Hahaha. @Bioware: We told ya. You didn't listen. This is what happens when you ignore the fanbase. You've become a fallen angel, going from masterpieces like BG2 to this... how does it feel at your personal all time low? Time to get back to the roots, buddies. @Every other gaming company: Make a deal with EA, and you die. I hope you're taking notes, this is the prime example. Peace, I'm out. Have been for 5 months, actually. Just had to get back to say this. Sorry to all the players that still play here, don't take this personally.

I am sorry, but it is a sign of weakness. BW has had the chance to compete with WoW, the time was right. People are bored with WoW, they wanted to test something new, SW had the potential of being that "something new" and they blew it. What I've watched in the past couple of months is an utter failure to commit quality gameplay. And what I've also seen is one of the most ridiculous cover-ups in MMO history, that I have seen for myself. I've heard about Aion and other games, however this is the first time I witness first-hand how developers blindly ignore just how much their game sucks. But then, I shouldn't be surprised. With ME3 BW has proven they are not the same company anymore that released things like BG2, KotOR, Jade Empire and other jewels of RPG games. I've been such a blind supporter of BW, I would almost have bought anything just because it has Bioware labelled onto it. Not anymore. I am going with my smarter decision and avoid Bioware games, since they have the EA label on them. Apparently EA still has the talent to turn anything into crap they can get their dirty little fingers on.

Hi. Warum weint ihr alle? Habt ihr noch nie ein MMO gespielt? Ist es nicht bekannt, das man seine Spielweise zwischendurch einfach mal ändern muss, um auf Patches zu reagieren? Sorry, du weinst da über nen Nerf von einem Spell rum, gibst irgendwelche dummen Verbesserungsvorschläge, die du dir grad ausm Arsch gezogen hast und man merkt nach 5 Minuten Patchlektüre, das du die Patchnotes nicht verstanden hast. Naja, egal, im Gegensatz zu dir hab ich mein Spiel wirklich gekündigt. HF QQing

I agree with you, mate. In WoW tab targetting was so much more precise. I could actually aim at a ball of mobs and pretty much aim exactly at the mob I wanted to have and one tab later, I had my target. I really prefer to be able to aim with my char in addition to the range feature (which also comes into effect in WoW as a secondary priority after the aiming).

Lustiger Thread mit vielen lustigen Beiträgen. Schade, das hier nur mit "Meinungen" um sich geschmissen wird und der Thread fast zwangsläufig in Bedeutungslosigkeit endet. Aber ist ja auch ein netter Zeitvertreib.

Witzig... ihr beschwert euch über den Ladebalken aber offensichtlich guckt keiner von euch auf die HDD LED ODER die Blinklichter von eurem Router... Ich hab eine SSD und wenn sie mal benutzt wird, blinkt sie kurz auf und gibt Ruhe. Das einzige, was das Laden verzögert ist irgendeine ********kommunikation zwischen euch und dem SWTOR Server, weil eure Router ziemllich busy sind ab 30%. Es sind nicht eure Festplatten, es sind nicht eure Rechner. Es ist eure Internetverbindung. Ich hab mich auch schon gefragt, ob Bioware da die map jedesmal neu runterladen lässt, aber... wer weiß. Ich muss nämlich auch 10s oder so warten, bis whatever geladen ist. Dafür hab ich mir ne SSD nicht geholt. Aber es ist ja völlig latte, weil ich bezweifle, das Bioware dieses Problem mit Priorität angehen wird/kann.

I don't know how long I subbed and I'm too lazy to look it up! But I'll tell ya what keeps me in an mmo: People. If I get a lonely feeling in an mmo, I'll quit. So it depends on other people's subs and the game design. Take the imperial fleet... at prime time, I turn around the corner and see people, great! 5 mins after 11, I see a long, empty hall with NPCs on their automated routes (if they move at all). Not good.

What I can't believe is the amount of trolling on the internet. Well, either that or just how stupid some people are on the internet. I'm still trying to decide...

