Hey Devs any PVP love coming for Arsenal Mercs?

[Typheran]

As it stands a great Arsenal will never beat a half dead Sorc of a Consular. Shield + Heal = auto win against no interrupts and LOS. If you say that you can consistently win you are not very truthful.

 

Eletro-Dart's timer is too long and it have too long of a activation to be realistically dependable as an interrupt. Surge + Concussion is nice but your still fighting reaction time plus Global cool down and activation time to be practical. Jetblast or talented Rocket punch? Yeah that will interrupt for 1 sec, but the spam will start immediately and you're back in the same boat. Plus when they shield it makes them immune to knock back until you out damage the shield.

 

They can LOS you because you have huge channeling time on your main damage dealing ability (tracer missile).

 

I'm not saying we cant do damage. In huttball a Ars Merc on the ramps can rain a great amount of death down if left unmolested, but in world, Civilwar or attack and defend Merc are seriously lackluster and need some serious Dev love.

 

In General Arsenal Mercs need either an low cool down interuppt/Silence, the ability to still hit a target that you STARTED a channeled ability on regardless of LOS or have other classes Healing force users nerfed). Some people have brought up the ability to channel and move, but I think that would be too OP.

 

Personally I'd like to be able to knock back through a shield even though I still have to out damage the shield to injure the player.

 

On a side note Merc really need some sort of movement ability. a rocket jump of something similar. It is sad that although I have a jetpack the only time I use it is DFA or resupply and reload.

 

Do Dev's even post on non patch related topics?

Edited January 6, 2012 by Typheran

[Juicenewtonz]

We are completely fine

[Yazule]

while we are not gimped by any means, dps is only a small part of pvp games, we could use just a little more functionality imo, personally i think a jet pack jump would do it nicely, say 15' vertical or horizontal leap

 

would make us more BHish too.

 

but the OP's idea is not too bad either, we dont need buckets full of love but in pvp games we are definitely below average functionality

[Rimbaldo]

On the PvP forum a lot of people are claiming that Tracer Missile will be getting a cooldown attached to it soon. Really hope that's not true, I'll lol hard if it is though. Edited January 6, 2012 by Rimbaldo

[Taggardwarf]

They're not going to add a cooldown to tracer missile, that makes no sense. Its our primary ability meant to replace Power Shot and essential to raid DPS rotations.

[fujeo-finel]

It's fine L2P.

[Rimbaldo]

It's fine L2P.

 

Hit 50 and get your Champion set, then come back and let us know how Arsenal's working out for you once all the geared melee on your server figure out you're a free kill.

Edited January 6, 2012 by Rimbaldo

[Yazule]

On the PvP forum a lot of people are claiming that Tracer Missile will be getting a cooldown attached to it soon. Really hope that's not true, I'll lol hard if it is though.

 

I am all for insta cast with a cooldown equal to the current chanel time, that would rock socks, adding mobility without affecting dps at all.

 

as for the "we are fine" we are below average but not bad, as for "free kill" I am not a free kill 1v1, or 2v2 with tank or healer but i am below 50% by a little i would bet in k/d ratio. Not a lot, but a little.

 

the truth is we do not shine in 50 pvp and we do not suck badly, we are just kind of meh.

[Rimbaldo]

I am all for insta cast with a cooldown equal to the current chanel time, that would rock socks, adding mobility without affecting dps at all.

 

as for the "we are fine" we are below average but not bad, as for "free kill" I am not a free kill 1v1, or 2v2 with tank or healer but i am below 50% by a little i would bet in k/d ratio. Not a lot, but a little.

 

the truth is we do not shine in 50 pvp and we do not suck badly, we are just kind of meh.

 

There's no talk of making it instant, just giving it a cooldown. And... well, yeah, everybody should do decently with a pocket healer if they're fighting other people who don't have one. Fact is, though, we're very much outclassed by melee at 50 once they get their gear. At best we can stun them with Electrodart and try to run to teammates for help, because if you try to kite a melee in this game they'll end up catching you and murdering you in short order. Our only decent snare being a longish channel doesn't lend itself well to 1v1 situations and we're the most easily interrupted class in the entire game, in addition to being one of the least mobile. Sniper is worse off in that department, but they get a pretty beefy damage reduction while in cover to make up for it... as well as ROOTS. If you ask me, Jet Boost ought to be a root instead of a snare.

