Every group is full of greedy ninja companion looters.

[Reddum]

Don't assume you're in any place to lecture me on MMOs. I played Galaxies for years, ran a guild and did just as much to support my groups and my friends there as I do here.

 

Companions work differently in this game than any other game. You *cannot* progress in this game on your solo quests without your companion. And depending on your specs, you may very well need a companion dishing out a lot of damage or being an effective tank, and that requires the right level of gear. I realize some professions don't need a tank as much, Sith Sorcerers for example can function pretty well alone if they're spec'd properly. My character doesn't play that way, so my companions gear to me is 100% equally vital as my own.

 

I'm sorry if you don't see the logic behind that, but the fact that you don't see things the same way I do doesn't make me wrong.

 

Quest Rewards / Commendations / Crafting is enough for companions. As a Healer with a Tank pet I actually went more than 10 levels without upgrading his gear and he was fine, I still could defeat champions alone. You should only need on that gear when everyone else greeded or passed and they said "it's okay to do it".

[OdonKnight]

I need mako to have better armor... its just that simple. BW sets the rules of the game... and the button has none of your rules applied to it.

 

So - applying the real world definitions of need and greed to the buttons marked need and greed is "imposing my rules".

 

You needing for anyone under the sun - your PERSONAL definition of the word need - removes the very meanings of having a need and greed button with those words on them. By your definition button A should be A and button B be B since the words on them have no meaning.

 

You needing for an alt or alts companion or four friend or guildmate is the same as me hitting need on the loot you want then dropping the item on the ground because I NEED to ruin your experience.

Edited January 5, 2012 by OdonKnight

[Saurakk]

Again, you ignoring me is of the most trivial of all consequences, and I'll laugh about it long before I care.

 

It would be one thing if you're carrying my weight in the flash point, but I play just as pivotal of a role as you do. That means I have every right to select Need on something I genuinely feel I need. I did just as much to earn that piece of loot as you did, and that's just fact. I often tank, pull mobs off of lower level players, even sometimes sacrifice myself for the healer. I do everything I can to pull my weight and get the group through. That means I equally deserve any loot that I can make use of, whatever that use may be.

 

Again, simply state your little personal looting strategy before every PUG and see how much they want to help you equip your pet at their expense.

 

If you are so secure in your stance being right, you would have no problem being clear up front about it.

 

And ignoring you is trivial...only takes the click of a few keys, thank god.

[Zakumene]

This is like every other MMO feature - if the feature is available and beneficial to you, use it. If it's not intended to be used that way it'll get fixed.

 

I will roll need on anything myself, and ANY of my companions can use (even that dumb tank one that I NEVER use). Oh, unless I'm running with my guild in which case by the 3rd time we've done the same flashpoint no one else will need the gear and I'll have it all then.....

 

Yea, not really a big problem here...

[OdonKnight]

This is like every other MMO feature - if the feature is available and beneficial to you, use it. If it's not intended to be used that way it'll get fixed.

 

I will roll need on anything myself, and ANY of my companions can use (even that dumb tank one that I NEVER use). Oh, unless I'm running with my guild in which case by the 3rd time we've done the same flashpoint no one else will need the gear and I'll have it all then.....

 

Yea, not really a big problem here...

 

the very definition of being a ninja.

a) when pugging you need if you decide upon some arbitrary basis you need it by some make-believe definition of need (you want to drop it, sell it, stare at it)

b) when with guildies you dont do the above but wait till your 3rd or so iteration and by then those that NEED the stuff have it - thus enabling you to get it for companions.

 

how about you be a decent person and apply B scenario to pugs. No, that might make you work harder - we can't have that now can we.

[Racheakt]

Wow, some people in here are ignorant as heck.

 

Personally I only roll need on items for my companions if no one else in the group needs it (Reality check; this happens quite a bit) so I'm able to keep my companion geared up through hand-me-downs and quest rewards with a few flashpoint items mixed in.

 

This assures that the flashpoint goes smoothly and that it will get done faster (Party member upgrading an item = more dps/heals/survivability = faster run) Some logical sense there right?

 

But no, people like Eldren seem to think that needing on an item to help better their companions will be better for them in the long-run. (Another reality check) It won't, guarantee in a few levels you will find a better piece of gear for your companion that you can put in there without having to worry about loot drama, sure the argument can be said that so will that other party member in the flashpoint, but who are we to know?

 

Stop being selfish greedy turds just because you want your companion to last a second longer, or do a few points extra damage. What will be more gratifying those few extra numbers of damage or the fact of knowing that you were the nice guy and didn't make several groups fall apart because of your selfishness?

 

Implement a Companion Roll between Need and Greed so that Eldren can click that for every piece of loot that drops and the people that ACTUALLY need them will roll need and get them.

 

Party Members > Your Companion

 

/end thread.

