3 big problems with SWTOR

[Grimfyre]

Quite a lot of MMO players believe in the "Main Character' approach and are not going to want to level alt after alt to keep engaged. If that is the design intent here, BW is not going to be happy when a ton of people quit.

 

If you have friends and a guild you have plenty to do....Flashpoints, hard modes, pvp, and operations...there is 1-2 operations out at the moment...which is more then WoW had when it launched...and that survived. People just need to take it easy.. If you are a person who just rushes to the end this isn't the mmo for you. Or maybe just take a small break...considering the first content patch is already being released this tuesday...with a new flashpoint and added bosses in an operations among other things..

 

I really dont see the issue...

[MrTijger]

End game is important, but don't dismiss the countless people who don't care that much about the end game.

 

A lot of the casual MMO players have been through the end games before. It's always the same type of stuff. I raided on Everquest 1 for like 2 years.

 

It might be hard to understand, but a lot of us just play to have fun. Not be the best geared, or most knowledgeable. When I play I'm just as likely to run around looking at my lightsaber than do any questing.

 

And this is exactly right and most likely what Bioware aimed the game at.

[Jswizzle]

'Looking at your lightsaber'

 

Um

 

Really?

 

Yep last night all I did was just watch Nadia Grell destroy stuff. I'll just stand there and right click on her for 15 minutes.

[mcfabulous]

'Looking at your lightsaber'

 

Um

 

Really?

 

i will admit to the guilty inner fanboy pleasure of running around snapping screenshots in awesome poses and facebooking them

 

If you have friends and a guild you have plenty to do....Flashpoints, hard modes, pvp, and operations...there is 1-2 operations out at the moment...which is more then WoW had when it launched...and that survived. People just need to take it easy.. If you are a person who just rushes to the end this isn't the mmo for you. Or maybe just take a small break...considering the first content patch is already being released this tuesday...with a new flashpoint and added bosses in an operations among other things..

 

I really dont see the issue...

 

because you aren't there, they know content exists, but over half of it is broken or unaccessable..

Edited January 16, 2012 by mcfabulous

[Grimfyre]

This game has the worst replay value in any MMO I've ever played. And that is mainly due to the voice acting / dialog, and very VERY linear questing.

 

Voice Acting and Dialogue which you can skip, especially if u did the quest before...

 

You can do Flashpoints, Pvp, Space Combat missions all to get xp, and skip half of the missions on the planets except your class mission, Or you could just do the quests...

 

 

This is the first mmo where i can redue quests and not get bored like i did in that OTHER mmo.

[silkforcalde]

While I don't judge books based on cover... I do judge movies on cover/name, haha... So I can relate.

 

I too have quite a bit of disappointment with this game, and I will take my subscription away soon, but I will be keeping an eye on it to see what gets added and improved on. There's another MMO heading our way that I really wanna try out because of its first - tried live combat battle system.

 

If you're talking Guild Wars 2, I'm not even remotely interested in that game because it has no tanks or healers, and that's what I play in mmos, I play tanks and healers exclusively. I play support roles. Without that, I have absolutely not the slightest interest in the game.

[princey]

This game has the worst replay value in any MMO I've ever played.

 

How is this ANY DIFFERENT than any other MMO out there? You do the same quests from 1-cap, just like EVERY OTHER MMO. Except in TOR, you get a unique storyline. You can spacebar through the conversations and it has the same feel as leveling an alt in any other MMO. I think that's it, right there. It feels like leveling an alt in every other MMO, ie. you're bored of leveling in MMOs. Don't blame that on the game.

[Hyperionthethird]

Alright, since my last thread on this topic got closed (probably due to my comparison with WoW.. which just caused mindless flaming from both sides).. I'll make this one more constructive.

 

The following are 3 big problems that need to be addressed ASAP if SWTOR wants to thrive:

 

1) Responsiveness:

 

SWTORs character responsiveness is pretty bad. With things like ability delay and animations having to finish before damage takes effect, it makes SWTOR combat / responsiveness VERY clunky.

 

The problem is not only with combat, but generally everything from mounting up and using quick travel. There seems to be a 0.5 second or so delay on abilities taking effect. This is a SERIOUS issue and needs to be looked into immediately.

2) The MMO factor:

 

Ask people if they feel like SWTOR is an MMO, and the most common answer you will get is "no". This is due to a few things:

 

-Sharding: Why does this even exist? All it does is prevents players from seeing eachother / communicating with eachother. Both being VERY big factors to an overall MMO feel.

 

-Too much phasing: There is FAR too much phasing in this game. Almost every quest leads to a phased area. I understand this is done to speed up questing, but it too has far too many cons.