 

Here's how 1v1 PvP will play out for a Mercenary once he starts fighting geared melee at 50:

 

Merc: *attack Marauder*

Marauder: *charge*

Merc: *stun, try to run away*

Marauder: *trinket*

Merc: *knockback, try to run away*

Marauder: *vanish*

Merc: *scan while running away*

Marauder: *force choke*

Merc: *trinket*

Marauder: *Force Charge is now off cooldown again, Jet Boost still has 5 seconds.. charge*

Marauder: *pop damage immunity cooldown*

Merc: *gets murdered*

 

Merc: *sees Juggernaut, realizes it's hopeless and runs the other way*

Juggernaut: lolnope *charge*

Juggernaut: *force choke*

Merc: *trinket, knockback, Unload*

Juggernaut: *waddles through, losing 1% of his HP*

Merc: *Tracer Missile, Tracer Missile, Heatseeker Missiles*

Juggernaut: *95% HP*

Merc: *tries to run again*

Juggernaut: lolnope *charge*

Merc: *murdered since Juggernauts only do slightly less damage than Marauders for some reason*

 

Assassin: *comes out of stealth, backstab stun*

Merc: *trinket, knockback, stun*

Assassin: *trinket, Force Pull*

Merc: NONONO-*Rocket Punch*

Assassin: *gets knocked back two feet, continues stabbing merc in the face*

Merc: *gets murdered*

 

Operative: *stealth opener*

Merc: *25% HP, laying on his back* OH FOR FU-

Operative: *stun*

Merc: *gets murdered*

Edited January 6, 2012 by Rimbaldo

[Daecollo]

Adding a Cooldown to tracer missile is fine as long as they make it instant cast.

 

It should be the same as the Juggs/Knights Armorbreak then.

 

 

4.5 Second cooldown, instant cast.

Edited January 6, 2012 by Daecollo

[Ripfang]

No No No No...Please do not suggest balancing this game around PvP!

 

All of these people that are complaining about PvP balance need to do the following...

 

1) All long onto the test server

2) Take off all of thier gear

3) Agree to zero out thier talents

4) 1 vs. 1 duel for hours and hours

5) Data crunch the numbers (I know I know...No Combat Log)

6) Then...keep your conclusions to yourselves

 

The rest of us will simply be having fun...and allowing BW to do their job.

[Taurenizer]

They're not going to add a cooldown to tracer missile, that makes no sense. Its our primary ability meant to replace Power Shot and essential to raid DPS rotations.

 

Doesn't completely replace power shot. If your tracer missile is interrupted you can switch from tracer missile spam to power shot spam while tracer comes back up

 

 

Also try not to rely solely on tracer missile or power shot spam, you have other abilities that make you quite powerful in pvp ...

 

http://i.imgur.com/IwII4.jpg

Edited January 7, 2012 by Taurenizer

[Typheran]

We are completely fine

 

I can tell the people that dont pvp at 50 with Champ gear.

[Borigrade]

We are completely fine

 

Mercs are the worst 1v1 in the game, we can't even solo kill a healer (lol interrupt) Tanks shred us cause well lol 5 second ramp us. Sniper's can literally tank us in cover and read Rimbaldo's post for against melee.

 

Were good in Huttball cause of the ramps, and good in voidstar cause of the AoE, were actually pretty mediocre in Civil War. Where there is no advantage for range heroes.

 

Ironically enough were the second best class at killing Sorcs and Sages.

Edited January 7, 2012 by Borigrade

[Taurenizer]

Mercs are the worst 1v1 in the game, we can't even solo kill a healer (lol interrupt) Tanks shred us cause well lol 5 second ramp us. Sniper's can literally tank us in cover and read Rimbaldo's post for against melee.

 

Were good in Huttball cause of the ramps, and good in voidstar cause of the AoE, were actually pretty mediocre in Civil War. Where there is no advantage for range heroes.

 

Ironically enough were the second best class at killing Sorcs and Sages.

 

I have, nor have i had any of these problems ever. 1v1 only operatives sometimes get close to beating me.

[Juicenewtonz]

I can tell the people that dont pvp at 50 with Champ gear.