All of the problems you described can be explained by humans being ******es. Which is - as far as MMOs and the internet in general goes - how people are on the internet. People misinterpret DPS Meters because they are too lazy to think about why the numbers are, what they are or what they represent. The community is destroyed because they are ******es about it. And honestly, look at the forums, people are complaining about class balance already. You don't need a DPS Meter for that. Dieing to a stunning agent is enough of a DPS Meter for the whiners. None of the problems above (People misinterpreting performance, being ******es about it and then whining about themselves not being strong enough/others being too strong) can be solved by ignoring numbers and praying that we never get to see them.

Xcore, you da man. You have brought something to the attention of the powers that be that I have always had a hard time explaining to the average joe. They kept mistaking my rants for "fps problems" or "internet lag", when in fact I usually play at 30-50ms on any game and just like everyone else am completely able to tell the difference between the lightning fast combat pace of WoW in comparison to this. @Bioware: What I feel is most important is that combat input has topmost priority above all animations and other considerations. As far as I know WoW works it in a way that your own actions are first calculated on your client, send to the server and there they are counter checked against other people's/mob's combat inputs and you get the response afterwards. That often led to situations that were slightly awkward: Healer sending off a heal successfully (on his client) and the person still dieing a split second later (because the server as the "supreme ruler of combat" decided that the heal was too late after all). That is just one of the more blatant examples to illustrate how I seem to remember having someone explain it to me. However, SW:TOR seems to thoroughly check everything on the server and THEN sending input response along with action result back to my client. To be clear, I have no way of knowing if my assumptions are correct, but what I want to stress is that the "WoW way" is the right one, even if it leads to awkward situations with contradicting events such as a successful heal still resulting in the tank dieing. Those things we are used to, those split second decisions made by the server don't happen nearly as often as me spamming abilities and them not going of smoothly/fast enough. Also, I want to point out that these problems get ultimately worse in pvp, in my opinion. Now that I explained my point, I could even imagine that being due to combat information sent from both players, compared on the server, send back etc. A lot of waiting time for information to get passed around in an MMO combat situation.

You know, it'd suck when that player you know sucks just like the worst noob on the server and you can't prove it, so either you are going to just call him out on it and he thinks you don't like him, or you ignore it essentially proving the previous poster right...

10 Bucks say they removed the enrage because it wasn't necessary in the first place. Another 10 say they even did it to provoke posts like these and are laughing really hard right now...

*Kleine Spoilerwarnung...* Wer immer schon mal James Bond sein wollte, wird den IA mögen. Das ist meiner Meinung nach das Vorbild für den IA. Kleiner Gag von Bioware: Denkt mal an James Bond und guckt euch Keeper (Minister) genauer an... Ich frage mich, ob das noch jemandem aufgefallen ist.

So you actually don't want a LFG Tool, you want the one click group composition/port button that saves you the effort?

LFG bad for the community? So... LFG in WoW usually looks like this: Click button, get ported. Say "Hi!". Kill stuff. Loot. Say "Bye!". Port out... social interaction on average: 0. Put it in other words: Community "gain" = 0. This is for egoistic single game players who quickly need 3 other extras in their personal heroic loot story. MMOs without LFG? Pester friends on your FL, if that fails, get on chat, announce what you're doing and wait for incoming replys. Check their roles against your demand, perhaps they have special needs like side quests etc., wait for others to join up and chat a bit while both of you are continueing quests in the vicinity of the dungeon/heroic quest. Need I point out how easily you get to know new people like this, instead of LFG? LFG is for lazy people and your argument about the community has NOTHING to do with LFG. In fact, your argument is the best argument to keep LFG out of the game as long as possible.

It seems, you have only picked the wrong posts. Or, heck, let's call your bluff, you only read perhaps the first two pages. If you had read the PREVIOUS 2 pages of this page, you would have read a lot of sensible posts not grilling bad players. Instead, calling it like it is. However, you can choose to get hung up on phrasing or even one word. Or instead, try replacing "Baddie" or "Fail" with "person who doesn't want to improve" and "makes a mistake" and Bob's your uncle! And again, if you had read the previous two pages, you would know that dmg meters don't make people treat think of other people as "bad players". The bad players have only themselves to blame. Hence the term "bad players". It's actually not name calling. It's describing a player, who is just... bad. It's simply the consequence of playing badly. Can anyone phrase it clearer than that? I dare you. Scenario: Person A deals 2k dps. The raid average is somewhere over 10k. How would you categorise person A? I'm asking that, because I get the feeling everyone against dmg meters thinks people are falsely accused of being bad players, while IN FACT they rock the house! Only the dmg meters are wrong or evil or something...

I'll jump to this, since you seem to be one of the few people arguing your side without too many emotions attached. I totally agree with your points about dmg meters creating a volatile competition among certain types of gamers. That leads to a lot of unnecessary and frustrating crap. Also, some people have made the suggestion to block the post option in wow style dmg meters. While I don't believe developers pay too much attentions to threads like these, I'll assume someone reads it just for the heck of it. Dmg meters in their most useful state are really only of interest to raid leaders. And even then, they are not near useful enough except for very quick checks on dps on a certain type of mobs midraid or even midcombat. So let's ditch that idea. All you really need is a working combat log, a logger and a parsing website/tool. Flaming douchebags are usually too lazy to parse their log, look up the website and THEN go and call names on someone. Raid leaders, however, have done exactly that to find out specific quirks about wipes or underperforming raiders. And they usually go to those people and - again, hopefully - politely let them know that they suck and need to change something. In an ideal world, they will even nudge them in the right direction. I agree that in a time of no enrage timers, you don't need to know who performed under par as long as everyone stays in shape and doesn't stress the healers out too much. Mark my words, though, enrage timers will come. They have to. Look at the game as it is now, there is no limit to healer/dps ressources. I wouldn't be surprised to see a few hard encounters done with a surplus of healers. It doesn't even need to be a big enrage timer wow style, just have many little soft enrages, like waves of mobs. Once you wipe to them 100s of times, you will want to find out what or who is going wrong. Combat log helps with that. Let's hope Bioware reads this discussion. PS: Since everyone seems to share anecdotes on why he thinks dmg meters sucks/rocks: Here's mine... Trial Healer is assigned to Tank who is tanking two of the three Boss companions. Is stressed but heals just fine. Next week, established veteran healer beach (I might have misspelled that...) fails miserably half a dozen times and whines about it being impossible. Until we check the meters and see that she was happily healing the entire f-ing raid instead of her assigned tank. Now, if you watch her cast animation, she is super busy. How will you find out that it was her fault if you don't have any combat information whatsoever other than cast animation and the health bar of your tank (who may be rescued by smart healers a few times that want to make sure he stays alive...). Answer me that riddle, please?

I like how people are seriously saying things like "I want to use a suboptimal rotation and not do what's best for the group and I want to get away with making everyone's life harder without being caught." You actually think you have a god given right to be a bad teamplayer in an mmo? I can see some arguments speaking against dps meters, and while I still don't care whether or not there is going to be one, I really dislike arguments along the line of "If I choose to be an ***, I should have a right to be an *** and no one should be able to call me out on it." I'm not sure if I get my point across, it's so fundamental, it's hard to explain. If you suck badly at this (or other games), and you actively refuse to improve, you deserve to be kicked from the group. The core of this discussion is not really dmg meters. That is just a scapegoat. But trust me, you WILL get booted for sucking. Dmg meter or not. People WILL find out that you suck, and they will - hopefully - politely tell you so and how to improve. And after your refusal to improve, because you think your personal f-ing role play experience (or whatever funky excuse people are thinking up in this thread) is worth more than the time of 3 other people, you willl get the boot. And rightfully so. P.S.: Even the most fun-loving clown posse of sucking players get REALLY annoyed at wiping to the first boss in any given instance repeatedly and having to abort instances because of people not doing their job at least halfway decently. In the end, they will all yell "l2p" at each other and leave. True fact, just saying you want to have fun doesn't actually make you have fun. No matter how often you repeat it.