Love the Assasin

[Nwalmaer]

Assassins Suck. If you don’t believe me, take on an operative or scoundrel that is geared the same as you are and the same level. Right now I bet all the topped geared premade warzone running assassins who are tanked spec are responding that the class is perfect. Well of course it is if you are going against an under geared lower level player.

 

I know everyone says spec 31 darkness and you will still do the same damage as spec’ing 31 deception. Does anyone other than me see an issue there? You would think if you spec 31 deception you would do a significant more damage than someone spec’d 31 darkness.

Deception assassin damage? That’s a joke. I was able to frap another class pop from stealth, stun their target, hit them for 3865, 6407, and finally 5431 damage and have a dot ticking for 633-880 and kill the target before the stun expired. It would be nice if an assassin could attack from stealth and deal damage like that.

 

Now, for the assassin to do decent damage in melee combat, we need to have our attacks cause effects on our targets. Exploit Weakness is one of our abilities that we wait too afflict our target before using Maul (an ability that hits like a feather if it even works).Next we wait for Static Charges to build. You ideally want 5 charges. In combat you usually die before you get a chance to use these abilities. Static Charges don’t apply with every attack; it is based on a percentage. Exploit Weakness is the same.

We do get a reduction in the amount of force used when attacking from stealth. But you will find that force goes quick and Sabre Strike, our attack that requires no force, hits like a fart from a distance.

 

Attacking from stealth is a joke as well. Even with Blackout up, you have a 50/50 chance of being seen or knocked back and rooted. If we can be seen while stealth, maybe we should be allowed to wear medium armor? And Force Shroud, Lol works sometimes.

I think “Assassin” is the wrong name for this class.

 

If the class is based in any way on the character Darth Maul (Shadow Hunter I think), he would have waved at Qui-Gon and Obi, and leaped into the chasm on his own. And just to think, he was supposed to be a figure from you worst nightmare.

[Krylaancelo]

If you think our damage is really bad... I'm thinking you aren't playing right.

 

For one, you don't wait to build up 5 stacks of your Discharge buff, you use it on cooldown for maximum DPS. If you absolutely need to build up stacks for maximum burst, go for it... But it is a DPS loss for sure. The stacks should be treated as a bonus, not a requirement.

 

I regularly get 3-4 crits in a row for 4k+ on GEARED opponents. On lesser geared people, they drop in 3 hits easily. Sure, I'm using cooldowns but no other class can do it every 10 seconds either.

 

Are we the strongest? No, absolutely not. But we aren't nearly as bad as you're saying we are.

 

And I do play 0/33/8 Deception.

Edited January 25, 2012 by Krylaancelo

[Azesino]

I tought assassins were the best 1v1 class, specially with the incoming Op/scoundrel nerf

[Relatz]

assassins do not suck lol you do.

 

http://youtu.be/mKtDHIgvwIA

[upzie]

assassins do not suck lol you do.

 

http://youtu.be/mKtDHIgvwIA

 

srsly saw lvl 33 and closed the vid....

 

how you can even think that hte pvp pre 50 is worth anything in regards to pvp balance.

Edited January 26, 2012 by upzie

[Relatz]

srsly saw lvl 33 and closed the vid....

 

how you can even think that hte pvp pre 50 is worth anything in regards to pvp balance.

 

well gimme some time man I'll still be topping the damage 95% of warzones, I'll only get better (along with every other class) as I move up in level. can still tell by video how to play assassin and maybe get an idea how to counter them, or play yours better from watching me. there are people out there (like the assassin in my WZ) that was lvl 43 and got 30k damage? I mean cmon. if anything the BALANCE you talk about only gimps me at this point. plenty of 40's+ in my warzones where are they ... under me. atleast watch before you comment.

