Tracer missile tracer missile tracer missile tracer missile tracer missile

[Dayshadow]

Tracer hits for 2500 only when it crits, otherwise it hits for 1200-1500.

 

Tracer Missile cannot be spammed forever because of heat issues.

 

The Reason Tracer Missile hits really hard is because of the 35% Armor Penetration from the Stance, stacked with the 20% you get by stacking heat signatures.

 

 

 

The Stance itself is actually the overpowered portion of the class, not tracer missile itself.

 

35% Armor Reduction on every attack is pretty much dead tank.

 

 

Please learn how classes work before calling for nerfs.

 

 

 

Because Tracer ignores 55% of the target's armor, it pretty much hits every class for the same amount, its the most sustained damage in the game, none of it is bursty, its almost always about the same amount no matter who your fighting.

 

 

 

I am all for nerfing the stance, since that is what probably needs to happen, because its really the stance that your having an issue with, not the ability.

 

Gunnery is supposed to have the same mechanics. I have played gunnery from lvl 10-47. Please stop pretending to know how a class works.

 

Grav round can be spammed nigh indefinitely (within the timeframe of a skirmish). It takes a long time for me to run out of ammo if I use grav round, full auto, high impact bolt and demo round. Mainly because they refund ammo and/or have a ammo cost reduction.

 

35% armor penetration equates to 1.7% damage increase. 55% is 2.7%. That's a difference of around 40 dmg per shot. And of course it's applied to all attacks so it builds up over time.

 

Unless you are a bunch of non-expertisers vs a single expertised player you won't have 5 stacks of anything before the target dies. Besides, if they are supposed to be mirrors the tracers are used to get you 20% addtional armor reduction. So why are they opening up with tracers hitting for 2000-2500K?

 

Grav round crits for 1800. Tracer round hits for 2000 and crits for 2500. I have never been hit by a tracer that didn't do at least 1800. Typically it's low end is 2100. Full auto critting all 3 shots is going to only do around 3000ish damage and that's supposed to be the main dmg dealer (BH mirror:Unload).

 

All I'm saying is that tracer should be brought down to grav round's dmg. They currently are NOT mirrors. I don't want a nerf. I want them at the exact same dmg as commandos. As they are supposed to be.

Edited January 23, 2012 by Dayshadow

[Daecollo]

Gunnery is supposed to have the same mechanics. I have played gunnery from lvl 10-47. Please stop pretending to know how a class works.

 

Grav round can be spammed nigh indefinitely (within the timeframe of a skirmish). It takes a long time for me to run out of ammo if I use grav round, full auto, high impact bolt and demo round. Mainly because they refund ammo and/or have a ammo cost reduction.

 

35% armor penetration equates to 1.7% damage increase. 55% is 2.7%. That's a difference of around 40 dmg per shot. And of course it's applied to all attacks so it builds up over time.

 

Unless you are a bunch of non-expertisers vs a single expertised player you won't have 5 stacks of anything before the target dies. Besides, if they are supposed to be mirrors the tracers are used to get you 20% addtional armor reduction. So why are they opening up with tracers hitting for 2000-2500K?

 

Grav round crits for 1800. Tracer round hits for 2000 and crits for 2500. I have never been hit by a tracer that didn't do at least 1800. Typically it's low end is 2100. Full auto critting all 3 shots is going to only do around 3000ish damage and that's supposed to be the main dmg dealer (BH mirror:Unload).

 

All I'm saying is that tracer should be brought down to grav round's dmg. They currently are NOT mirrors. I don't want a nerf. I want them at the exact same dmg as commandos. As they are supposed to be.

 

Something is wrong with you then, the abilities do the exact same damage.

 

Maybe they actidently labeled Tracer Missile as a tech Ability and Grav Round is not?

 

When I use tracer (full surge/crit specced.) it hits for 1270 noncrit, crits are 2540.

Edited January 23, 2012 by Daecollo

[Machazareel]

Tracer does 2000-2500.

Grav Round does 800-1200.

 

Grav round is nothing but filler to get Full Auto off CD and prime high impact bolt and demolition round. Tracer round is better than Full Auto and has no knockback. Full Auto is only better if all 3 hits crit. Even then it is inferior because of the 15 sec CD. A BH can outright kill you in half that time spamming tracers.