 

 

I'm kinda like this guy, in a 4 man group, roll need for yourself. You don't need roll for alts, why roll for someone not in the party?

 

I ran an instance with someone who had their companion out, i had no issue with him rolling need

 

Me I ask if I can need for my companion, like one should in polite society.

[profaneascension]

I'm honestly surprised to see the number of slimeballs here that are willing to perform all kinds of moral gymanstics to twist the definition of need to suit their purposes. Whatever happened to the concept of sharing? If you are so concerned about your performance in a solo situation (the "majority of the time" as one poster put it) that you would consider the needs of your companion to be greater than that of another player, what business do you have participating in group content?

 

Maybe it's because I've been progression-raiding for too long, and the concept of gearing up the player that needs the equipment most is too ingrained in my mind. Maybe it's because I'm someone who would yield a piece of gear to another person if I've already won something from a previous boss. Either way, this me-first attitude perpetuated by the current generation makes me sick to my stomach. But I have no doubt that most of you advocating rolling need for companions are simply trolling. If not, that's great; just let me know who you are and which server you play on, so I won't have to suffer your latching on to my groups like a parasite.

[Vialator]

but as there is no LFG, this cant be happening.....

 

you know that "community" which results from chat spam grouping where everyone gets along, becomes best friends in groups and nothing like this can possibly happen....

 

 

 

oh yeah, and LOL.

 

What were BW saying about the players should create the community again? hmmm?

 

So bloody true!

all the anti lfg idiots are getting the issues regardless

[Alianiren]

happens to me all the time they all need my TANKING GEAR !! and this makes me wanna do it to other people but I just cant do it.

[EdratLightindark]

If you didnt get the winning roll for the loot try again. Its that simple. Im amazed at the amount of whiners in this game. Honestly, the whole need/greed system is crap. It should be a random roll for everybody in the group. Whoever wins gets it, plain and simple. The game I was playing for the last few years was this way. Loot dropped off every boss and it was a random roll (if the loot table was on random, which it was 99% of the time). If you didnt get the loot on that run, try again. I made MANY runs until I got what i wanted. If the loot was class specific and the person that looted it couldnt use he had the option to give/sell it away (provided it wasnt no-trade. Which around 40% of it was). To those that cant get over this you have serious problems. Try again the next day. You arent always going to win the rolls........

[Iscarias]

I think the Diablo III system has it worked out. Separate drops for everyone in the group....no rolling, ninja behavior.....everyone gets something from the work put in.

[Zakumene]

the very definition of being a ninja.

a) when pugging you need if you decide upon some arbitrary basis you need it by some make-believe definition of need (you want to drop it, sell it, stare at it)

b) when with guildies you dont do the above but wait till your 3rd or so iteration and by then those that NEED the stuff have it - thus enabling you to get it for companions.

 

how about you be a decent person and apply B scenario to pugs. No, that might make you work harder - we can't have that now can we.

 

Because I am an evil bounty hunter and I enjoy stealing from you. Don't ruin my immersion bro.

 

Also it goes against my personal philosophy - "ME FIRST, and then back in line."

Edited January 5, 2012 by Zakumene

[LogicalPremise]

I'm honestly surprised to see the number of slimeballs here that are willing to perform all kinds of moral gymanstics to twist the definition of need to suit their purposes. Whatever happened to the concept of sharing? If you are so concerned about your performance in a solo situation (the "majority of the time" as one poster put it) that you would consider the needs of your companion to be greater than that of another player, what business do you have participating in group content?

 

Maybe it's because I've been progression-raiding for too long, and the concept of gearing up the player that needs the equipment most is too ingrained in my mind. Maybe it's because I'm someone who would yield a piece of gear to another person if I've already won something from a previous boss. Either way, this me-first attitude perpetuated by the current generation makes me sick to my stomach. But I have no doubt that most of you advocating rolling need for companions are simply trolling. If not, that's great; just let me know who you are and which server you play on, so I won't have to suffer your latching on to my groups like a parasite.

 

I don't think it's just you. I came from STO , which is the very same sort of "mostly single player" experience as we have here in TOR. Yet you never, ever , EVER saw anybody post anything like this.

 

I think a better way to look at this is not a generational issue. These are people who, quite frankly, have serious problems comprehending social situations and understanding what is expected in a social MMO context. I am extremely hesitant to suggest these people have mental issues of any kind, but their responses are so ... skewed to the norm and yet at the same time so internally consistant that I don't know what else it could be.

 

It's almost identical to a young child who doesn't understand why he or she is expected to share with others. There's simply no context in that child's mind as to why "others" and "self" can't be put in different boxes and be just as valid. These people think it's perfectly fine for them to equate an NPC character to a person, even if that NPC character doesn't contribute to the FP in question , based on the concept that the NPC is "part" of their PC.

 

Yet the reject the argument that in the FP the other PC's are part of their PC. They reject sociality, they reject grouping , they reject being stigmatized and ignored, and claim they don't care. Perhaps they are telling the truth.

 

In any case, it's best to ignore these people and just have fun with the game. That there are ninja-looters is nothing new. That they are really lonely people who pay more attention to a pile of bits than meeting new people and making friends is .. well, sad and depressing, actually. But I don't pay Bioware to help people get over their social avoidance disorder. I pay to kill things in the face.

[TumblerSW]

I think it's fine to roll need on anything and everything. Even if you companion can't use it everyone still likes picking up loot. You can sell it for credits if nothing else.

 

Talk to the group before you go in if you want people to only need what they can use. In my case just explaining it was all I needed. I don't mind hitting greed if someone asks everyone to only hit need on things you can use. If no one mentions is I'm just needing everything.

[SingleCoilPickup]

There is not a single instance of non Heroic or non FP content in this game that can't be accomplished by a companion in level-equivilent greens.

 

Not. One. Period.

 

The hilarious thing is, if you join a group, you would never bother to announce what you plan to do. You'll just ninja loot and tell yourself that you have just as much right as everyone else does.

 

What truly infuriates, of course, is the smug arrogance of your tone. How dare we presume that , simply because you (who, quite frankly, if you're so up on your companion, probably didn't even pull your weight in the FP) were present, you have the right to roll need for your companion, your alt, your alts companions, your friend, your friends companion, you friends alts companion, etc etc etc.

 

The reason people are putting you on ignore is that you are acting like an anti-social entitled snob, and fail to grasp how that rubs people. I'm happy you don't care about going on ignore because as least I won't have to hear any more sanctimonious drivel about how this is a new type of MMO.

 

Pause for sustained, hollow laughter.

 

So you've played every class in the game as well as every possible combination of skill specs?

 

If the answer to that question is no, then you are incorrect.

 

Further, I absolutely don't act anti-social or entitled. If that were the case, I'd mindlessly select need on everything while barely contributing anything to the group. Again, I put keeping my group mates alive above everything else when I'm grouped. I do anything I have to do to that end, and if something isn't something that I feel I genuinely need, I pass.

 

Not one single time has any group I've ever played with gotten upset or in any way voiced any concern over my actions in the group. And I'm in groups a lot, so I daresay that people like you are very much the vocal minority in this case, and being that I've never gotten anything but praise and thanks in a group, I'm quite confident I don't need to change anything about the way I play. Nobody has ever put me on ignore, I was only voicing that it's a very hollow, meaningless threat that many of you are slinging around in this thread.

[Darth_Gao_Gao]

i roll need because i need credits.

[Kelst]

I only really roll need on orange gear myself, (if I can even use it) I really like how I can customize my appearance this way and not look like a clown that flunked out of make up school

[anwar]

Actually....why even have "bind on pick-up"?

 

So far I've seen two folks roll need on the wrong gear and both were genuinely sorry and tried to give it up. Both cases were correct armor weight but wrong stats (I've only done esseles, but have done it on 3 chars, so these were both first-timers). Niether could even use the stuff on their pet, so it ended up being almost junk.

 

Those group things get very hectic because for some reason everyone treats them as a race and rushed people who have only been soloing at their own pace make mistakes.

[Pandemonic]

I think it's fine to roll need on anything and everything. Even if you companion can't use it everyone still likes picking up loot. You can sell it for credits if nothing else.

 

Talk to the group before you go in if you want people to only need what they can use. In my case just explaining it was all I needed. I don't mind hitting greed if someone asks everyone to only hit need on things you can use. If no one mentions is I'm just needing everything.

 

That is completely wrong. You shouldn't have to ask. Need is for things you can use, always. It's people like this that are making me worry about the future of this game. Warcraft has ingrained SO much anti-social and just general bad MMO behavior into so many people that they just don't know any better. Need is for things that are useful to your character, not your pet or your friends or to sell for money.

Edited January 5, 2012 by Pandemonic

[OdonKnight]

So you've played every class in the game as well as every possible combination of skill specs?

 

If the answer to that question is no, then you are incorrect.

 

Further, I absolutely don't act anti-social or entitled. If that were the case, I'd mindlessly select need on everything while barely contributing anything to the group. Again, I put keeping my group mates alive above everything else when I'm grouped. I do anything I have to do to that end, and if something isn't something that I feel I genuinely need, I pass.

 

Not one single time has any group I've ever played with gotten upset or in any way voiced any concern over my actions in the group. And I'm in groups a lot, so I daresay that people like you are very much the vocal minority in this case, and being that I've never gotten anything but praise and thanks in a group, I'm quite confident I don't need to change anything about the way I play. Nobody has ever put me on ignore, I was only voicing that it's a very hollow, meaningless threat that many of you are slinging around in this thread.