[upzie]

well gimme some time man I'll still be topping the damage 95% of warzones, I'll only get better (along with every other class) as I move up in level. can still tell by video how to play assassin and maybe get an idea how to counter them, or play yours better from watching me. there are people out there (like the assassin in my WZ) that was lvl 43 and got 30k damage? I mean cmon. if anything the BALANCE you talk about only gimps me at this point. plenty of 40's+ in my warzones where are they ... under me. atleast watch before you comment.

 

you just dont understand that theres a world of difference between lvl x pvp and lvl 50 pvp, and thats the problem.

[RoguexA]

I'm specc'd as a 31(?)/0/10 Darkness Assassin. I usually average around... 7-9 medals each match. Guarding is amazing for the first 4 medals or so.

 

However, 1v1, I don't feel like a tank. I pop my cooldowns, play my cards right, and I still have a chance of getting ripped up by either a Shadow, Scoundrel or Commando/Vanguard and definitely a Guardian - That, or I just pit myself up against some very experienced Players.

 

I get boned 2v1 against anything, yet I can see Juggies and Powertechs surviving 2v1's and even 3v1's.

 

Now, not saying that we suck. I enjoy the class alot, it takes a ****-load (lol joke it doesn't really) to understand how to play them. If anything they're probably one of the easiest.

 

The level 10-49 bracket is NOTHING compared to 50. Yes, Assassin may be amazing in the 10-49 bracket, but lulz. You wait till you get to level 50. You wait until you've had 40 or so bags with no more than 3-4 champion pieces dropping - most of the time the same item dropping twice. Wait until you're going up against people with 400-500 expertise. You'll be surprised at how much of a difference there is.

 

However, yeah I've seen myself as a Tank doing about 150k total damage in a majority of my warzones, with another Deception Assassin doing roughly lower than me, when it -looks- like they're unloading a whole lot more than I am. Deception Assassin's -look- like they could use a buff or be balanced to be on scale with other classes.

 

I for one am slightly peeved at the Smugglers Stuns - which, stun you for about 4-5 seconds and damage taken doesn't remove the ability - unlike most of our own abilities. Most of the time, I CC break outta that, then get caught with my pants down with that CC break on Cooldown.

 

Whenever you lose in a situation, ask if you're using your class to the best of your ability - IE: Using your own abilities when neccesary.

Edited January 26, 2012 by RoguexA

[Ameenachan]

I've been 50 for one day, I've opened 23 bags and received 1 champion pvp piece. My damage isn't great but then again I am against opponents in full champion gear. I learn to pick off weaker players and to be more of a group helper with interrupts and such.

[PullinStuff]

If you think our damage is really bad... I'm thinking you aren't playing right.

 

For one, you don't wait to build up 5 stacks of your Discharge buff, you use it on cooldown for maximum DPS. If you absolutely need to build up stacks for maximum burst, go for it... But it is a DPS loss for sure. The stacks should be treated as a bonus, not a requirement.

 

I regularly get 3-4 crits in a row for 4k+ on GEARED opponents. On lesser geared people, they drop in 3 hits easily. Sure, I'm using cooldowns but no other class can do it every 10 seconds either.

 

Are we the strongest? No, absolutely not. But we aren't nearly as bad as you're saying we are.

 

And I do play 0/33/8 Deception.

 

What is your build?

[Trayes]

I'm specc'd as a 31(?)/0/10 Darkness Assassin. I usually average around... 7-9 medals each match. Guarding is amazing for the first 4 medals or so.

 

However, 1v1, I don't feel like a tank. I pop my cooldowns, play my cards right, and I still have a chance of getting ripped up by either a Shadow, Scoundrel or Commando/Vanguard and definitely a Guardian - That, or I just pit myself up against some very experienced Players.

 

I get boned 2v1 against anything, yet I can see Juggies and Powertechs surviving 2v1's and even 3v1's.

 

Now, not saying that we suck. I enjoy the class alot, it takes a ****-load (lol joke it doesn't really) to understand how to play them. If anything they're probably one of the easiest.

