Everybody was Biochem fighting

[Sgt_BAP]

To be honest, I don't see the big deal. I have crafted reusable 48 medkits and adrenals for all of my pvp buddies, and keep them well stocked with the death persisting stims. Compared to Rakata stuff, there's not a whole bunch of difference- their slightly inferior versions still give them the same get of out jail free card or massive burst that biochems can get.

 

In short, just spend a few creds on getting your own lvl 48 reusables, and then you'll be just as "overpowered" as everyone else.

[Exothermix]

Your logic is so flawed. First of all, if someone is using crafted weapons in pvp then they really shouldn't be playing unless they are below 50 as the pvp armor and weapons are far superior. Whatever point you were trying to make there failed hard. Second, your pve comment is completely irrelevant. It literally made no sense and didn't contribute to the main idea of this post at all.

 

Biochem gives an unfair advantage to anyone who chooses to use it and punishes those who want to be different. It's not even about the other crew skills in the slightest.

 

(1) I am aware that PvP armor is better than crafted, I was simply applying OPs logic to another crew skill...(2) I was taking OPs logic to next extreme.

 

(3) What are best stats on best biochem only med/stim versus purchasable med/stim?

[Sabbathius]

I agree. I would like it if all medpacks/stims were deactivated upon entering warzones and blackened out.

 

I completely agree. Also all the mods and augments slotted into your gear should become disabled, as should your earpiece and implants and all the other stuff. If your armor and/or weapon is crafted, or uses crafted mods, it should be disabled too. Hey, fair is fair.

[Qlimitus]

To be honest, I don't see the big deal. I have crafted reusable 48 medkits and adrenals for all of my pvp buddies, and keep them well stocked with the death persisting stims. Compared to Rakata stuff, there's not a whole bunch of difference- their slightly inferior versions still give them the same get of out jail free card or massive burst that biochems can get.

 

In short, just spend a few creds on getting your own lvl 48 reusables, and then you'll be just as "overpowered" as everyone else.

 

How about get a skill in PVP learn your char,play fairly and not like some juiced up adrenalin junkie.At the end of the match you'll actually see you will gain more ego than knowing you pussied out and went for bio?

Only people who have no idea how to PVP will resort to using whatever means to win.You are no different.Im so glad im leaving at the end of the month.

 

Biochem users every time guaranteed have no idea how to play their char,they just load up on OP crap and pew pew lol the majority of them stay still,don't move like a mouse ran under their seat.You're philosophy is " need help killing this lvl 20 player real fast,i know ! I'll use OP over used and over rated adren and health packs because im a nub " ta da.. ye,i can't be bothered with you lamo's.

Edited January 13, 2012 by Qlimitus

[technogecko]

I completely agree. Also all the mods and augments slotted into your gear should become disabled, as should your earpiece and implants and all the other stuff. If your armor and/or weapon is crafted, or uses crafted mods, it should be disabled too. Hey, fair is fair.

 

This, exactly. Why nerf one crafting in pvp when we should be asking for buffs for others. IMO more content, more things to farm and obtain, more tactics, more interesting.

[Exothermix]

Stacking stims does not to equate to skill, it's called crutching.

 

I also don't like biochem either and refuse to use it simply because it's cheap, I feel bad enough as it is when I can use a PvP healthpack quickly followed by a Med vendor bought healthpack.

 

Or use them both in 1 GCD using panic button macro....

[technogecko]

How about get a skill in PVP learn your char,play fairly and not like some juiced up adrenalin junkie.At the end of the match you'll actually see you will gain more ego than knowing you pussied out and went for bio?

Only people who have no idea how to PVP will resort to using whatever means to win.You are no different.Im so glad im leaving at the end of the month.

 

By this logic, I should click off all my buffs and use social armor... that way I will prove I'm awesome without taking advantage of the perks available to me? I'm pretty sure we will be glad you are leaving as well

[Erasimus]

Obviously a bio user that has no actual skill other than spamming yourself with stims/adren/health

 

Well listen to this .. kiddo.

I have bio 400 also but i would never use it in PVP because i don't see the need to have to bio myself out of any situation. If you need adren/stim/health i suggest you quit playing now because you have no actual skill.

 

I can't stop laughing AT you.

 

You have to be kidding, right? That is akin to saying "I'll compete on the Pro Body Building circuit but won't use steroids." No you won't, at least not with any expectation of winning anything. There is a "Natural Body Building" drug free circuit but currently there is no stim/medpac free PvP circuit. Nor should there be unless you are just going to remove Stim/Medpac items from the game.

 

If there is a huge disparity between the total heals/stim provided by Bio only items and once you can buy, then perhaps that should be addressed. But if you can buy equivalent, but not necessarily reusable, items then buy them. (There should always be some crafting profession "advantage" specific to each crafting skill. Reusability is a good one.)

