Mhak
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Posts posted by Mhak
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I don't prefer either's pvp. I prefer PvP where I'm rewarded with advancement that isn't just shinier gear with more of the same stats, and where skill is more important than that shiny gear. Both of the games in question entirely fail in those regards.
This post is like voting for a president, all we're doing is picking the lesser of two evils. They're both crap.
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Hey, makes sense to me, kill the same target, one takes longer than the other. I will believe you, dont worry LOL, I just want to know as I recruited a PT to my guild(I MT) and want him to have a optimal DPS spec so he can learn the fights and in time, tank them while I level my other 2 tanks
if you can suggest a good pyro pve spec I will link it to him when I get home, you can PM me also, that will work better, thanks.Your question and posed scenario was framed so tongue-in-cheek that I'm surprised you didn't choke a little while typing it. I was speaking from experience that I put a lot of effort into and you mocked it without knowing that I had, in fact, tested the 2 specs in a controlled environment to the best extent this game will currently allow. You even had the good Admiral confirm your intent at the end.
It's impossible for me/most people to get offended over the interwebz, but you sure were being a complete dick when you phrased that post - which I still put lots of effort into answering to the best of my ability for the purpose of helping my fellow PTs perform the best they can.
You catch more flies with honey than vinegar. http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#301bMZMsZfhrbzGhrs.1
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Coming from a 50 PT in full champ/rakata gear, Pyrotech spec -
You're basically the slow moving death machine on the field. You can't charge, you don't get speed boosts, you're CCd easier than if you were AP (although AP does so much less damage than Pyro it's widely regarded as currently useless by most lvl 50s), and many of your powerful abilities require being at 10m or melee range to do.
However, when you do get within range of somebody, they drop. Fast. Even tanks, because most of your damage is elemental and your Rail Shot, which crits for about 3.5k unbuffed in my gear, ignores 90% armor as Pyrotech spec. It does not take long for the enemy team to paint as you as the guy to just stay the hell away from and CC as much as possible.
When you group with a healer or a tank who guards you, the destruction you can cause is glorious. I and many other PTs out there have gotten 500k+ damage in WZs, Pyrotech is a pure wrecking ball spec in PvP. Grapple is an I-win button vs anybody who knocks you back or Sages that try to force-speed away. By the way, having a Sage admit defeat and Force Speeding 30 feet away only to be yanked right back and punched in the face is one of the most satisfying feelings ever.
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1. A fair idea so long as there are fair tradeoffs, but your tradeoffs are terrible ideas, because -
2. They already have an independent stun that doesn't max the resolve bar, and concealment/scrappers often talent it to be only a 30 second CD. Giving them another tool they have already is pointless.
3. This isn't a fantasy MMO. These classes are not force sensitive. Having them disappear/reappear behind a class is totally non-canon and this game is 100% canon-abiding. A gap closer would be a great thing to have but it doesn't fall into play with these class' themes.
4. All this would do would further confuse the rotation they already have. It's the CD it does for a reason, it creates a rotation of moves for these classes to cycle through. 3 seconds would be a better reduction to compensate for the 1.5GCD timer, but this move is often used only once before the enemy distances themselves from you anyway, so it would only really help in PvE rotations. A more fair tradeoff would be to increase the damage of shiv/backstab if you're going to nerf the initial burst.
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This isn't what happened at all.
EA purchased Mythic based on the long developed alpha and beta clients of Warhammer. EA had seen Warhammer, and seen what Mythic intended to do with it, BEFORE they purchased the studio. The same applies to Bioware. In both cases, EA purchased the teams based on product those teams had already been developing for a considerable period of time. In both cases the purchase allowed the teams to continue development for an extended period of time due to increased cash flow, and EA - especially with Bioware - had limited oversight when it came to the development of the game. Perhaps EA did impart some influence on the game but that is hardly surprising. To blame all of the ills in War and SWTOR on EA, however, is a tedious misrepresentation of the facts on the ground.
It's exactly what happened. EA purchased Mythic because they could afford to, there was a lot of controversy during and after the purchase because Mythic didn't want to lose its sovereignty. They did because $$$ has the last say in anything, and the cash flow was needed, as you said.
And then EA did, absolutely, 100%, drastically change WAR from what it was going to be into what it is. This is EAs SOP and why they will never have as much success with an MMO as Blizzard. WoW was innovative at the time it came out. Blizzard gave it's devs more time and more time and more time every time they asked for it. EA drew a line in the sand and said "We want a game that incorporates a lot of things you didn't want to put in because we think it will attract more people, and we want it released by this date in time, period, we don't care if it's not even complete by that time."