 

The level 10-49 bracket is NOTHING compared to 50. Yes, Assassin may be amazing in the 10-49 bracket, but lulz. You wait till you get to level 50. You wait until you've had 40 or so bags with no more than 3-4 champion pieces dropping - most of the time the same item dropping twice. Wait until you're going up against people with 400-500 expertise. You'll be surprised at how much of a difference there is.

 

However, yeah I've seen myself as a Tank doing about 150k total damage in a majority of my warzones, with another Deception Assassin doing roughly lower than me, when it -looks- like they're unloading a whole lot more than I am. Deception Assassin's -look- like they could use a buff or be balanced to be on scale with other classes.

 

I for one am slightly peeved at the Smugglers Stuns - which, stun you for about 4-5 seconds and damage taken doesn't remove the ability - unlike most of our own abilities. Most of the time, I CC break outta that, then get caught with my pants down with that CC break on Cooldown.

 

Whenever you lose in a situation, ask if you're using your class to the best of your ability - IE: Using your own abilities when neccesary.

 

As 31/0/10 how can you EVER die to an assassin/shadow that is DPS speced? I can 1v2 assassins/shadow. I have made every assassin/shadow I play vs switch to my spec because i can last more than 3 sec in a real fight.

[Sabbathius]

As 31/0/10 how can you EVER die to an assassin/shadow that is DPS speced? I can 1v2 assassins/shadow. I have made every assassin/shadow I play vs switch to my spec because i can last more than 3 sec in a real fight.

 

It's weird, but just the other day I was doing a PvP daily on my Sin and I'm Darkness spec too (up to pull/stronger shock/instant spike with 20% armor increase. Rest in Deception, though I'm not even 40 yet, so it's not much.

 

And this Shadow on the other team, just 3 levels higher, completely annihilated me several times. I'm talking 100%-30% in seconds. And that's with me having my Dark Ward up and everything. But I didn't have Deflection up, I save it for flag carrying. And that Shadow was definitely a DPS spec - I know what their Dark Charge equivalent icon looks like - though I don't know the rest.

 

And from what I saw, all the attacks were melee, he wasn't casting. It was weird.

 

So I don't know about the other guy, but it's definitely possible to get dropped as a tank. Don't know how exactly, but it is. I did respectable damage to him before he downed me, he was squishy, but he still won more than he lost.

[Trayes]

It's weird, but just the other day I was doing a PvP daily on my Sin and I'm Darkness spec too (up to pull/stronger shock/instant spike with 20% armor increase. Rest in Deception, though I'm not even 40 yet, so it's not much.

 

And this Shadow on the other team, just 3 levels higher, completely annihilated me several times. I'm talking 100%-30% in seconds. And that's with me having my Dark Ward up and everything. But I didn't have Deflection up, I save it for flag carrying. And that Shadow was definitely a DPS spec - I know what their Dark Charge equivalent icon looks like - though I don't know the rest.

 

And from what I saw, all the attacks were melee, he wasn't casting. It was weird.

 

So I don't know about the other guy, but it's definitely possible to get dropped as a tank. Don't know how exactly, but it is. I did respectable damage to him before he downed me, he was squishy, but he still won more than he lost.

 

Lets say a fight vs them lasts 20 seconds. This is 4-6 procs of dark charge. That is 1600-2400 healing. 500-750 bonus damage. Overcharge saber is 10% of your max HP. Harnessed Darkness is 12% of your max HP. 5 Seconds of resist to all of their force attacks. 12 seconds of parry to 65% of their attacks. They deal 5% less damage. They are slowed by 30%. You shield 35% of their melee attacks. They have 5% less ACC.

 

I don't even see how they hurt you. My HD+FL does 1700-1900 damage a tick for 4 ticks. My Shock crits from 2800-3500. In just those 2 attacks they should be running for the hills.

 

The difference is they don't have dark charge up. They don't have all the bonus armor and damage resist. They will be hitting you for FAR less then you can hit them.