 

If the other crafting skills don't provide provide sellable items, and in my experience so far that isn't the case, then that should be addressed. After all buying/selling items on auction house is part of the game.

 

I have yet to do PvP in an MMO that did not require a certain amount of farming/prep to create or buy consumables. It is relatively minimal in WoW Arena and perhaps they'll have rated BGs, Arenas with different rules in SWTOR at some point. Until then it is just foolish to not take advantage of what the game offers.

[StealthLightning]

The problem is that Biochem has access to reusable stims and medpacks that are CONSIDERABLY better than anything non-biochem characters can get.

 

Rakata medpacks heals for the exact same amount as the blue medpacks you can buy from vendors.

[Dreadspectre]

The Stims are to make up for the lack of armor, mods, grenades, etc that the other professions make.

 

Using the stim isn't really a big deal. Using the med pack isn't really a big deal.

 

The Adrenals and how buffs stack in general is pretty retarded right now.

 

I'm sorry I'm Synthweave...what awesome gear and mods do I have again..? Oh, wait..I have none.

 

Players cannot craft any PvP gear or mods. I get 2 purple level 50 items I can make but I must PvE to make them and, once again, they are not meant for PvP(no expertise on them.)

 

Biochem is light years ahead of every craft in this game. Stop defending it. Either nerf Biochem or give other crafts something that is actually worth using. I don't care which.

 

I mean for comparison let's look at WoW. I was a Tailor, I got a Tailor ONLY cloak enchant and I could make starter sets of PvP gear. I can do none of that here as a Synthweaver.

Edited January 13, 2012 by Dreadspectre

[salamanderx]

I dont know about you but I ditched cyber tech for biochem... I'm sure I'll want it later but its not like leveling crafts is hard in this game.

[pixelelement]

The problem is that Biochem has access to reusable stims and medpacks that are CONSIDERABLY better than anything non-biochem characters can get.

 

That is not true. I am 400 Biochem Yes we get re-usables, but these are not "considerably" better than the level 50 greens/blues. If you want meds to use in PvP trying buying some.

[pixelelement]

Rakata medpacks heals for the exact same amount as the blue medpacks you can buy from vendors.

 

That's not true, but they are close. When I get home I am going to post some numbers.

[Aghar]

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ THIS ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

 

1. Stop being bad

 

2. Spend less time whining more time PvPing getting good

 

3. ?????????

 

4. Profit.

 

so if it was just a question of being bad you should be totally fine without your rakata stims/medpacks/adrenals. So just destroy them if your so awesome....oh wait they are still in your bags aren't they.....

 

 

 

 

Using a stim/adrenal that other professions do not have access to is not skill, its stacking the deck unfairly.

 

 

I am not against using the best thing possible to give you a slight edge, but the heal from the medpack is extream, and adrenal stacked up with other consumables makes people hit like a truck, and the stim is the best you can get by far, you cant even get exotech due to patterns being bugged so don't use those as a counterpoint.

[Caeliux]

I completely agree. Also all the mods and augments slotted into your gear should become disabled, as should your earpiece and implants and all the other stuff. If your armor and/or weapon is crafted, or uses crafted mods, it should be disabled too. Hey, fair is fair.

 

Don't be stupid to the fact that BIO is giving a 18% increase from stims, and also the med packs that can be assumed OP.

 

If you think it's fair to have one craft skill to make all others suck then you sir/woman don't understand balance, and don't want this game to be balanced.

 

Here is the truth, and I DON'T CARE IF YOU DONT LIKE IT,

 

1. Bio-chem needs adjusted for pvp purposes. Raiding and pve content is one thing, and crafting should play a part. But when you make crafting skills like Armormech, or Artifice suck in end game, and make is not really even close % wise what stims are giving, then why have it?

 

2. You make only one crafting class matter, the nature of crafting and the economy becomes over priced AND no usefulness for higher end crafted stuff.

 

3. Consumables should not be the only ticket to win in pvp. I don't want to hear some pep talk that it takes skill to pop a stim, or pop a med pack to stay alive.

 

Bottom line is Bio-chem needs a hard look at, and needs to be addressed asap. If rank matches are coming soon we don't want one craft to make all to be all. The game needs crafting to be balanced, not overthrown by Bio-chem.

 

Players know this is a oh **** button to get a boost, to get a advantage, so of course alot of this self proclaimed hardcore pvpers or what not don't want it nerfed or taken away.

 

Truth is it needs a overhaul asap and fast or the nature of pvp in this game will be a one sided deal when it comes to end game pvp.

 

And that one side is bio-chem, or go broke, and that is not pvp.

 

Yep.

Edited January 13, 2012 by Caeliux

[Erasimus]

....

I mean for comparison let's look at WoW. I was a Tailor, I got a Tailor ONLY cloak enchant and I could make starter sets of PvP gear. I can do none of that here as a Synthweaver.

