Who Is To Blame For Server Imbalance: We Are

[TheFieryBalrog]

Bioware can't fix server imbalance, not ever, because we as players decided as a majority to go sith instead of republic, so please stop complaining about a problem Bioware did not create.

 

Anyone care to prove me wrong?

 

Oh no! We can't directly control what players do! Guess it's time to give up as game designers and find a new job!

 

Influencing player behavior indirectly is like the entire point of game design.

 

Numerous posters have written very articulate posts in this thread about how game designers can try to alleviate the faction balancing problem. Or better yet, why the 2 faction system is a bad idea in MMOs. Bad in WoW, and bad here, in fact it barely even makes sense in this game. But BW blindly copied someone else's design without giving it any thought, so here we are!

 

EQ didn't have 2 faction system, neither did DAoC, neither did UO.

[CG_Osirhis]

Oh no! We can't directly control what players do! Guess it's time to give up as game designers and find a new job!

 

Influencing player behavior indirectly is like the entire point of game design.

 

Numerous posters have written very articulate posts in this thread about how game designers can try to alleviate the faction balancing problem. Or better yet, why the 2 faction system is a bad idea in MMOs. Bad in WoW, and bad here, in fact it barely even makes sense in this game. But BW blindly copied someone else's design without giving it any thought, so here we are!

 

EQ didn't have 2 faction system, neither did DAoC, neither did UO.

 

Yes...they really didn't think about how nonsensical a two faction based system was in a game whose premise is a war between TWO opposing sides...

[bennyhana]

I'm getting really tired of Republic players whine about how no one wants to play with them over on the Care Bear side. You know what? It just makes me want to play Empire even more (as well as everyone else who is Empire) because 1.) I want to own in PvP and 2.) I just want to do it out of spite just because of your smugness and sense of entitlement.

 

See? Bioware is brilliant...they have some have cause a meta-conflict between Republic players and Empire players. And I bet they weren't even trying to do that.

 

well have fun fighting npc's and all the huttball you can handle! Sure alot of pubs are whining and crying about it, but its attitudes like yours that will never fix the problem...

[TheFieryBalrog]

Imperial players can be part of the solution by switching over; if you truly think this is a problem you shouldn't need to be bribed to switch. For bonus points, see if you can pull any friends over.

 

If you're Imperial and won't switch, you are in fact a part of the problem - one which is generated by the collective choices of individuals, and can be fixed by the choices of some of those individuals. You don't have to be able to solve or cause the whole problem to be able to contribute to either.

 

I prefer Empire stories and aesthetics. Everyone I talked to buying this game said the IA story was hands down the best. I have limited playtime and I'm not going to slog through every class to see them all, and I'm not going to play an underpopulated side just for the sake of some nebulous ideal. For my $15 I'd prefer a better play experience for me, which means the side that is more populated AND has better stories/art.

 

I couldn't care less about faction imbalance, that's a problem for Republic players and Bioware to deal with.

[TheFieryBalrog]

Yes...they really didn't think about how nonsensical a two faction based system was in a game whose premise is a war between TWO opposing sides...

You're also playing in a universe heavily filled with the idea of defecting from one side to the other. But wait! That's not what WoW did! So let's throw out that part of the lore, eh? Apparently only NPCs are allowed to defect.

 

Also the idea that BHs and Smugglers are locked to one side or another is just stupid.

Edited January 26, 2012 by TheFieryBalrog

[CG_Osirhis]

well have fun fighting npc's and all the huttball you can handle! Sure alot of pubs are whining and crying about it, but its attitudes like yours that will never fix the problem...

 

I'm having plenty of fun in this game because I'm in a guild with a good group of guys I have been playing with for years. That's what playing an MMO is all about. But what I fail to see why you aren't having fun apart from this weird idea that people who chose to play Sith is somehow ruining your fun.

