD! DEAD! DEAD! AAAAAAAAHHHHHHH!

 

So.

 

I'm just supposed to get crushed for a while until I slowly gear up over a couple hundred games?

 

Really?

 

Spend...

 

about six days, if you just want to do the dalies that give the mods as quest rewards..

 

spend about six days doing Freeing the Fallen (Belsavis; provides a rank 22 mod of your choice), Poisonous Strategy (Illum; provides an Enhancement of your choice, rank 22), and Old Enemies (Illum, provides Rank 22 armoring of your choice).

 

You will have gear that is at least passable and roughly equivalent to Centurion PvP gear (yes, you are missing the 8% expertise that Centurion would get you, but you have about 16% more endurance, and about 12-18% more DPS stats, completely overriding its use anyway) to PvP in.

 

Amount of effort required:

 

20 minutes for six days.

 

If you really think expertise is worth it (i dont, but thats a post for another day when i have time to write a wall of text complete with math to show why Expertise is the biggest illusion in SWTOR) you can also spend WZ comms, while leveling, to get level 40-something PvP weapons. These weapons have a level 46 blue enhancement in them with expertise on it, that can be removed.

 

Put these in your oranges.

 

Bam, you have 6% expertise.

 

For the last several days, (as a m arskman sniper) i switched from using my full PvP set (All champion except earpiece & legs - which are still centurion, and belt and bracers, which are far superior rakata items - 10.45% expertise) to using my full PvE set.

 

I GAINED 1920 HP for this switch, about 200 cunning, 6.4% crit, and 42% surge.

 

I haven't lost a single but of survivability, but my damage output has roughly doubled.

 

TL:DR below:

 

hit the GTN, get level 50 purple (rank 22) armoring, mods, and enhancements in your gear, or do dalies if you dont have the cash for the GTN, and youll be fine. You wont be top of the heap but it isn't that bad by any stretch.

[Saccmaster]

I don't understand people arguing that WoW had a gear grind. It did, but TOR's is a lot worse.

• You could buy a starter set with gold.
  
• You had access to gear with large amounts of Resilence cheaply and without restriction. So you'd give up some offensive stats, but you weren't simply target practice.
  
• You didn't have to buy commendations with commendations in order to get access to the intro set of gear.
  

 

The entire system is incredibly punitive to anyone that's just hitting 50. I said the same thing as the OP when I hit 50.

 

You join Warzones to get commendations. You'll get rolled by scrubs and can barely help your team, but you'll have commendations (this is where WoW starts letting you buy gear). Unfortunately, these commendations aren't any good. You need to buy better commendations. So you buy Mercenary commendations, but you still won't be able to buy any gear directly. You need bags. Once you buy the bag maybe you'll get a piece of gear that you don't already have; but you'll probably just get some new commendations. Once you get a bunch of these commendations, then you can buy a piece of gear.

[Spyde]

Do the Dailies..

 

3 wins a day.

 

 

and if you had 6 bags when you turned 50.

 

 

pvp gear is easymode.

 

 

ive been 50 for 3 days on this char and i have Chest, gloves, 2x Relic, Earring, Pants

[Noctournys]

a tiny preview of why i dont think the Expertise is what it is really cracked up to be.

 

Take these two items:

 

http://knotor.com/items/612567 - PvP boots

 

http://knotor.com/items/588031 - PvE boots

 

notice, the mod and enhancement slots are filled with IDENTICAL items, the only difference between these two items (other than set bonuses - not relevant for this discussion) is the (currently locked) armoring slot.

 

The PvE armoring is:

 

57 cunning, 41 endurance (rating 136 armor)

 

the PvP armoring is:

 

30 cunning, 29 endurance (rating 136 armor) + 48 expertise (which it incorrectly quotes as 1..75% @ 50 - only true if you have zero as it suffers from a pretty harsh and complex diminishing returns formula)

 

thats 27 cunning and 12 endurance lost PER PIECE.

 

It's actually even *worse* on belts, bracers, and implants.

 

From a full set (incl belt, bracers, implants) you can easily add up more than 300 of your base stat (cunning in this case) and ~200 endurance - which, for me at 50, is actually more than a 12% increase in HP.

 

Expertise is an illusion.

 

If you wear (here's the important part) equivalent item-level gear, the extra stats on the PvE gear more than make up for expertise. You will have more than the 12-13% expertise can buy you in defense in extra HP, you will have more than that in extra dps (or healing) stats.

 

Expertise gear artificially deflates your stats and tries to convince you it replaces them with expertise, but the math doesn't follow along.

 

The best example i can come up with is a republic Jedi Sage named Tangier on my server (Port Nowhere). She PvPs i n the slave bikini with PvE mods in it. She regularly posts 450-550k damage and 100k+ healing with a 50 to 0 or so kill/death ratio.

 

Obviously the loss of expertise is really hurting her.

[Zombifikation]

Well, they could always add lower expertice mods that people could add to their existing gear so they could at least have some of it so they don't get stomped so bad...just a thought.

 

I for one am maxing out my toons on commendations and pvp from late 40's->50 so I can get some bags when I ding. Should make it a little easier, though I'm used to pvp grinds (Ugh, vanilla WoW) so it shouldn't be too big of a deal.

