True. If mind tricks don't even work on these guys, then I highly doubt it will work on the incredibly strong-willed Superman.

Superman moving faster than light speed: http://media.animevice.com/uploads/0/576/130404-882597_17_super_super.jpg http://img221.imageshack.us/img221/2373/su2eq5.jpg Superman keeping up with the Flash on foot (definitely much faster than a speeding bullet): http://media.comicvine.com/uploads/0/7604/1164958-flashv2209p011_super.jpg

Once again, the EU fanboys MASSIVELY overestimate Luke's abilities. 1. A lightsaber would have very little to no effect on Superman (a guy that shrugs off direct nuclear detonations and can fly THROUGH stars with no problem.) 2. Superman is far faster than Luke ever was. Superman moves faster than the speed of light on several occasions. 3. Superman is far stronger than Luke ever was. He can move (or smash apart) whole planets and can even contain a black hole with his fist. 4. Superman is far tougher than Luke ever was. Again, flying through suns, shrugging off nukes, etc. 5. Superman is far more experienced than Luke. He's fought and defeated tons of very different opponents in his lifetime. This is a stomp. Superman could just disintegrate Luke with a simple FTL attack. Luke would be nothing more than a slight annoyance to the Man of Steel.

They wouldn't know for sure I guess. It would actually make sense for her to die some time later. Deep depression and seclusion on Alderaan, which ultimately leads to her suicide. That is what happens when someone loses their will to live. It would also explain how Leia had a few childhood memories of her mother.

Medication, therapy, counseling, etc. etc. I'm sure a galaxy spanning society, one that is thousands of years more advanced than we are, has countless different treatments for people with emotional problems.

Also, Padme wasn't a distressed old person dying alone. Padme was not only a heathly young woman, she also had access to highly advanced medical science & tech. It's ridiculous that her body just decides to shut down for no real reason. It's even more ridiculous that the advanced medical droids can't save her and pretty much shrug and say, "Don't know, must be magic!!"

Nah. It was pretty lame.

Yep. Killing her off because she "lost the will" is just stupid and lame. It's also pretty stupid that the advanced medical science and tech couldn't save her. "Lost the will to live" was the medical droid's diagnosis? Give me a break.

Hayden Christensen is just a bad actor. Wooden and boring.

Without their Force powers, Jedi/Sith are nothing more than normal people with some combat training and skill with swinging around a lightsaber. Space Marines without their Psyker powers are still 8 foot tall superhuman mobile fortresses that can flatten urban blocks with their handheld weaponry and have centuries of combat experience in the 40k universe. I say the Marines would still devastate the Force users even without their Librarian's warp abilities. Typically, in these debates, the battle takes place in a neutral warzone where both sides have access to their Force/Warp abilities. I assume that's how it's set up for this fight.

Wrong. The tabletop game stats are balanced for fairness and playability. They are not accurate because of this. Tabletop Space Marines are heavily nerfed because they would completely unbalance the game if they were accurately portrayed. A single squad of Marines could massacre most tabletop armies if they weren't nerfed. Would that be fair to those who chose to play Orks, Tyranids, Imperial Guard, etc.? Nope. Those players would be forced to buy hundreds of warriors in order to have some chance at defeating a player with a couple Marine squads. Look to the official novels and in-universe stories to see what Space Marines are truly capable of.

Here you go: Jedi speeds aren't that big of a deal.

Uh...no they don't. What are you even talking about?

I agree. Jedi mind tricks would do nothing to a Marine. All I'm saying is that they aren't completely oblivious to what fear is.

They control it to such a degree that they can be called fearless. Space Marines may not feel fear anymore due to training and all that, but some still know what fear is. That does not contradict the Codex. Plenty of canon lore says they know what fear is. Also, keep in mind that some of the things stated in the Codex is Imperial propaganda.

Space Marines do actually know what fear is. Like Kribycollin said, they can control and ignore it, so it's never a problem.

