how is the gunslinger in lvl 50 pvp?

[namestakengr]

i have a lvl 41 gunslinger now and i cannot tell if its decent or bad. due to all the level 50s.

 

so im curious what the lvl 50 gunslingers think.

 

i see how OP scoundrel and operative is so im wondering if i made the wrong choice.

[Infanta]

Are you good at situational awareness, and knowing what out of 15 talents to use? If so the GS is a fun spec.

 

If you only want to use 3 buttons, reroll now

 

Scoundrels (well scrappers) are only OP from stealth on an opener, they are a wet noodle if you catch them out of it (imo).

 

I use SS for PVE and due to respec, cant go to DF...

[RolyartNala]

You have to really be in the zone to succeed, be mindful of the environment and who is where, stick to your buddies when you need to, use line of sight and cover to avoid fire.

 

I won't lie, it's challenging to run a Gunslinger in PVP. I went Dirty Fighting spec for the run & gun stuff and the damage over time skills. Little more versatile, was the thinking.

 

So far when I'm really in the zone it's a blast. When I'm off my game it's unbelievably frustrating. Either way, it's hard to play effectively.

Edited January 9, 2012 by RolyartNala

[JesusJoplin]

Currently gunsligers are probably one of the most difficult classes to play, mainly because of the reliance on cover combined with being one of the squishiest characters in the game. You definitely need a lot of situational awareness, and you need to be ready to use a LOT of abilities. I have 3 full action bars plus a few extra hotkey'd skills and in a regular pvp match I need to use almost all of them of them at some point.

 

That said, even if you are really good with it, gunslingers are a bit underpowered at the moment, not just compared to scoundrels/ops, but to other classes as well. We don't get stealth. We dont have many CC - 2 of them break on damage and the other one can only be used from melee range. We don't get stealth. You dont get any slows unless you spec into. We have 1 shield absorb skill that doesn't absorb much and is on a 30 sec cooldown (though one of the specs you can increase the absorb damage on it, but its not the same spec as the one that gives you your aoe slow skill). We have only 1 escape mech and its on a 2 minute cooldown. We have 1 aoe knockback but it has to be used from cover which is a huge pain in the ***. We dont have leaps or speed boosts.

 

I have a level 50 gunslinger and I've tried multiple specs, and while I do like the class, I just feel it falls behind compared to the other classs, especially in warzones where things like stealth, knockbacks, leaps, and stuns are far more useful than simple dps. All 3 gunslinger trees are DPS trees (with different flavors), but EVERY other class in the game that has a DPS spec'd tree has more DPS potential than we do, and I think that seems wrong.

 

TL;DR I do like my gunslinger, its a fun class, and each tree has its own unique play style, but there either needs to be some serious overhaul to the cover mechanics (I'm not just talking about the bug that used to make channeled abilities not work from natural cover) or we need a DPS burst spec tree that doesn't rely so heavily on cover abilities.

[RolyartNala]

I'm going to disagree with Joplin on a few points.

 

(1) We have a second escape mechanic in the Dirty Fighting tree---you can spec Surrender to clear you of movement-imparing effects. That said, several classes, such as the Sith Warrior, can simply reapply said movement-imparing effects as often as they like. So you need to combine Surrender with a CC for it to really be effective.

 

(2) I'm not convinced DPS is low. Anecdotally, I tend to place in the top three in any given warzone for overall damage. With Shrapnel Bomb, Thermal Grenade and a few single-target shots, I can burn anyone not in heavy armor down fairly quickly---though as often as not I am interrupting my own channeled attacks to prevent someone from healing, so damage is often a wash.

 

(3) Dirty Fighting does not strictly rely on cover. It's more of a run-and-gun, DOT-them-up-and-watch-them-go spec. Dirty Fighting is absolutely boss for covering a capture point---until you get focus fired, in which case a healer is unlikely to be able to save you.