WAR released early with tons of bugs and lots of unpleasantness and to a majorly disappointed fanbase who had been promised a "return of RvR" as a result. I have no idea why you're defending EA but your defense of them is baseless entirely. I am not misrepresenting anything in the slightest. You sound like an EA rep to be honest.
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OP I have the exact same feeling as you including the 500k+ games sometimes except I'm a Powertech.
Don't see many nerf Gunslingers or Powertechs out there though.
I am extremely satisfied with this.
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I think BW owns DAoC, why would they not take from one of the best and add it to their new game?
For the same reason EA forced Mythic into making the mediocre game WAR when it could have been so much better.
They find this great company called Mythic and purchase them. Mythic made what was empirically one of the best PvP games ever - DAoC. EA thinks "Great! We got a team of PvP experts working for us!"
They then proceed to tell that team "No no no, no all that stuff you did which was awesome, that's not popular. No, games like WoW are popular. Copy them. Guild controlled stuff? Motivation to Open World PvP? No no no you guys don't understand, people want WoW, that's not in WoW. People want to grind midlessly for shiny things, whether it be in PvE or PvP...like in WoW. Just make WoW, OK? God you guys have no idea how to make a product that will sell, all that stuff you're talking about sounds nothing like WoW."
And thus mediocre games like WAR and SWTOR are born, when they could have been so much better. The rush for the almighty dollar and the desire to appeal to 100% of the MMO playerbase rather than making an epic product to appeal to a smaller playerbase crushes all innovation and passion in this industry.
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That fact alone, that ONE thing, that BW does not see the problem with Ilum shows me that they are just SOOooo disconnected from PvP its just shocking.
This is a fact. For having Mythic on their side, Bioware clearly still has their head up their collective azzes when it comes to PvP. When will people learn that if you LET MYTHIC DO THEIR JOB WITHOUT BALL AND CHAINING THEM great things will happen? EA *should* have learned this lesson from WAR, where they let Mythic incorporate a *little* of their magic, but mostly demanded they copy/paste other more more popular games. As a result they got a game that was a *little* bit successful.
Ilum WILL NOT work for end game PvP and if something MAJOR is not done to add to the end game world PvP this game is already dead.Well, the game itself isn't dead, I would phrase it more accurately as "This game is dead to people who like to PvP." There's still a market for the carebears out there who will find a home in this game...
But most of the people who came here looking for epic, intense PvP like me sure are majorly disillusioned right about now, that's for sure. GW2 anybody? SOMEBODY has to get it right again one of these days...
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I agree that buffing both HEGC is the way to go, as well as significantly altering the FT mechanic.
The +50% Flamethrower is supposed to be the "oomf" of AP. Slightly-more-often critting Rail Shots are unimpressive when they don't get a +30% crit damage bonus, and all the other damage is just plain sub-par. +50% damage Flamethrower is impressive when you get the whole thing off, but is just a terrible move to lay all our chips on -
It's easily avoidable. It's easily interruptable (melee classes we fight will just save their interrupt for FT, because they have nothing else to interrupt.) The damage-ticking mechanic is terribly designed and takes significantly longer to hit a target at distance than ones up close. With lag people often appear to be somewhere they're not, and if you rotate with an opponent while channeling FC, you usually see them getting doused in fire but taking not a single tick of damage due to the crappy programming of this skill.
It is confusing, then, for Bioware to design the AP tree as a highly-mobile, hard-to-CC brawler with great resource management...but make their hardest hitting ability require them to stand still, and make it so easy to avoid or negate entirely the damage of it.
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I'm giving it a few weeks at 50 with solid gear. if they haven't fixed the issues by then I'm done.
Really the pvp is clunky and not that fun so far.
Same for me.
I came here hoping for Jedi v. Sith epic pvp action. Instead pvp seems to be duct-taped to this game at best, a complete afterthought.
So much for the epic battles I was waiting for...
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Oh, so this was some guild feud over the world boss. I was on Belsavis for dailies and read General chat and was thinking "What? Open world PvP? Since when does that exist in this game, I don't believe it.."
Sure enough....pretty decent brawl. I didn't know you guys were killing each other over and over again or I would have stayed, I just took my few Republican kills and finished my dailies. Now I'm sad I missed out D=
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What's rocket surgery?
