Deception=worst spec?

[Darth_Conan]

My main is a Deception spec'd assassin. When he's maxxed we'll see I guess, but at this point I'm noticing I seem to be the only fool doing deception. Everyone else is either darkness or madness, and with good reason. From what I see, deception is the only true assassin tree, yet it is by far the worst.

 

If you are darkness, you seem pretty set in all areas. If you are madness you seem pretty set. If you are deception, you are a time-consuming, glass cannon with less burst and sustained dmg than classes like IA Operative. I have played the stealth assassin/rogue class in every MMORPG since Ultima Online, and this is by far the worst one. Crap cc, weaker burst than other classes that shouldn't be stronger burst, lack of sustained dmg under the only true assassin tree, deception, and absolutely NO survivability, even with the ability to vanish in combat. Simple enough to knock you out of that with a quick aoe or whatever.

 

Okay, enough of my whining, I guess what I'm saying is, someone school me on the best spec for an assassin. Period. DPS primarily, even if thats the tanking tree. I notice it is very nice for survivability and sustained heavy dmg. Madness seems to be the dmg and cc tree with some survive. Deception is the true assassin tree that just plain seems to suck.Voltaic slash is our first move with higher dmg etc. etc. So, PLEASE, Im asking for specs. Your spec, what you think the best spec is period. PVE and/or PVP. I'm old-school, but this deception assassin is making me feel like a nub. I know how to play him, I'm using him correctly, and sure I can do some killin', but not like I should be able to. I may get one dude in a warzone but I am immediately dropped right after by one hit from any friend.

I'm accustomed to being able to do massive burst dmg and cc and harass the hell out of other players as a stealth/rogue type class. That doesn't seem like its going to happen here, so come on. Take a break from what you normally do on these forums and spec me. Spec this assassin to kill, survive, and kill again. And yes, I know how to play and have played every type of class in almost ever MMORPG. Rarely a healer, usually dps. Help an assassin out. Don't make me switch to my alt sniper as my main.

Edited January 8, 2012 by Darth_Conan

[Cowflab]

My main is a Deception spec'd assassin. When he's maxxed we'll see I guess, but at this point I'm noticing I seem to be the only fool doing deception. Everyone else is either darkness or madness, and with good reason. From what I see, deception is the only true assassin tree, yet it is by far the worst.

 

If you are darkness, you seem pretty set in all areas. If you are madness you seem pretty set. If you are deception, you are a time-consuming, glass cannon with less burst and sustained dmg than classes like IA Operative. I have played the stealth assassin/rogue class in every MMORPG since Ultima Online, and this is by far the worst one. Crap cc, weaker burst than other classes that shouldn't be stronger burst, lack of sustained dmg under the only true assassin tree, deception, and absolutely NO survivability, even with the ability to vanish in combat. Simple enough to knock you out of that with a quick aoe or whatever.

 

Okay, enough of my whining, I guess what I'm saying is, someone school me on the best spec for an assassin. Period. DPS primarily, even if thats the tanking tree. I notice it is very nice for survivability and sustained heavy dmg. Madness seems to be the dmg and cc tree with some survive. Deception is the true assassin tree that just plain seems to suck.Voltaic slash is our first move with higher dmg etc. etc. So, PLEASE, Im asking for specs. Your spec, what you think the best spec is period. PVE and/or PVP. I'm old-school, but this deception assassin is making me feel like a nub. I know how to play him, I'm using him correctly, and sure I can do some killin', but not like I should be able to. I may get one dude in a warzone but I am immediately dropped right after by one hit from any friend.

I'm accustomed to being able to do massive burst dmg and cc and harass the hell out of other players as a stealth/rogue type class. That doesn't seem like its going to happen here, so come on nerds, cool guys, passive-aggressive *****, +1 posters, closet case trolls etc.. Take a break from what you normally do on these forums and spec me. Spec this assassin to kill, survive, and kill again. And yes, I know how to play and have played every type of class in almost ever MMORPG. Rarely a healer, usually dps. Help an assassin out. Don't make me switch to my alt sniper as my main.

 

Your mistake is trying to play the assassin like a rogue. It's not! I repeat, the assassin DOES NOT play like a rogue. If you want to play like a rogue you need to roll an operative.

 

Since you said you've played rogues in other MMOs, I'm going to assume you played WoW. IMO in WOW terms darkness plays like a blood DK. Deception plays like an enhancement shaman that can stealth. Madness melee builds play like an unholy DK that can stealth and caster build madness plays like a warlock who can stealth and melee a bit.

Edited January 8, 2012 by Cowflab

[Darth_Conan]

Your mistake is trying to play the assassin like a rogue. It's not! I repeat, the assassin DOES NOT play like a rogue. If you want to play like a rogue you need to roll an operative.

 

Since you said you've played rogues in other MMOs, I'm going to assume you played WoW. IMO in WOW terms darkness plays like a blood DK. Deception plays like an enhancement shaman that can stealth. Madness melee builds play like an unholy DK that can stealth and faster build madness plays like a warlock who can stealth and melee a bit.

 

I never played DK's cuz they were flavor of the expansion and quite lame. Almost every other class and type tho. I did play a warlock and loved it. So whats this warlock like spec?

[Cowflab]

I never played DK's cuz they were flavor of the expansion and quite lame. Almost every other class and type tho. I did play a warlock and loved it. So whats this warlock like spec?

 

Go to the codex sticky at the top of the assassin sub forum. It will tell you everything you need to know. They rely heavily on dots, kiting, and instant cast procs. It takes a bit of getting used to but its fun once you do get the hang of it.

[RedShirtDude]

I myself am doing a hybrid spec. 0-23-18

 

Which means I get all the nice stuff in deception up to low slash, but I don't trade in my thrash for voltaic slash - instead I dip into madness to get the improved shock, death field talents, instant whirlwind and the chance to proc free cost crushing D. Feels like a pretty strong build with decent AoE and cc.

[Glamscum]

I play Deception since lvl 10 and I think it's the tree with the most burst for assassins.

Deception got alot of CC like Mind Trick(similar to rogues sap in wow), low slash, and other inquisitor CC like windwhirl & electricute.

 

But as the previous poster stated, you are not intended to play an assassin like a 'rogue' in wow.

I find deception really good with high amount of burst dmg and I'm really enjoying playing it.

[Dominickz]

assassin implies an assassin, not a melee warlock

 

BW ****ed up royally on this class eh?

[bokidarkness]

Well, I'm a level 43 deception assassin and I find it the best spec. I bet you still don't understand your class. Learn about it, learn how to play and you'll find deception is a good skill tree to go for.

 

From what I know, deception is more of the burst-damage kind. Where you burst out of stealth with huge damage. That's how I take it and I play.

[Zederok]

I never played DK's cuz they were flavor of the expansion and quite lame. Almost every other class and type tho. I did play a warlock and loved it. So whats this warlock like spec?

 

Never ever call my beloved class lame. DK was the only reason why I came back to WoW when I burnt out back in BC. I think any class that is hybrid of caster/melee is the ****, and is the sole reason why I play a Sin here in ToR, it reminds me so much of my DK it isnt even funny.

[Warlyik]

assassin implies an assassin, not a melee warlock

 

BW ****ed up royally on this class eh?

 

An assassin in the Star Wars universe that is a force user. If you honestly don't expect to use force powers as a sith, then you should've rolled Operative or Scoundrel. Because that's exactly what you're asking. You're asking to be melee only stab stab stab from behind. That would make this class far less interesting.

 

You'd assume that an assassin would use all of the advantages they have at their disposal. This means using force powers if you're trained in the ways of the force, just as an assassin in feudal japan would probably use an array of ranged weapons before engaging in melee combat (poison darts, arrows, ninja stars, etc). So it seems to me that Deception is the odd one of the bunch. I, for instance, never saw Jedi or Sith using "Stealth" in the movies, and as far back as I can remember, it never existed in the single-player games either. But they did all use force powers.

 

Yes, I imagine that it's disappointing for all of those people that wanted to be some pure rogue. But I think you should consider what you're asking. You're basically saying, "please dumb this class down to the level of a rogue". Because quite frankly, rogue gameplay is dumbed down melee.

[ChaosDystopia]

I have played as a deception assassin from 10-50. My main focus has been PVP, which I have not had much difficulty with, nor did I find PVE to be particularly challenging. The spec that I am presently running is 5/33/3. I generally get 7-10 medals a warzone with roughly 150-200k damage done (and I only have four pvp items). Not the best, but I'm satisfied with it.

 

The only class that I seem to have difficulty with 1v1 are powertechs... deception is a fun build and certainly no worse than any of the other specs. My roommate is playing a darkness assassin with more pvp gear than I have but cannot beat me 1v1. It just comes down to practice, learning how to use your priority list and also learning when it's time to **** and run away (in true assassin fashion, lol).

[Mcfondles]

I think playing a deception assassin is a lot like playing a rogue... Don't really get why everyone says it isn't.. I'm having a blast with mine got him to 25 and I haven't ran into any trouble yet..

[andrewsuh]

im a lvl 42 now as a decep

 

im steamrolling through everything at this point. i do so much dmg while my companian heals me i never die

 

i do alot of dmg i pvp as well so i don't know why anyone would think its a lackluster spec

[DarthVenizen]

I think playing a deception assassin is a lot like playing a rogue... Don't really get why everyone says it isn't.. I'm having a blast with mine got him to 25 and I haven't ran into any trouble yet..

 

rogues u don't have to pay attention to procs and use an attack to boost another attack. (induction and duplicity procs as an example)

 

rogues also have an alpha strike from stealth, something assassin's do not have.

 

 

operative IS the rogue of this game, NOT assassin

 

in fact the only thing REALLY rogue esque is the increased force regen when u pop out of stealth

Edited January 8, 2012 by DarthVenizen

[Artthen]

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[MatticusUK]

Level 42, Rank 40 Deception Assassin here who has levelled primarily through PvP. I have had no problems with the deception spec at all in PvP. I am the guy who is normally solo defending nodes, capping doors and terminals and running a ball in Huttball and I love the versatility of the spec. If I need to burst someone down I can go into surging, pop reck, pop trinkets and rip someone apart and if I need to play mor defensive I can go into dark charge, pop our deflection skill + cloak of shadows type ability and vanish when needed.

 

If I am solo defending a node against 2+ people I can normally sap them all twice, call for help, pop out of stealth and stop the caps when they can no longer be stunned, go back into stealth when their resolve bars are depleted and do the same again until someone shows up to assist. That's deception.

[Lacertus]

My main is a Deception spec'd assassin. When he's maxxed we'll see I guess, but at this point I'm noticing I seem to be the only fool doing deception. Everyone else is either darkness or madness, and with good reason. From what I see, deception is the only true assassin tree, yet it is by far the worst.

 

If you are darkness, you seem pretty set in all areas. If you are madness you seem pretty set. If you are deception, you are a time-consuming, glass cannon with less burst and sustained dmg than classes like IA Operative. I have played the stealth assassin/rogue class in every MMORPG since Ultima Online, and this is by far the worst one. Crap cc, weaker burst than other classes that shouldn't be stronger burst, lack of sustained dmg under the only true assassin tree, deception, and absolutely NO survivability, even with the ability to vanish in combat. Simple enough to knock you out of that with a quick aoe or whatever.

 

Okay, enough of my whining, I guess what I'm saying is, someone school me on the best spec for an assassin. Period. DPS primarily, even if thats the tanking tree. I notice it is very nice for survivability and sustained heavy dmg. Madness seems to be the dmg and cc tree with some survive. Deception is the true assassin tree that just plain seems to suck.Voltaic slash is our first move with higher dmg etc. etc. So, PLEASE, Im asking for specs. Your spec, what you think the best spec is period. PVE and/or PVP. I'm old-school, but this deception assassin is making me feel like a nub. I know how to play him, I'm using him correctly, and sure I can do some killin', but not like I should be able to. I may get one dude in a warzone but I am immediately dropped right after by one hit from any friend.

I'm accustomed to being able to do massive burst dmg and cc and harass the hell out of other players as a stealth/rogue type class. That doesn't seem like its going to happen here, so come on. Take a break from what you normally do on these forums and spec me. Spec this assassin to kill, survive, and kill again. And yes, I know how to play and have played every type of class in almost ever MMORPG. Rarely a healer, usually dps. Help an assassin out. Don't make me switch to my alt sniper as my main.

 

I'm afraid to say this is a L2P issue. This will undoubtedly hurt your ego but you are bad at playing Deception. The same applies to anyone who whines about Deception.

 

The damage from Deception Assassin's is brilliant, sure Operatives have the rogue like burst from stealth but they have nothing like our burst in general combat.

People need to learn that they can't charge into a group or stand 30m away and faceroll AoE damage to top charts like certain other classes. It won't happen as Deception. Single target, picking your fights and blowing up healers is where Deception shines.

[Dcayd]

I think assassin was a poor choice of name for the AC, not because of how the class plays, but because how mmo players perceive "assassins".

 

A large chunk of players coming to swtor see assassin and automatically think of the typical mmo archetype, when it's really reflective of the AC's role in Sith society. Until people figure that out there will continue to be people complaining that sins don't play like "assassins".

 

I personally am loving mine, although I'm running darkness. I would be deception but voltaic's animation makes me want to vomit. I do wish we had some more acrobatic attacks, but whatever.

[theonepanda]

you should read my thread =o

 

shameless self promotion

 

I disagree about those saying the assassin doesn't feel like an assassin.

 

Yea your moves are super flashy and kinda force centric, but your job is to stand behind the target and stab the crap out of it.

 

also, I disagree that the assassin isn't like a "wow rogue" or whatever.

 

The surging static charges is very much like stacking deadly, discharge is very much like envenom, dark embrace is very much like overkill, maul is...well backstab (rogue backstab took 65 energy >.<).

 

You can think of shock as your finisher and voltaic slash as your combo builder (mutilate or sinister strike or whatever you want it to be).

 

You also have your vanish and your cloak of shadows and your combat readiness and your sprint. You even have your vendetta (well, kinda of, overcharge saber might be a stretch). We're missing killing spree and shadowstep =P

 

Furthermore the learning curve for deception assassin is very much like that of a subtlety rogue.

 

It involves a lot of combo point management (not voltaic slashing at 2 stacks), watching your self buffs (for maul and discharge and other procs) and keeping your "dot" up (static charges).

 

It also is fairly straightforward until you add in your cooldowns. Then it gets a bit more complicated, but once you master your cooldowns you become a killing machine. There is a long section in my thread dedicated to managing cooldowns.

 

Deception is VERY good. And it crits like a truck (you can easily get 40%+ melee crit as well as almost 90% surge).

 

Massive burst, good survival (less than madness), and altogether the most roguey of the three specs.

[Nocorras]

I think playing a deception assassin is a lot like playing a rogue... Don't really get why everyone says it isn't.. I'm having a blast with mine got him to 25 and I haven't ran into any trouble yet..

 

Because if you try to play like a rogue at 50 you're going to be sorely disappointed.

[Lina_Inverse]

Defensively, the class is very rogue-like when specced dps. You are squishy, rely on active defenses, stealth, and cc to avoid quick deaths. Offensively this class does not play like any rogue I have played, minus the fact that it has burst. Stealth is not a burst increasing tool. Skills that can be used from stealth are considerably weaker than other games. The lack of reliance on stealth is an advantage in some cases, since the burst is still there, but it definately feels weaker in the suprise attack/control department than rogues in other games.

[Yoblad]

Seems to be quite the learning curve of Deception. Lots of people are just spamming maul without exploit weakness up or shocking without induction or recklessness. Once you get used to the flow of abilities and when to use what it becomes very deadly. Just a bit tricky to play. 1v1 I fear no one.

[plompkin]

Seems to be quite the learning curve of Deception. Lots of people are just spamming maul without exploit weakness up or shocking without induction or recklessness. Once you get used to the flow of abilities and when to use what it becomes very deadly. Just a bit tricky to play. 1v1 I fear no one.

 

Agreed. If you use the wrong ability at the wrong time in PvP, you can end up sitting through several GCDs using only Saber Strike. Sure we don't put up the stupid numbers like Ops/Scoundrels, but there's nothing wrong with the spec. We've got really strong tools, Maul with Duplicity hurts bad, and our own fair share of cc + taunts.

 

Things get better at 50 with weapons. We're not too much of a threat before then, but when your weapon damage goes up, things start to get gross.

[alement]

My main is a Deception spec'd assassin. When he's maxxed we'll see I guess, but at this point I'm noticing I seem to be the only fool doing deception. Everyone else is either darkness or madness, and with good reason. From what I see, deception is the only true assassin tree, yet it is by far the worst.

 

If you are darkness, you seem pretty set in all areas. If you are madness you seem pretty set. If you are deception, you are a time-consuming, glass cannon with less burst and sustained dmg than classes like IA Operative. I have played the stealth assassin/rogue class in every MMORPG since Ultima Online, and this is by far the worst one. Crap cc, weaker burst than other classes that shouldn't be stronger burst, lack of sustained dmg under the only true assassin tree, deception, and absolutely NO survivability, even with the ability to vanish in combat. Simple enough to knock you out of that with a quick aoe or whatever.

 

Okay, enough of my whining, I guess what I'm saying is, someone school me on the best spec for an assassin. Period. DPS primarily, even if thats the tanking tree. I notice it is very nice for survivability and sustained heavy dmg. Madness seems to be the dmg and cc tree with some survive. Deception is the true assassin tree that just plain seems to suck.Voltaic slash is our first move with higher dmg etc. etc. So, PLEASE, Im asking for specs. Your spec, what you think the best spec is period. PVE and/or PVP. I'm old-school, but this deception assassin is making me feel like a nub. I know how to play him, I'm using him correctly, and sure I can do some killin', but not like I should be able to. I may get one dude in a warzone but I am immediately dropped right after by one hit from any friend.

I'm accustomed to being able to do massive burst dmg and cc and harass the hell out of other players as a stealth/rogue type class. That doesn't seem like its going to happen here, so come on. Take a break from what you normally do on these forums and spec me. Spec this assassin to kill, survive, and kill again. And yes, I know how to play and have played every type of class in almost ever MMORPG. Rarely a healer, usually dps. Help an assassin out. Don't make me switch to my alt sniper as my main.

 

Endgame Deceptisin is fantastic. Static Charges + Discharge = burst. Voltaic Slash does enough damage on its own, but then it beefs up Shock. Then, of course, Maul.

[Windkull]

I leveled up to the mid 30s with deception before switching to darkness to tank and I have to say, pvp was much more fun as deception because the burst was enough to take someone from 50% down to 0, and getting someone to 50% with deception unless they are a healer was pretty trivial. Make sure you kite tanks though as you won't win a straight up melee fight against one.