KippTabor Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 Okay, I'm not going to bother replying to various stupid comments. But I can name a couple dozen people from my vanilla wow server who ended up quitting/re-rolling to different servers because of blacklisting. One of them was even an officer in progression guild. Over-time this went away in WoW, honestly I blame transfers, being able to just move without losing your progression means there is no incentive to punish the person misbehaving. If you go back further, it was worse in EQ, it even happened in Rift but it wasn't about looting it was about poor skills with a given role. Just buying an extra role and claiming you are a healer would get you blacklisted really quickly. Of course this changed with LFD, I stopped playing around that point. To claim this doesn't happen means you are very insular when it comes to server politics and probably aren't actually involved in any sort of guild leadership position. Anyway, on topic, I don't believe people should role on companion gear. Some people claim a companion is part of your character you can't live without. I contend you can complete every non-heroic quest without any companion out. They just make the process easier. (bold emphasis mine) Exactly. I have a feeling that people who think it's OK to companion need rarely group unless they have to to finish some content, then it's back to their insular gaming world. I'm sure we'll see some more word-salad, pseudo-intellectual denials about this, but it's starting to become evident to me to me that grouping is only a necessary evil for some of these folks, and if so, this is likely why they don't care if they get booted/black-listed for companion needing and screwing over a party member. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marlaine Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 (edited) Marlaine after reading all posts in this thread. Yours are definitely the most infuriating. You tell people that they can't SEE your point of view, but you are completely closed off to the notion that YOU could be wrong. So in this scenario: You are in a full 4 player group running a flashpoint: Heavy armor drops, there is a heavy armor PLAYER in the group who NEEDS the item as an actual upgrade that he will put on immediately. You are a light armor wearer, but your PET Khem Val could use the upgrade. Do you roll need on it? That scenario is all that needs to be figured out to see what kind of player you are. And if in the end, you cannot, in ANY way, see anything wrong with your companion taking gear from a player character who you are grouped with, then I feel sorry for you, because you are lacking a very basic emotion. You are probably also immature, and do not play well with others It's not that people can't see my point of view (and I've quite noticed it is not just MY point of view), it's that they refuse to adapt to the innovation of companions. They refuse to accept the fact that companions are an essential part of the overall character. They are stuck in the old paradigm and have not yet adapted. If you have a beef with companions being an important part of your character, then take it up with Bioware! Not with the players playing the game clearly as intended. I am arguing FACT, and you guys are arguing emotional opinion. THAT is why your are infuriated by my posts. The exact same things I've said have been repeated by others throughout this thread. I am far from alone here. Edited January 10, 2012 by Marlaine Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rzrknight Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 Like was said before , if a person ninja your item ignore the person and leave group , why you guys even discussing this with people that do this to begin with lols. PS: i hope they add a black list at some point so it always warns me if that person is in my group. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KippTabor Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 The player is the person behind a keyboard. It isn't a Jedi or his companion. Both of those are simply things used by a player. Both can be improved through improved equipment. Getting upset that your digital paper doll lost out on a roll to some other digital paper doll is taking things a bit too seriously. Then why have rolling at all? Let's just let whoever tags the corpse first get it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Splitquick Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 You are refusing to get the point. Is or is not the point of an instance to get better gear for your character? I will assume that your answer is yes. So in that case, since your companion is clearly a big part of your overall character, rolling need for companion gear is rolling for "your" gear. The fact that the companion is not participating in the instance means nothing. YOu are still in the end gearing your overall character. You cannot ignore this fact. Yes. I can ignore this "fact". Because in ALL GROUP SITUATIONS YOUR COMPANION IS NOT USED. If you want to gear YOUR companion, DO IT SOLO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laparkuh Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 The player is the person behind a keyboard. It isn't a Jedi or his companion. Both of those are simply things used by a player. Both can be improved through improved equipment. Getting upset that your digital paper doll lost out on a roll to some other digital paper doll is taking things a bit too seriously. Straw arguement is weak. =( That's the best you have? Who cares if both can be improved...If you aren't using your companion in that group...it doesnt NEED the loot. Again, that'd be like me rolling NEED for friends and family loot since I play with them sometimes. If their gear sucks it makes it harder on me, so in theory...shouldn't I be allowed to need for them without people getting mad? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferroz Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 (edited) Stop making up facts. You're companion doesn't share your stats...not part of your character. So? I have multiple willpower/strength/aim/cunning/endurance stats, one for each of my avatars. I control one of my avatars directly and one of my other avatars indirectly. I have one character, even though it has multiple avatars. BTW, pets in EQ1 could use gear/weapons til death / desummoned, would you let someone need on gear for them? Since it betters their character?Many EQ servers didn't do NBG by default. There were years worth of debats over that on the forums back in the day. I did see necros and magicians need rolling on weapons to give their pets from time to time. Even that is ignoring the apples to oranges comparison (permentant gear upgrades vs summoned pet that despawns on logout/DC or death). Edited January 10, 2012 by ferroz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferroz Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 Straw arguement is weak.I don't think you understand what that term means Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bekkal Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 Someone rolls Need for a companion, just kick them from the group and /ignore them. That's the beauty of no cross-server instancing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Splitquick Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 I can't continue to fight if I fall in a fight... does that man that I'm nothing more than another npc? My companion = me. I = my companion. My character has a bunch of gear slots; some of them are represented in the game world by an avatar that I move around directly; some are represented in the game world by an avatar that I do not move around directly. Both of them are my character. So by this logic, you should be able to roll need on items for alts right? Those are your characters too, represented by gear slots on an avatar, but wait... they didn't participate in the FP that the loot dropped in... oh wait... neither did the companion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marlaine Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 