Perszoon Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 am i an idiot who thinks pyrotech is a pure pvp tree and arsenal is a pure pve tree? arsenal = standing still ( what i have noticed in mmo pvp thats one thing you wanna avoid, maby this game is diferent? pyrotech have powershot rail shot and unload and when you have to escape stun run away and trhow dots get in position and do some chanel then dots again and move move move thats sounds more like pvp for me maby i am wrong? what you think? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBarnsen Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 (edited) I just tried Pyro for some pvp rounds. And wow, dont know if cant play this build. But it SUCKED so hard. Got owned left and right, and didn't do more damage than with the hybrid build. Also was way more squishy. And way more heat issues. The Merc definatly needs some love. When i was specced Pyro, i really lost much fun in playing the class Edited January 7, 2012 by BobBarnsen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juicenewtonz Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 Pyro lets you be mobile sure, but arsenal lets you just instagib high priority targets. Also going pyro forces you to give up your knockback on rocket punch, some of your knockback on jet boost, and 10 seconds off the cooldown of jet boost. Pyro is just kind of a mediocre spec that lets you be mobile but is very reliant on lucky rail shot resets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBarnsen Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 Yes i missed those knockbacks. Will try an Arsenal build now.But the more i play, i miss all those little gimmicks other classes have. But mostly the extreme damage some have *looks at smuggler classes* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perszoon Posted January 7, 2012 Author Share Posted January 7, 2012 (edited) Pyro lets you be mobile sure, but arsenal lets you just instagib high priority targets. Also going pyro forces you to give up your knockback on rocket punch, some of your knockback on jet boost, and 10 seconds off the cooldown of jet boost. Pyro is just kind of a mediocre spec that lets you be mobile but is very reliant on lucky rail shot resets. giving upp jet boost is kinda hard :/ but as pyro you maby dont need it as mutch, i am really confused i really hope the warzones in the futher is going to be more open and bigger maps the insane 12ppl zerg each other att an objectiv is not fun for me, barley cant se what you are doing but thats me Edited January 7, 2012 by Perszoon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Denadanier Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 It really depends on what your looking for, I've found pyro to be more fun as it requires you to think...well marginally...arsenal on the other hand becomes a one button spam to win spec against 90% of players and all PVE mobs. That said if numbers on the board are what get you going, go arsenal, in its current state it is by far the strongest merc spec; just get ready for the headache from the sound of tracer missile! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snakepitbull Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 I think Pyro is way more fun. ALot more mobile than arsenal and more burst imo. Have crappy gear but feels like we do crap bursta compared to all the sword dweebs. (not even gonna mention the 2 mistakes called scoundrel and operative) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBarnsen Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 (edited) Well i now just played some rounds as Arsenal. And i hade WAY more fun then with the Pyro spec i tried before! I still get owned by good enemies. But now it feels more like Quake Arena for me lol. Edited January 7, 2012 by BobBarnsen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xeikai Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 Pyrotech is in my opinion, better for people who want a more mobile spec, It's a godsend compared to the alternative, tracermissle, which basically turns you into a turret. I'm in full tier 2 pvp gear and I do extremely well with pyrotech, i top the dps charts ever game just about. And i can somewhat kite with the spec, For those looking for a good explanation of what pyrotech offers, here it is. Pyrotech offers much more mobility, giving you kiting options against melee, Since most of it's moves are instant cast. You can fire them off while running, Though i dont think SWTOR kiting is very effective due to there being very little for us to use aside from energy shield to escape snares/roots. It does pack nasty punch that'll sneak up on people. I've easily taken down 50 healer sorcs who thought they could just sit and cast in my line of site due to the burst this build can offer. Here's my general ability order 1. Incendiary Missie>Thermal Detonator>Power shot>rail shot>unload (rail shot again if talent procs)>More powershot This should only be used if your stationary and just applying dps. See next rotation if your kiting 2. Incendiary Missie>Thermal Detonator>Rail shot> Rapid Shots When your kiting, rapid shots will apply a snare off your gas cylinder, Along with another dot that'll tick with incendiary missile. count your rapid shots and you've got yourself some nice consistent damage, If you get enough spacing you can throw out your unload and hope you get a railshot proc for more burst, throw out railshot and thermal detonator on CD, Also if your fighting another ranged, use line of site against them, Most all other ranged need to channel/cast against you, you have the advantage of almost all your moves being instant, so abuse line of site like crazy. I've beaten tracer spamming BH's into the ground cause they cannot get a cast off on me while i just dip in and out of LoS applying rapid shots, and rail shot and thermal detonator. P.S. I should also add that i think SWTOR is not kite friendly. It's exceedingly hard to kite and use your abilities at the same time due to how the animation of pointing the guns gets in the way. There seems to be a dead zone where your character cannot fire if your strafing away from he opponent, and he follows you dead center to your character, you cannot shoot or use any abilities, You also cannot jump strafe due to you using speed when doing so, It's taken alot of adjustment to get used to this system, But i think it needs work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noeatnosleep Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 Just don't do pyro at low levels. You need the last half of your tree to have fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndrosX Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 I specced out of Arsenal and went Pyro lke two weeks ago.At first I was having fun because of the improved mobility, then it began to bore me because it didn't feel like I could hit hard enough. Now, it's hard to tell numbers because arena PvP depends on too many factors (premade group in the opp team? all lvl50 in pvp armor? lots of lowbies?), but it did feel like while sustained DPS and DPS in the long run might be about the same, burst dps and 1vs1 Arsenal can deal a lot more damage and a lot faster.The DoT in Pyro is very useful to keep stealthers from going poof in the middle of a fight, the reduced cooldowns on Kolto Overloard, Energy Shield etc are cool too (although they still won't become available twice in a single fight, which would make a big difference).. but that's pretty much it. And as a Pyro, it feels like luck matters because sometimes the proc on combustible gas cylinder will proc often and the one on rail shot too, but sometimes they don't and it's very frustrating to keep an eye on the debuff bar all the time, hoping for rail shot to proc in time to have it refresh combustble cylinder dot. As an Arsenal it feels like the proc is pretty much always active when you need it and you can use the "improved" Unload quite often.Plus, Arsenal is basically the only viable template to get the improved jet boost and rocket punch, which are vital in PvP.. you just can't do without them, because they will save your life quite often by allowing you to push the enemy away or off a ledge, interrupting them and often allowing your pals to come rescue you. I still think Mercenary needs some polishing, but I have to say that Arsenal is a lot more balanced than Pyro at the moment, because Pyro gets a little more mobility than Arsenal (tho they stll have to stop moving for Powershot and Unload) and in theory some more survivability with the reduced cooldown on shields etc, but in my opinion those features don't make up for the lack of pure damage and, most important, the lack of improved Jet Boost and Rocket Punch.Also, nothing beats the ability to consistently throw your enemy in the fire, in the acid pit or off a bridge in the arenas, which is much easier to accomplish as an Arsenal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lightmgl Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 (edited) I specced out of Arsenal and went Pyro lke two weeks ago. At first I was having fun because of the improved mobility, then it began to bore me because it didn't feel like I could hit hard enough. Now, it's hard to tell numbers because arena PvP depends on too many factors (premade group in the opp team? all lvl50 in pvp armor? lots of lowbies?), but it did feel like while sustained DPS and DPS in the long run might be about the same, burst dps and 1vs1 Arsenal can deal a lot more damage and a lot faster. The DoT in Pyro is very useful to keep stealthers from going poof in the middle of a fight, the reduced cooldowns on Kolto Overloard, Energy Shield etc are cool too (although they still won't become available twice in a single fight, which would make a big difference).. but that's pretty much it. And as a Pyro, it feels like luck matters because sometimes the proc on combustible gas cylinder will proc often and the one on rail shot too, but sometimes they don't and it's very frustrating to keep an eye on the debuff bar all the time, hoping for rail shot to proc in time to have it refresh combustble cylinder dot. As an Arsenal it feels like the proc is pretty much always active when you need it and you can use the "improved" Unload quite often. Plus, Arsenal is basically the only viable template to get the improved jet boost and rocket punch, which are vital in PvP.. you just can't do without them, because they will save your life quite often by allowing you to push the enemy away or off a ledge, interrupting them and often allowing your pals to come rescue you. I still think Mercenary needs some polishing, but I have to say that Arsenal is a lot more balanced than Pyro at the moment, because Pyro gets a little more mobility than Arsenal (tho they stll have to stop moving for Powershot and Unload) and in theory some more survivability with the reduced cooldown on shields etc, but in my opinion those features don't make up for the lack of pure damage and, most important, the lack of improved Jet Boost and Rocket Punch. Also, nothing beats the ability to consistently throw your enemy in the fire, in the acid pit or off a bridge in the arenas, which is much easier to accomplish as an Arsenal. I'm with you. Pyro feels so clunky. It is largely damage over time which in PvP isn't all that useful as it is the burst that typically lets you finish someone off before they can get healed or cured, Pyro is very susceptible to having their dots just flat out cured by a smart healer that notices them. It is incredibly RNG with the burst damage it does have as it relies on fixed % chances to proc which sometimes don't pop up when you want them to. Arsenal has burst, knockback (which in turn is our only interrupt) and a bit of damage mitigation too. Its alot less RNG as it relies more on crits for some of it's procs and also works around Armor Penetration which is incredibly effective. I'd love to see Pyrotech getting a skill that makes Power Shot usable while moving. That would create quite the interesting decision between the two specs. Edited January 8, 2012 by Lightmgl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thamightyboro Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 I love pyro in PVP and PVE, it may not quite have the single target dps of arsenal but tbh arsenal bored the living hell out of me. Pyro is great fun and suits my play style to a T highly mobile a good range of AOE only 37 at present but still consistently near the top on medals and dmg numbers in void and ald if your topping them in huttball then your playing it as death match not as huttball. Roll on 38 when I can use my 2 pvp blasters and then 40 when i can get my 40 pvp armor on. My only complaint at present is heat but thats only really an issue because I dont yet have the vent heat skill and muzzle fluting so Power Shot being in rotation (situational) sends my heat soaring. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juicenewtonz Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 Alright, well i've actually given the spec a chance and on my full champ geared merc i LOVE this spec now, while giving up the knockbacks certainly makes it the worse spec in huttball in voidstar / alderaan the dots are absolutely retarded for defending the objectives. The burst damage of this spec should not be scoffed at either, thermal detonator -> power shot -> rail shot will have all 3 of these abilities hit at the exact same time and do a crazy amount of damage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xesorla Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 I tried both, and prefer pyro. I typically run in a group with an arsenal merc also, and we are back and forth for dmg/kills on a consistent basis. I tend to win voidstar, he tends to carry huttball - alderaan is a tossup. Both specs are viable, both specs can burst. We're both fully t1, some t2 - I don't see this changing in t3. Comes down to play-style, imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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