 

Comparisons to WoW don't really work. SWTOR is not WoW and I for one am happy about that. I've played WoW since release, and still do from time to time. It has its own issues with crafting. Crafting requires way too much boring farming in WoW, and until the recent changes to make it much much more casually oriented, any serious PvP'er or PvE'er had 0 gathering skills, but rather 2 crafting skils so they could get the specials "Cloak/leg enchants for tailors, ring enchants for enchanters" for example. So I build up a whole crew of "suport" alts to do my gathering and to make my consumables. Not to mention that the value of the specials changed from time to time so dropping and re-leveling crafting professions was common and can be quite painful in WoW. (Note: I'm still trying to get my head around the idea of Kung Fu Panda's in WoW, but that is a different issue.)

 

If you don't want to buy equivalent stims/medpacs then by all means level Bio, it isn't like leveling crafts in SWTOR is difficult.

[Garbald]

Medpacks are fine, though they should be on the same timer as the pvp heal packs.

 

The main problem is buff stacking, where biochem stims are part of the problem together with expertise buffs and other klickables.

Pvp atm goes in the rocket tag direction is your rocket loaded? (do you have all your klickables ready?) then you can pretty much 3 shot nearly anyone, if not and the other has his stims rdy... yeah he will 3 shot you.

 

This goes directly against the devs "we will have longer fights" (ie longer ttks) "then other games" saying in one of the pvp QAs, atm its quite the opposite.

 

My solution would be to leave the medpacks alone, buff the other professions to have one very useful item (on par or better then the best endgame equip/stuff) available and put extreme diminishing returns on buff stacking.

Edited January 13, 2012 by Garbald

[FuzzyMuffins]

DO i use biochem.. Yes. Do people use biochem agaisnt me? Yes. Do they still kill me? Nope and i dont even have to use mine.

[Mertissielle]

Exotech Medpac (epic consumable, iLevel 56)

Use: Restores 4875 to 5950 health and an additional 2165 health over 15 seconds. (Cooldown: 90s)

 

Rakata Medpac (epic infinite use consumable, iLevel 58)

Use: Restores 5050 to 6175 health and an additional 2245 health over 15 seconds. (Cooldown: 90s)

 

175-225 extra healing.

 

 

Exotech Attack Adrenal (consumable)

Use: Increases Power by 535 for 15 seconds. (Cooldown: 3 minutes)

 

Rakata Attack Adrenal (infinite use)

Use: Increases Power by 565 for 15 seconds. (Cooldown: 3 minutes)

 

30 Power

 

 

Exotech Might Stim (consumable)

Use: Increases Strength by 128 and Power by 52 for 120 minutes. Only one stimpack can be active at a time. This effect persists through defeat.

 

Rakata Might Stim (infinite use)

Use: Increases Strength by 136 and Power by 56 for 120 minutes. Only one stimpack can be active at a time. This effect persists through defeat.

 

8 Strength + 4 Power

 

 

 

 

All of them higher, sure. Significantly so? Perhaps only at the top end but it's not like the extra heals/stats can make up for being less skilled than someone who only has access to the Exotech versions.

 

I think a lot of people saying it's overpowered are more upset that they're not consumed on use and, therefore, don't require spending any credits rather than that they're overwhelmingly OP.

 

The Rakata ones are slightly better, no denying and perhaps the fact that they're not consumed means that they already have enough of a bonus - that's a completely fair assertion. But a terrible player with Rakata stuff isn't going to beat an average player with Exotech just through the marginal difference in stats.

[Aghar]

DO i use biochem.. Yes. Do people use biochem agaisnt me? Yes. Do they still kill me? Nope and i dont even have to use mine.

 

doubtful at best, if you didn't need them why would you even wast the time making them.

[StealthLightning]

Exotech Medpac (epic consumable, iLevel 56)

Use: Restores 4875 to 5950 health and an additional 2165 health over 15 seconds. (Cooldown: 90s)

 

Rakata Medpac (epic infinite use consumable, iLevel 58)

Use: Restores 5050 to 6175 health and an additional 2245 health over 15 seconds. (Cooldown: 90s)

 

175-225 extra healing.

 

 

Exotech Attack Adrenal (consumable)

Use: Increases Power by 535 for 15 seconds. (Cooldown: 3 minutes)

 

Rakata Attack Adrenal (infinite use)

Use: Increases Power by 565 for 15 seconds. (Cooldown: 3 minutes)

 

30 Power

 

 

Exotech Might Stim (consumable)

Use: Increases Strength by 128 and Power by 52 for 120 minutes. Only one stimpack can be active at a time. This effect persists through defeat.

 

Rakata Might Stim (infinite use)

Use: Increases Strength by 136 and Power by 56 for 120 minutes. Only one stimpack can be active at a time. This effect persists through defeat.

