Goretzu Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 That doesn't surprise me. Me either, it isn't logical. No, I'm simply saying that no matter what is done, there will be complaints. Your argument is that people only complain when there is a problem. No, it's not. Be nice for you if it was though, I agree. Take this issue, for example. There's two sides - those that think it sucks and those that don't have a problem with it. Lets say BW changes it so that you just appear instantly on your ship any time you feel like. Then those that don't want to be happy won't complain any more and those that feel its not with the RP/story elements will complain that it is ruining the game. So now you have the same problem - people are complaning. So according to your logic here, if there are complaints, there's a problem. Maybe you understand now (though I doubt it). Again though you've agreed that what I suggested would have no drawbacks and a lot of positives so changing this would only be positive. If you were correct the forum would be flooded with complaints that there ARE taxi/speeder points in game..... there are NONE, so you are not correct. Actually it really is. People like to complain. People will complain about anything and everything. BW could give everyone 100,000,000 credits tomorrow and someone will complain about it not being 100,000,001 credits and someone will complain about how it will ruin the economy, and someone will complain that it should have only been 50,000,000 credits, etc etc. Again when a LOT of people are complaining about the same things (rather than a lot of things) occum's razor does not suggest that is because people just like to complain and all happen to be complaining about the same thing (statistically it's hugely unlikely), but rather that IF a lot of people are complaining about the same thing then, yes, there is something to complain about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goretzu Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 (edited) Right, so you want the taxi point IN the ship... Here is an idea: when the thread gets restarted, which sadly it will rather soon I assume, clear you mind, think about what you want, how you want it... and then, maybe you care to explain why there should be a taxistand in your ship? Because all the taxi stand I have seen in game are actually taxi stands and not QT terminals. Nope, again TO, not IN. I know you want it to be IN the ship, but I'm afraid that's not what I'm talking about. I don't know why you can't understand this. Edited February 1, 2012 by Goretzu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goreson Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 So (yet) again what would be the problems that would make what I suggested a bad thing? Either state them or you must agree with me that it would be an improvement. Oh, the horror of 'logic': if something isn't worse it has to be better! Hooray, ever thought that maybe your 'improvement' just doesn't really improve anything? Oh, wait, nope, obviously you are of the faction that a) having the game do things for you, while b) you gain a few seconds over the normal routine is a HUGE improvement over the given situation. Bad news: if the game does everything for you, well, unless you enable to skip either selective or all cutscenes, your taxiing into the ship would be an extra cutscene (of the taxi getting there, you getting out) which obviously you are not going to abort because that would mean pressing a button (on your keyboard)... Goretzu, why don't you just go back to the drawingboard and try coming up with an idea that actually IS an improvement? And I hope, by now you know where suggestions need to go? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goretzu Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 Oh, the horror of 'logic': if something isn't worse it has to be better! Hooray, ever thought that maybe your 'improvement' just doesn't really improve anything? Oh, wait, nope, obviously you are of the faction that a) having the game do things for you, while b) you gain a few seconds over the normal routine is a HUGE improvement over the given situation. Bad news: if the game does everything for you, well, unless you enable to skip either selective or all cutscenes, your taxiing into the ship would be an extra cutscene (of the taxi getting there, you getting out) which obviously you are not going to abort because that would mean pressing a button (on your keyboard)... Goretzu, why don't you just go back to the drawingboard and try coming up with an idea that actually IS an improvement? And I hope, by now you know where suggestions need to go? Well if it's not worse and it's not better then it must be exactly the same. So what would be wrong with something exactly the same that most people would prefer? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uebermann Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 Me either, it isn't logical. Its perfectly logical, you just don't get it. I can only lead you to water, I can't make you drink. Again though you've agreed that what I suggested would have no drawbacks and a lot of positives so changing this would only be positive. I've done no such thing - this has turned into some game for you where you keep putting words in my mouth. Its trolling, essentially. If you were correct the forum would be flooded with complaints that there ARE taxi/speeder points in game..... there are NONE, so you are not correct. I never said it would be flooded - I said it would be an issue. I see people complain about all types of things in the game. They complain about Orbital Strike being able to be used indoors by IAs, they complain that the speeders don't travel right. They complain that the shuttles used on Voss should actually be speeders or another type of transport. I've seen people complain about having paths at all. I've seen people complain about QT points. I've seen people complain about being able to use QT indoors. I can go on and on. Just because there isn't a 100 page thread on each of these doesn't mean people don't complain about them. However they understand there's something things that are going to be in the game and just live with it. Then there's those that complain about 60 seconds of their precious lives' wasted going from point A to point B. Again when a LOT of people are complaining about the same things (rather than a lot of things) occum's razor does not suggest that is because people just like to complain and all happen to be complaining about the same thing (statistically it's hugely unlikely), but rather that IF a lot of people are complaining about the same thing then, yes, there is something to complain about. People don't complain about illogical things and don't complain about things that don't need changing? Sir, I welcome you to the interwebz. May your stay be a good one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goretzu Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 Its perfectly logical, you just don't get it. I can only lead you to water, I can't make you drink. Indeed you can't lead someone to water and make them drink granite, it's not logical. It seems we agree again! I've done no such thing - this has turned into some game for you where you keep putting words in my mouth. Its trolling, essentially. Trolling would be arguing against something you agreed with, we've already established that you agree that what I suggested would be an improvement and in no way detrimental. So if you're still here it can only be to troll the thread. I never said it would be flooded - I said it would be an issue. I see people complain about all types of things in the game. They complain about Orbital Strike being able to be used indoors by IAs, they complain that the speeders don't travel right. They complain that the shuttles used on Voss should actually be speeders or another type of transport. I've seen people complain about having paths at all. I've seen people complain about QT points. I've seen people complain about being able to use QT indoors. I can go on and on. Just because there isn't a 100 page thread on each of these doesn't mean people don't complain about them. However they understand there's something things that are going to be in the game and just live with it. Then there's those that complain about 60 seconds of their precious lives' wasted going from point A to point B. And yet I've never seen ONE thread complaining that there is a taxi/speeder point system in the game. Funny that isn't it? Occum's razor wins again! People don't complain about illogical things and don't complain about things that don't need changing? Sir, I welcome you to the interwebz. May your stay be a good one. Strawman arguements won't work. It's not about that it's about whether MANY people all complaining about the SAME thing is either: 1. a completely random, but highly unlikely occurance or 2. because there is something specific to complain about. We both know 2. is occum's choice here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goreson Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 No, I'm simply saying that no matter what is done, there will be complaints. Your argument is that people only complain when there is a problem. No, it's not. Be nice for you if it was though, I agree. Whether there is a 'problem' rests mostly within the eye of the beholder. Just because somebody complains about something doesn't mean it's a problem for everybody else. Obviously me (and other people here) have 'problems' with your suggestion, you don't see and 'problems' with it. Well, who is right? Again when a LOT of people are complaining about the same things (rather than a lot of things) occum's razor does not suggest that is because people just like to complain and all happen to be complaining about the same thing (statistically it's hugely unlikely), but rather that IF a lot of people are complaining about the same thing then, yes, there is something to complain about. Congrats, you have just taken yourself out of the race! Because from what I've seen here there are more people complaining about your concept than supporting it... so there MUST be something wrong with it... unless you want to suggest that those complaints are just done to 'troll' you? Hm... right, the conspiracy against Goretzu... don't tell anybody, it's actually the shadow government's best kept secret! This is just a moon... This is just, err, another moon... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goretzu Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 Whether there is a 'problem' rests mostly within the eye of the beholder. Just because somebody complains about something doesn't mean it's a problem for everybody else. Obviously me (and other people here) have 'problems' with your suggestion, you don't see and 'problems' with it. Well, who is right? Congrats, you have just taken yourself out of the race! Because from what I've seen here there are more people complaining about your concept than supporting it... so there MUST be something wrong with it... unless you want to suggest that those complaints are just done to 'troll' you? Hm... right, the conspiracy against Goretzu... don't tell anybody, it's actually the shadow government's best kept secret! This is just a moon... This is just, err, another moon... Hmm... you just seem to be plain raging now. Shadow government conspiracy is it? Oookay. However if you want to talk about the issue at hand by all means do so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goreson Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 Well if it's not worse and it's not better then it must be exactly the same. So what would be wrong with something exactly the same that most people would prefer? It's not worth investing energy into it? And please be very careful about using the word 'most'... I don't see a petition anywhere signed by 1,000,001 gamers that support your suggestion. (Based on 2,000,000 subscriptions, modify as needed) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uebermann Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 Indeed you can't lead someone to water and make them drink granite, it's not logical. It seems we agree again! Since you asked a bunch of questions and I answered them all and you didn't disagree with what I said, it must mean that you agree. Thanks for agreeing that the system is fine the way it is. Have yourself a nice day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goretzu Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 It's not worth investing energy into it? And please be very careful about using the word 'most'... I don't see a petition anywhere signed by 1,000,001 gamers that support your suggestion. (Based on 2,000,000 subscriptions, modify as needed) Surely it would be worth it to the many people complaining about it and to Bioware in more $$$'s. Fair enough it may not be the most critical issue (but then even utterly critical issues like the CD debacle aren't being fixed ASAP), but that doesn't mean addressing it shouldn't be done. Frankly they could likely fix this in less man hours than you've spend arguing against making improvements. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goretzu Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 Since you asked a bunch of questions and I answered them all and you didn't disagree with what I said, it must mean that you agree. Thanks for agreeing that the system is fine the way it is. Have yourself a nice day. It's too late to try that, you already agreed! Now just Goremon to go then pretty much everyone in the thread is in agreement that this needs to be improved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
--Grim-- Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 The troll posts in this thread are much like the copy pasted corridors in SWTOR.... endless and they all look the same. LOAD SCREEN WARS.... The TROLLS STRIKE BACK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uebermann Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 It's too late to try that, you already agreed! Now just Goremon to go then pretty much everyone in the thread is in agreement that this needs to be improved. Hah you're delusional if you think that this is true by any stretch of the imagination. But hey, whatever floats your boat. If you want believe that you've "won" some kind of argument here (despite not being able to address a single point of mine in response to your questions), be my guest. No one can help your special little mind process information properly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goreson Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 Surely it would be worth it to the many people complaining about it and to Bioware in more $$$'s. Frankly they could likely fix this in less man hours than you've spend arguing against making improvements. Ha, yeah, it's Goretzu to the rescue! Your suggestion(s) will make SWTOR the best game ever and will make BW tons of money... I'm still waiting for ANY proof that ANYBODY other than yourself is supporting YOUR suggestion... or that spaceports/'elevators'/hangars are actually artifacts of the story line(s)...? By the way: Can I please have your extension at Bioware... err... which location? As obviously you have designed the game and know exactly how much it would take to modify the game as per your wishes... oh, wait, you said 'likely'... so you are taking an (uneducated) guess? Nevermind about that number... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gjozefi Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 Bioware, don't listen to these schmucks. Keep space travel the way it is. Don't make it like WoW please! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terans Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 (edited) I really don't see why players are arguing for the loading screens to stay. The possible solution to these loading screens i.e. less of them, will not effect you at all unless you want them there ofc. Edited February 1, 2012 by Terans Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buur Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 Bioware, don't listen to these schmucks. Keep space travel the way it is. Don't make it like WoW please! *groan* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goretzu Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 Hah you're delusional if you think that this is true by any stretch of the imagination. But hey, whatever floats your boat. If you want believe that you've "won" some kind of argument here (despite not being able to address a single point of mine in response to your questions), be my guest. No one can help your special little mind process information properly Nothing is won till the sort this issue out. But it is nice to have your support in it, I