 

How hard is the concept? You deciding to not hit need every-time is like a criminal not choosing to perform all his crimes out in broad daylight. Hint: tends to help the % chance of getting caught/called-out. You hitting need is a sense of entitlement! Why you ask? You hitting need for someone who isn't there or for any other person/reason/excuse/cop-out is a sense of entitlement that you have some sort of power to change the meaning of the word need simply because the game allows you to click it.

 

The game allows me to move in and empty that chest after you engage the guards. I NEED the contents for my companion I say. I NEED the contents for my personal self-worth.

 

The game mechanics allow me to kill you and camp you over and over and over and over. I NEED to do this. If the game mechanics allow it it must be OK.

[elvinu]

i roll need because i need credits.

 

you fail bro

 

my solution: remove pets completely or remove the ability to "dress" them because they are useless in raids pvp/pve anyway

[SingleCoilPickup]

How hard is the concept? You deciding to not hit need every-time is like a criminal not choosing to perform all his crimes out in broad daylight. Hint: tends to help the % chance of getting caught/called-out. You hitting need is a sense of entitlement! Why you ask? You hitting need for someone who isn't there or for any other person/reason/excuse/cop-out is a sense of entitlement that you have some sort of power to change the meaning of the word need simply because the game allows you to click it.

 

The game allows me to move in and empty that chest after you engage the guards. I NEED the contents for my companion I say. I NEED the contents for my personal self-worth.

 

The game mechanics allow me to kill you and camp you over and over and over and over. I NEED to do this. If the game mechanics allow it it must be OK.

 

Frankly, though you say it sarcastically, that's pretty much reality.

 

I don't need your permission to select Need. I don't need anyone's permission. I fought just as hard for the group as you did, and am entitled to the loot the same as you are. It's not ninja looting, I didn't swipe it before you could get to it. You still have equal chances to me as obtaining the loot. In fact, if you actually said something like "I really need that" I'd probably give it to you.

 

Fact is, not once has anyone ever complained about when/how I choose to select Need. This seems to be a problem that really only exists in a vocal minority of this forum. Me selecting Need when it's something I genuinely feel I need, regardless of reason, is no more or less valid than you hitting Need on something you genuinely feel you need, regardless of reason.

 

I've never left a flashpoint with someone angry at me for my looting actions, and if someone did "call me out" I'd discuss it with them just like I'm discussing it with you. But I have every right to try to obtain something if I feel I need it. This concept that's floating around that it's somehow morally wrong is really just absurd and childish.

[BCasey]

I only got to page 3 and I cant believe how many tools will need for a companion.

 

Insta kick from me if anyone does it. If everyone greeds an item, go ahead but if you take a piece of loot from someone for ur companion your a piece of trash.

 

a companion isnt an extension of you, it s a helper so you can solo some content while leveling up. You get upgraded gear from quests for all your companions so you dont need flash point drops.

 

You especially dont need gear for EVERY companion. You use one and only one. If you use different companions for different situations, or can't do some content because ur companion doesnt have good enough gear, you simply suck at this game.... SUCK! I've leveled at a healer since level 10 and NEVER had an issue with ANY companion and I only upgrade them with quest reward gear.

 

So to anyone that NEEDS gear for your companion because its a part of your character you suck at this game and dont have a hope in hell of getting into end game, be good at a pvp or even keep running flashpoints.

 

clowns

[Democratus]

There's a lot of talk here about the meaning of the word "need".

 

Nobody needs any one specific piece of equipment. Nothing in this game is that desperate. The game will still go on if they don't get it.

 

All the "need" button reflects is the desire of a player to acquire something. And different people desire stuff for different reasons.

Edited January 5, 2012 by Democratus

[ginfest]

Frankly, though you say it sarcastically, that's pretty much reality.

 

I don't need your permission to select Need. I don't need anyone's permission. I fought just as hard for the group as you did, and am entitled to the loot the same as you are. It's not ninja looting, I didn't swipe it before you could get to it. You still have equal chances to me as obtaining the loot. In fact, if you actually said something like "I really need that" I'd probably give it to you.

 

Fact is, not once has anyone ever complained about when/how I choose to select Need. This seems to be a problem that really only exists in a vocal minority of this forum. Me selecting Need when it's something I genuinely feel I need, regardless of reason, is no more or less valid than you hitting Need on something you genuinely feel you need, regardless of reason.

 

I've never left a flashpoint with someone angry at me for my looting actions, and if someone did "call me out" I'd discuss it with them just like I'm discussing it with you. But I have every right to try to obtain something if I feel I need it. This concept that's floating around that it's somehow morally wrong is really just absurd and childish.

 

^^^ Couldn't have said it better.