 

Overall I do feel as though the Gunslinger is a complicated and challenging class. I'm not convinced it's weak, however; just today I encountered a Sniper (our parallel class on the Imperial side) who was crazy nasty and very hard to kill. Give it time, give it PVP gear at 50, and then let's assess.

 

Edited January 9, 2012 by RolyartNala

[JesusJoplin]

I'm going to disagree with Joplin on a few points.

 

(1) We have a second escape mechanic in the Dirty Fighting tree---you can spec Surrender to clear you of movement-imparing effects. That said, several classes, such as the Sith Warrior, can simply reapply said movement-imparing effects as often as they like. So you need to combine Surrender with a CC for it to really be effective.

 

The dirty fighting skill that you are referring to requires 2 points to be effective (its only 50% chance if you only drop 1 point in it), and I feel those 2 points are pretty vital in other areas. That said, the way its worded I was under the impression it only worked on roots/slows, not stuns. I could be wrong because I never tested. If it does work on stuns too then I would say its definitely worth the 2 points, but again the skill has a fairly long cooldown (45 sec), which isn't going to help you all that much since all classes have multiple CC's that are on much shorter cooldowns.

 

(2) I'm not convinced DPS is low. Anecdotally, I tend to place in the top three in any given warzone for overall damage. With Shrapnel Bomb, Thermal Grenade and a few single-target shots, I can burn anyone not in heavy armor down fairly quickly---though as often as not I am interrupting my own channeled attacks to prevent someone from healing, so damage is often a wash.

 

Not sure where you are coming from here, I said that I can top DPS charts fairly regularly with all the various specs I've tried, but what I can't seem to do is hit those 400k+ damage numbers that ops/scoundrels/sorcs/jedi's can do because they have better CC, mobility, and burst than we do. To be clear I don't think our damage is low necessarily, I just think that as a class that is PURELY supposed to be dps (all 3 of our class tree's are dps specs), we should be able to put out top level damage numbers because of all the other things we give up like mobility, survivability, and cc's.

 

(3) Dirty Fighting does not strictly rely on cover. It's more of a run-and-gun, DOT-them-up-and-watch-them-go spec. Dirty Fighting is absolutely boss for covering a capture point---until you get focus fired, in which case a healer is unlikely to be able to save you.

 

No it certainly doesn't rely on cover. Dirty Fighting is currently the spec I'm running because its really good for the turret and sabotage maps (though its not much use in hutball, but neither are our other specs since Jedi with their leaps and speed boosts seem to be the premier classes for hutball). Dirty Fighting is a really fun spec, the AOE dot bomb is fantastic for keeping people off bomb doors and capturing turrets, but it has the lowest burst of all our specs, and is the most energy hungry spec as well since the vast majority of your rotation consists of instant cast ability's that cost 20-30 energy. The only real burst you in this spec though is the channeled ability that causes extra damage for each dot thats applied on a target, but it requires you to place several dots on the person first before it really does any damage (though if you nail someone with 3-5 dots on them, it does some SERIOUS burst). Dirty Fighting also has the best mobility because you can spec your AOE bomb to also cause a slow on all affected targets and your dirty kick move gives you a short speed boost.

 

Overall I do feel as though the Gunslinger is a complicated and challenging class. I'm not convinced it's weak, however; just today I encountered a Sniper (our parallel class on the Imperial side) who was crazy nasty and very hard to kill. Give it time, give it PVP gear at 50, and then let's assess.

 

Like I said, I don't think its a bad class at all, I do like playing it, and it has some great utility for the objective maps. But like you say its a very difficult class to play well and I feel like I was kind of tricked into thinking this was going to be the high dps ranged class, whereas its really more of a aoe/dot class that only really excels at objective based maps. Add to the fact that Jedi/Sith stealthers also have a plethora of abilities that allow them to be great objective capture/defenders, and I just feel like we are a bit weaker overall compared to other classes in the game.