 

Phasing itself is NOT the problem, in fact it has many benefits. The problem arises when you use it TOO MUCH.

 

Low server caps: This is quite simple, and doesn't need much explaining. The server caps just far too low. There needs to be a much bigger server cap (something like WoWs) which will mean more players. More players = MMO!

 

Overly large planets: Planets are far too big. This spreads players out way too much and makes the place look like it's empty (add to that the other factors, and it probably IS empty).

 

3) Endgame:

 

This is probably the biggest one. The main focus of an MMO should ALWAYS be end game. Right now, there is very little end game. The same flashpoints, the same warzones.. there's just nothing to do.

 

I know it's pretty early to derail SWTORs endgame, but there is absolutely nothing to do. BW should of been prepared, they should of known that MANY people would hit 50 within the free month. This could be the main reason that SWTOR will fail. It doesn't matter if they add end game later, what matters is how much they have when the game launches (when most people will try it out).. and that unfortunately is none.

 

cant agree on phasing, the only thing less phasing would change is things would feel very mmo-y when your quests are totally derailed by other players. and more importantly they let bioware do a lot of story elements they wouldn't be able to do otherwise.

 

server cap, and endgame possibly, are the real issues. many of the late zones in the game have something like 15 players on the planet at one time. Those planets don't feel empty because of phasing or sharding, they just ARE empty.

[Papazooki]

How is this ANY DIFFERENT than any other MMO out there? You do the same quests from 1-cap, just like EVERY OTHER MMO. Except in TOR, you get a unique storyline. You can spacebar through the conversations and it has the same feel as leveling an alt in any other MMO. I think that's it, right there. It feels like leveling an alt in every other MMO, ie. you're bored of leveling in MMOs. Don't blame that on the game.

 

Actually, I'm leveling a toon on that other MMO as we speak (no joke, I'm alt tabbed right now ).

 

There is a big difference between linear, and non linear questing. SWTOR is linear.

[Papazooki]

End game is important, but don't dismiss the countless people who don't care that much about the end game.

 

A lot of the casual MMO players have been through the end games before. It's always the same type of stuff. I raided on Everquest 1 for like 2 years.

 

It might be hard to understand, but a lot of us just play to have fun. Not be the best geared, or most knowledgeable. When I play I'm just as likely to run around looking at my lightsaber than do any questing.

 

The people who don't care about end game are a very tiny minority of people.

 

When I say end game, I mean anything you do at max level. The majority of players (just like in every other MMO) will be max level.

[PjPablo]

If you're talking Guild Wars 2, I'm not even remotely interested in that game because it has no tanks or healers, and that's what I play in mmos, I play tanks and healers exclusively. I play support roles. Without that, I have absolutely not the slightest interest in the game.

 

Then I hope you are playing a healer now because tanks are being marginalized in this game. When you need to omit a tank (and can) in Ops so you can beat enrage timers that doesn't exactly portend a strong future for the tanking profession. Bosses need to start 1-shotting DPS.

[brokentelevision]

The issue is it won't get fixed at all, it's not a matter of it's only a month old.

 

Back in beta when it was 6 months pre launch, many testers were giving very important feedback about game breaking issues. Several if not most of those made it all the way to launch.

 

 

Bioware has a long track record with this game of being very secretive and not listening to anyone but the share holders. They won't give you any real info about things to come, or tell you what they're working on. Or even acknowledge things. Hell players knew about ability delay almost a year ago and we're just now getting an acknowledgment about it's existence from Bioware.

 

Bioware is running and designing this game like one of their other single player games, and it'll keep failing until they pull their head outta their rear and start running this like an MMO.

[MrTijger]

The people who don't care about end game are a very tiny minority of people.

 

When I say end game, I mean anything you do at max level. The majority of players (just like in every other MMO) will be max level.

 

Sorry, but what do you base that wisdom on? Also, being max level doesnt mean people are only interested in 'raiding', other games have shown that end level content gets accessed by a very small minority.

[brokentelevision]

Sorry, but what do you base that wisdom on? Also, being max level doesnt mean people are only interested in 'raiding', other games have shown that end level content gets accessed by a very small minority.

 

Actually you are very correct sir, the people that don't care about endgame at all is the overwhelming majority in this game.

 

Why, because most everyone who cared even remotely about end game stopped playing when they figured out it wasn't worth to keep paying for a game without endgame.

[Papazooki]

Sorry, but what do you base that wisdom on? Also, being max level doesnt mean people are only interested in 'raiding', other games have shown that end level content gets accessed by a very small minority.

 

end game =/= only raiding.