I don't know either but whatever it is it sounds freakin' awesome.
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First let me say that the amount of emotion OP put into his post strongly implies he came from a badly lost WZ and not from an otherwise regular state of being to make this post. He did not, say, wake up from a nap, or finish lunch, or watch an episode of his favorite TV show, and then come here immediately afterward to make this post. The emotion implies bias right off the bat. But let me delve into these -
1.) trooper mortar volley travel time verses BH death drom above instant!!! -> BH DfA isn't instant, our missiles take about half a second to a second to travel to the target area. Our missiles do not just appear at the enemies feet and explode instantly.
2.) consular animation delays verses their counterpart instant !!! -> Examples....? I have not noticed this.
3.) convert the trooper pool of energy to BH energy BH has 4% more -
same for another classes energy i forget which one -> Actually, if you wanted to break it down troopers are more energy efficient. 1 Trooper ammo = 8 BH heat, yet BHs have attacks that cost 25 Heat - that's like 3.125 ammo, whereas troopers only use 3 ammo for those attacks.
4.) IA can do dirty kick on the run without stopping while Smuggler has to stop perform action then move -> Do they? Can someone confirm that Dirty Kick roots the smuggler, or requires the smuggler to not be moving to do? I've never heard of this.
5.) Ever wonder WHY it always seems empire starts with lead on alderaan warzone?
two turrets already pointing at republic ship and do not have to turn to begin firing not to mention the BIGGEST KICKER OF ALL .. the dumb DEVS ALLOW THE EMPIRE TO TICK QUICKER THAN THE REPUBLIC ... FILM IT FRAPS IT YOURSELF ... try and figure out how empire one caps and republic two caps and forst 5 secs empire ahead ... REALLY .. I MEAN REALLY!!!! W T F -> I checked this for myself just recently after reading this. All turrets were aiming inwards, not towards any ship.
6.) force way has animation that makes republic jump up then come down before it goes off empires is instant ... very rough across the bridge in voidstar and in huttball -> No, if you're talking about the SI KB, they have to jump up and then down too.
7.) empires knockbacks are farther -> Proof? I disagree.
8.) instant lightening no travel time ... rocks have longer animation til impact -> Already proven false by Consulars in this thread.
9.) IA gets gets 30 secs less on its cc grenade cooldown than smuggler -> Again, can someone confirm? SSs?
10.) electrocute ignores resolve bar and even dodge it gets through everything ... force stun DOES NOT!!! -> If it does, and I doubt that it does, that's called a bug and not a design choice.
11.) smuggler sabo charge requires again you guessed it longer period of time .. IA instant!!!! -> Can someone confirm? Again just because an animation looks longer doesn't mean the effect isn't instant.
12.) IA backstab instant - Smuggler has animation to pull out shotgun to deal with !!!! -> This I know for sure is wrong, they're both instant moves but have an animation that is not quite instant.
There are a few here I'm not sure about and if confirmed by somebody would mean there are some bugs that need to be fixed, but you did a terrible job of proving that the Devs favor one side over the other. At worst there's a couple bugs that need to be fixed, at best (and I think most likely) you're just raging over losing a PvP match and are still at an age where you take things like that very seriously.
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And yet you offer no ideas to make it better. Thanks.
It's not the critic's responsibility to do the game dev's job for them. It's the critic's job to point out flaws and draw attention to them so that they can get fixed sooner.
What world do you live in where nobody is allowed to call attention to problems unless they have a fix for those problems in their back pocket?
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I thought OP was talking about the body type 4 Imperial Agent named Peter Griffin on my server judging from the title. Thought you didn't like to lose your immersion or something.
I came here to defend him but I see that is not necessary.
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Only because you asked so nicely/sarcastically. I did EV 4 times now, 3 on normal, once on hard where we didn't down the last boss. Here's your enlightenment -
The first was done as full Pyrotech. On the Council fight I noticed I killed my Council member before anybody else did, with the second DPS (a sniper) still about 20k behind me by the time I was done. Overall I pulled agro constantly, even with a tank bubble on me. The damage was very impressive.
The second time I did EV I was AP, or I should say I did most of it as AP because the damage was so horrible compared to my first run I had to go respec after the Council fight for the last boss. The first boss the damage was so much worse than Pyrotech I wanted to do it then, but because so much of AP's damage *should* come from a +50% damage flamethrower, and I kept getting knocked back and stunned on the first boss, in addition to being forced to move constantly for large portions of the fight, I figured it might have just been a bad boss for AP.
I continued on with AP onto the second boss. Doing trash the damage was not that bad, +50% FT channels on a whole pack of mobs is nice, although that single ability was the only thing that was impressive. On to the second boss where I did have to move a lot to avoid Pounces and travel to different lava islands, but for the *most* part I got to stand still and beat on the boss.
The damage was still drastically less. Not being able to spam Rail Shots every 3-6 seconds, which proc a 500-1k CGC hit every time, as well as my most-used attack (FB) not getting the extra 500-1k CGC hit every use, is such a massive loss of sustained DPS that I didn't need a meter to tell I was doing much worse as AP. But I still didn't respec, because I knew the perfect test was coming up after some more trash and the 3rd loot chest event.
The Council. This is a fight where everybody has to fight their own boss. As I stated earlier, the first time I did this as Pyro, and I finished before any other DPS by a decent margin. Well now I had the exact same opportunity as AP. I chose the exact same council member to fight as last time, a mob with a little over 70k health.
I took about 20 seconds longer to kill my mob, and was the second-to-last DPS to finish, finishing only in front a marauder who was new to this and not in great gear. There were tanks and healers who killed their respective mobs faster (tanks and healers fight mobs with different health levels, the idea being we should all finish roughly at the same time). As Pyrotech I was finished *far* before any tanks or healers were.
You asked what damage meter I used. It was called "time", and it took a lot more of it to kill the same target as AP than as Pyrotech. There's your enlightenment. I tested these specs legitimately in a controlled environment to best extent I was capable of because I wanted to know which was better. I did not hold any prejudices against either spec before these tests, I wanted to do the best DPS I could, that was all.
It might require damage meters to tell which spec is better if the damage was close for each spec, but the damage disparity is so drastic that it's easily noticeable without needing to see a recording of numbers to compare. AP needs vast amounts of love to be brought anywhere close to on-par with Pyrotech's damage.
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Yes, that's called high school statistics, and what that tells you is that more often than not your rotations will not benefit from a charged gauntlet auto-crit proc. And when it does happen, the damage is unimpressive due to not receiving the 30% higher crit damage from deep Pyrotech.The above post really overstated how bad it is. Charged gauntlets procs around 43% of the time (math is in the other thread) with a rotation of flame burst, retractable blade, rocket punch, rail shot. For reference, the combination of one flame burst and rocket punch only procs particle accelerator ~61% of the time.
Yes, that is the intent of AP - utility in PvP. Unfortunately - due to terrible design which will hopefully be addressed in the future - it requires sacrificing massive amounts of damage for such meager utility. In turn, Pyrotech has utility of it's own which is intended for PvP.The build also totes a lot more pvp utility with a 35 sec grapple, 50 sec electro dart, and hydraulic overrides. Getting to a specific target is trivial for this build.
Well sir opinions stop at this point and facts enter the fray; you are empirically wrong. The sustained damage is far less due to a majority of your most-used abilities receiving 9-13% less damage (depending on whether they are fire effects or not) and 30% less critical damage. The burst damage is FAR less due to a lack of hard-hitting RSs and TD.It's really not bad, and I've been getting decent damage scores with it in pvp even before getting charged gauntlets, but right now it does seem like full pyro is better for both pve and pvp.I've used full AP, this Hybrid spec, and Pyrotech, AP and Pyrotech of which I have both tested in EV. This Hybrid spec offers the slightest of noticeable increases in sustained damage from AP - which is horrendous when compared to Pyrotech to being with. Add on top of that a severe lack of burst - as you said - and this spec is completely useless when compared to full Pyrotech with the noticable exception being Hydrolic Overrides. The people willing to sacrifice 30%-50% damage from a full Pyrotech build for that single useful talent are few and far between.
tl;dr - I did not overstate how bad this spec was at all - you are overstating it's usefulness, likely because you haven't the level/gear to test all your options out yet. I have, and did. This spec is not good and if there were damage meters it would be easy to demonstrate this fact.
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Everything has tons and tons of accuracy, get used to it. Endgame PvE and PvP gear is loaded with it. It's Bioware's way of saying "We like to give the appearance that all your gear has lots of stats, but a ton of it is mostly wasted unless fighting tanks because otherwise you'd all be OP." Instead of designing better geat they just decided to fluff it all up with accuracy. I'm in full champ/rakata gear and I have 111% accuracy. If you don't want accuracy on your gear then you won't be wearing much epic gear at all, because nearly all of it is loaded with accuracy.