 

This is so wrong it's absolutely hilarious. This is why you can't take nerf threads on these forums seriously, people don't even know how the game works.

[Dayshadow]

This is so wrong it's absolutely hilarious. This is why you can't take nerf threads on these forums seriously, people don't even know how the game works.

 

Operatives said the same thing about their overpowered attacks in PvP.

[_Nobby_]

You think we like that? Gimme a break. Give me an interrupt or a jump (Not sure why a Bounty Hunter can't charge people with ROCKETS DUH).....

 

Otherwise we have no abilities other than tracer......

 

Really poor response mate. BH spam tracer missle because they can. Just the same as Sorcs can spam force lightning. It gives you an easy way to do high damage repeatedly because the ability has a low heat cost and it provides a rediculous debuff.

 

As vanguard, I spend at least half of my globals on auto attacks because of having to maintain a decent ammunition level. Ion Pulse is the only spammable ability I have and has a high ammo cost compared to a BH specced into tracer missle. My big hitting abilities have relatively long CDs. Without taking binds for taunts and defensive CDs, i've got six buttons i'm regularly pushing during sustained combat. Most BH I face will just use tracer missle. If I interrupt them, the jump around for four seconds and start casting it again. If they aren't brain-dead they'll cast unload on me or rocket punch.

 

It's human nature to take the easy way out.

[Orkayl]

Really poor response mate. BH spam tracer missle because they can. Just the same as Sorcs can spam force lightning. It gives you an easy way to do high damage repeatedly because the ability has a low heat cost and it provides a rediculous debuff.

 

As vanguard, I spend at least half of my globals on auto attacks because of having to maintain a decent ammunition level. Ion Pulse is the only spammable ability I have and has a high ammo cost compared to a BH specced into tracer missle. My big hitting abilities have relatively long CDs. Without taking binds for taunts and defensive CDs, i've got six buttons i'm regularly pushing during sustained combat. Most BH I face will just use tracer missle. If I interrupt them, the jump around for four seconds and start casting it again. If they aren't brain-dead they'll cast unload on me or rocket punch.

 

It's human nature to take the easy way out.

 

No, we can't. 25 heat isn't a 'low' heat cost. You can spam exactly 5 if you proc a crit to vent 8 heat before you have to vent.

 

No BH just spams tracer nonstop.

 

As many others have already stated, nobody is ever going to take you serious when you just make up data and exaggerate the **** out of things.

 

If you really wanted to make a legitimate argument you would come with real data, and a real knowledge of how to play the spec. If tracer/grav was overpowered (it's not) then you wouldn't need to exaggerate to try to make it seem that way.

[Kipchak]

I thought OP to be hilarious.

 

Quit "l2p, youre bad" crap. He ain't saying mercs are OP. It is tragic, and OP is right to some extent.

 

Think that you play a 321321321 micro management button marauder/sentinel against a merc/commando. It gets even funnier.

Edited January 23, 2012 by Kipchak

[Stabbitha]

Whatever. So what should we ***** about? Let's ***** about BioWare making a 3-button class.

Tracer missile spammers, I still hate you.

 

This just in: Stationary range DPS characters should not do DPS while stationary and players are at range in front of them.

 

Coming shortly:So you're wearing cloth and explode like a biscuit when I give you an uppercut, you must be nerfed!!!

[Stratoforce]

There is no imbalance. If you believe there is so adamantly then find a merc and a commando with the same stats and have them attack the same target enough times to get real data.

 

I've noticed a huge trend by repubs on these forums to try to explain away underperforming in WZs with 'imbalances' of which only about 5% have any validity.

 

Also, FWIW there are probably just as many imbalances with the mirrors the other way, but Emps who are used to winning all the time don't spend half their playtime try to find any excuse for losing except poor coordination/teamwork/gear.

 

Obviously I am generalizing (sorry if this doesn't apply to you personally) but there is a definite trend with this attitude.

 

I play both sides.

 

My trooper has MORE gear than the BH in question, and Grav rounds doesn't hit as hard. My trooper actually has 9% more extra damage on critical. Like most Troopers now, I've went assault specialist for PvP.

 

I like to experience things myself before making any sort of claim. I enjoy playing both Republic and Empire too, so.

[Orkayl]

I play both sides.