Haven't seen much evidence to back up claims here. Here are basic Space Marine Librarian psyker powers from page 57 of the Codex: Space Marines (5th Edition) and examples for a couple of them in use that I found from official novels. Smite in use: The Avenger in use: Quick Overview Space Marine Librarian powers: Psychic lightning that can rip enemies apart and melt battle tanks. Creation of psychic constructs of flame that can kill hundreds of foes. Able to create a tear in reality to destroy opponents. Psychically enhance his already superhuman strength even further. Creation of force fields. Ability to time travel. Ability to teleport. Then, of course, there is his century+ of combat experience in the 40k universe and all the other basic SM stuff (superhuman toughness, strength, speed, bolt weaponry, power armor, etc.) Even the basic Librarian has access to powers that are far superior to what most Jedi/Sith are capable of. I have little doubt that Psykers would steamroll through Force users. Yes, there are a ton of 40k novels out there. You should check out http://www.spuler.us/40k/ This site keeps track of many, but not all, of the 40k stories released so far.

I don't see anything omnipotent about that. By that logic, plenty of 40k characters can "do pretty much anything" as well.

1. I am still waiting for evidence that says the Force can do anything. 2. This battle is not the Force VS a Space Marine. It is a Jedi VS a Space Marine.

Interesting picture. A Space Marine would still beat a Jedi into a bloody pulp.

True. SW strategies and tactics are pretty terrible. I bet our modern militaries wouldn't have much trouble destroying most SW ground forces and Jedi/Sith.

This is true. However, Lucas himself approved Boba Fett's return in the EU. Obviously, Lucas did this because Boba Fett is an extremely popular SW character. More new Boba Fett novels/merchandise = TRUCKLOADS OF MONEY!! Q: "Did George Lucas intend for Boba Fett to die in the sarlacc, despite what others may say or print?" A: "Yes, in George's view -- as far as the films go -- the baddest bounty hunter in the Galaxy met his match in the Great Pit of Carkoon where --unfortunately for Mr. Fett -- the ghastly sarlacc made its home. However, Lucas also approved Fett's comeback in the expanded universe. And of course, by going back in time with the prequels, the Star Wars creator has brought Boba Fett back to life himself, albeit at a much younger age." - Steve Sansweet, LFL/Fan Relations, 2002 - "Does Lucas Consider Boba Dead?", StarWars.com

True. Lucas, the creator and owner of the franchise, can pretty much do whatever he wants with the EU. Though he rarely involves himself in that universe. "I don't even read the offshoot books that come out based on Star Wars." - George Lucas, 1999 - Film Night interview "I don't read that stuff. I haven't read any of the novels. I don't know anything about that world. That's a different world than my world. But I do try to keep it consistent. The way I do it now is they have a Star Wars Encyclopedia. So if I come up with a name or something else, I look it up and see if it has already been used. When I said [other people] could make their own Star Wars stories, we decided that, like Star Trek, we would have two universes: My universe and then this other one. They try to make their universe as consistent with mine as possible, but obviously they get enthusiastic and want to go off in other directions." - George Lucas, 2005 - Starlog magazine interview "They have their own kind of world. There's three pillars of Star Wars. I'll probably get in trouble for this but it's OK! There's three pillars: the father, the son and the holy ghost. I'm the father, Howard Roffman [president of Lucas Licensing] is the son and the holy ghost is the fans, this kind of ethereal world of people coming up with all kinds of different ideas and histories. Now these three different pillars don't always match, but the movies and TV shows are all under my control and they are consistent within themselves. Howard tries to be consistent but sometimes he goes off on tangents and it's hard to hold him back. He once said to me that there are two Star Trek universes: there's the TV show and then there's all the spin-offs. He said that these were completely different and didn't have anything to do with each other. So I said, "OK, go ahead." In the early days I told them that they couldn't do anything about how Darth Vader was born, for obvious reasons, but otherwise I pretty much let them do whatever they wanted. They created this whole amazing universe that goes on for millions of years!" - George Lucas, 2008 - "George Lucas" interview, Total Film Magazine

What you failed to mention, Omnitheo, is that there are two separate universes in SW. You are talking only about the Expanded Universe. The "true" universe would be the "Film only continuity" that Lucas himself directly created and controls. In that universe, this game is not canon, Boba Fett did die in the Sarlacc, Emperor Palpatine never came back as a clone, Luke never got married, the Yuuhzan Vong war never happened, etc etc. So, if it's not in Lucas' films or TCW series, then it not canon in his universe. That is not opinion, it is a fact.

Yes, after 10,000 years it is finally beginning to fail, but not because someone splashed a little bit of water on it.