Excedrin Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 So it's a needless hassle to play SW:ToR as it is and you need to be helped? Ok. Now I'm convinced you're trolling. Have fun bro. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Setanian Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 Are you still on with this anti-intellectualism? You have an ignore list if people are mean to you. Stop demanding BW take revenge by banning the combat log. Stop demanding that BW help you play the game because you can't play it as is Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vydor_HC Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 There's nothing destructive about addons, parsers, minmaxing or powergaming. If you don't want to use them, you don't have to. You can go 2 man content with your spouse and anyone else who wants to come along, and I promise we won't come pee on your spaceship. -nods- I only wish it was that simple, but it's not. Anyways Im out of here, work is over, time to play the game. Good luck in the campaign to get this feature added. I will be adding my dissent along the way. /salute Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jett-Rinn Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 (edited) Are you still on with this anti-intellectualism? You have an ignore list if people are mean to you. Stop demanding BW take revenge by banning the combat log. Actually no one is demanding anything Bioware has already made there decision and the pro meter crowd are teeth gnashing and shaking their e-fist at the sky over it. As far as I'm concerned the debate is over and Bioware made a decent compromise. Edited January 11, 2012 by Jett-Rinn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sendrel Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 Nah, I just prefer not to see destructive additions added to the game. Especially ones that are superfluous. If you can prove to me that end game content will be impossible to do without it, I'd agree with you, they are needed. Why do people keep playing semantics with needed vs. wanted? Its an idiotic argument to use given that, in the right context, most developers see the terms synonymously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amiracle Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 in NO WAY do combat parsers even come CLOSE to showing raiders the 'way through' an encounter. If that is what you think they do, then I wonder why you are even expressing your opinion here, as by your statement I can only assume you have never before raided. Nope, that is what the Youtube video is for. The combat parser is to make sure you are following the rotation that you read on the net. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Setanian Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 Now I'm convinced you're trolling. Have fun bro. Ah, so again like the wow folks, you resort to name calling when I state you cannot play with what you were given and you need Bioware to help you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Excedrin Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 (edited) Actually no one is demanding anything Bioware has already made there decision and the pro meter crowd are teeth gnashing over it. As far as I'm concerned the debate is over and Bioware made a decent compromise. Sounds like a bunch of people going on very little information. Actually now that I think about it, that describes a majority of the posters on these boards. Edited January 11, 2012 by Meluna content Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devorin_Sargothi Posted January 11, 2012 Author Share Posted January 11, 2012 (edited) I can turn that around and say if you cannot learn to play without add-ons and meters you're not grouping with me. I want to play with players who can think for themselves and react to situations in the raid by simply looking at a mobs health. I don't want to raid with a bunch of beginners who cannot do anything except read everyones combat logs to see what they're doing and if they are doing it as stated by some interwebz site. The truth is, without someone making an add-in for you that shows you numbers you can't play. End of story. You are incapable of going around some mobs and testing your dos against them and figuring out your own set of numbers. You'd rather be given all the cookie-cutter specs and rotations and figures and them claim hero status and belittle everyone else that does not, or cannot, match the cookie-cutter class configuration you have deemed the "pwnz all".. So come along, I'll show you all the basics, what to do if you pull agro, how to work a rotation, how to use a parser, how to find a group, all that stuff. But if you're gonna hide, you're not trying to learn anything. Edited January 11, 2012 by Devorin_Sargothi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jett-Rinn Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 (edited) Insults aside I have all the information I need Personaland Optional Those are the two big wins any way you cut it. Edited January 11, 2012 by Meluna Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vydor_HC Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 Why do people keep playing semantics with needed vs. wanted? Its an idiotic argument to use given that, in the right context, most developers see the terms synonymously. Vast difference. One you can't play the game, one is helpful. The developers see the difference and add the wanted features when they see it as an overall benefit to their game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Excedrin Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 Insults aside I have all the information I need Personal and Optional Those are the two big wins any way you cut it. He italicized your. That's it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpookyDaInsane Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 (edited) The reason for my want/need for combat logs is very simple. I raid. And I raid competitively. Right now I am in an 8 man that is starting Nightmare pretty soon and I would perfer if we went into 16 mans. The reason why my 8 man is so far ahead after its first raid week is because I trust everyone in there due to playing with them previously, or they are trusted friends of others. Swapping to 16 man though, I do not know the 8 other players and they will have to be recruited from the general public. There is always "THAT" guy that is dead weight and worthless in a raiding environment. Even though he may be the nicest guy in the world he can't do his job so he wastes the time of 15 other people for hours on end. This is where combat logs are nessessary to see why he is dying, why his damage is so low, why other people are dying if hes a healer, ect ect. Any