Grouping should be forced.

[archifikoss]

I'm sure that's the opposite of what people want to hear. Most feel intuitively that would be a step in the wrong direction because of the lack of LFD type tools and such.

 

Truth is, there would be no need for LFD tool if people couldn't just solo through the entire game. If bioware made it so everyone had to group to move on through the game, that's what people would do. And really the game would be 10x more enjoyable for it.

 

Now I know some people don't like to group, or don't like to group with people they don't know. That doesn't mean that the genre of online rpgs should suffer like it has. So please hear me out. Of course none of this matters, nothing will change, but I will say my piece anyhow.

 

When people have to rely on each other, they behave themselves, or they pay the consequence. There's always the downside of being bullied around, but it is well worth having a community. If you don't care about these things, once again the genre shouldn't suffer for your sake.

 

Secondly, while it seems at times difficult to find a group right now, it's not due to lack of players. That misconception is fueled due to instancing making it seem like there's too few players. The reason is the general antisocial behavior of gamers. Not blaming them. Everyone has their reasons for avoiding others, but many of these same people who won't start groups, and are reluctant to join pugs will also complain about how the game is just a single player rpg.

 

If either

 

a: Players had to complete all heroics to progress through story mode

and/or

b: All enemies were moved up a notch in rank (weak/standard to tough, tough to elite, etc).

 

You'd have to run with others to progress. I especially like B, with automatic quest sharing, and xp bonuses for groups bigger than 3 people. Under such a system, people would group up, be polite and have a lot more fun as they play a role in a group.

 

Obviously a better loot system is needed, rolling need on stuff that isn't for your class has to go. But otherwise the game would still be easy, and it might actually feel like an online game, maybe even an mmo.

 

Maybe I'm the only one who isn't having fun just solo'ing everything, if so, carry on. Keep in mind, that the LFD tool didn't solve anything in WoW until they made it cross realm, and then it basically turned into the worst grouping experiences imaginable due to rudeness from people who didn't have to behave.

 

[Pokerface]

Forming a group is a good thing. I always play with my guild when it comes to Heroic 2 or Heroic 4 Quests. Lucky me I do not have to group with pugs.

[grandmthethird]

wanna play how u want? its called world of warcraft for a reason=P they made it soo damn easy u can solo it all but the new 5 mans and raid.

 

actually its called SWTOR as well

[powatwooopa]

This. logging in after work and spending my entire evening of gametime trying to find a group because that was the only way to advance in the game was the worst design ever.

 

Requiring players to group for everything won't force them to group, it will force them to unsub when they become frustrated at not being able to progress.

 

meh let them unsub let the ones who are weak leave and go back to wow i say good riddance bye bye 12 year olds.!!!!

[Kalfear]

So forced grouping is NOT smart design anymore!

 

That said, Bioware did go over board on the solo play in TOR

 

I think you should still be able to solo from 1 to max, but that doesnt mean you get to play all the game content and get all the game rewards and that doesnt mean your not forced to spend some time grinding content because you will not group.

 

IMO a MMORPG should be 50% solo and 50% group

 

Soloing to max level requires doing ALL the solo content (not just your story line content but ALL the side quests as well)

 

plus

 

80% of the group content at least once OR doing what the kids like to claim is grinding in todays game by running daily solo quests and/or farming mobs for xp/drops

 

There should be enough group content that you GAIN SOMETHING from doing the group content and do miss out if you decide not to do it.

 

But NONE OF THIS makes aLFD tool required or needed.

 

Honestly I prefer no LFD tool because it leave group forming in my hands completely!

 

See someone spamming for group...ignore (as in they go on ignore list as dont want to play with them)

See stupid name (Im on RP servers, stupid names perfectly acceptable on PVE and PVP servers)...ignore (as in they instantly go on ignore list as dont want to play with them)

 

You do the work, you lay the ground rules from the start.

 

I just feel if you put up a ad you are inviteing ANYONE to join and I (nor any people I know) dont play that way.