Stop making up facts. You're companion doesn't share your stats...not part of your character. If your in a 4man group, your companion basicly doesn't exist. You can twist it however you want but you are the minority. If you take someone from someone, then you're a ninja. Sorry if you don't like the title but that's what it is. BTW, pets in EQ1 could use gear/weapons til death / desummoned, would you let someone need on gear for them? Since it betters their character? Ignoring the fact does not make it less true. If you want to keep that head of yours in the sand you go for it. Claiming that a companion is "not part of your character" when it does like 35-40% of my overall damage is just astounding. Like I said, you are ignoring the facts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amiracle Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 Shouldn't be necessary. You should be able to show me 150 people it already happened to, since it's so self-evident and everything. Let's see them. Seems like you aren't willing to stand by your convictions. I never would've guess that....lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Democratus Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 That's the best you have? Who cares if both can be improved...If you aren't using your companion in that group...it doesnt NEED the loot. Never said I wasn't using my companion. I have used my companion in every group adventure I've done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holron Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 Companions dont get group loot. If you roll, you will be kicked. I dont need to lay that down beforehand. You should lay down that you will roll for yoru companion when you join teh group that way they can decide to keep you or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WutsInAName Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 Someone rolls Need for a companion, just kick them from the group and /ignore them. That's the beauty of no cross-server instancing. except I am the tank, so I would have myself a new group and be re-running while you were still shouting LFM need Tank!!! Good luck with that, I still come out ahead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laparkuh Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 So? I have multiple willpower/strength/aim/cunning/endurance stats, one for each of my avatars. I control one of my avatars directly and one of my other avatars indirectly. I have one character, even though it has multiple avatars. Many EQ servers didn't do NBG by default. There were years worth of debats over that on the forums back in the day. So you're basicly saying you think that your characters that weren't there for the group deserve loot just as much as someone who directly helped with the kill? That's like me taking all the cunning gear for my scoundrel alt when I play a sage....is that fair? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Splitquick Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 Ignoring the fact does not make it less true. If you want to keep that head of yours in the sand you go for it. Claiming that a companion is "not part of your character" when it does like 35-40% of my overall damage is just astounding. Like I said, you are ignoring the facts. So in the flashpoint that the loot dropped your companion did 40% of your DPS? No, it didn't. The 3 people HELPING you did the damage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferroz Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 So by this logic, you should be able to roll need on items for alts right? Those are your characters too, represented by gear slots on an avatar, but wait... they didn't participate in the FP that the loot dropped in... oh wait... neither did the companion.No, those are different characters, since they're part of a different character slot. If you aren't happy with someone needing on stuff for the other parts of their character, you should state that up front. If you don't, you have no room to complain or cry about it after the fact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amiracle Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 I've already been over this. I will repeat myself. The point of an instance is to gear up your character. Your companion is a part of your character. I don't care that I couldn't use my companion for the instance (because I would if I could!), that's not the point. The point is gearing out my character, which includes my companion! *I* am the one playing the game as clearly intended by Bioware. You are the one setting subjective rules that have nothing to do with the reality of the game. Actually you haven't. 5/10 for trolling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laparkuh Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 Ignoring the fact does not make it less true. If you want to keep that head of yours in the sand you go for it. Claiming that a companion is "not part of your character" when it does like 35-40% of my overall damage is just astounding. Like I said, you are ignoring the facts. Hey marlaine...did he help kill the boss that you needed loot on? Or did players? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Democratus Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 So you're basicly saying you think that your characters that weren't there for the group deserve loot just as much as someone who directly helped with the kill? That's like me taking all the cunning gear for my scoundrel alt when I play a sage....is that fair? Something is fair when all have an equal chance. So, by definition, several people rolling "need" is fair. Rolling "greed" is a choice - which also makes it fair. I've rolled "need", "greed", and simply passed before. None of this mechanic seems inherently unfair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferroz Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 Hey marlaine...did he help kill the boss that you needed loot on? Or did players?My character did, so I am entitled to roll on loot for my character, even if not all the avatars of my character are in the instance when the loot dropped. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Splitquick Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 No, those are different characters, since they're part of a different character slot. If you aren't happy with someone needing on stuff for the other parts of their character, you should state that up front. If you don't, you have no room to complain or cry about it after the fact. So I should make sure my group isn't douchebags before every run? No, I see it the other way around. The douche-bag who wants to need roll for his companion should make sure the group is aware he's a selfish douche before the run, not the other way around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marlaine Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 (edited) So in the flashpoint that the loot dropped your companion did 40% of your DPS? No, it didn't. The 3 people HELPING you did the damage. Why do I have to keep repeating this. A dungeon is to gear up your character. A companion is a part of your character. It doesn't matter whether the companion was used in that instance or not, it is stilll a part of your overall character. I am not advocating rolling need on everything on the excuse that you have four companions that all need different gear. I am talking about rolling need for that one primary geared out companion that is clearly a part of your overall character to anyone who has a lick of sense. Edited January 10, 2012 by Marlaine Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferroz Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 So I should make sure my group isn't douchebags before every run?No, we're not talkign about object for cleaning unmentionables. If you have specific rules on who is or isn't entitled to loot, you are required to bring them up in advance, or you have no leg to stand on when someone doesn't abide by it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts