I don't think fleet was meant to be a social hub. Fleet has the same generic set up as any planetary general chat. Even the desolate personal star ship has the same set up. Perhaps it's more like a venue for people to look for groups and a communications hub for new players. It's fleet for the week that a new player hasn't found a guild to join. I'll guess afterwards it becomes your guild, and then a lot of people just can play solo once they've figured things out.

Yes, I agree - this is what initially drew me to this thread, was calling the idiotic s-hole known as fleet chat "the social hub of SWTOR."

I'll pass. Common sense should have sufficed though.

I also want to add that the practice where any group over 16 people and those over 16 or whatever only get some RNG chance at a CXP pack is just SOOOO idiotic. Why would you even make something like that? Make CXP loot packs for everyone.

Well they gotta do what they gotta do to fill up the raid. Yeah conquest is a thing now that they're giving out a large box containing an RNG quantity of Charged Matter Rewards to at least the 10 guilds who are invading the largest of the 3 planets. You do have to be part of the guild and I think you have to collect the conquest points in the guild to collect the rewards on Tuesday.

Y'all have a good one.

And in other news water is wet. But the point of contention is this statement: "You do not need guilds for anything... If your not inclined to that sort of arrangement, you can play every facet of this game, start to finish, solo, group content, HM/NiM everything without being in a guild. Ya just need a few cool people who you can get along with when you guys want to get together. Guilds can certainly make a lot of things easier if you are into group content and the guild is geared for that content, I'm just saying, it isn't necessary, you can get on fine without it if that is your preference, as it is mine now." To which I reply: "You can't do NiM and several HM ops without a guild (also just for the record you can throw in several HM FP, Uprisings, and Conquest into that too). " Perhaps now that I've spoon fed you what you were replying to you can be less uninformed when you speak.

From the point of view of someone who replies out of his ignorance, foolhardy enough to cop an attitude and inept enough to try to prove their point by omitting obvious facts (i.e. the guys using Discord to run together without a guild were running the content in guilds for years prior to that). A total failure by all accounts.

+1 Original Post.

So you were in a NiM/HM raiding guild which bent the rules to have you in the guild in all but name. You were in their guild according to the elaborate ruse they constructed for your mutual benefit, and most importantly apparently they supplied the bulk of the raid, so all the NiM/HM content you did with them was guild runs, which proves my point that you can't do NiM and several HM ops without a guild (also just for the record you can throw in several HM FP, Uprisings, and Conquest into that too).

What you write to him changes nothing in our exchange. I have not and won't be concerning myself with it. There is no "way" you worded it. You made a series of false statements which I pointed out here. You only say my pointing this out is "semantics" and "splitting hairs", while not specifically showing how, maintaining that your comments are correct and using a straw man debate fallacy. That's being dishonest and has no merit. As neither of the two were ever my argument, your arguing against that position remains a straw man fallacy.

You did not correct me. Your comment avoids obvious facts in order to come to an absurd conclusion. None of this is news to me and it does not prove what you have said, nor disprove what I have said. All that you mention is based on being in a guild, which is what I've said. The only thing that is unique about what you have said is what is probably an omission of past guild membership.

You are clearly engaged in dishonest commenting. The statements you made all have different meanings, which I explained very simply to you. You do not attempt to show how my explanations are wrong, you simply slap a one word label on them and a cliche. Your saying that my posting your comments makes them different is a strawman fallacy. Your statements are different because the English language as well as the logical substance of your words makes them so, and my explanation of those statements shows how. Your failure to address this while still maintaining your original position is simply a blind irresponsible denial.

My disagreement with that poster isn't about what's necessary, it's about (1) the question of whether two of his comments are identical (they are not) and (2) if the statement about SWTOR being "pretty much a single player game" is true or not (it isn't). Being necessary and being predominant are two different things. It is true in some sense that guilds are not required, but that doesn't mean guilds and groups aren't popular. Not at all. I take the phrase friend seriously, and so there's a lot more difference. I have very little beyond stated duties to the guildies I have and I'm in 3 guilds I actively participate in. On average there are very little demands beyond that. I used to have the same problem. I got kicked out of a few guilds - actually just got kicked out a guild recently because I literally gave the guild some good advice (take down an advert that said donate flag ship components to the guild, because the guild was regularly hauling in large boxes of CMT and you have to choose between the latter and the former and the latter is far more valuable than the former by about 8-10 times). In any case, what I did was to adapt my tactics while basically remaining who I am. This is generally false. You cannot do NiM content and a lot of HM content (operations and flashpoints) without being in a guild. By the way I don't think it says much to say that you can do things without a guild. I mean I played World of Tanks for 18 months and except for Clan Wars, you could do everything without being in a guild. What does that tell you? Nothing.

Your 1st statement: "SWTOR is pretty much a single player game these days. You can do everything solo except warzones. Or raiding if you're into that sort of stuff. " Your 2nd statement: Playing in a guild/group - "it's not required is what I'm saying." Your 3rd statement: "What I posted earlier is the same as what I posted later." The 3rd statement is incorrect as statements 1 and 2 are not the same. 2 can be true without 1 being true. 2 can be true while 1 is false (which it is).

BTW what you're saying is what you said: "SWTOR is pretty much a single player game these days. You can do everything solo except warzones. Or raiding if you're into that sort of stuff. " This statement is not the same as your latter statement that playing with guilds and groups is "not required." Those are two distinct statements.

I would call that a shallow experience of the game, and if we are saying that a shallow experience of the game (maybe we can call that Pug Life) is the standard, then can't anyone live the Pug Life in any MMO? If that's true, then what's the point of stating that you can live the Pug Life in SWTOR?

I agree with him to some extent that fleet numbers can be used to measure the overall activity of the game. However, I think he might have mentioned the devs actions and that's really the root of the problem I'd say: specifically pointing to: * Waiting a year to merge servers * Moving Harbinger from California to Virginia (and fooking West Coast and Asia up the butt) * Terrible release of Galactic Command system * Continued same statistics for PvE and PvP (which makes it a necessity to nerf a bunch of disciplines into the ground in PvE because of the implications (which shouldn't exist if PvE and PvP weren't linked) on PvP Fleet can be A, B or C, but it's the devs actions which are setting the major structural reasons for the decline of the game.

Not at all. Been playing this game for about 4 years now and I've continuously been part of guilds or groups doing the multi-player content, even when I was guildless I saw it going on around me.

If I could write a title to my post it would be: Fleet is a Sheet Hole. Fleet has its uses for pugging the daily ops, but socially it's just a bunch of idiots usually trying to be offensive. I don't really see what the point of this thread is too much - the point is not clear. I would just say join some guilds and go to fleet to pug the daily ops, that's about it. The point of this thread is actually not really relevant to that. The devs do stupid ****, like they finally merged servers, but they have to **** that up by waiting a year too late and then fooking the West Coast and Asia up the bass by moving the servers to Virginia. Always gotta be that way: fix one thing and totally fook it up in another way. And they keep doing stupid sheet like having PvP and PvE stats for characters be the same, which mandates that certain disciplines be nerfed into the ground in PvE because they are overperforming in PvP. Same stupid **** until it's gotten so bad that the game is about to die - then they change....and of course fook something up to balance out the improvement.

A lot of this is so true. 5.0 really was a calamity. While I really have spent so much time on this game, 5.0 release was just so terrible. Just completely not thought out. RNG-based gearing, people on raid teams who now have to grind to get gear. It's like the fable of the dog with a bone in his mouth who looked into the river at his own distorted reflection and saw a larger bone, opened his mouth up and lunged to get the reflected bone and lost the real one. BW wasn't satisfied with the raiders it had who weren't spending a ton of time doing other parts of the game, tried to get them more involved with some old ******** and lost them. It's why Ben Irving got kicked out of here. The game went too long without an ops and other group content, they tried to get by with some old ******** and it blew up in their faces. Still a great game. Enjoy it while it's still here. P.S. They also were a year too slow in doing server mergers. - Worth mentioning.

Maintenance mode means no new content. New content is coming, so no maintenance mode (and as such calling it that is BS). As for where the game is going, I'd say probably off into the sunset. Perhaps the last expansion will be the last one and then maintenance mode. Maybe, possibly.

It's hard to organize for these things and it's really not good when the fight is taken away from you and you have no chance to do it when some random person pulls these things by accident and they go away for ever. That's putting it really politely. P.S. Also I think that bosses aren't always dropping CXP packs.

If you're in a big conquest guild, you get large Charged Matter Rewards if your guild stays in the big boy pool. So big boys playing in the kiddie pool are heavily disincentivized. Can you tell me how your comments address this?

P.S. I try to mix it up: make time for raiding, make time for things I find relaxing (flash points) and then make time for other stuff. You just have to prevent yourself from going all out on whatever activity you are allowing to completely monopolize your time. Cut that down to like 50% or whatever of your total time played.