SWG vs SWTOR

[RagnarokJC]

I don't care what the issues there were at launch. I'm comparing SWG in its prime to ToR now.

So basically, you're willing to completely overlook the numerous flaws in SWG prior to the CU when comparing it to a game that just launched. Well, that pretty much ends the minutes of me taking you seriously now. The crap I'm willing to read while stuck at work....

[DeeckTator]

You either never played SWG before the CU, were asleep, or are just plain lying. Pre-CU SWG was in fact losing subscriptions; it's part of the the reason they timed the release of the 1st expansion (JTL) to be around the time of WoW's launch. It's also the reason they made the now-historic decision to develop and implement the CU and NGE patches.

 

I liked SWG before the CU messed things up, but I never had any illusions that it would be anything more than an niche MMO. It was just too complex to appeal to casual players.

 

Yes, they were losing subs slowly. Then they came up with CU and we had the first exodus. Then when things where starting to pick up a bit again SOE did the boldest and dumbest move in the history of videogames, dramatic puase.........

 

The No Game Engine, remember when NGE went live, only 2 things mattered in combat. Combat level and armor rating. You did exactly as much dmg with a 50dps rusty dagger as with a 1200DPS lightsaber. Whoopdidooo, a medic could kill 8 jedi in seconds solo, due to Jedi having no armour rating and medics AOE DOTS.

 

Good stuff SoE!

Edited January 12, 2012 by DeeckTator

[Izorii]

I liked SWG and would have been happy to get a SWG 2.0 but we didn't get it so I am making the best of SWTOR. Maybe we will see more sandbox content at level 50.

[RagnarokJC]

Yes, they were losing subs slowly. Then they came up with CU and we had the first exodus. Then when things where starting to pick up a bit again SOE did the boldest and dumbest move in the history of videogames, dramatic puase.........

 

The No Game Engine, remember when NGE went live, only 2 things mattered in combat. Combat level and armor rating. You did exactly as much dmg with a 50dps rusty dagger as with a 12000DPS lightsaber. Whoopdidooo, a medic could kill 8 jedi in seconds solo, due to Jedi having no armour rating and medics AOE DOTS.

 

Good stuff SoE!

Seriously, SoE set the bar when it came to horribly stupid development decisions when they thought of the whole NGE idea. That one will live forever in infamy.

[Kazmtyh]

I can't be the only one feeling this game could have been done alot better, i feel Bioware have done many things right but its not the big Star-Wars MMO we have been waiting for. Its not 10% of what SWG had. Proper space travel, player cities, proper crafting (not auto grinding NPC's), fully open worlds, hundreds of different specs to choose for your class, tons of gear that all look unique. Its lacking alot of features that was available in a Star-Wars MMO 8 years ago.

 

You aren't the only one. But you are in the minority.

 

It is more than 10% of what SWG had. Easily. And I liked SWG.

 

• SWG didn't have Space travel or combat at launch. Even when it was added it wasn't that great.
  
• Player cities got cluttered, blocked quest access and turned into ghost-towns.
  
• This isn't a SandBox, 'fully open worlds' are not needed. Nor did most people explore them in SWG.
  

 

People seem to look back on SWG through rose-coloured glasses. It was not nearly as great as people try and make it out to be. If TOR and SWG both launched today, I'd take TOR in a heartbeat.

 

SWG was fun, but it was never a 'great' game.

[Viera]

Seriously, SoE set the bar when it came to horribly stupid development decisions when they thought of the whole NGE idea. That one will live forever in infamy.

 

SOE did it TWICE, mind you. They pulled the same stunt on Matrix Online.

[Remllik]

Pre-CU SWG failed. The game was launched with terrible bugs, absolutely lacked direction, the balance was terrible. Star Wars Galaxies launched without mounts, without any sort of space combat for over a year. Basically, it was just awful on every level imaginable.

 

What you are expericing is called "nostalgia", you remember something that you thought was fun and your mind is making it seem way better than it actually was. Lol.

 

SWG Pre-CU doesn't mean "Launch". And that's not what nostalgia means either. Your entire post failed.

[Remllik]

So, you are comparing a failed game in its prime to an MMORPG that has basically just launched. That's real fair~!

 

Of course it's fair. SWG came out in '03. Nuff said.

[Duhakalock]

Wow, I didn't even remember corpse runs... I mostly just remember having the "wound" penalty that required you to sit in a cantina AND a hospital for 30 or so minutes to "recover".)

 

Im pretty sure you had to go back for your inventory. Im not too sure, blurry memory.

[RagnarokJC]

SOE did it TWICE, mind you. They pulled the same stunt on Matrix Online.

Nah, nothing will ever match the NGE for sheer stupidity.

[DeeckTator]

So basically, you're willing to completely overlook the numerous flaws in SWG prior to the CU when comparing it to a game that just launched. Well, that pretty much ends the minutes of me taking you seriously now. The crap I'm willing to read while stuck at work....

 

Can't talk for him, but I acctually enjoy the half done EMU better than I like SW:Tor.

 

SW:tor is so bloody static. Nothing moves, Is my target a flagpole?