 

Course Ive also never had a issue finding a group truth be told more then couple times. And those times I asked over general twice, watched chat for 5 minutes, moved on as no one was doing the heroic.

 

In this game, skipping a heroic or flashpoint (heck skipping them all) doesnt put you behind the pack in leveling speed/xp gain.

 

Thats how I see it anyways, the days of forced grouping over but that doesnt mean you cant still make grouping an important aspect of your game and reward those that do group up.

[Deheart]

lets not turn this game into wowfail situations.

 

Forced groupings are bad. There are way too many leechers and nijaers playing to game. And inorder for forced groupings to happen it would also be random blind grouping, which is absolutely wowfail. That is why I quit wow pre cata.

 

Sometimes I like to try an instance or heroic on my own, but usually it is more fun to group with other people. But the choice is mine.

 

Basically if you remove choice you will dampen the fun for a lot of people. And you end up with people leaving in the middle of instances, people not trying and letting everyone else do the work, and of course ninjas. Basicly you end up with Wold of Warcraft.

[carnac_fett]

meh let them unsub let the ones who are weak leave and go back to wow i say good riddance bye bye 12 year olds.!!!!

 

Are you on drugs? You're acting very strangely.

[Nighenhale]

- An MMO that forces its players to group forces itself into a niche.

 

- SW:TOR has been and still is an extremely costly thing to create.

 

- Combine a costly game with a niche genre and you get a bankrupt company.

 

You see the problem?

[archifikoss]

meh let them unsub let the ones who are weak leave and go back to wow i say good riddance bye bye 12 year olds.!!!!

 

Hahahaha! Oh wait, you're actually serious?

 

Weak... because of a video game... 12 year olds...

 

Oh dear...

[GalacticKegger]

I dislike playing with people who are bad. This would just anger players like me.

I dislike players who come off as legends in their own mind - good or bad. Teaching bad players willing to learn is what community is all about, and seeing the light bulb go on when they go from liability to asset is a real Dr. Feelgood moment. At least for me. Edited January 7, 2012 by GalacticKegger

[VordakGef]

Just say "no" to forced grouping. It sounds like some sort of government mandate.

 

"The reason is the general antisocial behavior of gamers."

 

Ehr... might as well say all snowflakes are the same too.

[Darth_Rathus]

Hell no.

[Jebazel]

I feel 'forced' to do a lot of things in this game.

 

Could do without one more.

 

The ones who would force are the ones I'd least like to group with...

[Kalfear]

This is why some games are starting to do dynamic open grouping. e.g. Rift, GW2. It's the best compromise between forced grouping, and players soloing through the whole game.

 

I remember the early days of EQ and DAOC, and yeah, forced grouping had some huge advantages, but I just don't think it would work well in today's market. So, you can either just make the whole game soloable, or start getting creative about how to put the multiplayer back in MMOs. Preferably, in a way that doesn't need to be forced.

 

Rift public Rift groups were an amazing idea! Still had some bugs to work out as the elitists did figure out ways to make them unpublic, unfriendly, just down right nasty affairs a short ways into game. But the concept was a great Idea and would fit perfectly into TOR as well

 

Yeah EQ wasforced.

DAoC was NOT forced grouping. there was group content sure but you were NOT FORCED AT ANY TIME to do it.

 

This is where it muddies the water on the forced grouping issue. Players that want something thats optional,so they forced to group for it. BUT ITS OPTIONAL CONTENT, thus no one is forcing you to get it.

 

DAoC was NOT a forced grouping MMORPG

 

EQ was (except for Druid and Necro).

FFXI totally was

DDO in reality was (oh they say you could solo but that solo version was so watered down and unrewarding it wasnt used)

 

Most MMORPGs have never been FORCED grouping really!

 

As someone said above, NWN on AOL (first MMORPG ever) could be completed solo from start to end). Some content like Dracolichs required groups till you had better equipment or maxed out fully and understood the fight.