 

8 Strength + 4 Power

 

 

 

 

All of them higher, sure. Significantly so? Perhaps only at the top end but it's not like the extra heals/stats can make up for being less skilled than someone who only has access to the Exotech versions.

 

I think a lot of people saying it's overpowered are more upset that they're not consumed on use and, therefore, don't require spending any credits rather than that they're overwhelmingly OP.

 

The Rakata ones are slightly better, no denying and perhaps the fact that they're not consumed means that they already have enough of a bonus - that's a completely fair assertion. But a terrible player with Rakata stuff isn't going to beat an average player with Exotech just through the marginal difference in stats.

 

 

I think the real issue is that most players are lazy(biochems included). They don't want to have to buy and keep track of consumables. Biochems don't have to, so they use the awesome consumables while everyone else doesn't.

[Aghar]

Exotech Medpac (epic consumable, iLevel 56)

Use: Restores 4875 to 5950 health and an additional 2165 health over 15 seconds. (Cooldown: 90s)

 

Rakata Medpac (epic infinite use consumable, iLevel 58)

Use: Restores 5050 to 6175 health and an additional 2245 health over 15 seconds. (Cooldown: 90s)

 

175-225 extra healing.

 

 

Exotech Attack Adrenal (consumable)

Use: Increases Power by 535 for 15 seconds. (Cooldown: 3 minutes)

 

Rakata Attack Adrenal (infinite use)

Use: Increases Power by 565 for 15 seconds. (Cooldown: 3 minutes)

 

30 Power

 

 

Exotech Might Stim (consumable)

Use: Increases Strength by 128 and Power by 52 for 120 minutes. Only one stimpack can be active at a time. This effect persists through defeat.

 

Rakata Might Stim (infinite use)

Use: Increases Strength by 136 and Power by 56 for 120 minutes. Only one stimpack can be active at a time. This effect persists through defeat.

 

8 Strength + 4 Power

 

 

 

 

All of them higher, sure. Significantly so? Perhaps only at the top end but it's not like the extra heals/stats can make up for being less skilled than someone who only has access to the Exotech versions.

 

I think a lot of people saying it's overpowered are more upset that they're not consumed on use and, therefore, don't require spending any credits rather than that they're overwhelmingly OP.

 

The Rakata ones are slightly better, no denying and perhaps the fact that they're not consumed means that they already have enough of a bonus - that's a completely fair assertion. But a terrible player with Rakata stuff isn't going to beat an average player with Exotech just through the marginal difference in stats.

 

nice farming from darth hater/torhead, small problem, the recipies for the exotech's are bugged at the moment, and nobody can learn them. So they are not attainable by anybody. Kinda makes your whole post moot

[Dreadspectre]

Comparisons to WoW don't really work. SWTOR is not WoW and I for one am happy about that. I've played WoW since release, and still do from time to time. It has its own issues with crafting. Crafting requires way too much boring farming in WoW, and until the recent changes to make it much much more casually oriented, any serious PvP'er or PvE'er had 0 gathering skills, but rather 2 crafting skils so they could get the specials "Cloak/leg enchants for tailors, ring enchants for enchanters" for example. So I build up a whole crew of "suport" alts to do my gathering and to make my consumables. Not to mention that the value of the specials changed from time to time so dropping and re-leveling crafting professions was common and can be quite painful in WoW. (Note: I'm still trying to get my head around the idea of Kung Fu Panda's in WoW, but that is a different issue.)

 

If you don't want to buy equivalent stims/medpacs then by all means level Bio, it isn't like leveling crafts in SWTOR is difficult.

 

So you're saying that other crafting professions in this game should give nothing useable in PvP? Is it threatening to you? There is zero incentive to even keep a craft. I could make the 2 rakatta armor pieces and then drop Synth and not care. There is no "requires 400 synthweaving to use" gear, no perks to being a Synthweaver at all.

 

How is this bad, please tell me? Tell me how this was bad in WoW? Because I remember people being quite diverse in craft skills with only enchanting being the slightly dominate skill in PvP.

 

Enlighten me, or are you too blinded by your "haters gonna hate" WoW rage to see that they did a better job?

[Erasimus]

nice farming from darth hater/torhead, small problem, the recipies for the exotech's are bugged at the moment, and nobody can learn them. So they are not attainable by anybody. Kinda makes your whole post moot

 

Irrelevant comment. You don't nerf a profession based on the existence of a bug, you fix the bug.

[lexiekaboom]

Yeah my 6000 elemental bombs that prevent people from capping things for 6 seconds are useless.

 

Stop equating "pvp" with "killing that one dude" and it changes things. He used a med pack and ran away? Big deal, when someone kills him in 2 minutes you still get credit for the kill, and he's not on the objective any more so you did good.