 

BTW this is all from the mouth of a Battlemaster with 650+ expertise.

[Sabbathius]

Don't have many of those yet, I'm in mid-30s, I think. Hard to keep track, I'm leveling 6 chars right now.

 

But I take your point. If I had all the cooldowns available, it would have been better. Also I rather fear it's a L2P issue on my part. One downside leveling multiple classes in rotation is that I'm not totally at home with many of them. And while some, like Powertech, you can just pick up and go, others like Sin or Mara take some work.

[RoguexA]

BTW this is all from the mouth of a Battlemaster with 650+ expertise.

 

With 650+ Expertise, I completely understand that you think it's ludacris that I say that I drop like a fly. I honestly wish I didn't, because I don't understand how a tank can have such a struggle in PvP. At first, I questioned my playstyle - I compared it to others. Without floating my own boat, my playstyle is good - but not perfect. I use all of my abilities when I can where I should.

 

My HD+FL does not, no where NEAR do the damage it does for you (I'm always popping Recklessness before I use it as well), which I'm hoping is due to the Expertise.

 

The majority of hit's that I've received range from the 2.5k range to the 6k range, with Dark Ward up.

[Skizzik]

Assassins suck balls. I regret rolling one as my first character. It's making me hate this game.

[Trayes]

With 650+ Expertise, I completely understand that you think it's ludacris that I say that I drop like a fly. I honestly wish I didn't, because I don't understand how a tank can have such a struggle in PvP. At first, I questioned my playstyle - I compared it to others. Without floating my own boat, my playstyle is good - but not perfect. I use all of my abilities when I can where I should.

 

My HD+FL does not, no where NEAR do the damage it does for you (I'm always popping Recklessness before I use it as well), which I'm hoping is due to the Expertise.

 

The majority of hit's that I've received range from the 2.5k range to the 6k range, with Dark Ward up.

 

Expertise does help a lot. Also my gear stats as a whole help a lot. We are by far the weakest pvp defense tank. We don't have any % damage reductions and our defense only blocks auto attacks mostly. It is broken and kind of a joke. I have a powertech in my guild with over 20k HP ( I only have 17k ). He also has more armor and has skills that let him take a lot less damage. Our guild jugg has almost 20k HP and has around 26k HP with his last stand skill up. He also has many ways to give himself % damage reduction. Intercede is 20% for 6 seconds and then he has another skill that gives him 40% damage reduction and one more skill that gives 50% avoidance and 25% less damage taken from force and tech.

 

We have a skill that gives 15% shield chance (this puts us even with powertechs PASSIVE shield chance.) We get 50% avoidance (doesn't lower tech and force like Juggs does) and we get 5 sec of 100% force and tech resist. We have no flat % damage reduction skills.

 

However I am sure we do more damage than tank juggs. I dont know how much damage tank powertechs do but I think we do more than them as well. So overall we get a little more damage while they get to live a hell of a lot longer and are far more mobile.

[Cowflab]

What is your build?

 

Read the last line of the post you quoted...

[LekKharr]

What's the point of making twice the same post (http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=234775) apart from trolling?

These kind of posts start to be really annoying. When i see those "this class sucks" i read "i cannot 2 shot people/mob even though i have no skill like i was doing in some other mmo because i always played the most OP class".

We have no clue about dps as we have no dps meter (linking damage in pvp is irrelevant as when you usually toping damage it means you did not play the BG as you should) so complaining about dps is pointless.

If you do not like the mechanism of the class (the assassin is not a rogue from wow !) just roll something else instead of asking the class to be changed.

I think lot of assassin actually enjoy playing this class and are ok with its performance. To my opinion the only thing that could have some adjustment is our mobility (well and some bug correction, but that is not relevant to class design).

Edited January 26, 2012 by LekKharr

[djpravda]

If you think our damage is really bad... I'm thinking you aren't playing right.

