nschlan Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 (edited) What you are doing is called "projection". Your situation does not make a one size fits all situation. It is hard for most people. You have to take into account the greater good, and the better potential for profit for the company. More people participating and having a good time equals more dollars for Bioware to improve the game. Besides, I smell a lot of fear from some of you that an equal gear footing will crack the illusion of what great players you claim to be. Not at all. Above 2200 rating gear is the same. Good players are used to it so your whole comment about fear makes no sense. And you say I'm using "projection" and yet you claim to speak for everyone in saying that gear was hard to get (when it wasn't...Welfare set anyone?). Hmmmm... Edit: and besides, no one here is saying you should get the best gear. Why can't it all be the same so that carebears don't have to do arenas in order to be l33t in random WZs and arena players can get their rankings? Edited January 25, 2012 by nschlan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holocroncrystal Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 (edited) You were NOT forced to arena. RATED BATTLEGROUNDS gave the SAME GEAR. Id it that hard to comprehend? I didn't choose my friends on skill either, they just happened to not be scrubs. Wow didn't always have rated BGs you were forced, thats why I said to learn from WoWs mistakes. Edited January 25, 2012 by Holocroncrystal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nschlan Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 (edited) This is all also operating under the assumption that PvP gear really is the best for PvP in SWTOR. Personally, I prefer PvPing in my Rakata gear vs my BM gear. I do a lot better in Rakata gear and pull a ton more damage because of the stat differences. Edited January 25, 2012 by nschlan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dopebeats Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 I hearken back to the days of Street Fighter and Tekken, real PvP games in the 90s. That guy that whipped everyone daily in the arcade didn't need a special set of gear to make him have a huge advantage over the casual players that stepped up to try their luck. But every now and then, a casual player would practice up, and pull an upset. He didn't have to first spend several weeks to months grinding away for gear. Guess what I still occasionally play those games and I still watch the competitive streams of those games. Guess what they did to these fighting games? They made them more random. This is because the same type of people complained about the same type of stuff. "He knows better combos than me?" So they made the combos easier. "He plays all the broken characters?" So they make all the characters broken in some way or form. The difference between that community and the MMO community is simply, that community usually says screw it and they deal with it. Players will learn to play cheaper than the next guy. When will you notice really good arena players don't play for the gear, they play because they enjoy it and want to become rank 1. Im going to say it again, ONLY YOU CARE ABOUT THE GEAR. That is because you are playing for the gear. However, if you play to improve and learn, that gear will come. The gear was there just to give you an incentive to play, you took the bait and failed and blamed your failure simply on the gear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelbun Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 You were NOT forced to arena. RATED BATTLEGROUNDS gave the SAME GEAR. Id it that hard to comprehend? I didn't choose my friends on skill either, they just happened to not be scrubs. Nice deflection. Its pretty obvious though that what he was saying was that there were events that rewarded player with better gear and in order to get this better gear you had to play those events and he didnt want to. Its also very obvious in his statement that he didnt want to be at a dissadvantage gear wise just because he didnt like the events that rewarded the best gear. I agree with him. I think all pvp event should reward the same gear progression. I think truely good players dont need the combat advantage of gear with better stats. If you cant win with the same gear as your apponent, then L2P. If need better gear than someone else in a video game to feel good about yourself, get a life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Optiris Posted January 25, 2012 Author Share Posted January 25, 2012 how about a different system link them all you can get your rating from Warzones, world pvp kills or arenas. all use the same system so lets say rating starts out at a 1000 you can get you rating and gear from arenas i can get get mine from war zones and bob can get his from world pvp kills or 3 seperate systems their own individual ratings but the SAME gear rewards? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nschlan Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 Nice deflection. Its pretty obvious though that what he was saying was that there were events that rewarded player with better gear and in order to get this better gear you had to play those events and he didnt want to. Its also very obvious in his statement that he didnt want to be at a dissadvantage gear wise just because he didnt like the events that rewarded the best gear. I agree with him. I think all pvp event should reward the same gear progression. I think truely good players dont need the combat advantage of gear with better stats. If you cant win with the same gear as your apponent, then L2P. If need better gear than someone else in a video game to feel good about yourself, get a life. You do realize that people doing high level arenas could care less about the gear right? They didn't say "ok I'm gonna go get my 2200 gear so I can pwn Random BGs!" The only people who cared about the gear differences were the people playing arenas at low levels. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Optiris Posted January 25, 2012 Author Share Posted January 25, 2012 btw kelbun understands my view point Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelbun Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 You do realize that people doing high level arenas could care less about the gear right? They didn't say "ok I'm gonna go get my 2200 gear so I can pwn Random BGs!" The only people who cared about the gear differences were the people playing arenas at low levels. Good, then they wouldnt oppose my suggestion of same gear progression for everyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nschlan Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 Good, then they wouldnt oppose my suggestion of same gear progression for everyone. I'm not opposed to it. No one here is. Hell, I've suggested it before. It's the people who instantly say no to arenas just because they didn't like them in WoW and weren't able to get even the welfare honor set that make me mad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JediDuckling Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 People already say this is a WoW clone don't give them anymore ammo. You need to improve World pvp with capture points or something i WANT WAR not anymore of this pathetic arena crap it's lame. i know there are people that enjoy it but i don't i like mass battles with real goals not glorified group duels. if you do add this crap don't reward them with any seperate gear just give them their sad little rankings to make up for their "short" comings i totaly agree with you arena's should not be added, they are just grief fests of players abusing the overpowerd and broken thingsi n the game. the people at the top of the arena and scoreboards wont of gotten there legitly i can assure you that if they did add them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dopebeats Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 Here's an idea that blizzard did that was good. Have an arena server where everyone gets access to premade max-level characters and gear. But have this ladder serve for the purposes of a "best of the best" where you get a title on your live server character and a mount and other vanity items. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bidj Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 People already say this is a WoW clone don't give them anymore ammo. You need to improve World pvp with capture points or something i WANT WAR not anymore of this pathetic arena crap it's lame. i know there are people that enjoy it but i don't i like mass battles with real goals not glorified group duels. if you do add this crap don't reward them with any seperate gear just give them their sad little rankings to make up for their "short" comings "Hello, I am very bad at the game and I don't want people far more skilled than me have access to better gear. Please let me still have access to better gear by spending more time than other people in front of my computer and using it in a low skill-ceiled format because it makes me look like I am decent even if it is not the case" /thread Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelbun Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 i totaly agree with you arena's should not be added, they are just grief fests of players abusing the overpowerd and broken thingsi n the game. the people at the top of the arena and scoreboards wont of gotten there legitly i can assure you that if they did add them I agree with most of what you are saying except adding arenas. IF they do, I dont want to see a clone of Wow arenas. Seperate, better gear that can only be obtained through specific "leet" PvP venues. I would be down with team events for PvP, both team warzones ( a seperate system for premades, essentially) and arena styple ( 1v1, 2v2, 3v3, etc. Once your dead, your dead, last player standings team wins) just no seperate gear. One gear progression that can be obtained through any and all PvP venues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dopebeats Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 (edited) i totaly agree with you arena's should not be added, they are just grief fests of players abusing the overpowerd and broken thingsi n the game. the people at the top of the arena and scoreboards wont of gotten there legitly i can assure you that if they did add them Welcome to humanity. People using the best tools for the task at hand. The crazy thing is this evolves and changes on a regular basis. This is called metagame and this is what happens when people are capable of using their resources to adapt to a specific environment. This is the attitude that makes you fail at arenas. Oh that BH is spamming tracer missles should I move behind an object and get out of his line of sight. Or should I stand there and eat it because if I doi would be 'abusing' something. Edited January 25, 2012 by dopebeats Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelbun Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 Welcome to humanity. People using the best tools for the task at hand. The crazy thing is this evolves and changes on a regular basis. This is called metagame and this is what happens when people are capable of using their resources to adapt to a specific environment. This is the attitude that makes you fail at arenas. Oh that BH is spamming tracer missles should I move behind an object and get out of his line of sight. Or should I stand there and eat it because if I doi would be 'abusing' something. Lol, thats funny. I aint great but I am not THAT bad. I has seen some though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JediDuckling Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 Welcome to humanity. People using the best tools for the task at hand. The crazy thing is this evolves and changes on a regular basis. This is called metagame and this is what happens when people are capable of using their resources to adapt to a specific environment. This is the attitude that makes you fail at arenas. Oh that BH is spamming tracer missles should I move behind an object and get out of his line of sight. Or should I stand there and eat it because if I doi would be 'abusing' something. abusing broken overpowerd things in the game is not at all adapting, its just lazy people that want an easy win and think they have skills lol. 1. you cant LOS tracer missiles when there is nothing to hide behind 2. your in a warzone you might not notice the BH spamming missiles due to another target 3. you might be stunned 4. you get stunned again 5. still stunned 6. no cooldowns to break free 7. interupted 8. interupt on cooldown the BH is spamming missiles as it has no cooldown and costs barely any heat to use. :/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Padgemoe Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 i really dont understand how people equate extra gear to arenas. its like you think you cant have a hamburger with with out cheese. ffs stop thinking arenas me special gear. areas are just a test of skill at playing your class. if people were calling for special gear then you would have an argument, but noone is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neurosisxeno Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 i really dont understand how people equate extra gear to arenas. its like you think you cant have a hamburger with with out cheese. ffs stop thinking arenas me special gear. areas are just a test of skill at playing your class. if people were calling for special gear then you would have an argument, but noone is. I actually like this post. I would love to see Arena for small team combat (4v4 would be interesting) but hate the idea of requiring some rating to get access to improved gear. People who play better should be rewarded with Vanity items and Titles, not access to gear to make them even better and make it even harder for lower ranked people to move up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holocroncrystal Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 (edited) I actually like this post. I would love to see Arena for small team combat (4v4 would be interesting) but hate the idea of requiring some rating to get access to improved gear. People who play better should be rewarded with Vanity items and Titles, not access to gear to make them even better and make it even harder for lower ranked people to move up. I agree I never said I hate arena. I said how WOW made mistakes with the rated system and how overpowerd classes will be more over powerd, because they get the better gear more easly. so next season nerf and buff a class flavor of the season type thing. Then the next thing you know PVP evolves around arena. It's like a magnifying glass to balancing issues and tor's animation delays some classes suffer more from. A arena rated gear system that rewards a overpowerd class with better gear only makes the problems worse. Thus my beef. Edited January 25, 2012 by Holocroncrystal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelbun Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 i actually like this post. I would love to see arena for small team combat (4v4 would be interesting) but hate the idea of requiring some rating to get access to improved gear. People who play better should be rewarded with vanity items and titles, not access to gear to make them even better and make it even harder for lower ranked people to move up. amen! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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