 

My trooper has MORE gear than the BH in question, and Grav rounds doesn't hit as hard. My trooper actually has 9% more extra damage on critical. Like most Troopers now, I've went assault specialist for PvP.

 

I like to experience things myself before making any sort of claim. I enjoy playing both Republic and Empire too, so.

 

All I read is that empire players have more expertise/mitigation on average than republic.

 

I already knew that.

[Stratoforce]

No, we can't. 25 heat isn't a 'low' heat cost. You can spam exactly 5 if you proc a crit to vent 8 heat before you have to vent.

 

No BH just spams tracer nonstop.

 

As many others have already stated, nobody is ever going to take you serious when you just make up data and exaggerate the **** out of things.

 

If you really wanted to make a legitimate argument you would come with real data, and a real knowledge of how to play the spec. If tracer/grav was overpowered (it's not) then you wouldn't need to exaggerate to try to make it seem that way.

 

You can get off way more than 5 Tracer missles. I get off 6 on my level 21 BH before he is maxed heat, assuming I am being lazy and that is all I am doing.

 

25-9=16.

 

http://www.torhead.com/ability/74A88UM/tracer-missile

 

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#300ZMIkboMb.1

 

Assuming you get any Terminal Velocity procs, you can easily get off 8 before filling up a heat bar. Hell, even 9.

[_Nobby_]

No, we can't. 25 heat isn't a 'low' heat cost. You can spam exactly 5 if you proc a crit to vent 8 heat before you have to vent.

 

No BH just spams tracer nonstop.

 

As many others have already stated, nobody is ever going to take you serious when you just make up data and exaggerate the **** out of things.

 

If you really wanted to make a legitimate argument you would come with real data, and a real knowledge of how to play the spec. If tracer/grav was overpowered (it's not) then you wouldn't need to exaggerate to try to make it seem that way.

 

Five missles is more than enough to drop me once my ability to passively mitigate damage is serverly diminished. The stats I currently have in PvP gear are:

 

-52% damage reduction

-12% defence chance

-37% shield chance

-42% absorption

-10.8% damage reduction from expertise

 

BH are fully capable of only using tracer missle. During stuns I put on them, interrupts and periods where they are attempting to get distance from me, they are disipating heat adding 1-2 more missles they can cast in their effective combat period. At the end of that period, i'm dead or they are.

 

There's no need to exaggerate here. There's no combat log with no real data. I also played BH in beta.

 

You can't tell me that in a voidstar game you don't constantly see clowns on the attacking team standing behind the sorcs mashing their tracer missle keybinds. I could make a stop-motion, Benny Hill style video from screen shots all day long it's that rediculous.

[Machazareel]

Operatives said the same thing about their overpowered attacks in PvP.

 

Operatives *and* Scoundrels were saying that. You know why? Because they're mirrors and the abilities do the same amount of damage.

[Mattpatt]

This ^

 

The people that get owned by Tracer missile are the ones that simply don't pay attention and deserve a quick death.

 

Safe to say before 1.1.1, people who didn't get out of range once up from being knocked down by a Operative deserve to die aswell?

[Rogobono]

I have a Mercenary, and you are FORCED into pushing this one, single button, over and over. I disliked it so much i just scrapped it at level 50 and moved on. Something need be done, not only with this but with EXPERTISE! SCRAP EXPERTISE!

[Machazareel]

Safe to say before 1.1.1, people who didn't get out of range once up from being knocked down by a Operative deserve to die aswell?

 

Yes. People just needed to get some gear.

[jcyrus]

Here's the problem with Tracer Missile, in a nutshell:

 

Tracer Missile

Cast Time: 1 second

Heat: 25

Range: 30m

Launches a missile at the target that deals 1117 - 1213 kinetic damage and applies a heat signature, reducing the armor rating by 4% for 15 seconds. Stacks up to 5 times. Heat signatures leave the target vulnerable to Rail Shot.

 

Snipe

Cast Time: 1 second

Energy: 20

Range: 30m (35m if AC is Sniper)

Shoots a target for 1191 - 1362 point weapon damage. Can only be used from cover.

 

Tracer missile essentially gives Mercenaries Snipe capability, except without the garbage weapon damage type, and with a -4% armor debuff that stacks 5 times. The Rail Shot vulnerability Tracer Missile leaves is basically Followthrough (another Sniper skill) for Mercenaries.