competitive player needs a combat log to answer these questions. So people who say they don't want combat logs or anything, you are probably "THAT" guy. Which is fine. I will be nice to you and respectful to you but no, I really don't want to play with you. If its possible for me to help you, then I will, but I can't with out logs of any type. Edited January 11, 2012 by SpookyDaInsane Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Golroc Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 (edited) I need the combat log to identify bad players so I can avoid them. I don't want to waste my time playing with bads. Edited January 11, 2012 by Golroc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sendrel Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 (edited) vast difference. One you can't play the game, one is helpful. The developers see the difference and add the wanted features when they see it as an overall benefit to their game. whooooooooooosh!! Edit: this time with less snark. You missed my point. I conceded that no one 'needs' them to play. The point was that if enough people determine that they want a feature, the devs aren't likely to draw the same distinctions you will. Edited January 11, 2012 by Sendrel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlpsStranger Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 He italicized your. That's it. Nah, it means what it means. It's pretty obvious that Bioware has bought into their fearmongering. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jett-Rinn Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 Nah, it means what it means. It's pretty obvious that Bioware has bought into their fearmongering. Or they just don't want the crap that goes on in WoW....Or the looked at the most profitable and largest demographic and made a Business decision, or..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hairless Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 There really is no point arguing with people who don't understand why combat logs are needed for progression raiding for the average raiding guilds. Average guilds. The guilds that can't clear everything in every difficulty within the first 2 weeks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devorin_Sargothi Posted January 11, 2012 Author Share Posted January 11, 2012 Vast difference. One you can't play the game, one is helpful. The developers see the difference and add the wanted features when they see it as an overall benefit to their game. If they feel their game would benefit from obscuring data and preventing understanding game mechanics, I shudder to think what they had in mind to sell us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TItanten Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 Why would any kind of math skill be needed? That's what Recount or log parsing is for. Programs do it for us so we don't have to. Nobody does any manual math except the theorycrafters. That was sarcasm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jHats Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 (edited) There really is no point arguing with people who don't understand why combat logs are needed for progression raiding for the average raiding guilds. Average guilds. The guilds that can't clear everything in every difficulty within the first 2 weeks. If you can clear everything and are clearing everything without meters, you certainly dont "need' anything. There was raiding once upon a time without things like voice comms or addons. This first tier has been pretty terrible in terms of raiding. All 3 modes cleared in 2 weeks is a joke onto itself and Bioware needs to re-think their philosphy. If a company like blizzard implemented a 3rd mode even more challenging than heroic in WoW, it surely wouldnt be cleared in 2 weeks, by anyone. Hard and Nightmare have been cleared by tons of guilds already in this game. Its pathetic how easy it is right now. The whole reason to introduce 3 tiers of difficulty is for the different playstyles. Right now one playstyle can clear all 3. I feel sorry for the people actually patting themselves on the back about clearing them right now. Edited January 11, 2012 by jHats Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sendrel Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 If you can clear everything and are clearing everything without meters, you certainly dont "need' anything. There was raiding once upon a time without things like voice comms or addons. How many people do you know that raid without Vent/Mumble? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Setanian Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 Sorry buddy, if you could answer more to that then "lol u r bad" like a muppet I would have thought you were trying to actually discuss something. Well I'm not looking for add-ons to help me play. I know how I play and how I want to play. If you actually read my entire comments you would read that I don;t care if you have/get/need these meters to play. Im my mind and I know it's personal to me, I think anyone that needs these does not know how to play, they are unable to play and therefore contrary to others, they are the bad players. I think for myself, I know how to react to a raids movements and the boss and the adds the events. I learn by making mistakes. What you people want is instant gratification so you win every time. And if someone dares to be having an off-day, they're immediately bad and should be never invited again. In fact they should be kicked from the guild. And all this from people who I'm betting will live on YouTube to learn the raid before they even step into it and then claim to be the hero's. All this from people who will run the same rotations time after time that they got from the internet. WoW fostered these players and SW:ToR will end up being WoW with a different name. I may be a "muppet' in fact lots of people will say I am, but I don't need more told than I was supplied with to play my class or figure out in my head with simple maths if the raid is going good or bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TItanten Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 How many people do you know that raid without Vent/Mumble? <<< Yo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devorin_Sargothi Posted January 11, 2012 Author Share Posted January 11, 2012 If you can clear everything and are clearing everything without meters, you certainly dont "need' anything. There was raiding once upon a time without things like voice comms or addons. If this happens, it means you've cleared the content at a fraction of your full potential, and the content was too easy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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