 

For one, you don't wait to build up 5 stacks of your Discharge buff, you use it on cooldown for maximum DPS. If you absolutely need to build up stacks for maximum burst, go for it... But it is a DPS loss for sure. The stacks should be treated as a bonus, not a requirement.

 

I regularly get 3-4 crits in a row for 4k+ on GEARED opponents. On lesser geared people, they drop in 3 hits easily. Sure, I'm using cooldowns but no other class can do it every 10 seconds either.

 

Are we the strongest? No, absolutely not. But we aren't nearly as bad as you're saying we are.

 

And I do play 0/33/8 Deception.

 

You never wait for 5 stacks on Discharge.... You are playing it wrong and if you meet me in 1v1 situation you will die by the time you get your 5 charges

[tWoJo]

im doing just fine with my 2/31/8 build (with tank toggle on cuz im lazy). not only is my comp ****** but im still, imo, undergeared at times. just got my 4 piece champ bonus (about 6 champ/2 cent pieces...~500 expertise) and im nearly valor 50. since i got around those stats i hav started to see an improvement vs well known enemies. not sayin i do better against ops...i went from 100% to 0% in about 4 seconds earlier tonight with the tank toggle :/. i would tell u that im gettin on top of the charts most of the time and i even beat out that same op that killed me so quick for first, but thats due to all aspects of a warzone (dmg, kills, deaths, protection, healing, objectives, etc) which isnt that hard when u try, except for mayb the deaths if ur undergeared.

 

b patient, grind gear to get proper stats, use consumables, and make sure ur playin the class right.

Edited January 26, 2012 by tWoJo

[Krylaancelo]

What is your build?

 

As I said in my post you quoted: 0/33/8.

 

All talents mapped out: http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#200ZhGrRkhrbtzZf0c.1

 

It's the cookie-cutter Deception + Chain Shock build.

[Krylaancelo]

You never wait for 5 stacks on Discharge.... You are playing it wrong and if you meet me in 1v1 situation you will die by the time you get your 5 charges

 

I'm not really sure what you're trying to say. Are you responding to me or to the OP? You quoted me but then your second statement seems to contradict your first.

[kijthae]

Operatives are cakes for assasin.Jaggernauts are the anticlass of assasins.Only thing op can do is nuke ppl and slack around. They have no mobility.Dont expect from your sin to have same dmg output and same cc with operative.PVP is balanced around huttball in swtor.Assasin is heavy gear dependant class.

 

I QQed alot about sins but I enjoy my sin now.I see pure fun at pvp in swtor.

Edited January 26, 2012 by kijthae

[RoguexA]

Expertise does help a lot. Also my gear stats as a whole help a lot. We are by far the weakest pvp defense tank. We don't have any % damage reductions and our defense only blocks auto attacks mostly. It is broken and kind of a joke. I have a powertech in my guild with over 20k HP ( I only have 17k ). He also has more armor and has skills that let him take a lot less damage. Our guild jugg has almost 20k HP and has around 26k HP with his last stand skill up. He also has many ways to give himself % damage reduction. Intercede is 20% for 6 seconds and then he has another skill that gives him 40% damage reduction and one more skill that gives 50% avoidance and 25% less damage taken from force and tech.

 

We have a skill that gives 15% shield chance (this puts us even with powertechs PASSIVE shield chance.) We get 50% avoidance (doesn't lower tech and force like Juggs does) and we get 5 sec of 100% force and tech resist. We have no flat % damage reduction skills.

 

However I am sure we do more damage than tank juggs. I dont know how much damage tank powertechs do but I think we do more than them as well. So overall we get a little more damage while they get to live a hell of a lot longer and are far more mobile.

 

Aye, I agree about the Juggies survivability, which sucks though. I see them and their counterparts are able to kill things easier than I am - but maybe then, my offensive rotation is crystal.

 

If that's the case, I think it's about time that I leveled up a Juggy then, which is unfortunate - I loved my Assassin for tanking.