[TheHoodedFang]

Yes...they really didn't think about how nonsensical a two faction based system was in a game whose premise is a war between TWO opposing sides...

 

When one side of the conflict has blatantly obvious advantages over the other, that is a problem. Logic isn't your strong suit eh?

 

Have fun being FOTM champ, it'll only last so long.

Edited January 26, 2012 by TheHoodedFang

[Fubbik]

EQ didn't have 2 faction system

 

Uhm, yes it did. Evil vs Good side. Mostly effective on PvP servers though (the Zeks). The game was meant as a PvE game though and PvP in it was an afterthought, so not really comparative to todays MMOs.

 

My guild decided to go Imperial 6+months ago, without any knowledge about quest lines, ships, itemization, races etc etc. I can bet a lot more players probably rolled Empire for totally different reasons than those voiced in this thread.

Giving Rep perks to balance it up would probably be a good idea though.

[Khemizt]

Sorry, wrong.

 

Both sides have greater and weaker story telling.

 

And dont tell me that people go Bounty Hunter over Trooper because of 1-2 skills that are not perfectly mirrored and slightly favor empire? Please... (sure its an issue and needs fixing, but thats not the point here)

 

The problem is, that this is the first online game where all people can play a true villain... be Vader! be Sidious! be Boba Fett! be Darth Maul! etc.

 

Espacially PVP crowd likes that.

 

So even with 100% boring empire story and 100% perfect republic story... majority would still have gone to empire.

 

So dont blame Bioware for that!

 

If anything... blame them for not creating 3 factions instead of 2... that could be balanced with flexible alliances between the 2 weaker factions if 1 faction gets too powerfull.

 

Lol awhat? City of heroes? Even in wow Horde are portrayed as villains, your facts do not support your thoery, it was oversight on BW's part plain and simple.

[TheFieryBalrog]

Uhm, yes it did. Evil vs Good side. Mostly effective on PvP servers though (the Zeks). The game was meant as a PvE game though and PvP in it was an afterthought, so not really comparative to todays MMOs.

False. You were not locked to factions and you could gain/lose reputation with various cities. Certain races were more pushed to one side than the other, but that was about it.

[CG_Osirhis]

When one side of the conflict has blatantly obvious advantages over the other, that is a problem. Logic isn't your strong suit eh?

 

Have fun being FOTM champ, it'll only last so long.

 

 

1.) I fail to see these "blatanly obvious advantages" that you speak off apart from maybe Ilum imbalance (which is a valid point)

 

2.) There wasn't an argument presented in my post...it was a simple and witty way of pointing out the logical inconsistency in the previous poster's statement. So your statement about my logic is invalidated. (I'm a fourth year philosophy major...don't try to condescend to me about logic...you will fail.)

[bennyhana]

I'm having plenty of fun in this game because I'm in a guild with a good group of guys I have been playing with for years. That's what playing an MMO is all about. But what I fail to see why you aren't having fun apart from this weird idea that people who chose to play Sith is somehow ruining your fun.

 

Hmm.. i don't remember me saying i'm not having fun. But this is a pointless conversation, maybe the crying you think the pubs are doing might just be asking people to maybe broaden their sense of the republic themselves.. I'm sure a decent portion saw the forums saying how terrible the pub stories are, how terrible the gear looks, before even actually trying for themselves, so they'll just keep falling in line.

[CG_Osirhis]

Hmm.. i don't remember me saying i'm not having fun. But this is a pointless conversation, maybe the crying you think the pubs are doing might just be asking people to maybe broaden their sense of the republic themselves.. I'm sure a decent portion saw the forums saying how terrible the pub stories are, how terrible the gear looks, before even actually trying for themselves, so they'll just keep falling in line.

 

The reason I chose Empire because I (like I'm sure many others did too) played during the open beta weekend on the Republic...and was not interested in the Republic because the story was not interesting and the gear models looked horrible.

 

I'm just not interested in Republic...but trust me, the attitude I see from many Republic players doesn't give me much incentive to try out the other side either.

[ippollite]

Hmm.. i don't remember me saying i'm not having fun. But this is a pointless conversation, maybe the crying you think the pubs are doing might just be asking people to maybe broaden their sense of the republic themselves.. I'm sure a decent portion saw the forums saying how terrible the pub stories are, how terrible the gear looks, before even actually trying for themselves, so they'll just keep falling in line.

 

Its a bank run dude

 

Whats happening is that every thread proclaiming a republic flight to empire actually helps brings it about as people wonder if they should quickly change their faction, or get caught out when everyone else leaves and suddenly they really do have a faction problem and no one to run flashpoints/operations with.

 

It doesnt matter if the particular server you are on is healthy, republic players are twitchy at the moment and this is a very big part of the issue.

 

PS. to those complaining about giving unfair advantages... thats the point. Thats exactly why theyre part of the discussion. If they gave empire the same thing we'd be back at square one.

Edited January 26, 2012 by ippollite

[CommanderFrog]

Actually it is biowares fault, empire is far more attractive, and class wise, empire classes are stronger, I believe IA is only slightly weaker then smuggler, but the rest are much stronger..specially BH to trooper

[XxZkoolxX]

Bioware is doing all this for the lulz. There, I've fulfilled my mindless trolling quota for the day.

[bennyhana]

The reason I chose Empire because I (like I'm sure many others did too) played during the open beta weekend on the Republic...and was not interested in the Republic because the story was not interesting and the gear models looked horrible.

 

I'm just not interested in Republic...but trust me, the attitude I see from many Republic players doesn't give me much incentive to try out the other side either.

 

Just to verify I am not aiming this at YOU! I'm generalizing most players, not you and your click of imp friends. I don't care about your sense of entitlement to the Empire because you were a beta player, and you call us, the republic smug. lol

 

this is the type of attitude that once again leads to "I'm right you're wrong". which leads to the spreading of faction rumors. Its just too bad people are too stubborn or lazy to find out for themselves, and will jump on the forums join the band waggon and spread it quicker than the plague.

Edited January 26, 2012 by bennyhana

[Exilim]

I'll bite...

 

Say I create a house with two rooms, but you can only enter one.

 

In one room is a boring dude with a brown robe who will offer to teach you to meditate. In the other room is a bad***** with a sweet black robe who offers to teach you the secret of power.

 

Which room do you choose?

 

In a 2 faction game, if one side is way more attractive to players than the other...guess where they will go?

 

 

I wouldn't go in the room with the evil looking guy that will probably try to kill me. LA LA LA

[CG_Osirhis]

Just to verify I am not aiming this at YOU! I'm generalizing most players, not you and your click of imp friends. I don't care about your sense of entitlement to the Empire because you were a beta player, and you call us, the republic smug. lol

 

1.) It's "clique", bro.

 

2.) To quote Princess Bride..."I don't think that word means what you think it means..." Let me restate...I played in beta. My experience from playing Republic in beta was less than stellar. Therefore, I chose Empire.

 

Please stop being your own straw man.

[TheFieryBalrog]

2.) There wasn't an argument presented in my post...it was a simple and witty way of pointing out the logical inconsistency in the previous poster's statement.

 

Then perhaps you'd like to use your vast intellect and sharp wit to concoct an excuse for the inability to defect from one faction to the other, despite that being a cornerstone of SW lore and much of the lore in this game itself. And why BH and Smuggler are locked.

 

I notice you shut up about it once I pointed that out, so much for logical inconsistency.

[CG_Osirhis]

Then perhaps you'd like to use your vast intellect and sharp wit to concoct an excuse for the inability to defect from one faction to the other, despite that being a cornerstone of SW lore and much of the lore in this game itself. And why BH and Smuggler are locked.

 

I notice you shut up about it once I pointed that out, so much for logical inconsistency.