 

My merc is full champion gear bar 4 pieces and 2 of those pieces are centurion pieces (im lucky with bags), i could post a screenshot if its really necessary but i dont feel like going to my other computer just to prove some crybaby wrong.

 

Class is fine, you suck, get better.

[Lightmgl]

My merc is full champion gear bar 4 pieces and 2 of those pieces are centurion pieces (im lucky with bags), i could post a screenshot if its really necessary but i dont feel like going to my other computer just to prove some crybaby wrong.

 

Class is fine, you suck, get better.

 

I dunno if its the server and who we're playing but I do just fine as a Merc with about 6% Expertise (I've been unlucky) and the rest full Tier 2 PVE gear (2pc bonus MMMMMMMMMMM). You need support, get a guard on you, stay with a healer, make sure people know to knock the marauders off you.

 

1V1 we definitely have a hard time vs people who know how to interrupt. Don't be bad and keep Power Shot on your bar in case your Tracer gets kicked.

 

I feel like our lack of an interrupt probably hurts us the most PVP wise. I don't think anyone except the Snipers really have a right to complain about anything atm. If anyone gets on them they are hopeless and by the time they get into Cover their target is usually dead if you are focus firing like you should be.

 

3 Tracers, Dart, Heatseeker, Rail Shot

or

3 Tracer, Dart, Unload, Rail Shot

 

Its also hilarious if a clump of players lets you get off Dart + Fusion + Death From Above. You can AoE down an entire group of players if they stand in it and don't stop you.

Edited January 7, 2012 by Lightmgl

[Albinosmurf]

There's no talk of making it instant, just giving it a cooldown. And... well, yeah, everybody should do decently with a pocket healer if they're fighting other people who don't have one. Fact is, though, we're very much outclassed by melee at 50 once they get their gear. At best we can stun them with Electrodart and try to run to teammates for help, because if you try to kite a melee in this game they'll end up catching you and murdering you in short order. Our only decent snare being a longish channel doesn't lend itself well to 1v1 situations and we're the most easily interrupted class in the entire game, in addition to being one of the least mobile. Sniper is worse off in that department, but they get a pretty beefy damage reduction while in cover to make up for it... as well as ROOTS. If you ask me, Jet Boost ought to be a root instead of a snare.

 

Here's how 1v1 PvP will play out for a Mercenary once he starts fighting geared melee at 50:

 

Merc: *attack Marauder*

Marauder: *charge*

Merc: *stun, try to run away*

Marauder: *trinket*

Merc: *knockback, try to run away*

Marauder: *vanish*

Merc: *scan while running away*

Marauder: *force choke*

Merc: *trinket*

Marauder: *Force Charge is now off cooldown again, Jet Boost still has 5 seconds.. charge*

Marauder: *pop damage immunity cooldown*

Merc: *gets murdered*

 

Merc: *sees Juggernaut, realizes it's hopeless and runs the other way*

Juggernaut: lolnope *charge*

Juggernaut: *force choke*

Merc: *trinket, knockback, Unload*

Juggernaut: *waddles through, losing 1% of his HP*

Merc: *Tracer Missile, Tracer Missile, Heatseeker Missiles*

Juggernaut: *95% HP*

Merc: *tries to run again*

Juggernaut: lolnope *charge*

Merc: *murdered since Juggernauts only do slightly less damage than Marauders for some reason*

 

Assassin: *comes out of stealth, backstab stun*

Merc: *trinket, knockback, stun*

Assassin: *trinket, Force Pull*

Merc: NONONO-*Rocket Punch*

Assassin: *gets knocked back two feet, continues stabbing merc in the face*

Merc: *gets murdered*

 

Operative: *stealth opener*

Merc: *25% HP, laying on his back* OH FOR FU-

Operative: *stun*

Merc: *gets murdered*

 

Boy with that explanation you seem like a god among men in pvp. My only question is are you intentionally making us sound worse than we are. Or are you just forgetting about concussion missle. It stops the getting murdered part in every single scenario.

[-Fenix]

I think the people in here complaining are just gear grinders and don't actually know how to PVP. They hoped gear would make their PVP easy mode.

[Daecollo]

Please nerf Bounty Hunters so my Tank has nothing to stop him please, They are too hard to interrupt and I cannot kill them, so please nerf them all please, that way nobody can stop me.

