Smuggler/Ops healing. Where it is and where I'd like to see it go

[navido]

I have already posted this once in a different forum but feel like it's not being seen as much and would like more input on where the community stands on this one.

 

 

The thing with Op/Smuggler healing is it's hard to play. It's one of the more interesting healing classes I've ever played in an MMO and I feel like when played well it's one of the most powerful healing classes in the game with it's utility and mobility.

 

Now hear me out before you start judging this post.

 

First off, our main heal

 

2 Sec cast.... not bad but due to the fact that Alacrity really doesn't help at all makes it rough to land in PvP on focused targets. When used early in a fight and UH/TA stacks can be built it's more of a non issue. This heal could be fixed with one change that would fix most of our other heals as well which I'll get to in a second.

 

The short cast heal that requires a charge of UH/TA.....

 

This...heal...is....useless. I honestly don't understand the point of this ability... it needs to either have a HoT added to it (Which would work with well with our other HoT's) OR it needs to put some kind of buff on the target. Something like an x% healing increase or an x% dmg reduction buff. Something to keep this on a PvP healers bar.

 

The stacking HoT

 

I do like our HoT and when stacked twice it's very nice. The issue is with a 1.5 sec GCD getting 2 stacks of this on more than one person in PvP is a tall order and one that likely ends in another teammate dying. Honestly I would rather this ability do all it's healing in ONE stack instead of needing to stack it and if that turned out to be too powerful bring the healing back 10-15% on it.

 

31 point talent...

 

I understand that a lot of people don't like this ability, and I must admit it isn't great... but at least it's not the AoE grenade BH/Commando get right? Yes the Sorc/Sage AoE heals for more but it in on the ground (Read doesn't move) and must be channeled (Read can't move) so it doesn't leave much room for .... you know... moving... The healing on it may be a touch lackluster and could prolly use just a touch of love from BioWare but since it does move with the tagets it's healing it does still have a place.

 

 

Instant heal that requires TA/UH

 

Best heal in the tree by far no questions asked. Love this ability. The ability to spam it on targets under 30% is the only reason this healer works and can be played well in PvP. Please please BioWare don't touch this ability. You got this one right **Golf clap**

 

 

Diagnostic scan

 

Ok... now I understand why this heal is in the game, I understand it's purpose and function. What I DO NOT understand is why do I need to spend FOUR count them FOUR talent points to make this useful in any way shape or form? Honestly if this cost 2 talents points (1 for the crit 1 for the energy) I would love this ability.... but with that high a cost it's just not worth it in PvP at all. Side note I also think this being an instant cast isn't a terrible idea either as it would keep in line with our mobile healing.

 

 

Now for changes I'd like to see be made.

 

1) For the love of all things good and holy please PLEASE allow Alacrity to affect HoT's. You shove so much of this stat on our high level gear but really we only have 1 casted heal that's worth casting. Let's this stat work with HoT's would not only GREATLY help our HoT's and overall healing but also make our one casted heal a little closer on par with the other healers who stack a bit more Alacrity due to it's usefulness to them.

 

 

2) I'd very much like to have a CD added (1 min) that granted a charge (Maybe with that diagnostic scan change add a new talent that gives 2 charges????) of UH/TA. This change does 2 things for us.

 

 

A: When our one and ONLY casted heal that doesn't require UH/TA get interrupted we would have the ability to use the instant heal or even the quick heal (You know, with the changes you'll be making to it ) instead of standing around or throwing a grenade (I know pistol whip grants a charge but people aren't always in melee range and it's not always possible to get to someone before you NEED that heal)

 

 

 

B: When you come up to a fight and an ally is low and you don't have TA/UH what do you do? Cast the only heal we can and hope and pray they don't die... This CD would allow us to use our better heals without having to have already been a part of the fight (Much like shield+channeled heal for Sage/Sorc and Trauma probe + a quick cast heal for BH/Commando)

 

 

3) Dodge and the talents for dodge needs to changed.