 

 

I'm not sure we're really disagreeing, as I agree with many of your points, maybe we just see things a little differently. I've bolded my responses. For all those reading this, I'm not trying to sway anyone away from playing a Gunslinger. It really is fun but its got a bit of a learning curve to it and if you are just looking for a high dps ranged character you might want to try one of the jedi/sith caster classes.

[StealthNerf]

I'm not really concerned about the gunslinger's different performance on difference maps. I'll usually top the charts on voidstar and alderaan, and come middling in hutt ball. Plus I'm much better in world pvp than most simply due to my range.

 

 

We have 1 shield absorb skill that doesn't absorb much and is on a 30 sec cooldown (though one of the specs you can increase the absorb damage on it, but its not the same spec as the one that gives you your aoe slow skill). We have only 1 escape mech and its on a 2 minute cooldown. We have 1 aoe knockback but it has to be used from cover which is a huge pain in the ***. We dont have leaps or speed boosts.

 

The defense screen tree does get the 18 second single target slow, though, which I find incredibly useful. I tagged an operative with that today, and stealth couldn't save him once tagged.

[Fearheart]

I have pvpd on all but a shadow and sentinel. All things considerred my gunslinger (sharpshooter) is not very good at pvp when going against a good team.

 

1) If their team knows what they are doing you will be one of the first on your team to get focused.

a) why? Your damage output is very high if they leave you alone. You can cc melee that are running around with leg shot (they get annoyed and focus you). Anytime anyone sees a smuggler in cover they auto focus.

 

2) Your dependence on cover.

a) Your biggest abilities can only be cast from cover. You are very weak (damage) when not in cover.

b) cover is still buggy even after patch 1.0.2. When you are on a texture seam or sometimes against a wall it won't let you cast cover. By the time you figure out what is going on you will be killed just standing there trying to pop cover.

c) Once your hunker down is on cooldown it is very easy to get knocked out of cover. any CC or knockback will drop your cover. Seems like all they have to do is breathe on you sometimes to drop your cover. (Almost every class has a knockback or cc, so don't think you will stay in cover for long.)

 

3) Ability delay.

a) Your 3 biggest damage abilities (that you use most often) are quite buggy. Aimed shot, charged burst and speed shot. Sometimes you will cast an aimed shot, it will show a completed cast but it will never go off, nor will you get the damage from it.

b) sometimes when rapidly pressing keybinds your character will temporarily stop responding making good use of dodge, hunker down and interrupts nigh impossible to time correctly. I have died many times mashing dodge, defense screen, pulse, dirty kick, or other abilities for 10 seconds and them never going off. There are definately some weird delays going on. If you have any FPS problems, Lag or other issues affecting your gameplay this is definately not the right pvp class for you.

 

4) No self sustainment

a) We are one of the few specs in the game that don't have any self heal mechanic. So unless we have a healer nearby or drop out of combat we will never gain health that we lose.

 

I usually only use my Sharpshooter for pve now and use my scrapper for pvp.

Edited January 9, 2012 by Fearheart

[Arsanists]

really like it. Really high single target damage from sharpshooter spec, loads of cc own most ppl in 1v1 can be mobile if you're smart with rotations and can tank ranged fire. My friend who is a said wishes he didn't die from battlemaster operatives and could survive like the gunslinger.

 

As other people said though you need to be smart and use loads of buttons but its easy enough to to regularly get 400-500k damage on sharpshooter and also help team with shields and cc and have fun

[StealthNerf]

1) If their team knows what they are doing you will be one of the first on your team to get focused.

a) why? Your damage output is very high if they leave you alone. You can cc melee that are running around with leg shot (they get annoyed and focus you). Anytime anyone sees a smuggler in cover they auto focus.

 

That's the reason I went saboteur... I don't really want the high damage/low survivability of sharpshooter.

 

In group PvP it's better to have the extra cover defense and anti-melee abilities that high single target burst, imo, since if you want burst then it's just better to get another class to help.

Edited January 10, 2012 by StealthNerf

[shadowAI]

i have a lvl 41 gunslinger now and i cannot tell if its decent or bad. due to all the level 50s.

 

so im curious what the lvl 50 gunslingers think.

 

i see how OP scoundrel and operative is so im wondering if i made the wrong choice.

 

Try a commando to 20 for grav round. You will soon find out that against the majority of BH players the commando burst dmg is similar to that of gunslinger. however you arent as focused and can use all your knowledge of getting to valor 40+ as a gunslinger to become an extremely good commando.

 

Im close to benching my gunslinger. I can do nearly everything on my commando easier and even more. Only thing thats a con is that you can be charged/pulled as a commando.

[PiepTon]

I played a few specs with the gunslinger.

 

 

SS:

Is pretty ok in alderaan warzone, cuz you have a good field of view and nice placing posibilities.

 

The other warzones are not so good for ss.

 

But IMO SS is only effective with full pvp gear + rataka stims aso.

 

 

df / sab hybrid:

 

viable on all three warzones

 

df pure build:

IMO the most viable for the beginning. You are very mobile, setting up your dots interuppting ppl from flagging and you do a nice amount of damage. Sure it's not burst damage but you still can win 1v1 with kiting.

 

But energy management is pretty difficult with DF.

[Arkenthro]

Gunslingers are fine in PvP. In fact I've been cautious about posting on the forums at all because I don't want to make the class seem OP and get it nerfed.

 

http://imgur.com/8xEgC

 

It's all about effectively using pillars and objects to LoS targets and positioning yourself to make it hard for melee to attack you without surrounding themselves with enemies.

[Strah]

Try a commando to 20 for grav round. You will soon find out that against the majority of BH players the commando burst dmg is similar to that of gunslinger. however you arent as focused and can use all your knowledge of getting to valor 40+ as a gunslinger to become an extremely good commando.

 

Im close to benching my gunslinger. I can do nearly everything on my commando easier and even more. Only thing thats a con is that you can be charged/pulled as a commando.

 

Commando isn't even close on the amount of CC GS got.

[Estinius]

Gunslingers are fine in PvP. In fact I've been cautious about posting on the forums at all because I don't want to make the class seem OP and get it nerfed.

 

http://imgur.com/8xEgC

 

It's all about effectively using pillars and objects to LoS targets and positioning yourself to make it hard for melee to attack you without surrounding themselves with enemies.

 

Those are some really high numbers. You in Battlemaster gear?

[Arkenthro]

Those are some really high numbers. You in Battlemaster gear?

 

Nope. Currently rank 46. Half Champion half Centurion with a few PvE pieces.

[Estinius]

Maybe I just suck but my damage numbers can only drop undergeared players fast. I tend to go up against full champ/cent gear opponents and can unload all my skills on them and barely get them to half life. I only have 3 pieces of champ gear (relic, BP, and Pistol) so I am not sure if this is a factor. It is however very discouraging because I play in PUGS and just get pwned by Premades. It's an all out zerg fest when the Sith see me.

[StealthNerf]

No class can hold back a premade in a pug...

[Estinius]

No class can hold back a premade in a pug...

 

 

I know. It just sucks because WZ's on my server consist of mostly 1 Sith guild running 3-4 Warzones. Makes it almost impossible to get high damage numbers when they are already fully geared and grind continously.

 

Anyone know if Bioware is thinking about enabling server transfers?

[Arsanists]

on the comando vs gunslinger remember some of the key points that we offer... Burst.

 

Both my friend who is a comando and friend who is a dps sage can't believe how much damage i deal in 1 second.

 

If your smart... Armour debuff, Stagger, Sab charge, call xs, aim shot then quick draw... 10 or 11k damage all within a second or more if they all crit.

 

I know this kind of combo can't be repeated over and over but there are loads of little sequences like this that make gunslinger effective. Another good one is a straight forward 7k aimed shot hit