Yfelsung Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 The lengths people go to to try and cover their elitist tendencies baffle me. let me give some examples of people I know in "another game" who were essentially locked out of end game content because of these types of 'features' 1) A young lady who is physically disabled and able to press correct buttons fast enough to perform to others expectations. This info got around and she found herself pretty much banned from groups because she 'sucked' and refused to 'l2p'. 2) An older, slightly mentally challenged gentleman who found himself in the exact same situation. I feel for those of you who really do just want to better yourselves, or have friendly competition among your friends. But the fact is that more often then not these systems are used to keep undesirables out of your groups. And that is not something I can approve of. Should I not be allowed to choose who I group with and who I don't? I mean, sure, it sucks to be the disabled person but if I'm running Nightmare Mode Ops, I'm sorry, I can't afford to bring them. If I was playing a game of basketball, I wouldn't bring the guy in a wheel chair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gohlar Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 (edited) Recount is used to help figure out optimal rotations. But IT DOES NOT PROVIDE THAT INFO TO YOU. It doesn't tell you what buttons to press or what buttons not to press. ALL RECOUNT DOES IS TELL YOU HOW MUCH DPS YOU DID. That's it. -FIN LEARN BEFORE SPEAKING. That info can be directly used to quickly and easily find an optimal rotation. This is something you couldn't do on your own. Recount has dictated your rotation. Rubbing 2 brain cells together to interpret the data is NOT learning to play. THINK BEFORE SPEAKING. This is a hot key mmo don't make this out to be rocket science. Recount does exactly what he said, your brain does the rest. There is next to nothing left for your brain to do....that's my point. Edited January 10, 2012 by Gohlar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GalacticKegger Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 (edited) Actually 90% of the time, they are slacker disablers. I have no idea what servers you guys have been playing MMO's on where all you have in group chat is spammed DPS charts and fighting, but apparently you are on the wrong servers, none of the ones I've played on have had it. Hyperbole to support a groundless point maybe? Anyway, I have to go drive somewhere now. I'll be sure to cover my spedometer and use the "knowing my speed would have been a crutch" explanation if I get pulled over.I suppose that works in situations where there is a speed limit. If damage needs to decrease or cease altogether because of a phase change or an enrage timer expiring or something, well . . that's all situational awareness. Meters have nothing to do with it. Besides, driving at the same speed as the flow of traffic is what really happens anyway. Edited January 10, 2012 by GalacticKegger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlpsStranger Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 1) A young lady who is physically disabled and able to press correct buttons fast enough to perform to others expectations. This info got around and she found herself pretty much banned from groups because she 'sucked' and refused to 'l2p'. Dude, I don't want to sound harsh, but you have to actually be able to play the damn game. Blind people probably have a pretty hard time getting groups too. This argument, if followed to its logical conclusion, means that *any* level of difficulty in an MMORPG is bigoted. Your premise could literally be used to destroy all of gaming. It is a fallacious argument. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VicSix Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 That info can be directly used to quickly and easily find an optimal rotation. This is something you couldn't do on your own. Recount has dictated your rotation. Rubbing 2 brain cells together to interpret the data is NOT learning to play. THINK BEFORE SPEAKING. If we had a combat log it would be pretty easy to figure out a rotation. Recount also helped a ton on my tank. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gohlar Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 If we had a combat log it would be pretty easy to figure out a rotation. Recount also helped a ton on my tank. I'm tired of addons helping us win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoxiousAlby Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 Should I not be allowed to choose who I group with and who I don't? I mean, sure, it sucks to be the disabled person but if I'm running Nightmare Mode Ops, I'm sorry, I can't afford to bring them. If I was playing a game of basketball, I wouldn't bring the guy in a wheel chair. I'm sorry but that is why you fail humanity 101, after all it's only light entertainment..a game. No risk to financial security, your home, your loved ones....it's simply a game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PjPablo Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 I'm tired of addons helping us win. Hi there. Still waiting for some help here. I'm stupid. Can you give me a brief step to step that fills in the blanks here: 1. Download Recount . . . . . 10. Optimal Rotation Thanks a bunch!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VicSix Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 I'm tired of addons helping us win. actually it helped warn me of the stupids on my tank. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taroen Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 That info can be directly used to quickly and easily find an optimal rotation. This is something you couldn't do on your own. Recount has dictated your rotation. Rubbing 2 brain cells together to interpret the data is NOT learning to play. THINK BEFORE SPEAKING. There is next to nothing left for your brain to do....that's my point. Recount hasn't dictated his rotation. He's used recount to see if the changes he made in his rotation improved it, or made it worse. Recount never told him what to do. It only told him what he DID. The fact that you can not grasp this simple concept is, quite frankly, disturbing. You want to play without knowing your own dps. I suspect what you really want is for other people not to know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mineria Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 If we had a combat log it would be pretty easy to figure out a rotation. Recount also helped a ton on my tank. You can read tooltips and see the floating damage numbers? Got a calculator too? No need for recount to figure it out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jupit Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 Personally I wouldn't mind seeing who can do the most dmg/healing in my guild, as it would help me learn who is "able" and who still needs help. Help which I will give. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PjPablo Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 You can read tooltips and see the floating damage numbers? Got a calculator too? No need for recount to figure it out. No need for maps. Draw your own. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gohlar Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 Recount hasn't dictated his rotation Yes, it did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlpsStranger Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 I'm tired of addons helping us win. Ok, let me try this again. Those quest marks you see? That was an addon called Quest Helper. The big bag you put stuff in? That used to be called Bagnon. Those floating numbers when you hit stuff? That's right, it was an addon once upon a time. The distinction "addon" isn't as black and white as you wish to make it sound. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vaas Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 Current state:They nay-sayers are dictating the restriction of a useful tool because they don't like the feature. Thanks for choosing for me! /sarcasm I am not against the usefulness of the tool. I am against the abuse of the tool which will happen and become wide spread very quickly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VicSix Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 You can read tooltips and see the floating damage numbers? Got a calculator too? No need for recount to figure it out. yeah our toltips shouldn't scale with our talents we can figure it out. You know your playing on a COMPUTER right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mineria Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 No need for maps. Draw your own. Been there done that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlpsStranger Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 No need for maps. Draw your own. No need for pencils, chunks of coal work just fine. Hell, that's lazy. Get a clay tablet! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PjPablo Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 No need for pencils, chunks of coal work just fine. Hell, that's lazy. Get a clay tablet! Cuneiform FTW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gohlar Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 Ok, let me try this again. Those quest marks you see? That was an addon called Quest Helper. The big bag you put stuff in? That used to be called Bagnon. Those floating numbers when you hit stuff? That's right, it was an addon once upon a time. The distinction "addon" isn't as black and white as you wish to make it sound. If we could limit to only certain addons I would support having them. Some addons are good you are right. Problem is if you allow one you kind of allow them all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lostpenguins Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 The lengths people go to to try and cover their elitist tendencies baffle me. let me give some examples of people I know in "another game" who were essentially locked out of end game content because of these types of 'features' 1) A young lady who is physically disabled and able to press correct buttons fast enough to perform to others expectations. This info got around and she found herself pretty much banned from groups because she 'sucked' and refused to 'l2p'. 2) An older, slightly mentally challenged gentleman who found himself in the exact same situation. I feel for those of you who really do just want to better yourselves, or have friendly competition among your friends. But the fact is that more often then not these systems are used to keep undesirables out of your groups. And that is not something I can approve of. Two can play at that game: 1) I've seen people in EQ who start casting a spell and stop casting before it goes off so they never gain aggro. They are providing 0 help to the raid, but make it look like they are doing something. 2) I'm sorry that people are being locked out of content, but why should I have to try harder to compensate for their lack of capability to have fun? Why should wipe on a boss at 5% because one dps person couldn't contribute even 30% of the dps I did? How is that fun for me? I shouldn't be required to carry the load of someone else when I'm paying for my own game and time. It's selfish to think I should have to. Everyone who is saying that it's so elitist to exlude them is doing the exact opposite and forcing me to play with these sub-par players. I shouldn't have to and w/out recount it can be hard for me to see where the fat is that needs to be trimmed. I'm a competitor. Part of my fun is completing content and trying to get better and better. I'm sorry if some people cannot do that, but I shouldn't have to be stuck with a person like that. You people complain that pro-dps-meter people are forcing you to spec a certain way. No, I'm not. You don't have to group with me. But stop forcing me to not be able to optimize my spec. It's like saying I shouldn't be allowed to buy meat because you're a vegetarian. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Revelationjp Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 Should I not be allowed to choose who I group with and who I don't? I mean, sure, it sucks to be the disabled person but if I'm running Nightmare Mode Ops, I'm sorry, I can't afford to bring them. If I was playing a game of basketball, I wouldn't bring the guy in a wheel chair. I play basketball with a guy in a wheelchair, and he's better than most of us. But that's irrelevant. You're elitist tendencies are showing again. When people are paying for access to a game, they shouldn't be denied access to it simply because they aren't as good at it as you are. In rl, i would support you in this 100%, but we're in a game here, one that people are paying to play. I should add as well, that your post pretty much admits that you would use this system to deny groups to people who do not perform to your expectations, somthing most supporters have gone to huge lengths to deny. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matchews Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 (edited) I have been struggling with a decision of whether or not to continue playing this game for a few reasons. The lack of a combat log.The lack of UI customization.The lack of a Macro system.The lack of a competitive end game enviroment.The aweful world pvp that relatively does not exist. Each of us play MMo's for his or her own respective reasons. Mine is competition. I enjoy competing with other guilds and with my fellow raiders. Not being able to compare my dps or hps with other individuals completely denies me the liberty of my reason for playing these games. It has been quite some time since I have played an MMo that on release did not have any combat log whatsoever. Bioware has taken the extra step of not providing a combat log to remove the ability to compare damage and healing abilities. The shere fact that the combat log does not exist scares me. That leads me to believe that there will not be a damage parser and that the company has no intentions of ever allowing one. Chances are I will not pay for another month subscription. My plan is to cancel my subscription and go back to playing Rift. I will watch the PTR forums and continue to check for an update that includes a combat log and a damage/healing meter. Unfortunately until I see an update with these features I will not be coming back to this game. The other random reasons for me struggling with my decision to possibly quit are not as important to me as the combat log and damage/healing meter. I could live without them. The meter, I'm sorry but that's just a must have for me when I play an MMo. Without a meter, there is NO competition. Edited January 10, 2012 by Matchews Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PjPablo Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 If we could limit to only certain addons I would support having them. Some addons are good you are right. Problem is if you allow one you kind of allow them all. No you don't. Take Decursive for example. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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