 

 

A: This ability needs to dodge force and tech attacks, period. It just does. It last 3 seconds for the sake of pete.

 

 

 

B: The talent for this... while nice, doesn't really do much. I'd rather it either remove snares/roots OR and I like this change better make us immune to knockbacks for those 3 seconds. For a class with ZERO gap closers of any kind either way (Push enemy away, pull ally towards) this would help us immeasurable

 

 

4) Vanish... now this honestly bothers me so much about this class. How are you going to give us stealth, give us vanish and then reduce healing received.... AND DEALT by 100% for 10 seconds after use... ok the healing received thing I get... kinda... but the dealt? Really? Why? Why can I not heal my partner after using this? This just needs to be changed.

 

 

5) I would like defensive screen to change in two ways.

 

 

A: Show me ON the tooltip what this absorbs.

 

 

 

B: Let me use this on an ally as well, this would add another depth to the class that I think is somewhat missing.

 

 

 

 

Like it, hate it, couldn't case less. I just hope you read it and take it with a grain of salt. Yes I PvP... A lot and have in many many games though I won't sit and talk about how good I am at this or that, I just wanted to share my honest opinion of the class where it sits now and where I hope it can move to in the future.

 

 

Edit : I know it's long, sorry I tend to go into detail a little much sometimes, though I did try to keep it from being a mega crit wall of text

[elithrar]

I'm just going to comment on the bits where I want to add something. I agree RE: Emergency Medpack being awesome.

 

31 point talent...

 

I understand that a lot of people don't like this ability, and I must admit it isn't great... but at least it's not the AoE grenade BH/Commando get right? Yes the Sorc/Sage AoE heals for more but it in on the ground (Read doesn't move) and must be channeled (Read can't move) so it doesn't leave much room for .... you know... moving... The healing on it may be a touch lackluster and could prolly use just a touch of love from BioWare but since it does move with the tagets it's healing it does still have a place.

 

The +15% buff from the two-piece set bonus should just be baked in.

 

Diagnostic scan

 

Ok... now I understand why this heal is in the game, I understand it's purpose and function. What I DO NOT understand is why do I need to spend FOUR count them FOUR talent points to make this useful in any way shape or form? Honestly if this cost 2 talents points (1 for the crit 1 for the energy) I would love this ability.... but with that high a cost it's just not worth it in PvP at all. Side note I also think this being an instant cast isn't a terrible idea either as it would keep in line with our mobile healing.

 

Agreed. The four (4) talent point investment is way too much. It should be +12% crit/1 energy back (1/2) and +24% crit/2 energy back (2/2), and they could toss some +armor or whatever buff in there somewhere to make up for lost points.

 

4) Vanish... now this honestly bothers me so much about this class. How are you going to give us stealth, give us vanish and then reduce healing received.... AND DEALT by 100% for 10 seconds after use... ok the healing received thing I get... kinda... but the dealt? Really? Why? Why can I not heal my partner after using this? This just needs to be changed.

 

Since you can't heal from stealth, I completely agree. Using it for a quick target break/reposition means you're boned for the next 10 seconds, which is crazy. If you could heal from stealth (which I don't agree with), I'd understand the debuff. But it doesn't make sense in the current context.

Edited January 23, 2012 by elithrar

[nvmvoidrays]

to preface, i'm only level 23, so, i'll just comment on what i've got so far.

 

vanish:

 

y'know, i totally didn't realize this also reduced healing dealt to 100%. that's completely retarded and needs to be changed like yesterday. i realized it reduced healing done to you by 100%, which, is understandable, i suppose, but dealt? no.

 

kolto pack/kolto infusion:

 

this needs a secondary effect desperately. or, there needs to be a talent that allows it to be cast without consuming a charge of upper hand/tactical advantage, but this talent needs to be rolled into a talent that we'd already get. rolling it into healing hand or medpack mastery would let ANY sawbones get it, but not every scoundrel would get it.

 

or it can get both.

 

hell, healing scan/advanced medical probe give a HoT plus 10% armor for minimal cost and they're spammable with supercharged gas/cells.

 

slow-release medpack:

 

roll the double stack into one, imo. if not, give it a secondary effect of some description. what? i'm not sure. add SRMP to accomplished sawbones, maybe?

 

that's about all i can comment on, atm. also, a secondary way to recover energy that's not diagnostic scan? lol

[Nebelleron]

Diagnostic scan works fine, and the problem with the 4 talent points argument is a pure heal spec doesn't really have anything worthwhile to spend them on. Also, as it stands it is a purely PVE ability.

 

Kolto Cloud would be significantly better if it didn't have the restriction of 4 people in the affected area. Between its cooldown and energy cost, and the fact that in almost NO situations does your entire team or group stack, it balances itself out. This would make our "Ultimate" heal actually ultimate.

 

Also, some other suggestions I have posted before.

- Allow Diagnostic scan to refresh the duration of all the Smuggler's existing HoT effects on the target.

- Allow up to 3 stacks of Slow-release, since its energy cost is prohibitive to actual spamming and 2 stacks doesn't stand up to a lot of damage.

[Daqu]

/Signed. Navido for President!

[nvmvoidrays]

Allow up to 3 stacks of Slow-release, since its energy cost is prohibitive to actual spamming and 2 stacks doesn't stand up to a lot of damage.

 

i was going to suggest that too.

 

another option to buff sawbones is to, possibly, add an increased healing per stack of SRMP to a talent, say, 5% per stack of SMRP if it stays at 2, 3% if it goes to 3, for a total of 10%.

[Zenirvana]

from my experience to buff sawbones to where it needs to be for me is this:

 

dodge increased to 10 seconds

 

vanish no longer stops healing dealt or recieved

 

diagnostic scan provides insight into target's injuries granting a 20% heal bonus on target for 10 seconds

 

 

 

 

A 3 second dodge is a joke compared to force run, bubble, and knockbacks. Putting a heal debuff on vanish for sawbones was just mean spirited. Diagnostic scan for 4 points is worthless in pvp and having it provide a nice heal buff would justify the long cast time in pvp.

[skuggz]

First off... /signed ... I agree with you on almost all counts.

 

I took a stab at it in another thread, but long story short, Kolto pack NEEDS something... at this point it's an utterly dead keybind. I proposed then that it reset the timer on our slow release med pack stacks on the target, but that's admittedly a PvE idea more than PvP... I could be convinced pretty easily that a % healed increase buff or the like would be a better universal incentive.

 

In fact, if we were to get back a point or two that we had formerly invested in making Diagnostic scan effective I would gladly pay it back to get something useful out of KP.

 

--------

Disappearing Act has really been spotty for me since the patch (half the time it just won't activate in pvp), but even before then, I felt like it needed a change of some sort... sure it will drop target on me for a second... but since it drops my healing received, it's practically a death sentence unless i'm using it very early to reposition, or have a defensive cooldown to pair it with.

 

--------

I'm also a firm believer that a 3rd stack of SRMP would be a great way to buff our POTENTIAL output without just being a blanket buff to healing numbers.

 

Neither time nor energy cost would allow us to run that on more than basically one target, but it would make our HoT's actually a factor on that target, and force us to invest even more in keeping the stack up without it falling off, or pay else pay a lot of energy (and time) to get it back up.

 

---------

Finally, dear god yes, let alacrity effect our HoT's.... As it is, I'm intentionally shedding it for crit and surge. Reducing the cast time of Underworld is nice, but not nearly enough of an output incentive to make me even try and stack Alacrity.

 

 

Obviously, there are other things to talk about, but the OP cover it pretty well, nice post.

Edited January 23, 2012 by skuggz

[MelliMelon]

I think all of those suggestions makes sense and yes, they would be great. However, it does seem a bit of wishful thinking. Those changes would make us the best healers by far. I love our mobility, it does wonders in PvP and I would not sacrifice that for anything, and don't want to become like other classes. If HM FPs are a bit more difficult to attain, then so be it, but besides the gap closer issue (which really really really sucks in huttball), I have no issues with our class.