Eliminator is the only set you'll want as Pyrotech. There's really no debate here. As Pyrotech a massive amount of your damage is RS because you rotate it so often. +15% crit chance helps immensely.
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50 PT in full champ/rakata gear reporting. Normally I'm full 31-point Pyro. Get scores like this in WZs sometimes - http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/195/screenshot2012010911075.jpg/
Tested out the hybrid build for the first time last night.
Please. Nobody. Go. This. Spec. Somebody saw this combination of the talent calculator and thought it would be cute to try out. It's not. It's terrible. Charged gauntlets almost never happens and when it does, RS crits for far less than it would in Pyrotech because you don't get the 30% crit damage bonus from it by going this crappy hybrid spec, not to mention doing 9% less damage from lack of Rain of Fire. You also don't get the insane burst in PvP you get from landing a RS at the same time TD goes off.
This hybrid spec is just horrible and offers neither good burst nor sustained damage. I would love if Bioware made hybrid specs viable. They did not.
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Advanced Prototype is a more pve focused tree.
You are completely wrong sir. Please hold your opinions if you do not have any idea what you're talking about. AP does roughly 50% less sustained damage in a PvE Operation situation. I've tested both in EV. I knew AP did less damage just from the PvP experience, but when I confirmed it in sustained PvE the damage was so drastically less than Pyrotech I was appalled.
AP was designed with PvP heat management and mobility in mind, but in doing so Bioware made it have just insanely less damage than Pyrotech. This while being a "Damage" tree makes it effectively entirely useless, OP is exactly right. It's fine to sacrifice *some* damage for utility, but with AP Bioware just throws all your damage on the ground, burns it and pisses on the ashes.
I don't know *** Bioware was thinking when they made this wreck of a tree.
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As a Pyrotech Powertech in full champ/rakata gear I find commandos to be some of my favorite prey. Unless they're heal spec'd.
If they're heal spec'd and in pvp gear they can't kill me but I sure as hell can't kill them either. Mercenary/Mando healing is absurd in good gear.
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I don't ragequit, once I start a match in my mind I'm already close to the rewards, be they winning or losing rewards, and I'm not missing out on that just because I'm having a bad match.
However, I am at the point where I leave a lot of Huttball matches before they even start. Either if I just played 2 or 3 Huttball games in a row and get another one, screw it, I'm out. Or if I see a bunch of level 12s and 17s on my team who will clearly be doing nothing but running around hitting people with flashlights for 10 damage while we get steamrolled, I'm out.
Not wasting my time with that. Level brackets will fix the latter but I'll still be ditching a lot of Huttball games just because I am so. Freakin'. Sick. Of. Hutt. Ball.
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This is just another complaint from a clearly casual player going up against more hardcore players.
OP joins a PvP match in mediocre gear going "Lah-dee-dah, time for some pee-vee-pee so I can do my daily." Your competition joins a PvP match going "WE GONNA KILL US SOME IMPS GAME FACE YARRGGHHH!"
Don't expect to do much vs a coordinated, practiced, and motived team while you're casually pugging it. I can 100% guarantee you they'd still annihilate you without any of their pvp gear. Gear isn't the problem, although even coming from someone in full champ/rakata gear (me), gear is too easy to get right now and needs to take more work/effort.
That being said, it's so easy to get that even if you half-azz it you can easily get full champ gear yourself in a week or two...your post is therefore Null and Void.
if you can suggest a good pyro pve spec I will link it to him when I get home, you can PM me also, that will work better, thanks.
Aion PvP 2.0??? Summarization of why this game might fail.
in PvP
Posted · Edited by Mhak
Do your think before you type? You just said the players are the problem, either for playing too much or for being on the wrong faction. No buddy, the players are the CUSTOMERS, and many of us are depressed about the product we bought.
The guys who played the game too fast did it wrong? Yeah god forbid some people enjoy the game so much they play a lot of it. Are you kidding me? Getting bored at endgame means those people are detecting a frightening lack of end-game content - and endgame content is absolutely crucial to any long-term success of any MMO. Implying we should just play slower is the most absurd defense out there, it killed a few brain cells reading it.
You're a complete fanboi for blindly defending legitimate issues instead of letting them be addressed, which is the only way they'll ever get fixed. You probably have cancer you're infected so badly.