 

Ok...here I go....*searching my vast intellect*....*running through sharp wit database*...

 

 

They haven't implemented it yet? They might implement it later on down the line.

 

 

And since you take such great pride and high esteem in the whole "bounty hunter/smuggler" thing...maybe in the lore of the present day, the bounty hunters see more gain to be made by aligning with the Empire and the smugglers see more to be gained by aligning with the Republic. In fact, didn't they have a whole storyline video about how smugglers wanted to help the Republic by breaking some blockade?

 

It seems like the precedent was even more set in the original trilogy that smugglers (ie Han Solo) help the Republic and Bounty Hunters (ie Boba Fett) help the Empire. So if anything, they are set because of tradition.

 

"ARE YOU NOT ENTERTAINED?!?!" Lol.

[bennyhana]

1.) It's "clique", bro.

 

2.) To quote Princess Bride..."I don't think that word means what you think it means..." Let me restate...I played in beta. My experience from playing Republic in beta was less than stellar. Therefore, I chose Empire.

 

Please stop being your own straw man.

 

I like how you've managed to attempt to twist everything that i have said, and for some reason keep aiming it at yourself to avoid agreeing with the actuality that most people are too stubborn to even try. the fact that you cant accept anything that i have said just only proves more of what i have been trying to say. (this time i aimed it at you)

(grammar is not my strong point. so i'm sure you'll poke at that too, since you have already.)

Edited January 26, 2012 by bennyhana

[Redsuns_]

how is this not bioware fault? Its their responsibility to make both factions appealing. Have you seen the 3 intro movies for swtor yet? Its all about the sith kicking the jedi asses. In-game, a lot of stuff are biased towards the empire too.

 

So you are saying"oh my business is so bad, because i cannot control which shop the customers will patronize?"

 

I love how fanboys always blame the players than the devs.

[CG_Osirhis]

I like how you've managed to attempt to twist everything that i have said, and for some reason keep aiming it at yourself to avoid agreeing with the actuality that most people are too stubborn to even try. the fact that you cant accept anything that i have said just only proves more of what i have been trying to say. (this time i aimed it at you)

(grammar is not my strong point. so i'm sure you'll poke at that too, since you have already.)

 

1.) What have I twisted? Use a specific example instead of sweeping accusations please.

 

2.) Specifically relating to what I have bolded...Your claim is invalid because I explicitly stated that I have already tried Republic (twice I might add) as well as many others probably already have too.

 

3.) Also pertaining to what I have bolded...what have you said that was of any substance? All I have seen is these sweeping generalizations that have no basis in fact and no evidence to support.

[Aleoi]

Meh. Nothing made me pick what I play except what I was in the mood for.

 

I went empire cause I wanted to be a sniper. I always like playing a sniper.

 

I went empire again because my life didn't have enough shivving in it. Shivving is like hugging...on the inside.

 

I tried making a sorc and a jugg, but dealing with sith is just so weak at times and they do it more than any other class. Sith complain and moan about just about everything while blustering on about how powerful they are and you better do what they say. Only they rarely make good on those threats despite how much **** you give them. Hmm...kinda like the internet that way.

 

Warriors and Inquisitors need a force choke puppy option for every conversation. Get that nonsensical need for evil right out there. Every scene has a puppy hidden in it and if you find it, you can choke it. Find me a scene where that wouldn't work.

 

I have a guardian now, paired with a sage, I get to see both storylines. So far its what I expected. I come in, calm and rational, and deal with stuff. Its what they do. Problem is, most players can't relate to that at all.

 

I have powertech tank too, paired with an operative.

 

I have fun with them all, and really haven't seen anything to make me feel one side is better than the other. Other than maybe Hutta being an utter ****hole visually, which it should be. Thats what happens when you let hutts run planets after all.

 

Yeah...its 4 am and I'm rambling...

Edited January 26, 2012 by Aleoi