[McVade]

I'm just curious. Aren't fresh 85 players in WoW forced to go through this exact same gear grind? They obviously aren't going to have anywhere near as much as Resilience (the Expertise equivalent stat) as other 85s do so aren't they going through the same process of getting destroyed BG after BG until they slowly get gear and gain resilience? I realize that with Arena being available in WoW, full PvP geared 85s may not do BGs as much as full PvP geared players in SWToR (since there's no rated WZ or Arena) but nonetheless, fresh 85s will, for the most part, be playing against PvP geared opponents.

 

Are WoW players complaining about this as well? I'm honestly curious.

 

And yes, I am aware of the differences of Resilience and Expertise and understand that Expertise is far more "potent" than Resilience due to the increase in damage and healing as well. I know that this makes the grind in SWToR even worse.

 

With WoW, there's a few things players can do to minimize their own damages. They can queue for random 40 man BGs where their own individual shortcomings are pretty much moot. They can also queue for Tol Barad - same thing as the 40 man thing, but twice as rewarding and potentially 60-80 players.

 

Also, in WoW, you have 10-15 man Warzones. These diminish your individual contributions, as there's more people on the team to support your patheticness while you're gearing up. Your win rate will be closer to 50% in WoW than it will be in SWTOR while you're a 50 noob.

 

In this game, you have only two recourses.

 

1. Fight 2v1 vs. Imperials with gear. (if Republic)

2. Farm Crates for 2-3 hours per day (if Imperial)

2. Queue for 8 man warfronts, where given the small number of players on the team, you will drag your team down much more than you ever could in WoW and earn the disdain of people on your team if, in the end, your stats don't compete.

Edited January 30, 2012 by McVade

[ghostridah]

Do the Dailies..

 

3 wins a day.

 

 

and if you had 6 bags when you turned 50.

 

 

pvp gear is easymode.

 

 

ive been 50 for 3 days on this char and i have Chest, gloves, 2x Relic, Earring, Pants

 

Because your luck relates to everyone else.

[Noctournys]

Well, they could always add lower expertice mods that people could add to their existing gear so they could at least have some of it so they don't get stomped so bad...just a thought.

 

I for one am maxing out my toons on commendations and pvp from late 40's->50 so I can get some bags when I ding. Should make it a little easier, though I'm used to pvp grinds (Ugh, vanilla WoW) so it shouldn't be too big of a deal.

 

Also looking into buying some orange PvP weapons and stripping out the enhancements with expertise on them to cobble up a ghetto set, if thats your th ing, though see above as to why i dont really believe expertise is worth it if you have access to acceptable equivalent item level PvE gear.

[Celebrus]

So lemme get this straight. I was lvling up. Playing both PvE and PvP. I was doing pretty well in PVP. Def holding my own. Dinged 50 and went into a WZ. SLAM! BLAM! BLAST! POW! DEAD! DEAD! DEAD! AAAAAAAAHHHHHHH!

 

So.

 

I'm just supposed to get crushed for a while until I slowly gear up over a couple hundred games?

 

Really?

 

Guess what guys, they have entry level PvP gear in other games. Do you know what happens after you spend a few days crafting it when you hit 85? You Q up for reg BGs and get rolled by people in mixed honor/valor gear until you get your honor gear. Then you Q up for arena and get rolled by people in valor gear until you get a few wins and get your own valor gear.

 

The only difference here is that you don't have entry level gear, but you're still getting rolled by better players with better gear until you get better gear and get more skill yourself.

 

There is a food chain in PvP, you are at the bottom of it, work your way to the top or don't. Your choice.

[Viscerus]

It doesn't take that long to start getting some gear. My buddy hti 50 and had the champion boots within 2 minutes because he had comms saved up.

 

Yes, you will ahve to gear up.

 

Once you start getting the pvp gear the differences in the pvp gear tiers are not really that different

[Lazorous]

That's nonsense. Gearing up in WoW does not takes weeks. As I and others have already pointed out, you can pretty much gear up in an AV weekend.

 

You can gear up running PVE heroics (convert justice points to honor, valor to conquest)

by running PVE Raids

by running regular BG's

by running Arena's

by running ranked BG's

by running Tol Barad bosses

by crafting or buying crafted loot

 

The options to gear up for PVP in WoW runs circles around ToR.

 

THERE IS NO COMPARISON

 

You didn't read the entire context in which my post was responding to. The pvp crap gear I was referring to was the CRAFTED pvp gear. Unless you have all the mats ready at hand, you're going to take some time to acquire everything to make said pvp gear.

 

Then I also pointed out, because of this, just going through bg's for honor points would be much quicker than acquiring the mats for the crafted gear.

Edited January 30, 2012 by Lazorous

[Aowar]

Bioware appears clueless on such matters.

 

This is one you just have to accept.

 

 

 

They aren't clueless. This system was done on purpose. Any time a game puts a long grind in it is to hide deficiencies in content.

[Richoshist]

NO, you can craft starter PvP gear in WoW. That is something at least. Here you get rolled, stomped, spit on, and T-bagged.

 

Simple answer. Get rid of expertise stat. Problem solved.

 

 

When I played WoW and I saw a player with starter gear, I'd roll, stomp, spit on, and T-bag them. And I'm not talking just 1 of them, I'm talking 2 at a time.

 

WoW was (and is) no better than SWTOR in the fresh max level PvP department.