 

 

Sure it had it's flaws, sure it was unbalanced. But boy was it fun. And all the things you could do. Raph Koster seriously needs to get a new creative director position for a MMO, he rage quit SoE when NGE was pushed through.

 

Best MMO ever: unless you're a GFX who....

Edited January 12, 2012 by DeeckTator

[kirorx]

There has always been so much misplaced hate toward SWG. As you can see here you can't even mention that game with out people talking about how "bad" it was.

 

Of course, those are players that either never played it because someone told them not to or they got so upset after the NGE that they missed all the awesome content that came out in the last years of that game.

 

It is a shame that the SWG was never able to recover mostly due to the haters. (I can undestand their frusteration, it was not misplaced) The game may have not been the best looking or the most modern but the gameplay features where right there. Though it changed after NGE, the options for customization still exceeded most games available today.

 

SWTOR is an awesome game IMO, but I miss SWG too. I really enjoy the Sith Empire but I would like to be regular old stormtrooper living in Moenia on Naboo again.

 

Nothing lasts forever though and we are fortunate we have a starwars mmo at this point, I was really excited to see Korriban and Coruscant and they are cool.

 

If SWG were still around i would be doing most of my pvp their still, but i would still be playing SWTOR like crazy. Actually that would have been awesome, all starwars all the time then

Edited January 12, 2012 by kirorx

[Remllik]

So basically, you're willing to completely overlook the numerous flaws in SWG prior to the CU when comparing it to a game that just launched. Well, that pretty much ends the minutes of me taking you seriously now. The crap I'm willing to read while stuck at work....

 

Of course I'm going to overlook those flaws. SWG came out in 2003. It's now 2012. If you can't figure out why that matters, you're very stupid.

[Viera]

SWG Pre-CU doesn't mean "Launch". And that's not what nostalgia means either. Your entire post failed.

 

You are unfairly comparing a game that just launched to your random favorite memories of an old game, that wasn't even that good. Your entire logic fails.

 

P.S The term nostalgia describes a yearning for the past, often in idealized form

 

i·de·al·ize

   [ahy-dee-uh-lahyz] Show IPA verb, -ized, -iz·ing.

 

verb (used with object)

1.

to make ideal; represent in an ideal form or character; exalt to an ideal perfection or excellence.

 

also

 

nos·tal·gia definition

Pronunciation: /nä-ˈstal-jə, nə-, nȯ-; nə-ˈstäl-/

Function: n

1 : the state of being homesick

2 : a wistful or excessively sentimental sometimes abnormal yearning for return to or of some past period or irrecoverable condition

[nitan]

I got nothing more to say than..

 

Oh dang, i died.. oh well Cantina and chat abit for 15-20 minutes...

 

Oh dang again.. I missed the shuttle.. oh well what should i do the next 30 minutes

 

But but but.. I never bothered with it, i was more like oh well thats how it is.. Guess ill just settle with this

[itekazzawrrlic]

You mean the awful mission terminals that spawned those god awful quests?

 

Or do you mean that copy and paste terrains with zero life?

 

For a second, i thought you were talking about this game.

[ThiborF]

To the people lacking common sense here: The OP is speaking of when the game was in its prime. After certain updates (I believe the first meltdown was the "Combat Upgrade"), the game began an extraordinary decline, which is why the game is now shut down.

 

To the OP: You are not alone. In fact, I cancelled my account about an hour ago for reasons including what you've listed. One thing I'd add to your list is space combat, crafting, and the overall sandbox element (though you sort of hinted a the lack of sandbox in TOR). Sad that after 8-9 years of technological progression, the world couldn't recapture what SWG was.

 

And to the people with rose colored glasses and short memories, pre-major updates SWG was far from "all that" too.

 

Go to mission terminal, get another mission to kill ********es (insert other repeatable mission from short list here), rinse repeat. You got a VERY small update from SOE in which the story capacity of it took you 1-2 days at most and then back to the mission terminals.

 

The open-ended class system had its merits.

The limiting you to 1 character per account per server sucked massively.

 

I will give the developers credit to the extent that they created a system in which player housing/cities had a purpose (instead of simply tacked in to say "we've got'em".) I'll also give them kudos to one of the more robust (though carpal tunnel inducing) crafting systems. You could avoid the carpal tunnel repetitveness IF you spent a good amount of time fine tuning intricate macros.

 

Your big open worlds? Filled with 90% nothing. Well that's not exactly true ... most were filled with harvesting areas for crafting mats with very little of those areas of a grade worthwhile.

 

The combat? If you enjoy queuing up several moves in advance and watching them play out I guess you could find it enjoyable. But if folks here are complaining about ability delay they would be scratching their heads going "***?!" in SWG.

 

Class/story pro: You could create an avatar that felt like it was some random X in the SW universe where X was merchant, entertainer, anonymous non-heroic bounty hunter, etc.

Class/story con: There was little-to-no story to provide much of any direction or purpose so you were left to make your own castles in the sand. Don't get me wrong ... i can have a good time going to the beach and spending an afternoon building (or attempting to) an intricate sand castle. I'm simply not going to find enjoyment in it ever single day and I'm going to find something else to do to break up the monotony.