 

The Realms...solo

DSO .....solo

UO .... Solo

AC .....solo

DAoC .....solo

SWG .....solo

ect ect ect

 

AsI said above, the trick is making the Group content so appealing that people feel its required. That doesnt make it any less optional in reality, just makes it mor elikely people will group up to do it.

[Chomag]

Forcing players to do what a very large percentage of the said players don't like to do, is a very sound marketing direction.

[rockmonkee]

I know the op means well but I don't think this should be implemented. There is a lot of bad players out there and there is a pretty bad penalty for death so the incentive to group is already there. And on my server there is usually 30 people tops on a planet. There is no easy way to level from 24 to 27 either. I'm going to be stuck in these levels for a very long time. Most of the planets with these levels only let u do the story missions. So I'm 24 trying to kill a 27 elite. The incentive for groups is already there.

[SgtFrog]

Final Fantasy XI proved that forced grouping makes for a garbage game.

 

FFXI was an amazing game.

 

 

Anyway I never play alone but I don’t think people should be forced to group.. a lot of people like to play alone in an MMO they just like to play in a persistent ever changing world..Does not mean they want to play with people all the time.

[Vihazur]

Rift public Rift groups were an amazing idea! Still had some bugs to work out as the elitists did figure out ways to make them unpublic, unfriendly, just down right nasty affairs a short ways into game. But the concept was a great Idea and would fit perfectly into TOR as well

 

Yeah EQ wasforced.

DAoC was NOT forced grouping. there was group content sure but you were NOT FORCED AT ANY TIME to do it.

 

This is where it muddies the water on the forced grouping issue. Players that want something thats optional,so they forced to group for it. BUT ITS OPTIONAL CONTENT, thus no one is forcing you to get it.

 

DAoC was NOT a forced grouping MMORPG

 

During its early days, it was pretty close. You could solo, but it was a lot more slow and tedious. I could solo in "vanilla" EQ, even as a late 40s cleric, but it was just even more slow and tedious. To me, when you make soloing involve massive amounts of downtime, that's pretty much forced, although some MMOs push it further than others.

 

 

As for the "elitists" in Rift, yeah, I remember encountering them once in a while. I think they just didn't get it, and wanted to stick with old fashioned closed grouping. I didn't encounter them all that often, though. Not really sure if it'd be better to just let them do their thing, or try to discourage it somehow.

Edited January 7, 2012 by Vihazur

[ReiperX]

I'm a social gamer and prefer to group with people than not to, this is a bad idea.

 

Off-peak hour players would be screwed over

New players coming to the game in six months, when most people are 50 would be screwed over

People who don't like to group would be screwed over

And of course, there are times when someone really doesn't want to group. Either because they are only going to be on for a short amount of time, may have to log off with almost no notice, or will be back and forth between afk (all three of which happens to me on a regular basis).

 

So in the end, you would be screwing over a ton of players.

[Seffrid]

If bioware made it so everyone had to group to move on through the game, that's what people would do.

 

That's what a few people would do, the rest simply wouldn't play the game.

 

Not just those who prefer - perfectly legitimately - to solo, but also those who want to group but don't want to be told to group.

 

The game caters for solo and group players and that's exactly as it should be. No-one should have someone else's preferred playstyle forced on them.

[Adam_Nox]

I know the op means well but I don't think this should be implemented. There is a lot of bad players out there and there is a pretty bad penalty for death so the incentive to group is already there.

 

What point is an incentive that doesn't work? It's not working, no one groups. And yes there are bad players, but it worked in other games. DAoC, EQ, FFXI. Every other game allowed solo'ing for normal leveling and in almost every case grouping was a rare occurance.

[Yvin]

Hello everyone,

 

Please understand that we have a diverse community, one built on a variety of different backgrounds and playstyles. Discussions and comments disparaging chosen playstyles are not permitted on the forums.

 

While we are closing this thread, should anyone wish to discuss the merits of a dungeon finder or suggestions for a more robust Looking For Group tool, please do so here: http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=115210

 

Thank you!