 

From your Vrook Lamar level 50 scoundrel,

Melyn

[nvmvoidrays]

from my experience to buff sawbones to where it needs to be for me is this:

 

dodge increased to 10 seconds

 

vanish no longer stops healing dealt or recieved

 

diagnostic scan provides insight into target's injuries granting a 20% heal bonus on target for 10 seconds

 

 

 

 

A 3 second dodge is a joke compared to force run, bubble, and knockbacks. Putting a heal debuff on vanish for sawbones was just mean spirited. Diagnostic scan for 4 points is worthless in pvp and having it provide a nice heal buff would justify the long cast time in pvp.

 

10 seconds for dodge might be too long considering its a 1 minute cool down. 5-7 is more reasonable.

 

vanish doesn't need to stop healing received by 100%, but dealt? yeah, that needs to be changed immediately. if you vanish to stop people from targeting you or in PvE when you have adds ****** your face, well... i don't think i need to explain further.

 

20% is too much of a healing bonus. 10% would be more reasonable and bump the duration to 15 seconds.

[Zenirvana]

10 seconds for dodge might be too long considering its a 1 minute cool down. 5-7 is more reasonable.

Any improvement is needed but 10 seconds of dodge with 50 seconds of downtime I would still trade for light armor, force run, and bubble.

 

vanish doesn't need to stop healing received by 100%, but dealt? yeah, that needs to be changed immediately. if you vanish to stop people from targeting you or in PvE when you have adds ****** your face, well... i don't think i need to explain further.

Vanish is an absolute fail ability. Breaks 9 times out of 10 yet still prevents you from performing the one thing you spent 31 points into doing.

 

20% is too much of a healing bonus. 10% would be more reasonable and bump the duration to 15 seconds.

Taking the time to stand still and cast in pvp the buff better be worth it.

 

I wish I could see these changes on a test server just for giggles.

[Trimanir]

What if Emergency medpack was removed and replace by a talent removing energy cost Kolto Pack, also all talent on emergency medpack moved to affect Kolto Pack

 

with good alacrity we could cast Kolto Pack each second for free on 30% and less allies, also it heal more but we lose the instant.

 

Kit need more alacrity, (make more sense with gear) and PVE 4 piece set is now fun.

 

Drawback are PVP we lose mobilty this could hurt a lot.

[Iheamylap]

I like your suggestions! Well thought out, and I feel like you plucked your concerns and changes right out of my head!

 

I would greatly accept a better way to drum up UH/TA procs. I think it would be easier if Slow Release Medpac was changed to provide its full benefit from just one cast. Then I could have it on more party members, increasing the UH proc chance.

 

I whole heartedly agree that Dodge needs to include ALL attacks, and the boosting of it needs some additional work. Either a duration increase, or something like you suggest.

 

I would also yes love for there to be a Version of Diagnostic Scan I can place on another player. A separate ability (so I don't' accidentally cast it on another when I need it on myself), but with a shared cooldown timer.

[SliggXx]

vanish no longer stops healing dealt or recieved

 

diagnostic scan provides insight into target's injuries granting a 20% heal bonus on target for 10 seconds

 

 

You win the thread. GREAT idea.

 

 

-Kolto Cloud should heal for nearly double what it does and tick faster. A 31 point talent should be a game-changer.

 

-Either remove HoT stacking and increase the value of the HoT to compensate or have HoTs not trigger Global CD. Either way it is too time consuming to get multiple players running with HoTs.

 

-Allow alacrity to increase tick rate of HoTs. WE HAVE ENOUGH ALACRITY ON OUR GEAR DON'T WE?

 

-Diagnostic talent improvements should be combined, only requiring two points to max it out.

 

-Defense screen should be castable on other players. In the absence of all changes above, Defense Screen should be a group buff like Sage Bubble. With the above changes, this might be too much and a bit OP.

 

-Dodge should block all damage, period. It's three seconds...I mean really...