admit. Ha, yeah, it's Goretzu to the rescue! Your suggestion(s) will make SWTOR the best game ever and will make BW tons of money... I'm still waiting for ANY proof that ANYBODY other than yourself is supporting YOUR suggestion... or that spaceports/'elevators'/hangars are actually artifacts of the story line(s)...? By the way: Can I please have your extension at Bioware... err... which location? As obviously you have designed the game and know exactly how much it would take to modify the game as per your wishes... oh, wait, you said 'likely'... so you are taking an (uneducated) guess? Nevermind about that number... I'm just suggesting a way to solve the current issue. So far you've not been able to come up with any drawbacks too my suggestion. I'm not saying that my way is the best or only way to fix things, but so far there doesn't seem to be anything against it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShonaChaos Posted February 1, 2012 Author Share Posted February 1, 2012 To the OP: This is an MMO. You do realize that this means we are travelling in a virtual realm. This realm has to be realistic. If there was space travel at this time (for general population), these would be the same mechanics involved. Do we not go to an airport (orbital station), stand in line to be screened (hangar), then go to our gates (airlock) and then finally board the aircraft, only for our hostess/host to utter the same emergency advice every single time? I for one do find it utterly banal, but I applaud the realism and the design efforts taken to re-create the atmosphere. Though every single station, airlock, etc looks the same (which imo should be different), I do think that they have done a good job at recreating the reason we bought and pay a subscription fee. They have recreated a virtual reality for us to take part in. And don't get me wrong I want to strangle C2-N2 every single time he opens its mouth! So be happy that some time was taken to recreate reality, otherwise it would be a bland setting, and that would be something else you complained about. Wow... I actually read this and laughed. You can't possibly believe the words you just typed. There's nothing realistic about this game. It's a game FFS. You scream realism to defend running through stupid orbital stations and airlocks... and yes while it may be somewhat realistic (if i give you that part of the argument), you cannot tell me that it's fun or belongs in an MMO. You go on to say "or else it would be a bland setting". Like... seriously? I can't possibly think of anything blander than running through empty orbital stations and emtpy hallway airlocks. Hey let's recreate reality... or... let's watch reality as 98% of the population of this game unsubs because it's not fun. I mean seriously, I'd rather run though an empty corridor in real life than in a video game, and that isn't saying much. has anyone quested through Correlia? It's like one giant airlock that never ends. It's like BW thought the airlock wasn't evil enough, they made an endgame planet out of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uebermann Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 Nothing is won till the sort this issue out. Well since there isn't any issue...I guess that means you'll be leaving now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dire Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 I really don't see why players are arguing for the loading screens to stay. The possible solution to these loading screens i.e. less of them, will not effect you at all unless you want them there ofc. Because i spent the time and money to play an mmo - You perceive issues of loading screens as a problem? Get a better computer. My load screens take 1 - 2.5 seconds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uebermann Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 I really don't see why players are arguing for the loading screens to stay. Would you rather stare at a black screen for 2 minutes while a planet loads? They have zone files like Everquest and WoW. Each planet is its own zone. There will be loading screens, sorry to say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkSidePoint Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 (edited) For all those who argue the current system is fine and realistic, and should stay for the realism such a tedious time sink adds, I have but one question: When was the last time you toggled your toon down to a walk? If you want realism in travelling, that's the ticket! Sprinting continuously makes no sense! Nor does running forever. So why is that ok while you wait to get your speeder? Meanwhile, for the rest of us: I don't agree with racing to get to the next content--but damn there is no point to the way these spaceship/space station interactions work. Those hangar rooms? Worthless. Utterly worthless. Just removing the hangars and letting you click something and be on board your ship would be an improvement. Hell, lets take a middle ground and have every ship type on the ground like the shuttles are in the shuttles in the giant hangar on the second world. You still get to walk up to your ship and click on a glowy door, you just get to skip the loading screen from the elevator ride. Edited February 1, 2012 by DarkSidePoint Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
___Luis___ Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 /signed They need to get rid of all these pointless air locks and loading screens. Just leaves the ones required for story quest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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