 

And then you also have a developer who decides not to simply nerf a class (which happens in pretty much all MMOs) BUT actually remove it with a major update (RIP creature handler)

 

And top it off, IF the game was indeed "all that", where were the subscriptions for what some allege as being the single MMO of all time? Translation: It was but, only to a small niche crowd.

 

And to put it in perspective, the above is the thoughts of a MMO vet who has tried several since Dec'02 and subscribed to no fewer than 6 and beta tested 4-5 more on top of that. The simple truth is, the majority of decent AAA MMO titles have at least one or two "take aways" of things they did good-to-great. The better MMOs have plenty of features that people remember fondly and lament when new releases don't incorporate some version of them. And the reality for ALL of them is there are things about them that people detest.

[Pattypuppet]

I hear ya OP.

 

In SWG I rp'd as did many of my friends. It just came naturally and there were a lot of tools that allowed and encouraged that kind of gameplay. I had many wonderful adventures and met some friends there, some of whom have reunited in SWTOR which is exciting.

 

In SWG my friends and I founded a guild and built a city. We scouted for days until we found a spot we liked, and over time the city grew organically. We created a government and military, built bases, decorated and planned city growth. We waged war on neighboring player run cities and bases. It was an epic time to be a gamer.

 

Sadly there is a lot of hate for SWG, by people who feel burned by SOE and by people who never played or just like to be fanbois of other games. But Precu SWG was epic times, and I will always cherish those gaming memories.

 

SWTOR is a different kind of game all together. I am enjoying my time thus far, though I would like more rp tools. But sadly, I feel that is not the direction of the devs. An appearance tab, more customization options, a house you can decorate....all these things I would love to see, but I am not holding my breath.

[Remllik]

You are unfairly comparing a game that just launched to your random favorite memories of an old game, that wasn't even that good. Your entire logic fails.

 

"What you are expericing is called "nostalgia", you remember something that you thought was fun and your mind is making it seem way better than it actually was. Lol. "

 

 

P.S The term nostalgia describes a yearning for the past, often in idealized form

 

 

 

 

 

Not sure where your definitions clarify that statement in bold. Now you're just embarassing yourself.

 

And as I said to the others, the comparison is fair considering SWG came out in 2003.

[RagnarokJC]

Can't talk for him, but I acctually enjoy the half done EMU better than I like SW:Tor.

 

SW:tor is so bloody static. Nothing moves, Is my target a flagpole?

 

 

Sure it had it's flaws, sure it was unbalanced. But boy was it fun. And all the things you could do. Raph Koster seriously needs to get a new creative director position for a MMO, he rage quit SoE when NGE was pushed through.

 

Best MMO ever: unless you're a GFX who....

"All the things you could do?" If you mean the different professions, well, yes, there were a lot of them, but they all boiled down to: grind out XP to get levels in the professions until you master them. Kill mobs, get repetitive quests from the terminals, buff up, solo mobs, rinse and repeat. You obviously also never played a Jedi (force-sensitive) as I did- if it weren't for the fact that it was a Jedi, which before the CU was immensely powerful, I wouldn't have bothered, because leveling was a massive grind and boring as hell. There's a reason that players used bot programs in that game.

 

Again, I'm not saying that SWG was the worst MMO ever made, far from it. But some people here seem to think that it was the best MMO ever made, and nothing could be further from the truth.

[itekazzawrrlic]

Can't talk for him, but I acctually enjoy the half done EMU better than I like SW:Tor.

 

SW:tor is so bloody static. Nothing moves, Is my target a flagpole?

 

 

Sure it had it's flaws, sure it was unbalanced. But boy was it fun. And all the things you could do. Raph Koster seriously needs to get a new creative director position for a MMO, he rage quit SoE when NGE was pushed through.

 

Best MMO ever: unless you're a GFX who....

 

QFT You speak the truth.

[RagnarokJC]

Of course I'm going to overlook those flaws. SWG came out in 2003. It's now 2012. If you can't figure out why that matters, you're very stupid.

What does the year of release have to do with anything? Standards are different today? If you're talking about the effect of WoW, then I agree, but only insofar as to say that it created an entire generation of spoiled, self-entitled, ADD-sufferers who cry about something if it isn't perfect this very second. Look into Ritalin, it may help.

[Avrose]

Both games run on completely different systems.

 

Apples and oranges mate. Apples and oranges.

[stoatle]

SWG had high level missions that would autocomplete when you got close enough on release. It was kind of like slicing at release, but better.

 

Also, I didn't stop playing SWG after 1 month.

[Viera]

Not sure where your definitions clarify that statement in bold. Now you're just embarassing yourself.

 

And as I said to the others, the comparison is fair considering SWG came out in 2003.

 

 

You are having nostalgia, if you are too dense to understand what I said that is hardly my fault.

 

Nostalgia, you are remembering something in idealized form. You are remembering only the good, none of the bad, and your mind is exaggerating the good.

 

Which is exactly what I said, it is called nostalgia, you are remembering a time that you had fun and your mind is remembering something better than it really was. Human memory is flawed.

Edited January 13, 2012 by Viera