 

By it's very design Tracer Missile was crafted to be spammed.

 

The easiest fix to the Tracer Missile problem would be to add a cooldown of say... 8 seconds (just as an example). Along with that cooldown, change the debuff to -10% armor, and make it stack twice. That gives the same armor debuff once fully stacked (-20%), and will promote the usage of other abilities while waiting for the ability to refresh.

Edited January 23, 2012 by jcyrus

[Grawed]

Skraw Sith Juggernaut

 

No issues vs Merc/Mando's in a 1v1 situation, the only time they can be a pain is when ignored.

 

There has to be a class for people with the inability to process 2+2... Its ok if they can just spam 1 because they will never out play or out do a 2.

 

Please send me a challenge any time if you would like to prove me wrong.

[Daecollo]

Here's the problem with Tracer Missile, in a nutshell:

 

Tracer Missile

Cast Time: 1 second

Heat: 25

Range: 30m

Launches a missile at the target that deals 1117 - 1213 kinetic damage and applies a heat signature, reducing the armor rating by 4% for 15 seconds. Stacks up to 5 times. Heat signatures leave the target vulnerable to Rail Shot.

 

Snipe

Cast Time: 1 second

Energy: 20

Range: 30m (35m if AC is Sniper)

Shoots a target for 1191 - 1362 point weapon damage. Can only be used from cover.

 

Tracer missile essentially gives Mercenaries Snipe capability, except without the garbage weapon damage type, and with a -4% armor debuff that stacks 5 times.

 

By it's very design the ability was crafted to be spammed.

 

The easiest fix to the Tracer Missile problem would be to add a cooldown of say... 8 seconds (just as an example). Along with that cooldown, change the debuff to -10% armor, and make it stack twice. That gives the same armor debuff once fully stacked (-20%), and will promote the usage of other abilities while waiting for the ability to refresh.

 

Tracer Missile has a Cooldown of 1.5 Seconds.

The Passive Stance that the Mercenerys get increases there armor penetration by 35%, +20% From Talents, making it 55%.

 

Don't call nerfs from classes if you don't know how they work.

 

Giving it a cooldown like that would be "..." because you could completely lock it down via interrupts, so basicly you can hit us but we couldn't do anything to you? very fair!

Edited January 23, 2012 by Daecollo

[Machazareel]

I think you mean cast time. But that's true for Snipe as well, they're both 1.5s casts.

[Orkayl]

Here's the problem with Tracer Missile, in a nutshell:

 

Tracer Missile

Cast Time: 1 second

 

Studied hard to make that case didn't you?

 

BTW I stopped reading here.

[jcyrus]

Tracer Missile has a Cooldown of 1.5 Seconds.

The Passive Stance that the Mercenerys get increases there armor penetration by 35%, +20% From Talents, making it 55%.

 

Don't call nerfs from classes if you don't know how they work.

Where in my post did I call for nerfs? And I have a 50 Mercenary, I'm well aware of how the class works.

 

I also know that a reasonable cooldown would stop the spam, and force the spammers to use some of the other worthwhile skills Mercs get access to.

[jcyrus]

Studied hard to make that case didn't you?

 

BTW I stopped reading here.

I cut and paste the ability info from Darthhater's ability list. I'm terribly sorry for not logging into the game to verify every single detail that has no relevance to the overall point I was making.

[Machazareel]

Where in my post did I call for nerfs? And I have a 50 Mercenary, I'm well aware of how the class works.

 

I also know that a reasonable cooldown would stop the spam, and force the spammers to use some of the other worthwhile skills Mercs get access to.

 

Ignoring the other things that stack from the use tracer doesn't really seem to indicate a vast amount of class knowledge when coupled with not knowing the cast time of the ability. You shouldn't have to log into the game to check the cast time of the ability the entire tree is built around.

Edited January 23, 2012 by Machazareel

[Daecollo]

I cut and paste the ability info from Darthhater's ability list. I'm terribly sorry for not logging into the game to verify every single detail that has no relevance to the overall point I was making.

 

Calling for nerfs on a class you have NO idea about, NO idea how its talent tree is based around, makes you a D"..."bag.

 

It also shows you have no idea of how the skill works.

Edited January 23, 2012 by Daecollo