 

 

 

 

^

 

Pretty much every single post.

[blackbeaver]

Only thing I would add to merc in PVP is ability to knock-down player with rocket like in normal PVE as interrupt, rest is ok and depends on luck (i.e. you winning 1v 1 with sorc or asssasin and then come rest of his team when your is playing chess).

[Werdan]

Hit 50 and get your Champion set, then come back and let us know how Arsenal's working out for you once all the geared melee on your server figure out you're a free kill.

 

I hit 50, have all but my main hand Champ weapon, am also Valor 60, and I am nowhere near a "free kill". Then again I'm a hybrid spec so I'm not exactly as squishy as full Arsenal/Pyro spec Mercs. Mercs are fine IMO. We have a few outstanding issues leftover from beta, but nothing that seriously gimps the class.

[Rimbaldo]

Boy with that explanation you seem like a god among men in pvp. My only question is are you intentionally making us sound worse than we are. Or are you just forgetting about concussion missle. It stops the getting murdered part in every single scenario.

 

Yeah, because using Concussion Missile and running away from every fight means our class is good at PvP. It's pretty much interchangeable with Electrodart in the examples I used since either one of them will max out their resolve bar for the remainder of the fight.

[LarkBenson]

This all just comes down to rock paper scissors. If melee get the jump on you, they SHOULD beat you. If you get the jump on them or have the high ground, you SHOULD beat them. It's as simple as that. The penalty for being a class that can blow people up from distance is that it needs to be weak against players that can close the gap. Honestly how do people not understand this? The only problems mercs have are small ones like the lack of an interupt. And if you feel like being able to tangle with melee is most important to you then go spec pyro and learn to kite them.

[Gadrak]

This all just comes down to rock paper scissors. If melee get the jump on you, they SHOULD beat you. If you get the jump on them or have the high ground, you SHOULD beat them. It's as simple as that. The penalty for being a class that can blow people up from distance is that it needs to be weak against players that can close the gap. Honestly how do people not understand this? The only problems mercs have are small ones like the lack of an interupt. And if you feel like being able to tangle with melee is most important to you then go spec pyro and learn to kite them.

 

what if the melee is always on you?

 

Merc can deliver a good amount of damage if the enemy ignores you,but currently all the melee classes have more options to catch us in close combats then us to mantain distances

 

before starting with the same story "oh but we have 2 knockdowns a stun a snare and an incapacitate",think about that,only 2 of our CCs are useful and 1 when combined with another ability,the other 2 are worthless or VERY situational

 

Jet boost:excellent knockback low CD if you are arsenal and applies a snare effect

 

Electro darth: our primary stun very good and with 1 Min of CD

 

rocket punch:useful only to kick an enemy off a ledge on huttbal,it's only 4m knockbacks,and the melee range is...guess what?4m!!!

 

concussion missile:2 seconds cast time is too long,and is absolutely impossible to land this shot on someone who is near you,you are going to get interrupted and killed,the only good application for this ability is by using it combined with power surge

 

Pinning fire:completely idiotic snare 2 second snare for an ability that requires you to stand still channeling,worst waste on 2 talent points EVER.

 

now let's take a look at the gap closers of the melee units

 

Juggernaut

 

this is the only melee class that we can fight due to the non extreme damage and their only gap closer wich is force leap.

 

Marauder

 

Extreme amount of damage,a good marauder is never going to approach you with the force leap since he knows that you have to stand still to attack,and even if you can pull it off he can just stealth himself or use the sprint to return at Close combat

 

Sith assassin

 

Another dps monster with 3 gap closers,Sprint,Stealth and force pull,completely impossible to take him off you and even if i can the time im able to land 2 tracer missiles he is back on me and can easily interrupt me and kill me with ease

 

Operative

well they can kill me in a single stun,the time i trinket they vanish sap stun and kill me

 

powertech

Nearly our same damage,1 very effective gap closer and if he is specced ST with 2 gap closers,godly damage mitigation,the time that i require to drain 40% of his HP im dead

 

in the end,im level 50 with full champion gear,when im backed up by my guild i can became someway useful due to the good damage,but that's it.

 

we are good group class but we are an ATROCIOUS 1v1 class

Edited January 7, 2012 by Gadrak