[princey]

Actually, I'm leveling a toon on that other MMO as we speak (no joke, I'm alt tabbed right now ).

 

There is a big difference between linear, and non linear questing. SWTOR is linear.

 

The only linear missions in TOR are the class stories and the planet arcs. You don't even have to do anything but the class story. You can spend all of your time in FPs if that's what you want to do. You could spend all your time PvPing if you wanted to. You could spend all your time doing space missions.

 

And don't try to say that other game isn't linear. Go to a high level zone at a low level, let me know how that works out. Just because you get a choice of ~3 zones to quest in (with very similar quest styles), doesn't mean the game isn't linear. Sure, in TOR there is only one planet for a given level range, but those planets (especially later in the game) are much bigger than one zone in "that other MMO".

 

If you prefer "that other MMO", knock yourself out. But don't portray it in a way that it's not, just to try to make a point. You're wrong, it's linear too, just a rigidly.

[Papazooki]

The issue is it won't get fixed at all, it's not a matter of it's only a month old.

 

Back in beta when it was 6 months pre launch, many testers were giving very important feedback about game breaking issues. Several if not most of those made it all the way to launch.

 

 

Bioware has a long track record with this game of being very secretive and not listening to anyone but the share holders. They won't give you any real info about things to come, or tell you what they're working on. Or even acknowledge things. Hell players knew about ability delay almost a year ago and we're just now getting an acknowledgment about it's existence from Bioware.

 

Bioware is running and designing this game like one of their other single player games, and it'll keep failing until they pull their head outta their rear and start running this like an MMO.

 

Totally agree with you.

[Papazooki]

The only linear missions in TOR are the class stories and the planet arcs. You don't even have to do anything but the class story. You can spend all of your time in FPs if that's what you want to do. You could spend all your time PvPing if you wanted to. You could spend all your time doing space missions.

 

And don't try to say that other game isn't linear. Go to a high level zone at a low level, let me know how that works out. Just because you get a choice of ~3 zones to quest in (with very similar quest styles), doesn't mean the game isn't linear. Sure, in TOR there is only one planet for a given level range, but those planets (especially later in the game) are much bigger than one zone in "that other MMO".

 

If you prefer "that other MMO", knock yourself out. But don't portray it in a way that it's not, just to try to make a point. You're wrong, it's linear too, just a rigidly.

 

It's either linear or not, face the facts:

 

in that other MMO, you have choices where you want to quest (for the most part), in SWTOR.. you do not.

[princey]

It's either linear or not, face the facts:

 

in that other MMO, you have choices where you want to quest (for the most part), in SWTOR.. you do not.

 

And they both are linear. That's what happens with a theme park MMO. Face facts.

[Dosblade]

left out one.. deceiving.. play the test server the graphics that are MED now they changed to HIGH. So its LOW or HIGH.. or really low or MED. World of Warcraft is not this bad.. its the small things..

[brokentelevision]

It's either linear or not, face the facts:

 

in that other MMO, you have choices where you want to quest (for the most part), in SWTOR.. you do not.

 

Yup this game is linear as hell, I thought Rift was bad in it's linearness, but at least they had options after 30. Multiple high level zones and such.

 

 

Rift is really really bad linear. Like do a bounty hunter and try to play an IA after that and it feels almost exactly the same. There isn't any options on where to go, what to do. It doesn't feel very open world.

 

 

Oh well, I feel like playing something in "that other mmo that isn't linear at all and is relatively bug free"

[Dee-Jay]

Ability delay and performance related issues are a given. Those are problems and should be dealt with ASAP.

 

I disagree on the lack of endgame content. There are daily quests, raids, and hardmode flashpoints. Honestly, for a classic MMO, that's quite a lot.

 

I agree that some planets are too big (like Hoth), yet others are too small (Tython). Imo there are a couple on general problems with the way the built the zones.

 

1. There are too many planets, clustering players all over the place. Less planets with more content and detail would have been better for everyone.

 

2. Planets are built as levels, not as zones or worlds. You can't explore them freely. Instead you're channeled into pre-defined paths most of the time. When not, there's simply large amounts of nothing.

 

Every zone in WoW has 10-times more love, detail and attention put into it than any planet in SWTOR.

[BobTheTeepo]

end game =/= only raiding.

 

End game also included crafting, getting the best equipment, and PvP.

[MrTijger]

end game =/= only raiding.

 

No.

 

Btw, why do you keep posting here, do you really need to be validated in your choices this badly?

[Jswizzle]

Some of the design choices I did wonder about. Correllia feels pretty linear, but I would in no way say there wasn't level of detail. The rail system there is really cool. The level designer hit a home run with that, but left the rest of the level feel boxed in.